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blankseplocked I would just like to point out - CSM meeting minutes are out
 
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LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
Posted - 2009.02.04 09:33:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: LaVista Vista on 04/02/2009 11:49:17
That thy shall no longer wait for the CSM minutes.

They are available right here.

Please enjoy. There's a lot of good stuff especially on 0.0 and sov mechanics and some good ideas on mining.

The minutes discusses skill-queue. A dev-blog was JUST released on it. Find it right here


Navtiqes
GoonWaffe
SOLODRAKBANSOLODRAKBANSO
Posted - 2009.02.04 09:34:00 - [2]
 

I got here as fast as I could.

Thumbs up, guys -_-;

Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
Posted - 2009.02.04 09:43:00 - [3]
 

rawr mining! meow no M10.

Pontet Canet
Amarr
en primeur
Posted - 2009.02.04 09:54:00 - [4]
 

Thumbs up for the TLDR :)

Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2009.02.04 10:17:00 - [5]
 

Highlights:

-A lot of real poorly thought out 0.0 improving ideas thrown at CCP
-Recycled materials = 40% of all the materials in EVE
-Skill Queue is being worked on as we speak
-"Sorry, nop" on live events


The best part by far is when CCP completely OWNS CSM member Ankh about her ridiculously dumb ideas about Factional Warfare. I told you that your ideas were dumb and now you wasted CCPs time having to listen to your useless rabble. God you fail, Ankh.

Omber Zombie
Gallente
Frontier Technologies
Posted - 2009.02.04 10:52:00 - [6]
 

did i mention i made a movie?


MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
Posted - 2009.02.04 10:56:00 - [7]
 

Quote:
Pattern raised the topic of Environmental effects. Aspects would involve slowing ships down, but the point here would be to use those effects to effect sov through alliances controlling them. This was stated as being slated for being part of EVE in Apocrypha's Wormholes


I love you guys :)

LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
Posted - 2009.02.04 11:03:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Omber Zombie
did i mention i made a movie?


You just had to find the worst picture of me Laughing

Omber Zombie
Gallente
Frontier Technologies
Posted - 2009.02.04 11:08:00 - [9]
 

which one? Razz

LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
Posted - 2009.02.04 11:10:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Omber Zombie
which one? Razz

The first one, just after the pictures of Diagoras and Darius Razz

CCP Xhagen

Posted - 2009.02.04 11:44:00 - [11]
 

Applied glue.

Omber Zombie
Gallente
Frontier Technologies
Posted - 2009.02.04 11:48:00 - [12]
 

ohai Xhagen Very Happy

Joss Sparq
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.02.04 11:50:00 - [13]
 

NOBODY CARES ABOUT YOUR STUPID COUNCIL.

- just kidding, I've been reading the notes for the last twenty minutes or so. Good stuff, I found myself nodding my head/frowning on a regular basis and might post some comments later.

LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
Posted - 2009.02.04 11:50:00 - [14]
 

Changed op to reflect the newest dev-blog on the long-awaited skill-queue.

I hope that everybody is happy about the outcome of the skill-queue issue. We raised this during the first CSM which has now made it's way into a major expansion. I think that's a nice result Cool

SentryRaven
KIA Corporation
Zenith Affinity
Posted - 2009.02.04 12:59:00 - [15]
 

I agree, the sov discussion and 0.0 stuff is hot air, or vaporware. You are throwing around multiple ideas that have no coherence.

But I'll give it another read, just to make sure I haven't missed stuff...

Jack Gilligan
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2009.02.04 13:04:00 - [16]
 

The CSM is probably the only "legislative" body less productive than the United States Congress.

Joss Sparq
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.02.04 13:32:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Joss Sparq on 04/02/2009 13:34:40

TL;DR crowd: Why are my opinions important enough to publish? I don't know, but I'm still publishing them.

