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Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.09.01 16:00:00 - [391]
 

You can't balance the game based on cheaters and if that's the only argument then, well, I think CCP's course is clear. If people start buying more ISK, then the GMs will ramp up enforcement and start removing more ISK.

It will NOT reduce PVP...at least meaningful PVP. "Fly out into lowsec looking for random fight" PVP would instead be replaced by "Fly around in lowsec and defend your valuable ISK-gathering territory" PVP, which is much, much better.

Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
Posted - 2008.09.01 17:44:00 - [392]
 

Originally by: Kahega Amielden

It will NOT reduce PVP...at least meaningful PVP. "Fly out into lowsec looking for random fight" PVP would instead be replaced by "Fly around in lowsec and defend your valuable ISK-gathering territory" PVP, which is much, much better.

See this is where you have it wrong. WHO will defend their valuable areas?

Pirates? Nope, they are mostly interested in blowing others up.

Carebears? Nope, they will get blown up once and return to HighSec. Without their percieved ability to "progress" by losing their ISK source or level 4s, many will quit.

Alliance PvP alts? Nope, if they were interested in "fighting for their valuable ISK generating territories" they would be running their mains in 0.0.

Basically those that are already in lowsec will benefit, everyone else will go do something different. LowSec will still be empty. The reason? If you lose a single ship a week you have lost more trying to run level 4s in LowSec as compared to running level 3s in HighSec. At first people will move out there, but after losing a ship or two they will move back.

It is simple math that the reason no one is in LowSec is because for running missions or mining you WILL lose ships and lose them often as a PvE fitted ship will lose to a PvP fitted ship that has NPCs backing it up every time. If you take all the precautions and align to station, jump when local changes, etc then you might as well be running level 1s in empire because you cannot make ISKies while docked or cloaked in a safe spot.

No amount of rewards or nerfs will force players into LowSec, you have to make it safer for the SOLO player or they won't move there. And like it or not, most Empire corp players are essentially solo while chattering with their friends.

Ki An
Gallente
The Really Awesome Players
Posted - 2008.09.01 18:18:00 - [393]
 

Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby

See this is where you have it wrong. WHO will defend their valuable areas?

Pirates? Nope, they are mostly interested in blowing others up.

Carebears? Nope, they will get blown up once and return to HighSec. Without their percieved ability to "progress" by losing their ISK source or level 4s, many will quit.

Alliance PvP alts? Nope, if they were interested in "fighting for their valuable ISK generating territories" they would be running their mains in 0.0.

Basically those that are already in lowsec will benefit, everyone else will go do something different. LowSec will still be empty. The reason? If you lose a single ship a week you have lost more trying to run level 4s in LowSec as compared to running level 3s in HighSec. At first people will move out there, but after losing a ship or two they will move back.

It is simple math that the reason no one is in LowSec is because for running missions or mining you WILL lose ships and lose them often as a PvE fitted ship will lose to a PvP fitted ship that has NPCs backing it up every time. If you take all the precautions and align to station, jump when local changes, etc then you might as well be running level 1s in empire because you cannot make ISKies while docked or cloaked in a safe spot.

No amount of rewards or nerfs will force players into LowSec, you have to make it safer for the SOLO player or they won't move there. And like it or not, most Empire corp players are essentially solo while chattering with their friends.


You do realise that low sec used to be populated when it was worth fighting over, right?

Also, how the hell do you think any alliances start anyway. They go from being a bunch of carebears or pvpers without a purpose and get togehter and cooperate. We're trying to make it worth doing this in low sec as a stepping stone to 0.0.

Not everyone in high sec is risk averse. They are there because you get the most isk/effot there, and among the best isk/h on top of that. If the profit is moved to low sec, they will go. Not all of them, but some, and probably most. Those of you who quit, take care and good luck in whatever game you try next. I hear Age of Conan is overrun with your type, so you could go there.

Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
Posted - 2008.09.01 19:39:00 - [394]
 

Originally by: Ki An

You do realise that low sec used to be populated when it was worth fighting over, right?


Take a look at your calendar. LowSec emptied out NOT because High SEc was suddenly more lucrative, LowSec emptied out shortly after Revelations was released.

