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blankseplocked BBC: negative reporting of Eve, but positive report on Second Life
 
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Jack Target
Astral Adventure
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:03:00 - [1]
 

The BBC annoys me. They quote an author, Dr Castronova, as saying:

"The appeal [of online games] is not for those in a good job, but for those working low-paid, low-skill jobs. Would you rather be a Starbucks worker or a starship captain?"

Here is this charming man's website.

However, the BBC publishes completely positive reports on Second Life:

A very real future for virtual worlds

In real life, I am a junior medical doctor and I feel I am doing the best job in the world helping elderly patients. The pay is fair, but I am definitely not low skilled (I have three excellent university degrees and intend to gain further qualifications).

I question the quality of research of Dr Castronova and wonder if his book has been peer-reviewed by professional researchers.

Kurogauna
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:08:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Kurogauna on 15/12/2007 00:07:50
Eve will beat second life when ambulation will come out ^^


/troll of

Illyria Ambri
SMASH Alliance
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:08:00 - [3]
 

Yea.. this professor from Indiana knows us gamers so well..

Dude probably got pk'd over and over in UO

JamnOne
Amarr
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:17:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: JamnOne on 15/12/2007 00:24:10
Ok - Uhm, after I re-read the article he wasn't talking bad about those who play Eve. He was just doing an example of the reason why so many go to the online world.

He didn't want reference other games because he has his own game, or works with a gaming company, for the game called "Arden". Choosing Spaceship Captain was an easier and safer choice. Plus, think about it, regardless if you work low paying or high paying, you are here because you do want to be a Spaceship Captain.

Alty MacAlterson
Alt Corporation
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:17:00 - [5]
 

This thread was locked then unlocked. :tinfoil:

Ontaku Oroa
Minmatar
Tribal Liberation Force
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:20:00 - [6]
 

Well, he is right, in a way. But I think he is placing too much of an emphasis on people's jobs and job skills. For example, most people would think that being a garbage-man is a degrading, low-skill job nobody really wants to do, but none of those three assumptions are actually true.

I would say that with the advent of full-scale virtual reality there will be people seeking to "escape" real life by plugging in and living their fantasy online. Hell, if it came to having your brain removed and placed in a nutrient jar, I would bet there would be people willing to sign on.

But it has nothing to do with your job, skills or whatnot, but everything to do with how fulfilled and satisfying your life is to you. The less satisfied with reality and you life in general, the more likely you are to seek refuge in a virtual environment which caters to your desired fantasy. I know there are very unhappy (real) CEO's out there. Perhaps they would, too, prefer to be starship captains?

Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:21:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Del Narveux on 15/12/2007 00:23:05
Wow, that article totally fails at making distinction between virtual-world games like Second Life and Entropia, and MMORPGs like EVE and WoW. The dude's right in that SL and such appeals to people who want to have a better life online, but seriously most MMORPG players have other reasons, and generally are quite affluent.

edit: to clarify, I dont think they were targeting Eve in particular, but it does go along with the mainstream media's relative ignorance in the nuances of online gaming.

Jaabaa Prime
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:25:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Jack Target
In real life, I am a junior medical doctor and I feel I am doing the best job in the world helping elderly patients. The pay is fair, but I am definitely not low skilled (I have three excellent university degrees and intend to gain further qualifications).


Sir, you are one of real life's unsung heros. Forget the 2nd life or EVE stuff, but you are delivering where it really counts.

As such, I salute you.

mechtech
SRS Industries
SRS.
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:29:00 - [9]
 

Seems true to me.

Escapism is a major reason many people play MMOs, which would naturally appeal to "low paid, low skill jobs" a bit more.

I fail to see the importance though, it's not there aren't any successful people playing eve or WoW, just the demographic breakdown is a bit different.

CCP kieron

Posted - 2007.12.15 00:29:00 - [10]
 

Removed some of the more inflammatory posts in the thread. While some may not agree with the sentiments presented by the media or personages, there's no need to make assumptions about their private lives. Keep the discussion on topic, please.

Alex Terman
Gallente
Gaston Mining and INdustrial
War and Pestilence
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:32:00 - [11]
 

The BBC has the hots for Second Life like a fat man has the hots for a McCoronary.

Joie Mains
Vindicator A Team
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:34:00 - [12]
 

bbc once said that eu is bigest threat to usa ....... LaughingLaughingRolling EyesRolling EyesRolling EyesRolling Eyes

Soulita
Gallente
Inner Core
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:40:00 - [13]
 

Ignorant people like Dr Castronova are part of the reason why I do not watch TV.
TV is full of wanna be's who have no idea about most things they report on.
Who needs TV anyways? We got the net, dont we?

SoftRevolution
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:41:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: SoftRevolution on 15/12/2007 00:44:43
I think that's actually quite a persistent idea in writing about online worlds. I'm sure I've read similar things elsewhere. Nothing very outlandish there.

If you think there's nothing to what he is saying then you are surely in a river in egypt or else you just haven't spent nearly enough time playing these things.

