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Angela Toren
Amarr
Toren Shipyards
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:13:00 - [2131]
 

Edited by: Angela Toren on 07/12/2007 09:19:59


My question is how something this bad could get past QA.

No beer for you!


Ting Tong
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:17:00 - [2132]
 

Edited by: Ting Tong on 07/12/2007 09:18:06

Installed Premium upgrade before 4am.

Applied Patch

Turned comp off after.

Boot.ini file is deleted, windows will not load.

My computer is an off the shelf with windows pre-installed, (No Windows disc)

I have no-where to recover a copy of boot.ini.

How do I recover from this with no windows disc?



(Edit) Posting from my work comp not on XP

General M0BIUS
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:20:00 - [2133]
 

Im Still Running the Pre 4am Upgrade patch and i have restarted my PC several Times, then Again I did Have the Sence to install EVE onto a completly different hard drive.

Boy was I lucky

Thargat
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:24:00 - [2134]
 

Edited by: Thargat on 07/12/2007 09:27:10
Originally by: Ting Tong
Edited by: Ting Tong on 07/12/2007 09:18:06

Installed Premium upgrade before 4am.

Applied Patch

Turned comp off after.

Boot.ini file is deleted, windows will not load.

My computer is an off the shelf with windows pre-installed, (No Windows disc)

I have no-where to recover a copy of boot.ini.

How do I recover from this with no windows disc?



(Edit) Posting from my work comp not on XP


Ask your PC vendor (or a friend) for a windows CD, worst case... install a new windows (or LINUX it's freee) in a different folder on the same computer (do not format or anything else). The computer should start up with no dataloss (everything will look different though). Check under C: and make sure the boot.ini is there (if it's not, create one following CCPs simple steps). Edit it or to have it point towards your old windows (the one under C:\WINDOWS) reboot and all should be fine...

option2: Remove the HDD from your computer, insert it into another computer (anywhere with windowsXP or vista) as a secondary drive. Start the computer up and copy the boot.ini from the "new" computer (or the internet) to your old HDD. Re insert the HDD to your computer and all should be fine (no dataloss).

edit: you obviously are on a computer now, you can always download a boot.ini from the web or write your own (or download a linux for free).

DaarMaar
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:25:00 - [2135]
 

Originally by: Stork DK
So was there a CCP statement as of what actually happened?

yeah.. like i give a damn

whatever and whoever srcrewd it up it's of no importance, as much is the fact that we now have 71+ pages in this topic.
Once again i'm more than amazed how huge and aware this community is.

I salute you guys for not been afraid to state your emotions, but also i salute you all for getting together and help each other out with posting about different solutions for all kinds of operating systems ppl might have regarding this issue.
You boys and girls are my heroes..

eve-online COMMUNITY FTW!

Ting Tong
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:31:00 - [2136]
 

Thargat...thankyou for your suggestions.

I do have the 5 recovery discs that are created when the comp is first switched on.
I can get to a DOS prompt in the recovery function, how do I create a new partition / drive?

Hell, I dont even know how I can install Windows to that new drive :?

I will just have to obtain a windows disc from someoneConfused
Unfortunatly, I am in the sticks and will not get to the town untill next week.
Can a Windows disc be borrowed from a library?

Mallikanth
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:34:00 - [2137]
 

Have you looked here?


Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Emptiness.
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:35:00 - [2138]
 

Originally by: Toarch Lightbringer
There is something called due dilligance, I really don't think this was followed here. Because if it was installed even on one Windows Machine with XP, which I assume a great number of their subscribers use, they would of found this tiny blunder. As well to have somebody post about it previous and only get blasted about being in the wrong thread. You would also assume that people with common sense would have forward that 'critical' information to the game developers.

I have been trying hard to get a friend to play this game and all he can do is show me many time's when dev's have used exploits for their friends benefits, all be it they have been released from CCP, and now something as basic as using a windows system file name as a gaming file name. Is that not programing 101 on the top 5 things not to do??? I was in a panic this morning as I did not reboot my machine, my friend (remember I was trying to get a guy to play this game??) forwarded me a link to slash dot about my Eve and the effects last night patch may have had on my machine. I looked for a number to call, a live chat to join, or surf this forum to find the answer. And I could not. I had to rely in him and myself to find the answers, pull the plug on my PC and Prey it came back up again.

Will I quit playing this game?? Probably not, do I feel that some sort of compensation should be given back to the community?? Absolutely. Some sort of 'token' compensation would go a long way to eleviate some of the just concerns people have and the trust that was lost in part by following simple, upgrading protocols. Confused


NO!They would NOT find out! Because XP machines UP TO DATE with microsoft updates are IMUNE!!!


