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blankseplocked Expensive high end clones is bad game design.
 
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Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Posted - 2008.10.31 15:11:00 - [31]
 

Really weird to hear that. I spend more gametime in 0.0 and lowsec than in Empire and I think my 150mil+ implant clones die about once every 2nd-3rd month or so.

A 70mil+ SP player with +3's will have a clone that cost about 50mil to replace. Jumpclone out of it when it's a fleetfight and you know you might die, use it for roaming/small scale, say you lose one every 2nd month and that's 25mil a month. Less than a mil/day.

I've been using that system for quite some time, so far I have lost zero clones with implants. In high risk ops I've jumpcloned to a clear clone. For 95% of my roaming PvP I've been running 150mil+ implant clones. Havn't lost a single one.

Pretend I have 70mil SP, I fly no implants in fleets and +3's rest of the time. I doubt you still would lose more than 50-100mil a month in clones. That's one or a few hours of ratting, or a few running lv4's.

And as I said before, a few rats or a single lv4 will pay your clone with no implants, so I don't see the issue. It has to be a troll OP.

Ghost Goat
Posted - 2008.10.31 15:13:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Nexus Kinnon
Seriously? You're whining about clone costs? Really?
Neutral


the man have a point , save your whines to more important things ,
this is a dead cause .

Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Posted - 2008.10.31 15:15:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: Kuar Z'thain
You know what I do sometimes? I fly in a clone worth 500m in a ship worth less than 1/10th that.


Actually that sounds about the benchmark to me. Razz

Dictor/Ceptor etc = 150mil implants.
HAC/HIC or low sec BS = 500mil implants.
Fleet tackler = 0mil implants.
Capital = depends, 0mil for cap vs cap, supercap, 4-5bil.

Implants improve performance by a crapload, but meh, the more people that whine about isk and refuse to pay it.. the better for those that fly with 'em plugged in. Twisted Evil

Ghost Goat
Posted - 2008.10.31 15:25:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Misanth

Implants improve performance by a crapload, but meh, the more people that whine about isk and refuse to pay it.. the better for those that fly with 'em plugged in. Twisted Evil


i meant attributes implants not skill hard wiring ,that's a whole different story.

Shard Merchant
Minmatar
Posted - 2008.10.31 15:27:00 - [35]
 

No one says you're entitled to high skillpoints with no tradeoffs simply because you played a long time. I have 90mil, and I think its great game design. Although, its funny that my clone is about to cost 30mil isk for the THIRD TIME. They keep nerfing the price. I also pvp heavily and have been podded in combat about four times, most of that being 0.0. I've spent ten times more on agent locators than I have on replacing clones.

This is really one of the more worthless reasons to complain about. I don't get how some people spot something they don't like, and immediately think its a flaw, a bug or bad game design.

Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Posted - 2008.10.31 15:32:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Ghost Goat
i meant attributes implants not skill hard wiring ,that's a whole different story.


In essence those improve your performance as well, seeing as you skill up faster = you get better.

But I assume people mix attribute implants and hardwiring. I know I do at least. Either you run low-/high-grades, which gives a few +stats alongside the other effect. Or you run hardwires with pure stat enhancers. Five +4's with five 3%'s is ~150mil. Five +3's with 1%'s is not much more than 75mil.

Ghost Goat
Posted - 2008.10.31 15:44:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: Misanth
Originally by: Ghost Goat
i meant attributes implants not skill hard wiring ,that's a whole different story.


In essence those improve your performance as well, seeing as you skill up faster = you get better.

But I assume people mix attribute implants and hardwiring. I know I do at least. Either you run low-/high-grades, which gives a few +stats alongside the other effect. Or you run hardwires with pure stat enhancers. Five +4's with five 3%'s is ~150mil. Five +3's with 1%'s is not much more than 75mil.


well you obviously don't die as much as i do Laughing
guess its about play style , if im attacking someone
im staying there till one of us is dead , which is usually me .

blasters ftw Razz

but im not complaining ,was just answering someone question .
so lets stop derailing this fail whine thread and let it die in peace .


