open All Channels
seplocked Ships and Modules
blankseplocked The new Eos: an Astarte with less grid, and the DPS of a Thorax.
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5

Author Topic

Bellum Eternus
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2007.11.09 07:51:00 - [1]
 

So what is the point of owning an Eos CCP? Sure, reduce it's DPS a bit, but don't just erase it's unique design. Having a 5th mid gave it more flexibility and versatility than the Astarte. Now that it has the exact same slot layout, crap DPS, reduced drone bandwidth *and* reduced drone bay size (wern't we supposed to be getting *more flexibility with increased drone bay size?), it's just a big Thorax.

The unbonused drones in the smaller dronebay with reduced bandwidth completely erased it's 'drone ship' status. The 15m3/level 'bonus' is just a waste. Give the Eos a static drone bay (325m3 or so) and replace the useless drone bay bonus with a tanking bonus (+7.5% resists to all armor resists per level or something).

Keep the 7/5/5 layout. I want that 5th mid slot back. It's one of the things that made the Eos unique.

Or don't give it a resist bonus, keep wasting that bonus on the drone bay size, and just replace the 5th mid, while keeping the 6th low.

I know the devs put a lot of work into a design before it hits Sisi, but I can't believe that multiple people would take a look at the Eos and decide that this is *the* best course of action for both the Eos and the rest of the game. Keep the Eos unique and valued, not a bad shadow of the Astarte.

Ray Duo
Posted - 2007.11.09 07:57:00 - [2]
 

oi stop bashing on the thoraxes, they can deal good dps you know

Bellum Eternus
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2007.11.09 08:02:00 - [3]
 

Not compared to a Brutix or the current Eos, or any of the fleet command ships. It's a cruiser ffs. And T1 at that.

Zendoc
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.11.09 08:10:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 08:11:29
So the point is this.

The Eos is the fleet command ship, and unlike all of its fleet command ship breatheren, it was dishing out more DPS than its Field Command Ship counterpart. If you read the description, you will see that it states that the fleet command ships are not really made for direct combat, this is the reason they can use more than 1 gang mod at once.
The field command ship is supposed to be the powerhouse of the 2. Look at any other Fleet command ship, you will see its DPS is significantly lower than its field command twin, Claymore vs Sleipnir for example.

You asked what's the point? The Eos was vastly overpowered, it needed a nerf, and the game is better off because of it.

diska
Caldari
Heavy Industry INC
Posted - 2007.11.09 08:11:00 - [5]
 

My current target was an EOS. I planned it with EFT and 51 day remain. But since the new changes I don`t think that I still need it as well.

But I still training to it, cause it`s my personal fleet command ship. I`m don`t want to solo PvP with him, just for primary target - gang bonuses for 5 lvl agents.

Bellum Eternus
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2007.11.09 08:20:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Zendoc
Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 08:11:29
So the point is this.

The Eos is the fleet command ship, and unlike all of its fleet command ship breatheren, it was dishing out more DPS than its Field Command Ship counterpart. If you read the description, you will see that it states that the fleet command ships are not really made for direct combat, this is the reason they can use more than 1 gang mod at once.
The field command ship is supposed to be the powerhouse of the 2. Look at any other Fleet command ship, you will see its DPS is significantly lower than its field command twin, Claymore vs Sleipnir for example.

You asked what's the point? The Eos was vastly overpowered, it needed a nerf, and the game is better off because of it.


You're an idiot.

I'm not asking for the Eos to do the same/more DPS than the Astarte, or even more than other fleet command ships. What I'm asking for is that the Eos retain it's drone focus, and it's 5th mid slot. These two things are what made it unique when compared to the Astarte.

As it sits now, the devs have turned it into an Astarte, with less grid, and less DPS. So I'm asking that they review their design and keep the Eos focused on drones as it's main form of DPS, and keep it's 5th mid at a minimum, so as to retain it's flexibility and versatility (like shield tanking for instance, or an ECCM or sensor booster, dual webs, dual scrams etc.).

