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Angela Toren
Amarr
Toren Shipyards
Posted - 2008.03.16 09:42:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Angela Toren on 16/03/2008 09:43:55

Those clever bods at blizzard have teamed up with another company to sell real life limited edition replicas of the legendary ingame Frostmourne sword.

The first 99 are being auctioned and will go for crazy prices.


Now, considering models of eve ships (obviously not to scale) are cheaper and easier to make than stainless steel swords - why don't we have EVE ship models in the store?

Why oh why!?

CCP Whisper

Posted - 2008.03.16 10:58:00 - [2]
 

I would love to own a 50cm long die-cast model Rifter that comes complete with a pod you can eject by pushing a button and several different autocannon and artillery guns that can be clicked into place on the model. It would be really cool and fun to own. But producing something like that just isn't worth the setup costs.

Currently, EVE Online has 220,000+ subscribers. When considering whether to offer ancillary products, we need to consider how many of our players will actually purchase something. Prudence dictates that we estimate conservatively. Then we need to consider the setup costs associated with production. In the case of ship models, these are considerable as you have to pay for the creation of the mould and the establishment of the production line for painting and such. The more detailed, the higher the cost. As people are probably not going to buy something non-detailed (otherwise we would be selling blocks of raw aluminium with "Rifter" scrawled on them in marker) we need to come to a compromise as far as that is concerned, balancing production cost versus potential income. The size of the production run, shipping and customs duty all come into the equation as well.

For Blizzard, who have millions of players, it makes sense to enter into a business partnership with someone who will take over the production of something like the Frostmourne sword as there are bound to be at least a couple of thousand WoW players who will buy one, easily covering setup costs and the like. For us it is a different issue. Any production run of EVE ships would have to be small, and that drives prices up. Which, in turn, lowers the pool of people who would be interested in purchasing one. Which increases the number of unsold ships and reduces our chances of covering production costs.

This isn't to say we will never produce any ship models. Every year sees a reduction in production costs and the development of better production methods which would fulfil our quality guidelines. At some point, we may find someone who is able to produce ship models which are affordable. I'll be amongst the first in line to buy one of the results.

SCSPOOK
Caldari
16th Interspacial Dynasty
The 11th Hour
Posted - 2008.03.16 11:00:00 - [3]
 

Looking around these forums, I see no shortage of nerds.

You will probably make a killing.

xStormwingx
Dark Star Cartel
Posted - 2008.03.16 11:17:00 - [4]
 

CCP should give Lego a call.

Oh man oh man that would be so much fun. Very HappyVery HappyVery Happy

LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
Posted - 2008.03.16 11:45:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: xStormwingx
CCP should give Lego a call.

Oh man oh man that would be so much fun. Very HappyVery HappyVery Happy


Lego Mindstorms NXT - Eve Online Edition

Holy freaking ****! I think i just cum! Shocked

xStormwingx
Dark Star Cartel
Posted - 2008.03.16 12:29:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: LaVista Vista

Lego Mindstorms NXT - Eve Online Edition

Yes yes and then you can make your own...drones?

I was thinking more along the lines of Star Wars Ultimate Collectors Series - Big, painstakingly detailed models of the most popular EVE ships.
And then in a similar Lego SW vein, a huge series of EVE Mini ships for blob fights and maximum swooshability. Very Happy

Elliot Reid
Digital Fury Corporation
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2008.03.16 13:59:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: CCP Whisper
I would love to own a 50cm long die-cast model Rifter that comes complete with a pod you can eject by pushing a button and several different autocannon and artillery guns that can be clicked into place on the model.


Also it should come in a bag of treacle so we can simulate the lag Very Happy

Sorry, only joking Wink

Kirjava
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2008.03.16 14:19:00 - [8]
 

May I suggest a compromise Whisper?

At Christmas I bought my sister a book costing 10 pounds (my keyboard won't let me use the pounds symbol, apologies) with cardboard modles in it.

