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Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2008.06.03 22:37:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Ferocious FeAr
For the first month (like level 5 missions did) then it will die out and it will be a waste of major patch release.

Sigh..


L5s are a waste primarily because of the fairly low rewards given the time and organization that goes into doing them. I know some corps which did them and can do them, but it's simply not worth it financially.

The major issue I see with FW is that it's simply not going to be worth it all that much (low rewards) but we'll have to wait and see.

Larkonis Trassler
Doctrine.
Posted - 2008.06.04 01:44:00 - [32]
 

I've played around a little on test and me and my guys are going to pop down and give it a blast a few days a week.
It looks like fun tbh.
It will attract it's share of solo PVP noobs in ridiculously expensive ships but there is also plenty of potential for some very fun and more importantly very cheap PVP for all parties involved. While some may call it 'PVP lite' it's a nice way to break in those who don't have a clue.
First chance I get I shall be jumping a load of ready fit T1 frigs and cruisers down their for some solo/small gang disposable fun.

Gatecamps? Laugh as you breeze past them in a nano cruiser or frig.
Plex entrances? OH NOES A BS! Good thing I'm in a T1 frig that is able to align and warp in before he's even finished locking me.

From my experiences on test the militia channels are full of all sorts, pirates and noobs a like x'ing up in the militia channels to go and innitiate some pwnage. This is where the likes of Eve voice will come into it's own assuming you don't get a host of clueless noobs/wannabe FCs with more mouth than talent spamming the channels.

Stop whining, wait for it to come, grow a pair, grab an empty clone and a dozen cheap ships and get stuck in.

Najri
Got Buddha
Posted - 2008.06.04 14:10:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: Faife
Originally by: Spectre3353
Ernest Vincent Wright wrote a novel with over 50,000 words, none of which containing the letter "E".


He spelled his name on the front as rnst Vincnt Wright c/d?


and on the back a sticker saying PRIC $9.99 ?

TerrorLucy
Amarr
Posted - 2008.06.04 14:14:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Najri
Originally by: Faife
Originally by: Spectre3353
Ernest Vincent Wright wrote a novel with over 50,000 words, none of which containing the letter "E".


He spelled his name on the front as rnst Vincnt Wright c/d?


and on the back a sticker saying PRIC $9.99 ?


No thats the sticker on YOUR back (without the 9.99) Razz

Jakke Logan
Caldari
F Off And Die
Posted - 2008.06.04 16:43:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Opertone
Originally by: Jakke Logan
Will FW revive lowsec?

Sure. For about a week, which is what I expect is the longest it will take for all the chokepoints and static sites to be bookmarked.

Figure for about a week (maybe less) the FW content will actually get used, followed by a week or so of mass pirate/0.0 alliance nuking of the noobs, followed by every week thereafter of no one even attempting to do the missions.

Duh. If the Devs don't know that this is what's going to happen, well, they need new leadership.

I'm not saying that this is wrong. It's lowsec after all, the domain of pirates. What is wrong is CCP's poor design of this system, which they intend to bring noobs out in T1 frigates and cruisers into an area where they can (and will) get destroyed repeatedly by people in better ships with more skillpoints. It's a very poor concept, and it's why FW is destined to fail. It never should have been aimed at the noobs (though they could have added a highsec series of PVE FW missions and content) it should have been a system aimed at EXISTING lowsec and 0.0 pvp'ers.




i agree... they also expect new players to bring new Navy Cruisers, which cost around 60-100 mill a piece to these contested sites.

maybe the CCP has to put it right and restrict choke points control... why can't you PVP at the same beacon location? Why do you have to club the carebear down with your 10+ camp when he jumps in.

Honestly, i am against chokepoint camping, there is much more fun in actual PVPing with someone in asteroid belts or beacons.

I want them to fix GATE warfare and STATION camp warfare... both are ridiculous.


Furthermore if they think that excluding alliances will keep them out... the Devs are hopelessly naive. I expect superpowers like the Goons and BOB to send blobs in to blow up the faction warriors just for spite. I fully expect the powerblocks to SEEK the ruination of FW.

As well they should. Make CCP re-do it the right way.


Larkonis Trassler
Doctrine.
Posted - 2008.06.04 19:36:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Jakke Logan


Furthermore if they think that excluding alliances will keep them out... the Devs are hopelessly naive. I expect superpowers like the Goons and BOB to send blobs in to blow up the faction warriors just for spite. I fully expect the powerblocks to SEEK the ruination of FW.