Knock two highs off of it and add a 5th mid. Make it 5/5/6. Or do any of my suggestions in my original post. Just don't make it an Astarte with no DPS.

Alex Harumichi
Gallente
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2007.11.09 08:26:00 - [7]
 

As noted in numerous other threads, the Eos was overpowered DPS-wise, and needed a nerf.

The problem is, the Eos was a crappy fleet support ship before this triple-nerf, and is just as crappy after -- and now it doesn't have the DPS, which previously was the only thing going for it.

It still has (by far) the worst gang links, weird mismatched bonuses, and fitting problems. The move of a mid to a low improved the tank to reasonable levels, but removed the small bit of flexibility the ship had.

The nerf was way overdone, and totally failed to take into account the fact that the Eos performs poorly as fleet support.

One of the more popular fixing suggestions is: regrid it to rails, swap the hybrid damage bonus to optimal bonus, and increase drone bandwidth a bit to keep total DPS even. If this ship is supposed to act as EW squad support as its pretty much only task, it should at least use ranged weapons (currently it can't even reasonably fit 250mmII rails).

Also, nerfing the drone bay was stupid and counterproductive, with the drone bandwidth now in place as the limiter. The ship should get a static large drone bay, and have the (now pointless) drone bay size bonus replaced with something that helps the ship act as fleet support. Bonus to logistics drones, perhaps.

At the moment, there is very little reason to fly an Eos, the other fleet commands pretty much wipe the floor with it in general utility.

Note that I'm not talking about solo ability here, I'm glad that has been toned down. I'm talking about what is supposed to be the main role of this ship, in which it currently fails.

Zendoc
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.11.09 08:33:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Alex Harumichi
As noted in numerous other threads, the Eos was overpowered DPS-wise, and needed a nerf.

The problem is, the Eos was a crappy fleet support ship before this triple-nerf, and is just as crappy after -- and now it doesn't have the DPS, which previously was the only thing going for it.

It still has (by far) the worst gang links, weird mismatched bonuses, and fitting problems. The move of a mid to a low improved the tank to reasonable levels, but removed the small bit of flexibility the ship had.

The nerf was way overdone, and totally failed to take into account the fact that the Eos performs poorly as fleet support.

One of the more popular fixing suggestions is: regrid it to rails, swap the hybrid damage bonus to optimal bonus, and increase drone bandwidth a bit to keep total DPS even. If this ship is supposed to act as EW squad support as its pretty much only task, it should at least use ranged weapons (currently it can't even reasonably fit 250mmII rails).

Also, nerfing the drone bay was stupid and counterproductive, with the drone bandwidth now in place as the limiter. The ship should get a static large drone bay, and have the (now pointless) drone bay size bonus replaced with something that helps the ship act as fleet support. Bonus to logistics drones, perhaps.

At the moment, there is very little reason to fly an Eos, the other fleet commands pretty much wipe the floor with it in general utility.

Note that I'm not talking about solo ability here, I'm glad that has been toned down. I'm talking about what is supposed to be the main role of this ship, in which it currently fails.



QFT

LUKEC
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
Posted - 2007.11.09 08:56:00 - [9]
 

/me looks at claymore speed and whine NERF!

Shevar
Minmatar
Target Practice incorporated
Posted - 2007.11.09 09:06:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Shevar on 09/11/2007 09:06:17
*sigh*

http://eve-search.com/thread/586859/page/1

Originally by: bellem eternus
Originally by: Torothin
Amarr recon pilt here if you whine and say that these 2 ships are worthless then heres what you do:

1. Train up your industry skills.
2. Train up your trade skills.
3. Go to empire and build mods and sell them or run missions just be a complete and carebear since your too stupid and too much of a noob to realize the curse and pilgrim are still the best recons in the game. And if you can't figure out a good setup you don't deserve to fly these 2 great ships.