Since we have the Eve Art Book, perhaps something around that size and cost with paper models on good quality card? That way it is cheaper and can be used as a gauge as to how many people may go for ceramic models should they be released.
To the best of my limited printing knowlege, it would not be a large investment to expand the printing operation of the Eve Art Book for such a venture.

Ikkajo
Minmatar
Illudium Space Products
Posted - 2008.03.16 14:52:00 - [9]
 

My company, along with several partners, is within months of releasing something that goes one-step better than this: on-demand custom manufacturing in the Cafe-press style of website. Setting up something like this is relatively trivial if we have access to the raw model files. In fact, several of the guys at work have already used the screen sc****rs to grab their WoW characters and had them printed.

Right now the printing technology really only works well for single colour models, meaning you'd need to paint them yourself to match the in-game representation - but that is just an oppourtunity waiting for some other EvE entrepreneur :)

I'd really love to have EvE models in our first public release (we have a private restricted beta test in progress right now). Whisper, who should I contact at CCP to discuss such possibilities? Keiron?

Suze'Rain
Caldari
Posted - 2008.03.16 17:37:00 - [10]
 

god it makes me sick every time that any idiots call such toys "swords"

stainless steel...
bad machining, awful hilts.

Can't any bloody game designers design swords that look good while actually working? What is it? is it a prerequisite of such studios to ask if you understand how to use a weapon, and if you do, then you're clearly overqualified. What kind of victim of amateur trepanning thinks this **** would work?

gah.

cant people just appreciate the elegance of a proper weapon ? please?




SoftRevolution
Posted - 2008.03.16 17:52:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: SoftRevolution on 16/03/2008 17:53:54
Originally by: CCP Whisper
I would love to own a 50cm long die-cast model Rifter that comes complete with a pod you can eject by pushing a button and several different autocannon and artillery guns that can be clicked into place on the model. It would be really cool and fun to own. But producing something like that just isn't worth the setup costs.

Currently, EVE Online has 220,000+ subscribers. When considering whether to offer ancillary products, we need to consider how many of our players will actually purchase something. Prudence dictates that we estimate conservatively. Then we need to consider the setup costs associated with production. In the case of ship models, these are considerable as you have to pay for the creation of the mould and the establishment of the production line for painting and such. The more detailed, the higher the cost. As people are probably not going to buy something non-detailed (otherwise we would be selling blocks of raw aluminium with "Rifter" scrawled on them in marker) we need to come to a compromise as far as that is concerned, balancing production cost versus potential income. The size of the production run, shipping and customs duty all come into the equation as well.

For Blizzard, who have millions of players, it makes sense to enter into a business partnership with someone who will take over the production of something like the Frostmourne sword as there are bound to be at least a couple of thousand WoW players who will buy one, easily covering setup costs and the like. For us it is a different issue. Any production run of EVE ships would have to be small, and that drives prices up. Which, in turn, lowers the pool of people who would be interested in purchasing one. Which increases the number of unsold ships and reduces our chances of covering production costs.

This isn't to say we will never produce any ship models. Every year sees a reduction in production costs and the development of better production methods which would fulfil our quality guidelines. At some point, we may find someone who is able to produce ship models which are affordable. I'll be amongst the first in line to buy one of the results.


Is there any way you could do it "on demand" so you're not stuck with stock or does that just ramp prices even higher?

What about if you did a short run based on pre-orders?

I realise this kind of production run doesn't have the same economies of scale as making a few thousand of something.

Leilani Solaris
0utbreak
Outbreak.
Posted - 2008.03.16 18:28:00 - [12]
 

Registration Fee: $429.00

Shocked

Saint Lazarus
Pwn 'N Play
Chaos Theory Alliance
Posted - 2008.03.16 19:12:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Suze'Rain
god it makes me sick every time that any idiots call such toys "swords"

stainless steel...
bad machining, awful hilts.