As well they should. Make CCP re-do it the right way.





That is the funniest thing I've heard yet. BOB and goons have their own worries and will not waste time trying to gank FW players. Well, maybe certain Goons, but those will be a minority. Besides, if you get a bloody nose, you pick yourself up, get organised and come back and have another go.

Rono Vizu
Amarr
Imperial Shipment
Posted - 2008.06.04 21:11:00 - [37]
 

So what kind of rewards are they going to have for FW?

Larkonis Trassler
Doctrine.
Posted - 2008.06.04 22:11:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Rono Vizu
So what kind of rewards are they going to have for FW?


You get to blow stuff up, interact with other people and you know, have fun.

Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2008.06.05 10:06:00 - [39]
 

I think the biggest issue I have with FW and PvP in general is that I can't be bothered to commit a whole day to it (24 hour delay between clone jumping) and I'm sure as s**t not going to be PvP'ing in a clone with implants (simply because I'm new to PvP and will no doubt lose ship & pod within the first few encounters).

The other issue is that it's in low-sec. Low-sec means pirates and all the usual s**t you have to deal with there - gatecamps, etc. If I wanted to go to low-sec and experience all that I'd already go there.

As a pure carebear currently the only "solution" as I see it is to either move L4 missions to low-sec, make the rewards from low-sec & FW significantly greater (reward risk with... rewards), or move FW to high-sec somehow.

Lilan Kahn
Amarr
The Littlest Hobos
En Garde
Posted - 2008.06.05 10:11:00 - [40]
 

my corp wil be joining faction warfare, feel free to call us pvp noobs

Draenila
Posted - 2008.06.05 11:20:00 - [41]
 

you all make it sound like it will be noob vs experienced.

but what you dont realize is thats how it is now

what CCP is intending to happen is that both noobs and experienced players alike will join factions, I.E. the week old frig pilot will be teamed up with the 3 year old hac pilot. They want noobs to be on the same side as the experienced for a change, instead of noobs going into lowsec and dying alot because they dont have 35mil sp.

Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2008.06.05 11:28:00 - [42]
 

Edited by: Durzel on 05/06/2008 11:28:33
Originally by: Draenila
you all make it sound like it will be noob vs experienced.

but what you dont realize is thats how it is now

what CCP is intending to happen is that both noobs and experienced players alike will join factions, I.E. the week old frig pilot will be teamed up with the 3 year old hac pilot. They want noobs to be on the same side as the experienced for a change, instead of noobs going into lowsec and dying alot because they dont have 35mil sp.
Yep, it'll just be noobs going into lowsec and dying a lot because they don't have 35m sp, like the pirates that roam there and dying a lot because they're on the opposite faction to blobs with 35m sp, etc. See where this is going?

Larkonis Trassler
Doctrine.
Posted - 2008.06.05 11:34:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Durzel


The other issue is that it's in low-sec. Low-sec means pirates and all the usual s**t you have to deal with there - gatecamps, etc. If I wanted to go to low-sec and experience all that I'd already go there.



Have you ever actually been to lowsec?
I guess not.
Pirates only camp gates in certain choke points where it is profitable to do so (ie there is more than one jump per hour)and these are only camped around 30% of the time. It's easy enough to slip in if you have a look at the map. With regards to your clone buy a cheap set of +2s or +3s. Sure they won't be AS good, but who cares? Don't be such an SP *****.

Daan Sai
Polytrope
Posted - 2008.06.05 11:47:00 - [44]
 

Originally by: Cpt Branko

L5s are primarily because of the fairly low rewards given the time and organization that goes into doing them. I know some corps which did them and can do them, but it's simply not worth it financially.


True, but the good news is that the FW patch will also be introducing much improved LP rewards for L5 missions. I've done one with just the two of us, one in a passive nighthawk and one in a gank blaster hype, was cheap to run and rewards are much better. You might expect some increase in L5 mission expeditions in between the noob militia.