Try different setups mine works great and I just had to SLIGHTLY change my ship setup. Still pwns bs's, still owns HACS, still is the ultimate ship for guerilla warfare. Still the same old ship just takes more skill to fly it and an understanding of game mechanics.

CCP did this nerf to implement more of a use for medium energy nuetralizers since you rarley saw them on a curse or pilgrim cuz they were a hassle. Theres your 1 and only hint you peons.

I agree with what he said, and how he said it. 90% of the Curse pilots in the game are whiners.


So if it's your ship you scream OMG WTF?!!! If it's someone elses ship it's fine l2p.

Why don't you just follow up the advice you seemed to fully agree with when it is going about the curse and not your own FOTM?

Testy Mctest
Posted - 2007.11.09 09:11:00 - [11]
 

So wait - the new Eos, is weaker at combat than it's combat based counterpart, and is now in line with the relationship that other field command -> fleet command ships have instead of being a flawed design that makes it's combat counterpart obsolete?

Clearly this must be a mistake!

Shevar
Minmatar
Target Practice incorporated
Posted - 2007.11.09 09:27:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Testy Mctest
So wait - the new Eos, is weaker at combat than it's combat based counterpart, and is now in line with the relationship that other field command -> fleet command ships have instead of being a flawed design that makes it's combat counterpart obsolete?

Clearly this must be a mistake!


Quite frankly the Eos has the same problem as the curse/pilgrim. It's gang usefullness compared to the other races ships is bad, it's old advantage was it was a good DPS/solo ship. They nerf DPS/Solo but don't radically revamp it's gang usefullness and thus basicly screwing the ship over big time.

Grytok
KL0NKRIEGER
Posted - 2007.11.09 09:44:00 - [13]
 

I have to agree, that the given Warfare-Links are crap compared to the other races.

Fitting is not that hard I've to say. I tried something like this:

High: 5x Heavy Ion II, 2x Med NOS
Med: 10MN MWD II, Med Electrochem CapBooster, Warpdisruptor II, Web
Low: 2x MAR II, Explosive Hardener II, EANM II, DCU II, 800mm RT
Rigs: Trimark, Powergrid

Drones: ECM-600er, Hammerhead II, Med Armor Bots, whatever

So it's still dishing out some 400 DPS with Hammerhead II's, and the tank got a little bit better.
The DroneBay make this ship still viable I think, as you can carry alot of choices with you.

I still liked the "old" Eos more, but it really was a better Astarte, then a Fleet Command Ship.

Would've been better to make it a Drone-Carrier like the Ishkur/Ishtar, shifting a High-Slot to the lows, and reducing turret-hardpoints to 3, for cutting off it's damage.

Zendoc
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.11.09 10:41:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 10:45:38
What the hell are you talking about? It has the same Warfare link bonuses as any other race and on top of that it has 2 more turret hardpoints that you can use instead of using those as warfare links. It has the same 3% bonus to a race specific warfare link mod (EW links)Read the bonuses of other ships before you complain FFS.

Look at the minmatar for example. The claymore has 8 high slots, 5 of which are turret hardpoints, all fleet command ships can use up to 3 warfare link mods simultaneoulsy, meaning those extra 3 slots are for warfare link modules.

The Eos has 7 high and 7 turret slots, so what? you give up a a 5th turret for an extra warfare link module and hey now you are down to 4 turrets instead of 5 and blasters do more damage than autocannons anyway. Not to mention you have a bigger drone bay. You have the same battle cruiser damage bonus, and the same battelcruiser tanking bonus. FFS why are you crying? Plus you even have an extra low slot, you armor tank so you don't have to fill your mids with shield bull**** and you can use it for EW.

Your ship got hit by the balance train, quit crying and look at everybody else's ship before you call the whaaambulence. It's still a good ship for what its meant for. Its about time the gallente started to get some balance.