Ghoest
Posted - 2008.10.31 16:11:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Kuar Z'thain
Originally by: Ghoest
Seriously some of these response are stupid.

1 50 mill sp doesnt help you make any more isk than 20 mill sp.
Once you hit 15 or 20 mill sp earning money depends on the time you spend earning money not you skill points.

2 The need to avoid PVP is why this is stupid game design. Yes you can safely sit in high sec - thats not what the game is suposed to be about.



By design CCP has made it so adding SP broadens your character with out making you much better. Thats fine, but if high SP doesnt make you richer or tougher you shouldnt have to pay for it.


You know that character you bought with mommies credit card? Give it to me, cause it's obvious you don't know how to play this game.

Someone that has invested the time to get to 50m sp knows plenty of ways to earn passive income to offset the cost of that clone and a full set of +5s with plenty of hardwirings.

You know what I do sometimes? I fly in a clone worth 500m in a ship worth less than 1/10th that.

Man up nancyboy.




lolz at the bob newb

clonkrieger
Imperium Forces
Nulli Tertius
Posted - 2008.10.31 16:23:00 - [39]
 


You obviously can't be arsed to make ISK, because you have to invest your time to do so. Get into a corp with an alliance and start belt running, or just trade/mine/ or mission run.

Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2008.10.31 16:41:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Misanth
Really weird to hear that. I spend more gametime in 0.0 and lowsec than in Empire and I think my 150mil+ implant clones die about once every 2nd-3rd month or so.

I plug in +4's as I need them, and currently I got all my clones with full sets cause I just don't seem to get podded lately, even though I'm doing 0.0 and pew pew. (Begone; jinxing)

So the question really should be; Where is the OP getting all that awesome pew pew that causes clone upgrades to drain his wallet?

Bish Ounen
Gallente
Best Path Inc.
Cult of War
Posted - 2008.10.31 16:50:00 - [41]
 

Edited by: Bish Ounen on 31/10/2008 16:50:19
10 M isk and you are complaining? OMG WHINER!

I've been paying over 10m for clones for some time now. don't even bat an eye at it. and I almost never have more than 100 Million ISK in my wallet at any one time. Just die less.

Barkaial Starfinder
Minmatar
The Kairos Syndicate
Transmission Lost
Posted - 2008.10.31 17:21:00 - [42]
 

I almost replied seriously, but this can't be serious...

Snake Doctor
MacroIntel
Posted - 2008.10.31 17:24:00 - [43]
 

In my experience, 50m sp players don't usually have a hard time coming up with 10 or 12 million....

Spurty
Caldari
V0LTA
VOLTA Corp
Posted - 2008.10.31 17:30:00 - [44]
 

if they have negative security status, they can't just simply run a level 4 mission or 2 to pay for the clone.

If they can't afford it and get podded down to 20mill from 50mill sp, they still can't get to high sec to make the isk back, but they probably have enough isk to afford a clone (could also sell 90% of those ships you can no longer pilot lol).

That or just retire to jita.

Insurance should also pay out on implants tbh. You don't get enough back for the cost.

daisy dook
Posted - 2008.10.31 17:30:00 - [45]
 

Personally I don't mind the SP loss with the standard clone; I just don't feel the need to buy an expensive medical clone.

After all SPs regenerate.

Ghoest
Posted - 2008.10.31 17:56:00 - [46]
 

Edited by: Ghoest on 31/10/2008 17:56:30
It would be cool if you could cancel out skills you dont want(of course you couldnt cancel out something that was required for a skill you had kept.)

Spurty
Caldari
V0LTA
VOLTA Corp
Posted - 2008.10.31 18:01:00 - [47]
 

yah, only knocks you back 10% of the skillpoints on your most invested skill.

I think it took me just 9 days to get back into HACs after I rushed back into a fight without renewing my clone (should be a check box for this to be automatically done if you arrive in a station with accessible medical service).

Cheaper to just sell a GTC if your future has lots of poddings in it.

Bellum Eternus
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2008.10.31 18:04:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: Ghoest
50 million points in combat is no more likely to win a fight than 20 million in combat.