Gnaus
Minmatar
Tyr Na Nog'th
Roids'Are'Us
Posted - 2008.06.05 11:50:00 - [45]
 

Edited by: Gnaus on 05/06/2008 11:51:42
Originally by: Spectre3353
Ernest Vincent Wright wrote a novel with over 50,000 words, none of which containing the letter "E".


here you can find the text :
Linkage

enjoy

Melllo champers
Posted - 2008.06.05 12:01:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Durzel
Edited by: Durzel on 05/06/2008 11:28:33
Originally by: Draenila
you all make it sound like it will be noob vs experienced.

but what you dont realize is thats how it is now

what CCP is intending to happen is that both noobs and experienced players alike will join factions, I.E. the week old frig pilot will be teamed up with the 3 year old hac pilot. They want noobs to be on the same side as the experienced for a change, instead of noobs going into lowsec and dying alot because they dont have 35mil sp.
Yep, it'll just be noobs going into lowsec and dying a lot because they don't have 35m sp, like the pirates that roam there and dying a lot because they're on the opposite faction to blobs with 35m sp, etc. See where this is going?


Yeah I see where it's going. Some people (who can earn 20 million in an hour) just don't want to risk a 7 million isk cruiser to have fun. They would much rather run the same boring, low risk high reward missions 24/7 and watch their wallet grow. People who are so afraid of losing that they won't even try. Like you, they throw up ridiculous scenarios and conjure up all sorts of reasons for not doing FW. 90 % of these people would only try FW if they could fly a T1 frig and be gauranteed a reward of 100 million isk for 10 minutes sitting in losec. Just look at all the carebears crying because there is no hisec content for them to farm.

FW is not about rewards, it's about ganging with people of various sp and going out into losec to shoot other people.
It's about the challenge and the thrill.

Anybody not interested in FW should stick to those good, honourable fights and rewards that they get from NPCs in Motsu.

ShardowRhino
Caldari
Torque Theory
Posted - 2008.06.05 12:58:00 - [47]
 

Originally by: Jakke Logan
Sure. For about a week, which is what I expect is the longest it will take for all the chokepoints and static sites to be bookmarked.



1st off, FW hasn't even started. 2nd anyone that believes ONLY pvp noobs,which most people also equate to basically being trial accounts. 3rd anyone that has repeated the same bs about FW being dead is truely a noob as they have no ability to look beyond over simplistic,unrealistic results.

Pirates are going to dominate a few choke points and kill off FW? That I can tell you right now will end up being a myth to scare new players off. What will be the reality is similar to most 0.0 gate camps. The campers will be able to hold against unsuspecting individuals and small groups. After they down a few solo pilots the clock will start. That clock is the time left before a force greater then the campers is assembled and arrives at the choke point to clear the camp. The campers will likely flee after a few losses. There will not be some all important gate where ALL pirates are going to peacefully assemble and agree to attack the "noobs" participating in FW.

I would think real "pirates" would attack anyone that they consider to be weaker then themselves. Can they take the ship down in front of them? if so they will attack, if not they will move along for smaller prey. The real profit and epeen opportunity won't be in killing FW players but the campers in the BSes,BCs ,t2 ships loaded with tastey t2 gear. Killing "real" threats = +X epeen. Killing a t2 fitted BS=minimum of 30mil potential loot up to hundreds of mil. So with that said pirates are going to take advantage of other pirates sitting on a gate being shot by the turrets.

There are anti pirate groups out there, what they lack in cajones individually they make up in isk+numbers. Add in a group of FW players and eventually gate camps are going to be smashed. Remember there is going to be a FW:militia chat so people are going to be spreading the word,aka intel, and people are going to use it against the campers.

Not everyone is a 1mil sp,"not sure if ill sub" noob. Not everyone with 2+mil sp is in a 0.0 alliance or stationed in lowsec. Not everyone currently in empire has 0 pvp experience. People are going to realize that in order to succeed in FW they are bound to need 2 groups. Group A will be those participating in the FW fight and fitted for it. Group B will be the camp smashers/campers which will use any ship they want,t1 or t2 fitted for standard pvp. Without group A you cant win the "missions" without group B you cant stop a flow of reinforcements, break gate camps or discourage small groups of pirates. If you think pirates are going to work together all the time, reread what i said above.

FW will create a fps scenario within eve.Cheap ships=low risk.mission based=storyline. ranking=motivation/epeen. its going to get nonpvpers a way to pvp without guilt and low participation costs. those with pvp experience will get fights instantaneously instead of flying for hours in a hope they will find a ship they can take and can scram before it warps off. Its going to create a level playing field due to its "soft" Sp cap.