Tibilo
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:26:00 - [15]
 

Its good that the eos is no longer as good a solo ship as it was. however it now doesn't fit any role particularly well. When faced with the choice of fleet command ship, there is the vulture which has an amazing shield tank and can improve it with warfare links it fits well with shield tanking ships. the claymore that can have a good shield tank and/or amazing speed, it has warfare links that can improve its speed and tackling, it fit well with speed based gangs. the damnation that has an amazing armour tank and warfare links that improve its tank, it fits well with armour tanking gangs. Finally the Eos has a good tank and can use a few slightly bigger dones than usual. it has warfare links to improve electronic warfare? so you would think it was better able to damp or jam or some kind of electronic warfare, no? it only has 4 med slots. it could use its drones for some Ew cutting its overall dps by about half and still not be any better at it than say a vulture or claymore fit with ecm, maybe even worse as its drones can be killed even if it has backups.

I have the skills for an Eos, admittedly I have never used it for gang support as I am sure is the case with many people but theres a reason for this. As its no longer a good solo ship, if I wanted a ship for fleet command I would just take the couple of weeks needed for another races cruiser level 5. Theres just not much of a reason to fly the Eos over the other fleet commands

Suboran
Gallente
Best Path Inc.
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:26:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Zendoc
Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 10:45:38
What the hell are you talking about? It has the same Warfare link bonuses as any other race and on top of that it has 2 more turret hardpoints that you can use instead of using those as warfare links. It has the same 3% bonus to a race specific warfare link mod (EW links)Read the bonuses of other ships before you complain FFS.

Look at the minmatar for example. The claymore has 8 high slots, 5 of which are turret hardpoints, all fleet command ships can use up to 3 warfare link mods simultaneoulsy, meaning those extra 3 slots are for warfare link modules.

The Eos has 7 high and 7 turret slots, so what? you give up a a 5th turret for an extra warfare link module and hey now you are down to 4 turrets instead of 5 and blasters do more damage than autocannons anyway. Not to mention you have a bigger drone bay. You have the same battle cruiser damage bonus, and the same battelcruiser tanking bonus. FFS why are you crying? Plus you even have an extra low slot, you armor tank so you don't have to fill your mids with shield bull**** and you can use it for EW.

Your ship got hit by the balance train, quit crying and look at everybody else's ship before you call the whaaambulence. It's still a good ship for what its meant for. Its about time the gallente started to get some balance.


eos is a drone boat, but where do you mention that its loosing its role as one.

oh and btw, before you start going on about 'crying' and ' whining' perhaps you shouldve though of a valid point to put across your arguement.

VicturusTeSaluto
Gallente
Metafarmers
MeatSausage EXPRESS
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:31:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: VicturusTeSaluto on 09/11/2007 11:31:45
They don't want to balance ships like the eos(and to a lesser extent the myrm), they simply want people to stop using them as combat ships.

This is ******ed, less variety in ship types = less fun fights.

There is no reason at all why the eos should not be able to field a rack of heavy drones and why it should not have a large bay. They are unbonus'd drones FFS. Want to make a less of a turret ship? Yeah whatever it might work. Messing with the drone-capability as well? wtf

Cornette
Gallente
Solar Revenue Service
TAXU
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:32:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Alex Harumichi
As noted in numerous other threads, the Eos was overpowered DPS-wise, and needed a nerf.

The problem is, the Eos was a crappy fleet support ship before this triple-nerf, and is just as crappy after -- and now it doesn't have the DPS, which previously was the only thing going for it.

It still has (by far) the worst gang links, weird mismatched bonuses, and fitting problems. The move of a mid to a low improved the tank to reasonable levels, but removed the small bit of flexibility the ship had.

The nerf was way overdone, and totally failed to take into account the fact that the Eos performs poorly as fleet support.

One of the more popular fixing suggestions is: regrid it to rails, swap the hybrid damage bonus to optimal bonus, and increase drone bandwidth a bit to keep total DPS even. If this ship is supposed to act as EW squad support as its pretty much only task, it should at least use ranged weapons (currently it can't even reasonably fit 250mmII rails).