Can't any bloody game designers design swords that look good while actually working? What is it? is it a prerequisite of such studios to ask if you understand how to use a weapon, and if you do, then you're clearly overqualified. What kind of victim of amateur trepanning thinks this **** would work?

gah.

cant people just appreciate the elegance of a proper weapon ? please?







Which looks cooler?


be hooonest

Bosie
THE C0RP
Posted - 2008.03.16 19:29:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Saint Lazarus
Originally by: Suze'Rain
god it makes me sick every time that any idiots call such toys "swords"

stainless steel...
bad machining, awful hilts.

Can't any bloody game designers design swords that look good while actually working? What is it? is it a prerequisite of such studios to ask if you understand how to use a weapon, and if you do, then you're clearly overqualified. What kind of victim of amateur trepanning thinks this **** would work?

gah.

cant people just appreciate the elegance of a proper weapon ? please?







Which looks cooler?


be hooonest


This one by far.

Saint Lazarus
Pwn 'N Play
Chaos Theory Alliance
Posted - 2008.03.16 19:45:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Bosie
Originally by: Saint Lazarus
Originally by: Suze'Rain
god it makes me sick every time that any idiots call such toys "swords"

stainless steel...
bad machining, awful hilts.

Can't any bloody game designers design swords that look good while actually working? What is it? is it a prerequisite of such studios to ask if you understand how to use a weapon, and if you do, then you're clearly overqualified. What kind of victim of amateur trepanning thinks this **** would work?

gah.

cant people just appreciate the elegance of a proper weapon ? please?







Which looks cooler?


be hooonest


This one by far.



Its as plain as vanilla!

Qanael Radlari
Caldari
Morior Invictus.
Velocitas Eradico
Posted - 2008.03.16 19:50:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Saint Lazarus
Originally by: Suze'Rain
god it makes me sick every time that any idiots call such toys "swords"

stainless steel...
bad machining, awful hilts.

Can't any bloody game designers design swords that look good while actually working? What is it? is it a prerequisite of such studios to ask if you understand how to use a weapon, and if you do, then you're clearly overqualified. What kind of victim of amateur trepanning thinks this **** would work?

gah.

cant people just appreciate the elegance of a proper weapon ? please?







Which looks cooler?


be hooonest


The real sword by far. The Warcraft one looks like a Power Rangers toy.

Saint Lazarus
Pwn 'N Play
Chaos Theory Alliance
Posted - 2008.03.16 20:05:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Qanael Radlari
Originally by: Saint Lazarus
Originally by: Suze'Rain


Stuffz




Which looks cooler?


be hooonest


The real sword by far. The Warcraft one looks like a Power Rangers toy.



Its not made of plastic :P

Rawr Cristina
Caldari
Naqam
Posted - 2008.03.16 20:27:00 - [18]
 

Will you make a Thorax at least?

Qanael Radlari
Caldari
Morior Invictus.
Velocitas Eradico
Posted - 2008.03.16 20:43:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Rawr Cristina
Will you make a Thorax at least?


I'm sure you could make do with certain...Thorax-like objects sold in...certain stores, and some metallic paint.

Kathryn Dougans
Amarr
Posted - 2008.03.16 20:52:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Kathryn Dougans on 16/03/2008 21:05:19
Eve Lego would be awesome. Fun for everyone. The whole "Modules" thing makes complete sense for it as well.

Originally by: Suze'Rain
god it makes me sick every time that any idiots call such toys "swords"
cant people just appreciate the elegance of a proper weapon ? please?


That fantasy thing is ridiculous. 16lbs? Madness. Skulls and spikes? Lame. Tacky too.
The real sword is much cleaner looking. More skill in the metalwork as well.

Also, from the FaQ about that thing:
"What material is Frostmourne made with?
The blade is made of 420J2 Japanese milled stainless steel, the other detailed parts are made of cast metal, and the wrapping of the handle is made from leather."