Will it breath life into lowsec? Sure,FW is giving people a reason to go out there and promises them a chance at a "fair"fight that wont kill their wallet. Its as close to fps respawning as possible without losing the real loss aspect that makes eve,Eve. people will be flying out there and eventually key systems will be recognized and FWs might operate out of them which will create new lowsec residents in addition to the increased traffic. If people lose to much isk,go to empire and mission for a week,restock and head back out.

Those declaring FW a failure right now should be ignored as short sighted fools. They "want" increased lowsec traffic and "pvp" but at the same time they suggest they do not as they are the ones dumping on FW the most. So you gotta ask what do they really want?

Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2008.06.05 14:05:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: ShardowRhino
Pirates are going to dominate a few choke points and kill off FW? That I can tell you right now will end up being a myth to scare new players off. What will be the reality is similar to most 0.0 gate camps. The campers will be able to hold against unsuspecting individuals and small groups. After they down a few solo pilots the clock will start. That clock is the time left before a force greater then the campers is assembled and arrives at the choke point to clear the camp. The campers will likely flee after a few losses. There will not be some all important gate where ALL pirates are going to peacefully assemble and agree to attack the "noobs" participating in FW.
I'll admit I don't have much experience of low-sec, but I have been there out of necessity rather than choice (as a poster above questioning).

What I can't get my head around really is how FW is supposed to be an segway between the harshness (i.e. losing a ship/pod, trivial reward over high-sec for the risk, etc) of low-sec as it exists currently. Assuming a carebear wants to get involved in FW, they venture into low-sec and are unlucky enough to land in a random gate-camp and think "I've just lost my ship wahhh! Back to missioning for me". You don't just get over that mindset that easily.

I'm not suggesting that people who engage in FW should get free ships but inferring that FW is the solution to 90%+ of the playerbase living in high-sec Empire space is just plain wrong. Carebears don't go to low-sec because they know they'll get blown up in their missioning ships which have no need for MWDs, webs and scrams (i.e. so they don't fit them), ipso facto you have to be motivated to get into PvP and I've not seen anything in FW that motivates me to stop running L4 missions in high-sec. If I want PvP combat at some point in the future I'll just wander into low-sec without a care for the FW mechanics.

CCP need to really think about the sort of rewards they give people for the significant risk involved in venturing into low-sec, because right now they just aren't worth ditching L4 missions or high-sec mining for.

Just my 2p as a 100% carebear (who has occasionally ventured into low-sec, and knows about Rancer et al)

Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2008.06.05 14:07:00 - [49]
 

Edited by: Durzel on 05/06/2008 14:13:27
Originally by: Melllo champers
Originally by: Durzel
Edited by: Durzel on 05/06/2008 11:28:33
Originally by: Draenila
you all make it sound like it will be noob vs experienced.

but what you dont realize is thats how it is now

what CCP is intending to happen is that both noobs and experienced players alike will join factions, I.E. the week old frig pilot will be teamed up with the 3 year old hac pilot. They want noobs to be on the same side as the experienced for a change, instead of noobs going into lowsec and dying alot because they dont have 35mil sp.
Yep, it'll just be noobs going into lowsec and dying a lot because they don't have 35m sp, like the pirates that roam there and dying a lot because they're on the opposite faction to blobs with 35m sp, etc. See where this is going?


Yeah I see where it's going. Some people (who can earn 20 million in an hour) just don't want to risk a 7 million isk cruiser to have fun. They would much rather run the same boring, low risk high reward missions 24/7 and watch their wallet grow. People who are so afraid of losing that they won't even try. Like you, they throw up ridiculous scenarios and conjure up all sorts of reasons for not doing FW. 90 % of these people would only try FW if they could fly a T1 frig and be gauranteed a reward of 100 million isk for 10 minutes sitting in losec. Just look at all the carebears crying because there is no hisec content for them to farm.

FW is not about rewards, it's about ganging with people of various sp and going out into losec to shoot other people.
It's about the challenge and the thrill.

Anybody not interested in FW should stick to those good, honourable fights and rewards that they get from NPCs in Motsu.

Despite your clear bias and negativity towards a game-playing preference which differs from your own you make a valid point and I agree with it entirely (speaking as one of those people you're talking about in the first paragraph). What in FW is supposed to attract me to FW/low-sec if I haven't already got a pre-disposition to PvP? Wasn't FW supposed to be the segway between carebears and PvP?