What happened in Revalations? Probing. Suddenty your deadspace missions and SS areas were not 99% safe. THe "risk" factor went up dramatically, while rewards were raised slightly.

THAT is why LowSec is empty; the risk vs reward is off in that part of the game.
Quote:

Also, how the hell do you think any alliances start anyway. They go from being a bunch of carebears or pvpers without a purpose and get togehter and cooperate. We're trying to make it worth doing this in low sec as a stepping stone to 0.0.


LowSec has never been a stepping stone to 0.0, regardless of what the Player's Guide might say. Even when I started 2 years ago people would say go straight to 0.0 because LowSec wasn't worth it.

If you want to make LowSec worth going to, that is great. Nerfing High Sec isn't the way; all it does is makes those same CAREBEARS (hint, you aren't talking people who like a struggle here) get restless and decide it isn't worth their time anymore.
Quote:

Not everyone in high sec is risk averse. They are there because you get the most isk/effot there, and among the best isk/h on top of that. If the profit is moved to low sec, they will go. Not all of them, but some, and probably most.


Look at who you are claiming are running missions in High Sec:

1) Carebears. Guess what, there IS not profit worth loss for these players. Even if they were making a Billion an hour if they lost a ship a week it is too much for some of them. If you can't guarantee the same ISK/Time ratio over a period of several months (ie, they make as much ISK or more after ship losses) they simply won't go. And most of them won't go even if they DO make more because they aren't interested in getting ganked.

2) PvPer's alts funding their PvP. Excuse me? You SERIOUSLY think these are even a little interested in risk when they are making ISK to burn elsewhere? If they were they wouldn't have alts to begin with. These accounts would just get cancelled.

3) 0.0 people making ISK is safety. This one I can't understand when they can make as much or more in 0.0 than level 4s, EXCEPT they don't have to watch over their shoulder all the time. These people wouldn't move to lowsec to do missions either, they would simply stay in 0.0

4) Farmers. As previously mentioned, these people are heavily diversified and will just do something else.

Make this change and LowSec will not increase in population, it won't be more worthwhile simply because the hunters will always have too much of an advantage over the hunted. Some small numbers might move, but the vast majority will do other activities.

Quote:

Those of you who quit, take care and good luck in whatever game you try next. I hear Age of Conan is overrun with your type, so you could go there.


Always with the "You don't belong here if you don't play my way". Here is a little hint for you: You are requesting a radical change in the game that WILL effect ALL Eve players in some way, and a large percentage of them dramatically. The burden of proving to CCP that your way is best is on you; it isn't our place to defend the status quo.

Telling CCP that those players aren't welcome isn't going to help your cause any, especially when you are seriously underestimating (IMHO) how many it will effect Wink

Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.09.01 20:08:00 - [395]
 


Quote:

Pirates? Nope, they are mostly interested in blowing others up.

Carebears? Nope, they will get blown up once and return to HighSec. Without their percieved ability to "progress" by losing their ISK source or level 4s, many will quit.

Alliance PvP alts? Nope, if they were interested in "fighting for their valuable ISK generating territories" they would be running their mains in 0.0.

Basically those that are already in lowsec will benefit, everyone else will go do something different. LowSec will still be empty. The reason? If you lose a single ship a week you have lost more trying to run level 4s in LowSec as compared to running level 3s in HighSec. At first people will move out there, but after losing a ship or two they will move back.

It is simple math that the reason no one is in LowSec is because for running missions or mining you WILL lose ships and lose them often as a PvE fitted ship will lose to a PvP fitted ship that has NPCs backing it up every time. If you take all the precautions and align to station, jump when local changes, etc then you might as well be running level 1s in empire because you cannot make ISKies while docked or cloaked in a safe spot.

No amount of rewards or nerfs will force players into LowSec, you have to make it safer for the SOLO player or they won't move there. And like it or not, most Empire corp players are essentially solo while chattering with their friends.


Dumb carebears will get blown up and return to hisec. Smart ones will organize, dodge and fight the pirates. I am of course aware that people would just run level 3s, which is why I am in favor of a blanket hisec mission nerf (full scaling rewards, bounties/loot included, by sec status) so that running 3s to make almost as much ISK would not be an option.