Friday 16th January 2009

I. Incentivizing 0.0 & Environmental Effects


Comments: the "Pendulum" actually reminds me very much of the system being employed in Warhammer Online right now (represent Ironclaw Destruction?) where certain activities (Public Quests, Realm v.s. Realm combat, etc) accrue points that result in certain benefits being unlocked for the Realm with the "Pendulum" swinging in their favor. I generally like this system in WO so I hope it could work here in some capacity.

However I don't quite see how/why sov should affect what moon materials are generated. For example, why should my Atmospheric Gases Moon magically turn into a Dysprosium Moon because I have a higher sov and then return to being an Atmospheric Gases pumpkin again when the server dings after my sov goes down?

There is a lot of different ideas to process here however so I won't go any further for now.

II. General Discussion on Mining

Comments: Call me odd, but I like the current mining mechanics: Go to belt, pick rock, lock rock, mine rock. That isn't to say there is no room for improvement. There does need to be more incentives for miners to move out of high security space. At the same time the system could use some spicing up and it really does need a boost in profit v.s. missions, in my reasoned opinion.

However, I don't know what to think of ninja mining. Without any details it sounds more like warping in, managing your HP while mining for however long you can, then warping out again possibly to rinse/repeat. Hardly inspiring.

III. Skill Training Queue mk2

Comments: DO IT! I should be able to play when I want to play and not feel forced to login by the game developer or feel bad when Real Life ruins all my carefully orchestrated login and skill change plans, the fact that I was is still silly. I won't comment on the Dev Blog directly as I might make a few comments too pointed, suffice to say: about ****ing time already, guys! I think the 24hrs should be 3 days, but whatever.

IV. Live Events

Comments: I do miss these. I didn't get to do many due to time zone differences but the ones I got to take part in I greatly enjoyed. Personally I'd like to see them return but it isn't really practical I guess.

V. Drone Improvements & Drone Protocols

Comments: drones are an area of improvement. Tech II drone modules, drone implants and yes, disconnection issues and drone control.

VI. (1)R&D Job Security, (2)Addition of “View Contracts” to Context Menu, (3)UI Import/Export Overview Settings, (4)UI New Context Menu

Comments: (3) is my main area of concern, it can be a real pain to get everything setup just right only to lose it all and have to start again with settings.

VII. Regular Revisit of Pre-Nerfed Features

Comments: lol @ the poor Black Ops. Your time will come Soon(tm).

VIII. Unanchoring Abandoned/Offline POS

High/Low Security:

Dead Corp: Unanchor on next DT after corp goes dead. Allow players to scoop or just delete the POS.
No fuel: Unanchor after 1 month. Allow players to scoop.

0.0 Security:

Dead Corp: Unanchor on next DT after corp goes dead. Allow players to scoop or just delete the POS.
No fuel: Unanchor after 1 month. Allow players to scoop.

You snooze, you lose!

IX. Colonies

Comments: Interesting. Maybe turn the "happiness factor" into an ISK sink, then offset that by a successful colony churing out some products.

X. Factional Warfare – Focus & Goals

Comments: Not my area of expertise at all but it does seem a game feature which has been a little orphaned. Perhaps attache VP to LP will be a good start.

XII. Modifiable Corporation Orders

Comments: Who should pay? The corporation. Implement? I have no idea. Good luck, Team CCP!

- Last few entries are mostly TL;DR so I'll skip along to,

Joss Sparq
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.02.04 13:33:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Joss Sparq on 04/02/2009 13:39:10

Saturday 17th January 2009

I. Mission Monopoly On Standing


Comments: Standings seem like one of if not the biggest boon of mission running and a big part of why mission running usually leaves mining way behind it in time v.s. value (I mean not just ISK). Heaps of stuff is tied to Standings which gives missions a hell of a lot of pulling power v.s. other professions.

II. Ghost Training

Comments: horrible implementation was absolutely horrible. I was surprised SP was killed but RP wasn't. Seemed strange. I'm not too fussed about the production.

May as well kill RP, if only to hear their anguished cries. Twisted Evil

III. Display Account Expiration Date On Character Selection Screen

Comments: lol @ technical difficulties, but glad to see it is being looked into. ****ing annoying as hell to be in the middle of a scrap in 0.0 only to be kicked out of the game without warning, until of course the message pops up after I've been kiced from the game.