What others (i.e. PvPers) don't seem to understand is that there is a reason 90% of the playerbase lives in Empire high-sec. Move L4s to low-sec and you will get more people there, make MWDs/webs/scrams essential equipment in missioning and carebears will get into a PvP mindset early on in their character development. There are plenty of things CCP could do to improve the population of low-sec, and none of it is in FW.

Given the rewards (yes, that's what missioners care about) there is nothing I can see in FW which is going to magically convert them to PvP'ers unless they already have a pre-disposition towards it.

Jakke Logan
Caldari
F Off And Die
Posted - 2008.06.05 14:49:00 - [50]
 

Edited by: Jakke Logan on 05/06/2008 14:51:00
Originally by: ShardowRhino
Originally by: Jakke Logan
Sure. For about a week, which is what I expect is the longest it will take for all the chokepoints and static sites to be bookmarked.



Quote:
Those declaring FW a failure right now should be ignored as short sighted fools. They "want" increased lowsec traffic and "pvp" but at the same time they suggest they do not as they are the ones dumping on FW the most. So you gotta ask what do they really want?


We shall see. I consider FW to be fundamentally flawed and that it will fail for these reasons:

1. The exclusion of a large proportion of current pvp'ers, ie: those in alliances. Right there you are telling people they either have to give up everything or not participate.

2. It won't be well organized because the majority of those who try it will be in NPC corps, and thus not function at all as a unit. Plus keep in mind the potential for scammers taking advantage of noobs in the new NPC corps... I'm sure some PC corps will join the militias but they will be outnumbered by the people who just join the NPC ones outright.

3. Those who are in FW have to follow "the rules" (such as what ship types to use). Pirates and other non participants do not. Locations of the hubs can easily be scanned out by covert ops ships and invaded by T2 nano ships which will far outclass what the participants will be using. It will be trivial for pirates/gankers to use an alt toon in a militia to easily locate targets for their main(s).

4. Once someone achieves rank, etc within the faction, if they then want to "move on" to the 0.0 endgame they have to give up all achievements and ability to further participate. This is the WORST flaw of all, since you will be nonsensically forcing players to make a tough choice they should never have to make.

5. It's being implemented without ANY mechanism in place to recover from bad standings, either before participating, or afterwards. This is a huge mistake, tantamount to leaving a wheel off a car and calling it done. Stuff like this missing should cause the expansion to be delayed... But no, like SOE, deadlines must be met, fundamental flaws and important parts that are missing be dammed!

6. It's being balanced in such a way as to EXPECT players to be using (and losing) the new faction ships, which are far more expensive for newer players to lose than conventional T1 frigates and cruisers. The rewards don't look good enough to sustain a player in this.

There you go. Reasons and detail as to why FW is going to flop, and flop badly. It's poorly conceived, poorly implemented and incomplete. It fits into the current game like a square peg in a round hole.

Draenila
Posted - 2008.06.05 19:48:00 - [51]
 

Edited by: Draenila on 05/06/2008 19:50:03
Edited by: Draenila on 05/06/2008 19:49:15
Originally by: Melllo champers
Originally by: Durzel
Edited by: Durzel on 05/06/2008 11:28:33
Originally by: Draenila
you all make it sound like it will be noob vs experienced.

but what you dont realize is thats how it is now

what CCP is intending to happen is that both noobs and experienced players alike will join factions, I.E. the week old frig pilot will be teamed up with the 3 year old hac pilot. They want noobs to be on the same side as the experienced for a change, instead of noobs going into lowsec and dying alot because they dont have 35mil sp.
Yep, it'll just be noobs going into lowsec and dying a lot because they don't have 35m sp, like the pirates that roam there and dying a lot because they're on the opposite faction to blobs with 35m sp, etc. See where this is going?


Yeah I see where it's going. Some people (who can earn 20 million in an hour) just don't want to risk a 7 million isk cruiser to have fun. They would much rather run the same boring, low risk high reward missions 24/7 and watch their wallet grow. People who are so afraid of losing that they won't even try. Like you, they throw up ridiculous scenarios and conjure up all sorts of reasons for not doing FW. 90 % of these people would only try FW if they could fly a T1 frig and be gauranteed a reward of 100 million isk for 10 minutes sitting in losec. Just look at all the carebears crying because there is no hisec content for them to farm.

FW is not about rewards, it's about ganging with people of various sp and going out into losec to shoot other people.
It's about the challenge and the thrill.


Anybody not interested in FW should stick to those good, honourable fights and rewards that they get from NPCs in Motsu.