You wont lose ships while running a mission unless you're not paying attention. There are too many damn tools at your disposal to stop that from happening, and in my vast experiences with lowsec exploration (EASIER to probe down than in a mission) I have NEVER been caught...even when flying in hisec/lowsec border systems that are usually brimming with pirates compared to the rest of it.

I don't give a **** if people are too scared to move out there. I really don't care if one person moves out to lowsec (although a lot would). What I care about is that people who DO go into lowsec are appropriately rewarded and people who sit in the safe, secure zones aren't making huge amounts of easy ISK.

Ki An
Gallente
The Really Awesome Players
Posted - 2008.09.01 21:09:00 - [396]
 

Originally by: Kahega Amielden
I don't give a **** if people are too scared to move out there. I really don't care if one person moves out to lowsec (although a lot would). What I care about is that people who DO go into lowsec are appropriately rewarded and people who sit in the safe, secure zones aren't making huge amounts of easy ISK.


This is what I've been saying all along. I don't think these people are getting it.

Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
Posted - 2008.09.01 23:44:00 - [397]
 

Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Kahega Amielden
I don't give a **** if people are too scared to move out there. I really don't care if one person moves out to lowsec (although a lot would). What I care about is that people who DO go into lowsec are appropriately rewarded and people who sit in the safe, secure zones aren't making huge amounts of easy ISK.


This is what I've been saying all along. I don't think these people are getting it.


Then advocate a method of rewards that doesn't screw over a large portion of the player base and you might actually have a chance of getting it. You aren't advocating making LowSec more valuable, you are advocting nerfing a huge portion of the game.

I don't think these people are getting it Wink

Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.09.02 00:36:00 - [398]
 

Edited by: Kahega Amielden on 02/09/2008 00:42:23
Quote:
Then advocate a method of rewards that doesn't screw over a large portion of the player base and you might actually have a chance of getting it. You aren't advocating making LowSec more valuable, you are advocting nerfing a huge portion of the game.


If the problem is an overpowered profession and the majority of the player base use it then THERE IS NO WAY TO FIX IT WITHOUT "Screwing them over".

And the only reason missioning is a huge portion of the game is because it's the perfect money maker.


Should we move Crokite/bistot and the high-end 10/10 DED plexes to hisec? Why not?

Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
Posted - 2008.09.02 04:55:00 - [399]
 

Edited by: Anaalys Fluuterby on 02/09/2008 04:57:23
Originally by: Kahega Amielden

And the only reason missioning is a huge portion of the game is because it's the perfect money maker.


Believe it or not, a large percentage of those players LIKE to run missions. Same as some people LIKE to mine Ice (why? I can't comprehend why, I feel my soul shriveling even trying).

Originally by: Kahega Amielden

Should we move Crokite/bistot and the high-end 10/10 DED plexes to hisec? Why not?

*looks* Nope, they aren't there now. Hence for me to ask for them would be a major game-altering feat. I would be hard-pressed for even considering getting people or CCP to agree with this one. The Status Quo, and all that mentioned above.

If we were discussing whether level 4s belonged in HighSec before they were first implemented you might be able to pursuade me but it is WAY too late to take them out now. It would be like telling 0.0 players "Hey, we want to balance everything. No more sovereignty, no more caps and Concord will be at every gate to make things safer and more player-friendly."

Too much of what your average player does in eve revolves around missions and the results there of. You can't just take such a significant part of their daily eve lives out without huge consequences. It would cause more subscription losses than going to consensual PvP in High Sec, I can pretty much guarantee, and is as radical of a move to those players it would effect.

And yes, moving level 4s to LowSec IS taking them away from the majority of HighSec players because they WILL NOT go there to run missions. Something the PvPer types don't seem to understand. Maybe try listening to some of the Carebears for once and learning how they think?

Right now Eve is a pretty good balance between PvE and PvP players, leave it alone.

Ki An
Gallente
The Really Awesome Players
Posted - 2008.09.02 12:44:00 - [400]
 

Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby
Edited by: Anaalys Fluuterby on 02/09/2008 04:57:23
Originally by: Kahega Amielden

And the only reason missioning is a huge portion of the game is because it's the perfect money maker.