Ooh, 420J2 Japanese milled stainless steel? Wow, that must be good, because everyone knows Japanese swords could like, cut atomic bonds, while European swords couldn't cut mustard.
Lol at the lack of description of the "Cast Metal" that the rest of it is made from. The leather too. No "Cast from meteorite iron" or "Leather from pedigree herds of Chamois goats" ?

Originally by: Qanael Radlari
Originally by: Rawr Cristina
Will you make a Thorax at least?


I'm sure you could make do with certain...Thorax-like objects sold in...certain stores, and some metallic paint.


Paint flakes or rubs off too easily.

Suze'Rain
Caldari
Posted - 2008.03.16 21:35:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: Suze''Rain on 16/03/2008 21:44:24
Originally by: Kathryn Dougans
Eve Lego would be awesome. Fun for everyone. The whole "Modules" thing makes complete sense for it as well.

Originally by: Suze'Rain
god it makes me sick every time that any idiots call such toys "swords"
cant people just appreciate the elegance of a proper weapon ? please?


That fantasy thing is ridiculous. 16lbs? Madness. Skulls and spikes? Lame. Tacky too.
The real sword is much cleaner looking. More skill in the metalwork as well.

Also, from the FaQ about that thing:
"What material is Frostmourne made with?
The blade is made of 420J2 Japanese milled stainless steel, the other detailed parts are made of cast metal, and the wrapping of the handle is made from leather."

Ooh, 420J2 Japanese milled stainless steel? Wow, that must be good, because everyone knows Japanese swords could like, cut atomic bonds, while European swords couldn't cut mustard.
Lol at the lack of description of the "Cast Metal" that the rest of it is made from. The leather too. No "Cast from meteorite iron" or "Leather from pedigree herds of Chamois goats" ?


Exactly this.

420J2 japanese stainless steel. a steel utterly unsuited to actual swords.
(Again, 420J2 has very little carbon , and is incapable of Rockwell hardness higher than 53 Rockwells. The sole reason for speccing that steel is that it's extremely easy to machine-cut. and in short, they can mass-produce this cr*p and call it a sword, when in reality it's a butterknife that wont even hold an edge. Think of 420J2 as the stainless equivalent of mild steel - with very low carbon content making it useless.

What you want is a eutectoid carbon steel, with proper heat-treating and hardening. something I doubt the makers of that toy have even heard of.

however, above all, that so-called sword is just plain ugly. it has no flow, no balance - no real person could effectively use such a toy, it's shape is completely un-ergonomic, and to use such a thing in actual combat would be exhausting and inefficient... and when you're fighting for real, you want every tiny advantage, every drop more efficiency.
That thing has a 28 inch blade, and a yet it's got a hilt that would fit a longsword 6 inches longer... the quillions are those of a toy - quite aside from being "cast metal". Who te hell uses cast metal? you forge the guards from steel stock, forge-welding segments into a unified whole, for structural strength. Those quillions are to protect the user's hand, not some ridiculous bit of scuplture, an exercise in bad taste.
The pommel has no hope of ever balancing out the grossly overweight blade and hilt, and even if it did balance out, the entire hilt is'nt going to ever be comfortable. look at the spikey, studded rings in the hilt... perfect for not being held comfortably... and then compare it to the sleep hilt on this, with leather sewn in one peice, not some mass-market cr*p leather thonging wrapped around it.

And then there's the weight... 16 pounds. I'm struggling to even express my contempt at anyone who makes a "sword" that weighs 16 pounds.

This beautiful, elegant Longsword weighs 4 pounds. its blade is forged, hollow-ground, with a deep fuller that both stiffens the blade and reduces weight. the blade tapers both in top, and in side profile (a distal taper) to save weight, and to move the centre of gravity up into the ricasso, to allow better balance.
4 pounds. and that's a re-enactor's sword, with thick edges, and a rounded point... the real ones are sharp, with considerably less steel in their blade geometry.

All that is what makes a proper sword beautiful, and what rankles me about such hideous toys that have the nerve to call themselves swords.