QFT

they didnt say it was designed to bridge carebears to lowsec/nullsec. they said it was designed to allow newer toons to have a chance to get into the lowsec PvP action.

and also for the whole reason you should be playing this game in the first place. FUN!Idea

Darth Syphils
Noshikkan
Posted - 2008.06.05 20:02:00 - [52]
 

i wouldent worry about choke point camping by random pirates. Alot of the nano gangs you see roaming around null sec will most likely be hanging around these areas looking for the big slow blinky ships sitting on a high sec gates.

Overall im not sure what the outcome of the whole FW will be but i think it will lose its apeal for the newer players very quickly.

Agazoth V
Native Freshfood
Posted - 2008.06.05 21:49:00 - [53]
 

Corstaad:
I'm just about done with Cynosural Field Thoery V so I'll reactivate just before FW Laughing. After reading abit about it the last few weeks I'm kinda excited about it. With solo yarring and FW stuff I'll be kinda happy I can part-time play EvE. Honestly theres a large group of mmorg players that don't have the time for alot the "pvp" we are used to. So I think this is atleast a springboard for other ideas to come along.

Also a reminder try Low Sec out before whining about it. Grab a frig and look for other frigs. You'll be on the same level as those 319mil sp pirate toons you think are everywhere. Of course don't attack them if there in bigger ships or your going to get slapped by common sense. I started yarring Day 14 and never stopped and now at 17mil pvp sps in one year.

Opertone
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2008.06.05 23:30:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: Agazoth V
Corstaad:
I'm just about done with Cynosural Field Thoery V so I'll reactivate just before FW Laughing. After reading abit about it the last few weeks I'm kinda excited about it. With solo yarring and FW stuff I'll be kinda happy I can part-time play EvE. Honestly theres a large group of mmorg players that don't have the time for alot the "pvp" we are used to. So I think this is atleast a springboard for other ideas to come along.

Also a reminder try Low Sec out before whining about it. Grab a frig and look for other frigs. You'll be on the same level as those 319mil sp pirate toons you think are everywhere. Of course don't attack them if there in bigger ships or your going to get slapped by common sense. I started yarring Day 14 and never stopped and now at 17mil pvp sps in one year.



grab a frig, run into a sentry gun and be popped...

grab a battlecruiser, run into remote repping carrier and pray that you can warp out...

find a solo target, engage, and get jumped by enemy gang...

solo pirating? do you believe in it? it's only a matter of one's belief.

you can only kill beginners, who are unaware of pirates and have never had PVP, you can also kill a few farmers, who are afk... but not 319 mill SP pirates, not unless they sold the account to a beginner.

Agazoth V
Native Freshfood
Posted - 2008.06.06 00:02:00 - [55]
 

Edited by: Agazoth V on 06/06/2008 00:07:01

Lilan Kahn
Amarr
The Littlest Hobos
En Garde
Posted - 2008.06.06 00:15:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Opertone
Originally by: Agazoth V
Corstaad:
I'm just about done with Cynosural Field Thoery V so I'll reactivate just before FW Laughing. After reading abit about it the last few weeks I'm kinda excited about it. With solo yarring and FW stuff I'll be kinda happy I can part-time play EvE. Honestly theres a large group of mmorg players that don't have the time for alot the "pvp" we are used to. So I think this is atleast a springboard for other ideas to come along.

Also a reminder try Low Sec out before whining about it. Grab a frig and look for other frigs. You'll be on the same level as those 319mil sp pirate toons you think are everywhere. Of course don't attack them if there in bigger ships or your going to get slapped by common sense. I started yarring Day 14 and never stopped and now at 17mil pvp sps in one year.



grab a frig, run into a sentry gun and be popped...

grab a battlecruiser, run into remote repping carrier and pray that you can warp out...

find a solo target, engage, and get jumped by enemy gang...

solo pirating? do you believe in it? it's only a matter of one's belief.

you can only kill beginners, who are unaware of pirates and have never had PVP, you can also kill a few farmers, who are afk... but not 319 mill SP pirates, not unless they sold the account to a beginner.


you just suck at eve if you cant figure out solo pvp

Tim Chapman
WOLVES ll
Posted - 2008.06.06 01:33:00 - [57]
 

Originally by: Jakke Logan
Will FW revive lowsec?

Sure. For about a week, which is what I expect is the longest it will take for all the chokepoints and static sites to be bookmarked.