Believe it or not, a large percentage of those players LIKE to run missions. Same as some people LIKE to mine Ice (why? I can't comprehend why, I feel my soul shriveling even trying).


Even so, Kahega hits the point. You can't fix overpowered missions without screwing over the people who run those missions. Sure, make them more fun. Make them more dynamic. Just make them pay a lot less. It's like the nano nerf. You can't nerf nanos without screwing over the people who fly nanos. I bet they really think it's fun to fly nanos, but that's beside the point.


Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby

Right now Eve is a pretty good balance between PvE and PvP players, leave it alone.


No. You make the PvE/PvP distinction where no such distinction should be. PvE should only be possible in a highly competitive environment. There should be no free rides.

Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
Posted - 2008.09.02 13:08:00 - [401]
 

Originally by: Ki An

No. You make the PvE/PvP distinction where no such distinction should be. PvE should only be possible in a highly competitive environment. There should be no free rides.


So you keep saying. CCP says otherwise.

You still haven't convinced me why your idea would be good for Eve as a game and ensure its survival.

Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
Posted - 2008.09.02 13:12:00 - [402]
 

I had a lengthy post written with arguments and such ...

Why bother ... screw the missions so I won't regret not continuing my subscription. It's the last thing still keeping me in game (but why would anybody bother, right?).

I think the Goons realy are successful with destroying the game for everybody else and some people even help them ...


Nilder Shadowfiyah
Caldari
3rd Millennium Group
Revival Of The Talocan Empire
Posted - 2008.09.02 13:19:00 - [403]
 

Edited by: Nilder Shadowfiyah on 02/09/2008 13:23:50
Level 1 = 1.0 & 0.9
Level 2 = 0.8 & 0.7
Level 3 = 0.6 & 0.5
Level 4 = 0.4 & 0.3
Level 5 = 0.2 & 0.1
As the stations in 0.0 are mostly player ran giving them mission agents won't work well. I say this because they are not stable enough for consistent missioning. Conquerable !

Momo chan
Posted - 2008.09.08 04:08:00 - [404]
 

Originally by: Nilder Shadowfiyah
Edited by: Nilder Shadowfiyah on 02/09/2008 13:23:50
Level 1 = 1.0 & 0.9
Level 2 = 0.8 & 0.7
Level 3 = 0.6 & 0.5
Level 4 = 0.4 & 0.3
Level 5 = 0.2 & 0.1
As the stations in 0.0 are mostly player ran giving them mission agents won't work well. I say this because they are not stable enough for consistent missioning. Conquerable !

Makes sense.

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2008.09.08 06:11:00 - [405]
 

Originally by: Nilder Shadowfiyah
Edited by: Nilder Shadowfiyah on 02/09/2008 13:23:50
Level 1 = 1.0 & 0.9
Level 2 = 0.8 & 0.7
Level 3 = 0.6 & 0.5
Level 4 = 0.4 & 0.3
Level 5 = 0.2 & 0.1
As the stations in 0.0 are mostly player ran giving them mission agents won't work well. I say this because they are not stable enough for consistent missioning. Conquerable !


Um, what's that got to do with anything? Leaving aside the fact that stations don't change hands all that often, if an alliance decides to spend the ISK on a hypothetical outpost upgrade to provide an agent then that's an investment they're making, just like adding a refinery upgrade.

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2008.09.08 06:14:00 - [406]
 

Originally by: Hugh Ruka
I had a lengthy post written with arguments and such ...

Why bother ... screw the missions so I won't regret not continuing my subscription. It's the last thing still keeping me in game (but why would anybody bother, right?).

I think the Goons realy are successful with destroying the game for everybody else and some people even help them ...




So if hi-sec missions were made more entertaining but less lucrative, you'd quit? Being able to endlessly grind dull, safe, repetitive kill-missions is the only thing keeping you subscribed?

Jerni
Posted - 2008.09.08 06:44:00 - [407]
 


Venkul Mul
Gallente
Posted - 2008.09.08 07:53:00 - [408]
 

Originally by: Malcanis


So if hi-sec missions were made more entertaining but less lucrative, you'd quit? Being able to endlessly grind dull, safe, repetitive kill-missions is the only thing keeping you subscribed?