Also, nerfing the drone bay was stupid and counterproductive, with the drone bandwidth now in place as the limiter. The ship should get a static large drone bay, and have the (now pointless) drone bay size bonus replaced with something that helps the ship act as fleet support. Bonus to logistics drones, perhaps.

At the moment, there is very little reason to fly an Eos, the other fleet commands pretty much wipe the floor with it in general utility.

Note that I'm not talking about solo ability here, I'm glad that has been toned down. I'm talking about what is supposed to be the main role of this ship, in which it currently fails.



Best idea I seen so far.

/Signed

//Cornette

Zendoc
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:41:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 11:41:30
Originally by: Suboran
eos is a drone boat, but where do you mention that its loosing its role as one.

oh and btw, before you start going on about 'crying' and ' whining' perhaps you shouldve though of a valid point to put across your arguement.


Except for... it has a gun damage bonus, making it not only a drone boat? In fact it has the SAME gun damage bonus as the claymore the only difference is one is rate of fire and one is damage, they have the same effect on dps. I could equally argue with you and say, no its a gunboat with a larger drone bay than any other fleet command ship. It even has more turret hardpoints. There's my valid point.

Alex Harumichi
Gallente
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:50:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 09/11/2007 11:52:15
The problem with the Eos is that there is no reason to fly it over the other fleet commands.

I can fly the Eos and Damnation, and see no reason to undock anymore with the Eos. The Damnation does it all so much better it's not even funny.

It doesn't have a role. Bascially, it's kind of like the Apoc -- sort of ok if you look at it in isolation, but compared to other ships in the same class it becomes a pointless ship.

Why pick a ship that has a useless gang link type as bonus, and has fitting problems? Because it's green?

Naviset
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:52:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Zendoc
Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 10:45:38
What the hell are you talking about? It has the same Warfare link bonuses as any other race and on top of that it has 2 more turret hardpoints that you can use instead of using those as warfare links. It has the same 3% bonus to a race specific warfare link mod (EW links)Read the bonuses of other ships before you complain FFS.

Look at the minmatar for example. The claymore has 8 high slots, 5 of which are turret hardpoints, all fleet command ships can use up to 3 warfare link mods simultaneoulsy, meaning those extra 3 slots are for warfare link modules.

The Eos has 7 high and 7 turret slots, so what? you give up a a 5th turret for an extra warfare link module and hey now you are down to 4 turrets instead of 5 and blasters do more damage than autocannons anyway. Not to mention you have a bigger drone bay. You have the same battle cruiser damage bonus, and the same battelcruiser tanking bonus. FFS why are you crying? Plus you even have an extra low slot, you armor tank so you don't have to fill your mids with shield bull**** and you can use it for EW.

Your ship got hit by the balance train, quit crying and look at everybody else's ship before you call the whaaambulence. It's still a good ship for what its meant for. Its about time the gallente started to get some balance.


qft. The eos was out of balance before, overpowered, doing stupid amounts of damage. Now, its underbalanced, doing too little damage and having useless gangmods. The Three other fleet commands have extremely beneficial gangmods, tank better than said Eos does (Even with the lowslot), and now deal roughly the same damage. So as it is, theres no reason to fly an eos.. might as well just get an Astarte. I agree the Eos needed to be brought back in line but this nerf is a bit extreme. They could at least make efforts to modify the ship so that its useful, not just nerf it out of the role it did fill and not make sure it had a fallback role to keep it useful.

Alex Harumichi
Gallente
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:54:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 09/11/2007 11:54:49
Originally by: Naviset
The eos was out of balance before, overpowered, doing stupid amounts of damage. Now, its underbalanced, doing too little damage and having useless gangmods.


Exactly. The nerf triple-bat swung too far, and failed to take into account the problems the ship has as a fleet support platform.

As of now, the only thing to do with an Eos is to sell it, before the price collapses totally. You might still get some isk from it, not everyone knows of the change (yet).

Setana Manoro
Gallente
Firefly Inc.
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:54:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Bellum Eternus
Originally by: Zendoc
Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 08:11:29
So the point is this.