IV. Contract API

Comments: could prove interesting for some and downright almighty for others I suspect.

V. Grouping of Non-Weapon Systems

Comments: Another case of DO IT! It felt half implemented being limited to just weapons, I think it has more potential to be exploited.

VI. Smartbomb Overhaul

Comments: Ideas on the linked wiki page are interesting. Never thought much about it before. I will chew these over some more.

VII. Marks Against Account

Comments: It would be useful for many people to know these things at a glance, same as subscription expiry discussed above.

VIII. Item Database Updates & Database Exports

Comments: Evelopedia is delicious.

IX. Bookmark My Ship

Comments: Hurray! Stick it in the right-click menu.

X. Suicide Ganking Part 2

Comments: I'm recalling a thread about this recently on GD. Therefore I "lol" and generally feel very satisfied with my reasoning there. Nothing further to add.

XI. Events & Gathering Forums being merged

Ugh, lotteries.

...

All in all, the minutes were very interesting reading and I'm happy to see some progress on several fronts. I may not agree with the priority given to some things but I certainly can't say it is wholly unsatisfactory.



P.S. if you ask them nicely will they let you swim in the fish tank?

Cors
It's A Trap
It's A Trap Alliance
Posted - 2009.02.04 13:46:00 - [19]
 

I loved the talk on 0.0 sov. And how to get 0.0 more populated.

It's quite simple.

People stay in empire because it's "Safe"er.

So make is so that major alliance's can make 0.0 "safe"er.

Setup a system that ties in with the SOV system. Make Sov 5. Sov 5 is directly tied to the systems NEXT to it. If one of the systems next to a sov 5 System get taken, the sov 5 system devolves to a sov 4 system.

In the Sov 5 system, only those who are +10 to the alliance can enter.

This will create pockets of "safe" space in 0.0.

this will pull the industiralists out of empire to mine/build in those systems.

If it's a system with an NPC mission agent, it'll help pull folks from emipre to run missions.

This will also allow 0.0 alliance's to create sov 5 systems at strategic choke points to block off their space.

This is a GOOD thing, as this will give a focus for PVP. The Sov 4 systems surrounding the Sov 5 systems will become targets for alliance's.

This will give 0.0 alliance's a potential way to introduce 0.0 life to carebears slowly.

People carebear in high sec due to the safety. Give a similar safety in 0.0 in small numbers, and you'll give folks a reason to leave high sec.

In the long term, as more and more systems are made into Sov 5 systems, we'll see more and more pvp takeing place in the Sov 1/2/3 systems. Combat fronts will appear where pvp will be focused. These fronts will focus pvp into smaller areas, with tighter target density.

Abrazzar
Posted - 2009.02.04 13:56:00 - [20]
 

I prefer Devblogs. At least those have substance and are not talking about things that may or may not, partly, completely or not at all in the same, similar or different shape as discussed some day, eventually maybe or never come on the live server.

Kayosoni
Caldari
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
Posted - 2009.02.04 13:56:00 - [21]
 

Meeting seems to have lacked much substance besides talking about sov mechanic.

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2009.02.04 14:11:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Cors
I loved the talk on 0.0 sov. And how to get 0.0 more populated.

It's quite simple.

People stay in empire because it's "Safe"er.

So make is so that major alliance's can make 0.0 "safe"er.

Setup a system that ties in with the SOV system. Make Sov 5. Sov 5 is directly tied to the systems NEXT to it. If one of the systems next to a sov 5 System get taken, the sov 5 system devolves to a sov 4 system.

In the Sov 5 system, only those who are +10 to the alliance can enter.

This will create pockets of "safe" space in 0.0.

this will pull the industiralists out of empire to mine/build in those systems.

If it's a system with an NPC mission agent, it'll help pull folks from emipre to run missions.

This will also allow 0.0 alliance's to create sov 5 systems at strategic choke points to block off their space.