The average idea here by anti mission guys is make them more grind and less rewarding, nerfing them both ways.

They see them as mining Arknor or Bistot and want them to move them to mining ice. Especially Ki An and his clones, not a surprise has he has stated more than once his pure hatred for mission runners.

To avoid large or huge after effects mission running must be changes with the chisel, doing a small change and then looking the effects (some of the new missions seem to go that way from the reports of people running them), you and your friends want want to sue the sledgehammer.

eliminator2
Gallente
Vindicated Blast.

Posted - 2008.09.08 08:27:00 - [409]
 

i support this

since they got rid of lofty scams and made it harder to high sec gank the reward for missioning/cearbearing is to high v risk CCP say there game is equal on RiskVreward but they are missing the fact that carebearing has to risk no more part from beeing scammed in jita but thats there own fault for not reading and nowing what is and what not ^^

FIX THE RISK IN HIGH SEC

eliminator2
Gallente
Vindicated Blast.
Posted - 2008.09.08 08:35:00 - [410]
 

Originally by: Anaalys Fluuterby
Originally by: Ki An

You do realise that low sec used to be populated when it was worth fighting over, right?





Quote:

Also, how the hell do you think any alliances start anyway. They go from being a bunch of carebears or pvpers without a purpose and get togehter and cooperate. We're trying to make it worth doing this in low sec as a stepping stone to 0.0.


LowSec has never been a stepping stone to 0.0, regardless of what the Player's Guide might say. Even when I started 2 years ago people would say go straight to 0.0 because LowSec wasn't worth it.

Quote:

Not everyone in high sec is risk averse. They are there because you get the most isk/effot there, and among the best isk/h on top of that. If the profit is moved to low sec, they will go. Not all of them, but some, and probably most.



ok for one thing allainces DO start in low sec not all go to 0.0 straight away /me looks at MC and the pirate allainces for example. so before u carebears claim u no how everythin starts u should think allainces do start in low sec and some dnt the ones that dont used to be in low sec as a corporation and then growed to a allaince which they moved to 0.0 allready for and the ones that dont start of as a corp in low sec grow into a allaince in low sec and then grow into 0.0 and start wtf pwning isk farmers and other people or start dying (HYDRA)

sorry for bad typing iv just woke up :D

Opertone
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2008.09.08 09:05:00 - [411]
 

people who advocate the nerf of hi sec never play in high sec...

Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
Posted - 2008.09.08 11:01:00 - [412]
 

Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Hugh Ruka
I had a lengthy post written with arguments and such ...

Why bother ... screw the missions so I won't regret not continuing my subscription. It's the last thing still keeping me in game (but why would anybody bother, right?).

I think the Goons realy are successful with destroying the game for everybody else and some people even help them ...




So if hi-sec missions were made more entertaining but less lucrative, you'd quit? Being able to endlessly grind dull, safe, repetitive kill-missions is the only thing keeping you subscribed?


sorry, but I missed the part about making mission interesting in the OP.

Mixing in PvP dangers does not make the mission interesting ... it's still the same mission just lot more dangerous.

oh yeah, I wrote it's the last thing keeping me here ... that should imply I tried lots of other things ... seems you did not catch that ...

Ash Bringer
Posted - 2008.09.08 11:53:00 - [413]
 

Moving all lvl4 agents to 0.0 is dream of big 0.0 alliances.

Lvl3s in lowsec actually by product of this dream and not even useful for anything. Probably ratting in lowsec better than farming lvl3s.

You can not group against of any 0.0 alliance. Big or Small... You go there in cloak ships and farm belts :) Because any alliance even a NPC station based corp is in 0.0 for constant pvp chance, not for the money..

The will of the OP is asking faction fitted npc ships run into 0.0 and die in their gate camps...

Btw dropping of lp and isk generated will make faction stuff much more expensive and carebear stuff much more cheaper... And a quite many account cancellations. Because there are many ppls in this game playing game for occasional lvl4s they do in relative safety of High Sec...Because its a challanging while staying comfortable...