Figure for about a week (maybe less) the FW content will actually get used, followed by a week or so of mass pirate/0.0 alliance nuking of the noobs, followed by every week thereafter of no one even attempting to do the missions.

Duh. If the Devs don't know that this is what's going to happen, well, they need new leadership.

I'm not saying that this is wrong. It's lowsec after all, the domain of pirates. What is wrong is CCP's poor design of this system, which they intend to bring noobs out in T1 frigates and cruisers into an area where they can (and will) get destroyed repeatedly by people in better ships with more skillpoints. It's a very poor concept, and it's why FW is destined to fail. It never should have been aimed at the noobs (though they could have added a highsec series of PVE FW missions and content) it should have been a system aimed at EXISTING lowsec and 0.0 pvp'ers.




My 2 isk...this will happen for a while, then it will turn into less profitable 0.0 with corps claiming systems and trying to fight out anyone of the other faction, similar to 0.0, this is what i imagine CCP had in mind when they said a bridge from empire to null sec.... /discuss

JonLuc McPew
Amarr
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2008.06.06 08:40:00 - [58]
 

Bork standings for half of Empire just so they can go into LowSec and pvp? Lawlz.

This is a pie buff and an existing pvp'er buff plain and simple. The best way I can see to profit from FW, whether by KM or Isk, will be remaining a neut.
The suposed target audience (not pvp'ers and not pies) will try it out and lose a lot of isk and gain a lot of aggravation then say screw it.

The only question is how fast will they get fed up with it.

Rawr Cristina
Caldari
Naqam
Posted - 2008.06.06 09:01:00 - [59]
 

looks to be fun, but IMO

The downsides to FW arn't going to be worth the rewards. You can't PVP without ISK.

Still, it should bring some life to the low-sec market Razz

Cpt Branko
Retired Pirate Club
Posted - 2008.06.06 09:52:00 - [60]
 

Edited by: Cpt Branko on 06/06/2008 09:53:59
Originally by: ShardowRhino

The campers will be able to hold against unsuspecting individuals and small groups. After they down a few solo pilots the clock will start. That clock is the time left before a force greater then the campers is assembled and arrives at the choke point to clear the camp.



This is what it's like now. Prolonged camping draws attention to you, and typically every now and then you have to get off gate since someone's bringing in a blob to deal with you.

The 'clock' will probably be shorter, since militia will have better communications.

Originally by: ShardowRhino

The campers will likely try to flee before losses. There will not be some all important gate where ALL pirates are going to peacefully assemble and agree to attack the "noobs" participating in FW.



Corrected it for you - everyone who wants to make any money off piracy knows that playing with nasty blobs is bad for your wallet, so you get off the gate and let the blob pass, and pirates tend to fight pirates, you won't have a 50-man camp blocking a gate ever. If you did, it would be horribly unprofitable - anything over 6 people and the loot gets split up too many ways.

Originally by: ShardowRhino

I would think real "pirates" would attack anyone that they consider to be weaker then themselves. Can they take the ship down in front of them? if so they will attack, if not they will move along for smaller prey.



This. Attacking people (under sentries, too) where you're likely to die too often will yield in you either having to rat or sell GTCs, and that would be bad.

Originally by: ShardowRhino

The real profit and epeen opportunity won't be in killing FW players but the campers in the BSes,BCs ,t2 ships loaded with tastey t2 gear. Killing "real" threats = +X epeen. Killing a t2 fitted BS=minimum of 30mil potential loot up to hundreds of mil. So with that said pirates are going to take advantage of other pirates sitting on a gate being shot by the turrets.



While pirates will naturally take advantage of other pirates with sentry aggro (we try to do this to people, and other people try to do this to us), your numbers on a T2-fit BS kill are way off. A T2-fit BS kill yields about 30M in loot at best (maybe a tad more if they're lugging tons of faction ammo), and 15-ish M in loot is commonplace dropping from a PvP-fit BS. A lot of the stuff gets destroyed, after all.

The really high value BS kills are kills with faction stuff on them, and that happens too; for plain T2+rigs fits, it'd be more valuable to ransom them if it's possible (which it often isn't, particularly not at gates/station!).

You're entirely correct about pirates continously trying to kill other pirates - it's the reality of low-sec life. After all, we compete for turf, and it can be profitable if you don't sustain (expensive) losses anyway.

I don't think FW is going to fail, as long as the rewards are decent enough.


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