If you had a XP runnign without the updates its user's fault! You cannot expect CCP to test every operatign system under every possible update status ( several hundreds of possible combinations)

Devick Bane
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:47:00 - [2139]
 

Edited by: Devick Bane on 07/12/2007 09:51:17
Originally by: Kagura Nikon
Originally by: Toarch Lightbringer
There is something called due dilligance, I really don't think this was followed here. Because if it was installed even on one Windows Machine with XP, which I assume a great number of their subscribers use, they would of found this tiny blunder. As well to have somebody post about it previous and only get blasted about being in the wrong thread. You would also assume that people with common sense would have forward that 'critical' information to the game developers.

I have been trying hard to get a friend to play this game and all he can do is show me many time's when dev's have used exploits for their friends benefits, all be it they have been released from CCP, and now something as basic as using a windows system file name as a gaming file name. Is that not programing 101 on the top 5 things not to do??? I was in a panic this morning as I did not reboot my machine, my friend (remember I was trying to get a guy to play this game??) forwarded me a link to slash dot about my Eve and the effects last night patch may have had on my machine. I looked for a number to call, a live chat to join, or surf this forum to find the answer. And I could not. I had to rely in him and myself to find the answers, pull the plug on my PC and Prey it came back up again.

Will I quit playing this game?? Probably not, do I feel that some sort of compensation should be given back to the community?? Absolutely. Some sort of 'token' compensation would go a long way to eleviate some of the just concerns people have and the trust that was lost in part by following simple, upgrading protocols. Confused


NO!They would NOT find out! Because XP machines UP TO DATE with microsoft updates are IMUNE!!!


If you had a XP runnign without the updates its user's fault! You cannot expect CCP to test every operatign system under every possible update status ( several hundreds of possible combinations)


You really want to know why the Dev/QA most likely missed this issue (besides ignoring that testers posts) is who tests a game by restarting their system? Lets be honest, when I write program I do not test them with a windows/linux reboot. Thanks.

PS- Should have added that boot.ini deletion is not a result of a patch or a missed patch, its just as vulnerable as it would be under any circumstance. Only way to protect it would be what people call and FLOCK (file lock). Open the file and leave it opened and no one can edit it until the stream is closed, even if its opened for read only purposes only.

Cephelo
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:50:00 - [2140]
 

Hi there in the wide world of screwed up EVE. Has anyone found that after leaving any station your eve Premium Graphics program suffers from a unexpected problem and needs to shut down?Shocked

Well I did last night so I downloaded to whole client this morning for a re-install but still suffer a problem when in space, I have a Rifter in mid-jump trying to get to it's destination.Mad

Has anyone got any sugestions? Smile

Ting Tong
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:53:00 - [2141]
 

Originally by: Mallikanth
Have you looked here?




I have looked there and called the help number, unfortunatly as I have turned my computer off, and I do not have a Windows CD, he was no able to help me. All he said was I would have to be able to get a Disc so I can copythe file over....

Basiacally the helpline, was not able to help

Haka Aragon
Caldari
SiN. Corp
Daisho Syndicate
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:58:00 - [2142]
 

Edited by: Haka Aragon on 07/12/2007 10:09:20
Originally by: Kagura Nikon

NO!They would NOT find out! Because XP machines UP TO DATE with microsoft updates are IMUNE!!!

If you had a XP runnign without the updates its user's fault! You cannot expect CCP to test every operatign system under every possible update status ( several hundreds of possible combinations)


You I am sorry to say are talking utter crap!!

Just because you have all the patches from Mircrsoft does not mean you are immune... I work as a Tech Support rep for a computer firm in the UK and we tested this out with EVERY RELEASE of Windows XP (Home/Pro/Media Centre/64Bit) and we installed all the Microsoft updates that were available on these systems as if they were going out to customers and EVERY SINGLE ONE of them was affected by this...

If you dont know what you are talking about please do all the people that are looking for help on this situation a favour and leave the topic for others to help people in until you get a clue...

Thargat
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:58:00 - [2143]
 

Originally by: Ting Tong
Originally by: Mallikanth
Have you looked here?




I have looked there and called the help number, unfortunatly as I have turned my computer off, and I do not have a Windows CD, he was no able to help me. All he said was I would have to be able to get a Disc so I can copythe file over....

Basiacally the helpline, was not able to help


Get a boot.ini file and put it on a USB stick (from the web).
then go here http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/index-en.html
make a linux bootable CD and start up your PC with it. Insert the USB stick (or similar) and copy the boot.ini file to your c:
remove the linux cd/dvd and restart.

Ting Tong
Posted - 2007.12.07 09:59:00 - [2144]
 

Thargat..will do.

Many thanks.

Devick Bane
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:01:00 - [2145]
 

Originally by: Ting Tong
Originally by: Mallikanth
Have you looked here?