FYI this game penalize ship+pod loss heavily .

Im against this proposal...

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2008.09.08 11:53:00 - [414]
 

Originally by: Hugh Ruka
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Hugh Ruka
I had a lengthy post written with arguments and such ...

Why bother ... screw the missions so I won't regret not continuing my subscription. It's the last thing still keeping me in game (but why would anybody bother, right?).

I think the Goons realy are successful with destroying the game for everybody else and some people even help them ...




So if hi-sec missions were made more entertaining but less lucrative, you'd quit? Being able to endlessly grind dull, safe, repetitive kill-missions is the only thing keeping you subscribed?


sorry, but I missed the part about making mission interesting in the OP.

Mixing in PvP dangers does not make the mission interesting ... it's still the same mission just lot more dangerous.

oh yeah, I wrote it's the last thing keeping me here ... that should imply I tried lots of other things ... seems you did not catch that ...


Seems you didn't catch that I said "entertaining", not "dangerous". Seriously, all you want to do is log in, and do the same old kill missions, lining up a bunch of completely predictable red + and popping them? Kill missions are basically space invaders on a nice 3D backdrop.

Damned Force
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2008.09.08 12:47:00 - [415]
 

Edited by: Damned Force on 08/09/2008 12:48:27
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Hugh Ruka
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Hugh Ruka
I had a lengthy post written with arguments and such ...

Why bother ... screw the missions so I won't regret not continuing my subscription. It's the last thing still keeping me in game (but why would anybody bother, right?).

I think the Goons realy are successful with destroying the game for everybody else and some people even help them ...




So if hi-sec missions were made more entertaining but less lucrative, you'd quit? Being able to endlessly grind dull, safe, repetitive kill-missions is the only thing keeping you subscribed?


sorry, but I missed the part about making mission interesting in the OP.

Mixing in PvP dangers does not make the mission interesting ... it's still the same mission just lot more dangerous.

oh yeah, I wrote it's the last thing keeping me here ... that should imply I tried lots of other things ... seems you did not catch that ...


Seems you didn't catch that I said "entertaining", not "dangerous". Seriously, all you want to do is log in, and do the same old kill missions, lining up a bunch of completely predictable red + and popping them? Kill missions are basically space invaders on a nice 3D backdrop.


And who are u that u can judge what peoples should do or should not, and what would entertain others? If they like to do this than they should able to do this.

Every empire CB could cry.....why so big part of eve universe is 0.0 so they cant play there for the money they pay in peace in style they like without joining 0.0 alliances???
So lets make every 0.0 to highsec ........

Would be that not a bit sux? Because what the guys here suggest is the same with the CB's

P.S.: No im not a chinese isk farmer, my english sux just because i never learned english and because the majority of the forums would not understand what i write if i would use my mother language

Karii Ildarian
Caldari
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2008.09.08 14:02:00 - [416]
 

Here is a solution to the OP's problem, doesn't need any intervention from CCP and that can be done today!


1. If you just hate carebear missioners and;

2. This hatred propels your nerd rage to a fever pitch. You can;

3. Get some of your nerd raging buddies together and start invading high sec missions.

4. While there, steal loot, salvage, whatever you like.

5. Hell, shoot a few rats and get some bounties while you are at it and, of course;

6. Even get the chance of annoying a poor carebear, to the point where it decides to open fire on your flashy ass;

7. Profit... YARRRR!!

...or you can just continue to whine for CCP to do your job for you, but I wouldn't hold my breath for that...

procurement specialist
Posted - 2008.09.08 14:17:00 - [417]
 

Originally by: Ash Bringer
Moving all lvl4 agents to 0.0 is dream of big 0.0 alliances.

Lvl3s in lowsec actually by product of this dream and not even useful for anything. Probably ratting in lowsec better than farming lvl3s.

You can not group against of any 0.0 alliance. Big or Small... You go there in cloak ships and farm belts :) Because any alliance even a NPC station based corp is in 0.0 for constant pvp chance, not for the money..

The will of the OP is asking faction fitted npc ships run into 0.0 and die in their gate camps...