*spits*



xStormwingx
Dark Star Cartel
Posted - 2008.03.16 21:36:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Qanael Radlari
I'm sure you could make do with certain...Thorax-like objects sold in...certain stores, and some metallic paint.

Hurry, CCP! Before that 'other' toy industry makes a fortune on replica Thoraxes with..."additional functions"!

I stand by me replica Lego idea. :]

Suze'Rain
Caldari
Posted - 2008.03.16 21:55:00 - [23]
 

I've just realised that piece of... sh*t is being sold for $429 dollars...

about the same price charged for This longsword, which is handmade by czech artisans with proper forging and grinding, with hand-forged qillions (instead of cast in a mould), proper steel, is incredibly elegant (and lethal...)

I'm disgusted.

Kyrall
Posted - 2008.03.16 22:00:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Suze'Rain
I've just realised that piece of... sh*t is being sold for $429 dollars...

about the same price charged for This longsword, which is handmade by czech artisans with proper forging and grinding, with hand-forged qillions (instead of cast in a mould), proper steel, is incredibly elegant (and lethal...)

I'm disgusted.


You do realise that realism and actually being usable as a sword aren't aims that these people have with this thing yeah? If anything, having it too heavy and uncomfortable to use would be a good thing, considering the target market!

Seriously, what sort of lunatic would arm WoW-kiddies with a proper lethal weapon? Shocked

Suze'Rain
Caldari
Posted - 2008.03.16 22:06:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Kyrall


Seriously, what sort of lunatic would arm WoW-kiddies with a proper lethal weapon? Shocked



Darwin in action. anything that kills off the little whining brats is good in my books...

Euriti
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2008.03.16 22:27:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Suze'Rain
Originally by: Kyrall


Seriously, what sort of lunatic would arm WoW-kiddies with a proper lethal weapon? Shocked



Darwin in action. anything that kills off the little whining brats is good in my books...
You and your posts made my day.

Thank you good sir!

Laughing

Meiyang Lee
Gallente
Azteca Transportation Unlimited
Gunboat Diplomacy
Posted - 2008.03.16 22:31:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Meiyang Lee on 16/03/2008 22:36:56
If you're going to arm rabid fans with lethal weaponry from their favorite franchise,
atleast design it properly.

Slayer of Kings (Warhammer)

MalVortex
Applied Agoraphobia
Posted - 2008.03.16 22:44:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: CCP Whisper
As people are probably not going to buy something non-detailed (otherwise we would be selling blocks of raw aluminium with "Rifter" scrawled on them in marker...)


Well, it would work if you wrote "Rokh" instead of Rifter... Laughing

Suze'Rain
Caldari
Posted - 2008.03.16 22:52:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Meiyang Lee
Edited by: Meiyang Lee on 16/03/2008 22:36:56
If you're going to arm rabid fans with lethal weaponry from their favorite franchise,
atleast design it properly.

Slayer of Kings (Warhammer)



while the purist in me is rather cringing at the "so goth I **** bats" cliché of that one, at least it's a reasonable price, and made by someone who understands a bit of sword geometry...




Meiyang Lee
Gallente
Azteca Transportation Unlimited
Gunboat Diplomacy
Posted - 2008.03.16 22:56:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Suze'Rain
Originally by: Meiyang Lee
Edited by: Meiyang Lee on 16/03/2008 22:36:56
If you're going to arm rabid fans with lethal weaponry from their favorite franchise,
atleast design it properly.

Slayer of Kings (Warhammer)



while the purist in me is rather cringing at the "so goth I **** bats" cliché of that one, at least it's a reasonable price, and made by someone who understands a bit of sword geometry...



i never said it wasn't cliché now did i? To bad i couldn't find a good picture of the other sword Windlass did for GW, that was even worse. (not goth, but the other end of the spectrum. High Elf design ftl.) Sunfang was all gold and extremely polished metals, fake gems and all. Laughing


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