I have looked there and called the help number, unfortunatly as I have turned my computer off, and I do not have a Windows CD, he was no able to help me. All he said was I would have to be able to get a Disc so I can copythe file over....

Basiacally the helpline, was not able to help


Try using a LiveCD such as knoppix. Only difficulty you will get is with finding the harddrive that is your windows one. Usually its the hd? with the WINDOWS folder on it. Just use the instructions listed prior in this post to go from /WINDOWS/ or whatnot to find the boot.ini.backup and then copy it to the / location on the HD? drive usually its HDA depending on where on the IDE it is. Unfortunately unless I saw the system I cannot give exact locations. Sorry I cannot be of any more help.

Devick Baalreth
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:03:00 - [2146]
 

Originally by: Haka Aragon
Originally by: Kagura Nikon

NO!They would NOT find out! Because XP machines UP TO DATE with microsoft updates are IMUNE!!!

If you had a XP runnign without the updates its user's fault! You cannot expect CCP to test every operatign system under every possible update status ( several hundreds of possible combinations)


You I am sorry to say are talking utter BULLSH*T!!

Just because you have all the patches from Mircrsoft does not mean you are immune... I work as a Tech Support rep for a computer firm in the UK and we tested this out with EVERY RELEASE of Windows XP (Home/Pro/Media Centre/64Bit) and we installed all the Microsoft updates that were available on these systems as if they were going out to customers and EVERY SINGLE ONE of them was affected by this...

If you dont know what you are talking about please do all the people that are looking for help on this situation a favour and STFU until you get a clue...


I agree with you whole heartedly, however you could go without the vulgarity. I answer the question and statements without swearing without need (or at all). I would have more respect for you if you did.

Nelson Vandermark
Black Omega Security
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:09:00 - [2147]
 

Hey where do I send my 120$ Invoice from my computer repair place since I had to get them to rebuild the system because I only play games?

Haka Aragon
Caldari
SiN. Corp
Daisho Syndicate
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:12:00 - [2148]
 

Originally by: Devick Baalreth

I agree with you whole heartedly, however you could go without the vulgarity. I answer the question and statements without swearing without need (or at all). I would have more respect for you if you did.


Sorry Devick, I altered my post.

I shouldn't have worded it as I did I am just annoyed with people thinking that because they weren't affected and they did such and such that everyone that does what they did are also safe...

Devick Bane
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:12:00 - [2149]
 

Originally by: Nelson Vandermark
Hey where do I send my 120$ Invoice from my computer repair place since I had to get them to rebuild the system because I only play games?


Nobody, unfortunately its AS IS. Which means you accepted risk upon install. Sometimes getting a solution that goes above and beyond of immediately sending to a TECH or calling a TECH need to be done first. Ample instructions where given to repair it. I read most of it and its pretty solid on most accounts.

Devick Bane
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:14:00 - [2150]
 

Edited by: Devick Bane on 07/12/2007 10:15:07
Originally by: Haka Aragon
Originally by: Devick Baalreth

I agree with you whole heartedly, however you could go without the vulgarity. I answer the question and statements without swearing without need (or at all). I would have more respect for you if you did.


Sorry Devick, I altered my post.

I shouldn't have worded it as I did I am just annoyed with people thinking that because they weren't affected and they did such and such that everyone that does what they did are also safe...


Thats fine, we all have our moments and its not as if you where beyond saving. I just prefer reader safe ones. Words win wars, resorting to vulgar words means you're at the bottom of the clip with no more ammo.

Crap is a decent word, its not bad and gets the point across, like the reword at the bottom as well.

giddymochug
Minmatar
Oyster Colors
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:16:00 - [2151]
 

so is it safe to install now? hehe

Ader
Genisis Industries
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:21:00 - [2152]
 

Originally by: giddymochug
so is it safe to install now? hehe


Yes I belive its been like that for a long time, unless you have downloaded file long time ago.. or havent rebooted you comp. yet (as I have, prolly will not reboot for another 10days anyway.)

Zataaki
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:22:00 - [2153]
 

I'm running a windows partition on a mac. When I try to start up windows it gives me the hal.dll error. My cd drive is currently broken and won't read any cd's. What are my options here other than get the cd drive fixed so I can use the windows cd to recover?

PsyMan
Amarr
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:28:00 - [2154]
 

Edited by: PsyMan on 07/12/2007 10:31:37
Originally by: Zataaki
I'm running a windows partition on a mac. When I try to start up windows it gives me the hal.dll error. My cd drive is currently broken and won't read any cd's. What are my options here other than get the cd drive fixed so I can use the windows cd to recover?