Btw dropping of lp and isk generated will make faction stuff much more expensive and carebear stuff much more cheaper... And a quite many account cancellations. Because there are many ppls in this game playing game for occasional lvl4s they do in relative safety of High Sec...Because its a challanging while staying comfortable...

FYI this game penalize ship+pod loss heavily .

Im against this proposal...


the biggest problem in 0.0 is simply that it isn't scalable. you reach belt saturation point ratters and miners normally very quickly. it takes a lot of intelligence to keep a few systems safe enough for people in big pve fit ships to come out to make isk. this requires a lot of people to maintain while at the same time reducing the rewards. 3 ratters can take care of 12 belts. 2 can with really nice fits and skills.

In u4 in syndicate their is an l4 kill agent q20 and an entire corp use to pay a fee just to have access to that station. that single agent was worth the 150m a month tax on that corp.

that is my biggest problem with both sides. empire argues that 0.0 can make 60m/hour ratting and leave them alone and 0.0 people complain that that only happens every third blue moon on a tuesday when they are mystically alone in system.

i normally mine 0.0 but have been running l3 and l4 mission (courier and kill) in lowsec and now l3 kill mission in high sec to get standings for a datacore agent. i have seen both sides the last few weeks. Empire is even more dangerous for me because of war decs on my main.

Damned Force
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2008.09.08 15:02:00 - [418]
 

Originally by: procurement specialisti normally mine 0.0 but have been running l3 and l4 mission (courier and kill) in lowsec and now l3 kill mission in high sec to get standings for a datacore agent. i have seen both sides the last few weeks. Empire is even more dangerous for me because of war decs on my main.[/quote


Agree. I was long enough as CB in empire as pirate in lowsec and even in 0.0 too. If u not in noobcorp, than highsec is more dangerouse......

if u want to make some change, than force peoples out of noobcorps after a time, so they can be wardecced. For example u cant get enough standing in noobcorp to make lvl4 missions, or after a defined ammount of SP or or or

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2008.09.08 22:56:00 - [419]
 

Originally by: Damned Force


And who are u that u can judge what peoples should do or should not, and what would entertain others? If they like to do this than they should able to do this.

Every empire CB could cry.....why so big part of eve universe is 0.0 so they cant play there for the money they pay in peace in style they like without joining 0.0 alliances???
So lets make every 0.0 to highsec ........

Would be that not a bit sux? Because what the guys here suggest is the same with the CB's

P.S.: No im not a chinese isk farmer, my english sux just because i never learned english and because the majority of the forums would not understand what i write if i would use my mother language



Damb dude, you're mighty defensive about a bunch of stuff I didn't say. I thought it was a pretty uncontentious assertion to say that missions in EvE are dull and unimaginative.

Sidrat Flush
Caldari
Eve Industrial Corp
Posted - 2008.09.09 02:27:00 - [420]
 

Currently watching the end of the packers game. Read whole thread = NO not at all.

Nerf empire missions? Why? Whole game out of balance. Yes.

Okay so what we have here is the skewed isk making machine that is fun and "safe" in empire (no ships should be lost in a mission short of desync or lag) and the fun ratting/mining/exploration and pvp in 0.0.

So you move all level 4 agents to 0.4 and 0.3: The missions don't change the ship fittings do. Supposing the systems that get seeded see an increase in population as an individual you have a much lower chance of being the one that gets probed out and "ganked".

I'm all for keeping eve the pvp game I love, even though I rarely pvp myself.

will it truely make low sec more profitable than empire?

Not really if you can run level 3 missions in perfect safety for less isk, they are actually even easier to do anyway so you can run an extra one or two anyway.

Another point is that the casual players log in to say hello to corp mates as well as run missions/mine with them. I call myself a casual player because a) I live in empire. b) I mission and mine in empire and c) I can't be arsed with 0.0 politics, lag and capital online. I'm not isk rich but I do tell other players about 0.0 and what it takes to survive out there (to start with minimal requirements at least what I had when I first went). It's made me a better empire citizen at least and I won't break a sweat if I take some corp mates to a low sec system to do a level 4 mission or two because it might get the heart pumping and it'll mean the pirates will have more work to be successful.

This post is my own opinions and not that of my current corp.


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