What I'm not seeing in that BBC snippet is him saying everyone who plays these things is doing so to escape from their horrible mess of a life.

LUH 3471
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:42:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Soulita
Ignorant people like Dr Castronova are part of the reason why I do not watch TV.
TV is full of wanna be's who have no idea about most things they report on.
Who needs TV anyways? We got the net, dont we?


this

Joie Mains
Vindicator A Team
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:53:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Soulita
Ignorant people like Dr Castronova are part of the reason why I do not watch TV.
TV is full of wanna be's who have no idea about most things they report on.
Who needs TV anyways? We got the net, dont we?

qft

Dramaticus
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.12.15 00:57:00 - [17]
 

i hear goons were loved in second life too

Alex Terman
Gallente
Gaston Mining and INdustrial
War and Pestilence
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:01:00 - [18]
 

So are Furries, your point?

Anon Forumalt
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:03:00 - [19]
 

Haha I work at a Starbucks

Gunstar Zero
Caldari
Reikoku
IT Alliance
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:09:00 - [20]
 

BBC's tech reporting has always been a bit suspect. Shame really, it does most other things quite well.

Cipher7
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:14:00 - [21]
 


Not exactly false.

MMO's have always catered to people who need escapism in some way.

Either crappy job, crappy self-esteem, family problems, social anxiety, etc etc.

In Eve you can be powerful and lord over other players.

Prolly attracts more escapists than any other MMO in my opinion.

Paulo Damarr
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:15:00 - [22]
 

Where are the EVE references? I do not see the BBC saying anything about EVE so whats with the sensationalist thread topic?

Mika Meisk
Caldari
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:20:00 - [23]
 

I'd hazard a guess that the analogy between escapism and unforfilling RL is stretched at the best. From my personal experience my friends from engineering schools tends to be more gaming friendly than ppl that I know who works/studies in less tech oriented fields. Bu to draw a line between virtual and rl flight of focus seems rather far fetched and strange to me.

How can there be a difference between reading tons of books and discussing its deeper meaning with ya book club friends, than hoaring the forums during work/school hours?

We is it less escape from realit get immersed in soccer/football/hockey because its athleticism? I can work out and still choose to focus my hobbies in the virtual realm.

I think that at times this debate is about a nuansed as the video violence debate was in the eighties, or that of the novel debate far before that. Youth in particular and man in general has allways searched for a safe haven where one can relax, that one brings the wants of society and tries to excell there as well has little or no connection with how attuned one is with the real world.

//Boycott the escapism sceptics and the virtual hate mongers

Mika

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:26:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Cailais on 15/12/2007 01:26:07
There's a market for people who want a second chance at 'life'. The real world has proved to difficult for them, or they have failed to realise their ambitions in 'real life', or real life has crushed their spirt - And so, with the option to create a 'second' life they turn to MMOS -

as do we all.

C.




Phrixus Zephyr
MEK Enterprises
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:28:00 - [25]
 

Why exactly does the (whole) 'BBC' annoy you? All they've done is publish a short page on two different peoples opinions. And i see no direct mention of Eve anywhere in any of the links you've supplied.

CraicWhore
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:32:00 - [26]
 

Castronova? Never heard of him.










Karann
Minmatar
Locus Evolved
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:33:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Alex Terman
The BBC has the hots for Second Life like a fat man has the hots for a McCoronary.


i lul'd, that is all

Lissa Isillia
Posted - 2007.12.15 01:39:00 - [28]
 

What a load of crap. I know IRL players of this game and MMOs in general who are very intelligent and successful business/service people in high stress jobs.

What the author fails to realize that for the majority of players it is a stress relieving hobby that they use to wind down with after work. Some go watch a movie, some go play sport, others play games.


Janu Hull
Caldari
Terra Incognita
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2007.12.15 02:00:00 - [29]
 

Pardon me, Professor, I only make about 40k a year, with benefits covered by the company, and four weeks of paid vacation a year and a cozy little desk.

BTW, I'm a drafter/project manager for an architectural firm. We do a lot of religious and educational projects, including multimillion dollar megachurches.

Yeah, Professor, I'd like fries with that, and hurry up, I'm running late for a meeting Evil or Very Mad

Masheine
Posted - 2007.12.15 02:33:00 - [30]
 


For everybody crying foul, Castonova is a well respected member of the niche group of academics that are studying mmo's, and has been for a long time.

The article is deplorable, and poorly researched, but that's no fault of Ed's. He's an honest researcher, who generally knows what he's talking about, not some fly-by-nighter making commentary to get a paycheck.

That said, the academics are generally full of hot air and long winded musings on why things work the way they do. Anyone who regular reads Terra Nova will know what I'm talking about. Some of the crap they get up to is ridiculous. But they're longhairs, and that's what longhairs do, and every now and then some interesting insight will come out of it.

Oh, and, yeah, most of them have previously knelt down willingly at the feet of Second Life, though the current trend is to dismiss as hype (even though they helped create the hype by not shutting up about it when the media started asking them questions).


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