This is a GOOD thing, as this will give a focus for PVP. The Sov 4 systems surrounding the Sov 5 systems will become targets for alliance's.

This will give 0.0 alliance's a potential way to introduce 0.0 life to carebears slowly.

People carebear in high sec due to the safety. Give a similar safety in 0.0 in small numbers, and you'll give folks a reason to leave high sec.

In the long term, as more and more systems are made into Sov 5 systems, we'll see more and more pvp takeing place in the Sov 1/2/3 systems. Combat fronts will appear where pvp will be focused. These fronts will focus pvp into smaller areas, with tighter target density.


That's a truly dreadful idea. Giving alliances the ability to lock the rest of eve out of whole systems would be awful for the game. Destructible gate guns or whatever: fine. Flat out closing off a system: HELL NO.

Thargat
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.02.04 16:23:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Omber Zombie
did i mention i made a movie?




That video was awesome, but it was faster than a pre nerf vagabond, I can barely read that fast. Very Happy

Omarvelous
Destry's Lounge
Important Internet Spaceship League
Posted - 2009.02.04 16:45:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Cors


In the Sov 5 system, only those who are +10 to the alliance can enter.

This will create pockets of "safe" space in 0.0.


I'd rather have a dangerous low populated area than this awful awful idea.

Seriously - blocking off access to accommodate carebears?! Keep them in high sec.

Use financial rewards to lure pople out of safety - not blocking off access.

Thargat
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2009.02.04 16:53:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Omarvelous
Originally by: Cors


In the Sov 5 system, only those who are +10 to the alliance can enter.

This will create pockets of "safe" space in 0.0.


I'd rather have a dangerous low populated area than this awful awful idea.

Seriously - blocking off access to accommodate carebears?! Keep them in high sec.

Use financial rewards to lure pople out of safety - not blocking off access.


This better? http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=986402 ugh

Kayosoni
Caldari
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
Posted - 2009.02.04 18:48:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Thargat
Originally by: Omber Zombie
did i mention i made a movie?




That video was awesome, but it was faster than a pre nerf vagabond, I can barely read that fast. Very Happy


Actually I really like the idea of of controlling gates with a regional sov system. You get something of real substance for laying claim to some space so intently. Personally I think using gates as KoTH control points is what should contribute to Sov.

Smog890
Minmatar
Blackwater USA Inc.
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2009.02.04 19:27:00 - [27]
 

You did not bring up this topic http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=975896 I did a quick search for it but nothing on faction warfare!!!

Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
Posted - 2009.02.04 20:47:00 - [28]
 

Why do CCP keep trying to get PvE people into PvP or into 0.0. The very nature of PvE people means they mostly don't want to do PvP or move to 0.0. FW failed as the PvE people mostly don't want to be shot at by other players so they don't do the FW missions. The PvP don't want to PvE so they don't do the missions. There needs to be content just for the PvE people and just for the PvP people.

Kazzac Elentria
Posted - 2009.02.04 20:49:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Pottsey
Why do CCP keep trying to get PvE people into PvP or into 0.0. The very nature of PvE people means they mostly don't want to do PvP or move to 0.0. FW failed as the PvE people mostly don't want to be shot at by other players so they don't do the FW missions. The PvP don't want to PvE so they don't do the missions. There needs to be content just for the PvE people and just for the PvP people.


Because this is a PvP game, period. You can and should be able to be killed anywhere at anytime for any reason given sufficient planning and force for your attacker.

Sorta makes this game unique among the other MMOs

Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
Posted - 2009.02.04 21:44:00 - [30]
 

Kazzac Elentria said " Because this is a PvP game, period."
It is not a PvP game period. It's a PvP and a PvE game. Many people play it as a PvE only game and lots of the content is clearly PvE. Eve is by no means unique among other MMO's.

PvE to Eve is just as important as PvP. Tryingf to force all the PvE people into PvP is just going hurt Eve. For Eve to survive it needs a balance between PvP and PvE.


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