50 million in a trading focus isnt going to earn more than 20 million in trading.

All it does is unfairly punish long term players who want to PVP.
5 million isk clones are annoying but ok. 8 Million ik clones are more annoying but you put up with it. 10 million plus for a clone isnt fun it just a stick in the eye at the most faithful customers.


10m? Try losing a pod worth 4+ bil and then you can maybe be allowed to post. Maybe.

Faife
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2008.10.31 18:35:00 - [49]
 

successful troll is successful.

Korovyov
Cool Story Bro
Posted - 2008.10.31 20:03:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: Faife
successful troll is successful.


very successful is very

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2008.10.31 20:37:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: Ghoest
Seriously some of these response are stupid.

1 50 mill sp doesnt help you make any more isk than 20 mill sp.
Once you hit 15 or 20 mill sp earning money depends on the time you spend earning money not you skill points.

2 The need to avoid PVP is why this is stupid game design. Yes you can safely sit in high sec - thats not what the game is suposed to be about.



By design CCP has made it so adding SP broadens your character with out making you much better. Thats fine, but if high SP doesnt make you richer or tougher you shouldnt have to pay for it.


hahaha are you serious? you're worried about a clone that's less than the price of the rigs I put on a HAC that I'm gonna lose when I get drunk and get LOL-killed?

Seriously, people put +4s in the clones and PvP in them - even a pair is 35M or so.

making ISK is insanley easy. why the tears?

Uuve Savisaalo
Rage and Terror
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2008.10.31 20:42:00 - [52]
 

money sinks are good.
if you're at a point where your character's clones cost serious money, you should have no trouble affording it.

phanthom chancer
Posted - 2008.10.31 20:58:00 - [53]
 

Stop getting podded and it won't be a problem.

Ocih
Amarr
Space Mermaids
Posted - 2008.10.31 21:33:00 - [54]
 

I understand your gripe.

Most PvP in Eve is a 15 minute gate giggle with HIC bubbles. Losing a hundred mill to medical clone seems out of touch.

Solution given?
Don't play... why doesn't that surprise me?

I Hope you have jump bridges, avoid gates. Cloaked Sniper.

Foulque
SniggWaffe
Posted - 2008.10.31 21:35:00 - [55]
 

Kinda fail if you can't afford 10-20M for a clone.

Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2008.10.31 22:59:00 - [56]
 

Wahhhh, I have too many skill points, wahhhhhh.

EVE must be very difficult for you, poor baby. Rolling Eyes

VicturusTeSaluto
Gallente
Metafarmers
MeatSausage EXPRESS
Posted - 2008.11.01 00:04:00 - [57]
 

just use a jump clone

Jacob Mei
Gallente
Posted - 2008.11.01 02:01:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: Ghoest
50 million points in combat is no more likely to win a fight than 20 million in combat.

50 million in a trading focus isnt going to earn more than 20 million in trading.

All it does is unfairly punish long term players who want to PVP.
5 million isk clones are annoying but ok. 8 Million ik clones are more annoying but you put up with it. 10 million plus for a clone isnt fun it just a stick in the eye at the most faithful customers.


You recently got podded and dont have the isk to buy a replacement clone huh.

Strill
Posted - 2008.11.01 02:24:00 - [59]
 

Edited by: Strill on 01/11/2008 02:25:46
Originally by: Liliana Jade
No one forces you to buy a 50 million point clone, buy only 20 million point ones instead and the problem will solve itself.

You're ignoring the problem. The issue is that at 30 mil or so you reach your maximum pvp potential, and the rest of the points are just going into maxing out other types of ships. So why should the clones cost so much when you're not getting as much benefit from them?

Poast Warrior
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2008.11.01 02:53:00 - [60]
 

You think that's bad, other day I got podded and wasn't paying close attention to the clone screen. I see 45,000,000 and I think it's SP. Yeah, that's the one I need. Instead I picked the 45,000,000 ISK clone which gives me 156,000,000 SP. Whoops.

I guess I'm good on the clone for uh.. oh about 9 or 10 years =/


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