One option you can try if you have access to another PC or Mac with a firewire port and a firewire cable is to plug a cable between the 2 machines and boot your mac while holding down T, this will start it in target disk mode and your hard drive will show up on the other machine as an external disk, you can then make the repair. Or of course you could boot it to your mac OS and repair it from the mac, I recommend to use textwrangler (free) to create a new boot.ini though as it will produce a nice clean file.

Zandev
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:30:00 - [2155]
 

Originally by: giddymochug
so is it safe to install now? hehe


Yes and no.

It should be safe to download and install now.

However, do note that I got hit by this bug *after* CCP had fixed it, as the Eve background downloader had grabbed the patch before the fix.

Thus, be careful, and make sure that you are installing the fixed version.

Maxus Cynus
Perkone
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:34:00 - [2156]
 

Well this confirms that I shouldn't resubscribe even for a month to check out this "awesome" new update.

Regarding the EULA, in Iceland you can NOT waive your legally guarded rights so the EULA will not make CCP exempt from the damage they have caused. However the blame culture has not yet, thankfully, seeped into the national psyche here.

However the same may be true in other European countries, the EULA is not a carte blanche for CCP to mess up your PC.

If CCP think that they can hide behind their EULA they are perhaps going to find out the hard way that the world doesn't work like that. They better compensate their users even if it will cost them millions of Euros because the alternative will be millions more of Euros.

Zataaki
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:34:00 - [2157]
 

Originally by: PsyMan
Edited by: PsyMan on 07/12/2007 10:31:37
Originally by: Zataaki
I'm running a windows partition on a mac. When I try to start up windows it gives me the hal.dll error. My cd drive is currently broken and won't read any cd's. What are my options here other than get the cd drive fixed so I can use the windows cd to recover?


One option you can try if you have access to another PC or Mac with a firewire port and a firewire cable is to plug a cable between the 2 machines and boot your mac while holding down T, this will start it in target disk mode and your hard drive will show up on the other machine as an external disk, you can then make the repair. Or of course you could boot it to your mac OS and repair it from the mac, I recommend to use textwrangler (free) to create a new boot.ini though as it will produce a nice clean file.


I'm actually getting an error with hal.dll rather than boot.ini. If anything I will have to repair it from mac OS. My roommate has a pc with vista but we dont have firewire.

Sgt Zim
Fallen Angel's
Blade.
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:38:00 - [2158]
 

Originally by: Maxus Cynus
Well this confirms that I shouldn't resubscribe even for a month to check out this "awesome" new update.

Regarding the EULA, in Iceland you can NOT waive your legally guarded rights so the EULA will not make CCP exempt from the damage they have caused. However the blame culture has not yet, thankfully, seeped into the national psyche here.


However the same may be true in other European countries, the EULA is not a carte blanche for CCP to mess up your PC.

If CCP think that they can hide behind their EULA they are perhaps going to find out the hard way that the world doesn't work like that. They better compensate their users even if it will cost them millions of Euros because the alternative will be millions more of Euros.


You sir are a total Joker.........why don't you start a compensation /lets all sue eachother / I hate CCP / Its just not fair / cruel cruel world ........type thread

and leave this thread for people trying to sort out our fellow gamers technical problem


Thaneal Swiftbird
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:40:00 - [2159]
 

Originally by: Haka Aragon

Sorry Devick, I altered my post.

I shouldn't have worded it as I did I am just annoyed with people thinking that because they weren't affected and they did such and such that everyone that does what they did are also safe...


The real shame is CCP has nothing better to do then to start putting a spin on this issue. If you look at the "known issue" post at the main page, you will see they put up totally wrong criteria:

# You must have Windows installed not on the primary partition.
# You must have at least 2 hard disks and the OS must be installed not on the primary, but the secondary hard disk.

This is utter nonsense and can hardly be seen as just a mistake. They are already trying to tell the world: "Oh but that mistake was not so bad, because it only affected a few people with esoteric setups."

Dear CCP, such a behaviour adds insult to the damage already done. Its disgraceful and stupid. Please correct your wrongdoings asap!

Just in case you do not happen to know: Your patch killed XP installations with regular out of the box configs and installations. Even if they were up to date with patches.

Malixu
Posted - 2007.12.07 10:41:00 - [2160]
 

Originally by: Kagura Nikon
NO!They would NOT find out! Because XP machines UP TO DATE with microsoft updates are IMUNE!!!


If you had a XP runnign without the updates its user's fault! You cannot expect CCP to test every operatign system under every possible update status ( several hundreds of possible combinations)


Specifically, XP SP2 with a fairly vanilla install may be able to auto-recover. XP SP2 with an unusual setup can screw up significantly worse than previous versions, as it tries to boot from partitions that Windows isn't on, leaving you with no actual error message (happened to me).

And while I don't expect CCP to test against every possibility, I do expect them to have a file modification test done to ensure the patcher doesn't touch files it's not meant to (same for the game itself).


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