The Eos is the fleet command ship, and unlike all of its fleet command ship breatheren, it was dishing out more DPS than its Field Command Ship counterpart. If you read the description, you will see that it states that the fleet command ships are not really made for direct combat, this is the reason they can use more than 1 gang mod at once.
The field command ship is supposed to be the powerhouse of the 2. Look at any other Fleet command ship, you will see its DPS is significantly lower than its field command twin, Claymore vs Sleipnir for example.

You asked what's the point? The Eos was vastly overpowered, it needed a nerf, and the game is better off because of it.


You're an idiot.

I'm not asking for the Eos to do the same/more DPS than the Astarte, or even more than other fleet command ships. What I'm asking for is that the Eos retain it's drone focus, and it's 5th mid slot. These two things are what made it unique when compared to the Astarte.

As it sits now, the devs have turned it into an Astarte, with less grid, and less DPS. So I'm asking that they review their design and keep the Eos focused on drones as it's main form of DPS, and keep it's 5th mid at a minimum, so as to retain it's flexibility and versatility (like shield tanking for instance, or an ECCM or sensor booster, dual webs, dual scrams etc.).

Knock two highs off of it and add a 5th mid. Make it 5/5/6. Or do any of my suggestions in my original post. Just don't make it an Astarte with no DPS.


The ship is supposed to run links and you want it with 5 highs ?

Alex Harumichi
Gallente
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:57:00 - [24]
 

I personally don't care too much about the DPS, but it needs to be useful as a fleet support ship. Currently it's mostly a paperweight, compared to the other three. It has horribly conflicted design, and no real role.

Setana Manoro
Gallente
Firefly Inc.
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:58:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Naviset
Originally by: Zendoc
Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 10:45:38
What the hell are you talking about? It has the same Warfare link bonuses as any other race and on top of that it has 2 more turret hardpoints that you can use instead of using those as warfare links. It has the same 3% bonus to a race specific warfare link mod (EW links)Read the bonuses of other ships before you complain FFS.

Look at the minmatar for example. The claymore has 8 high slots, 5 of which are turret hardpoints, all fleet command ships can use up to 3 warfare link mods simultaneoulsy, meaning those extra 3 slots are for warfare link modules.

The Eos has 7 high and 7 turret slots, so what? you give up a a 5th turret for an extra warfare link module and hey now you are down to 4 turrets instead of 5 and blasters do more damage than autocannons anyway. Not to mention you have a bigger drone bay. You have the same battle cruiser damage bonus, and the same battelcruiser tanking bonus. FFS why are you crying? Plus you even have an extra low slot, you armor tank so you don't have to fill your mids with shield bull**** and you can use it for EW.

Your ship got hit by the balance train, quit crying and look at everybody else's ship before you call the whaaambulence. It's still a good ship for what its meant for. Its about time the gallente started to get some balance.


qft. The eos was out of balance before, overpowered, doing stupid amounts of damage. Now, its underbalanced, doing too little damage and having useless gangmods. The Three other fleet commands have extremely beneficial gangmods, tank better than said Eos does (Even with the lowslot), and now deal roughly the same damage. So as it is, theres no reason to fly an eos.. might as well just get an Astarte. I agree the Eos needed to be brought back in line but this nerf is a bit extreme. They could at least make efforts to modify the ship so that its useful, not just nerf it out of the role it did fill and not make sure it had a fallback role to keep it useful.


Let me get this right. The fact that a fleet command ship does fleet command ship damage is what you consider undesirable ?
Any other race has to live with this but somehow gallente are special ?
And as for reasons to fly EOS, train links.
If you put it like "why should i fly the eos when astarte is better" then, you miss the point of using a fleet command ship. Pick the astarte and pray it doesn't get turned into a 3 mid ship - this would be a nightmare for all you gallente whiners ... you might understand the pain of the amarr users.

Zendoc
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.11.09 11:59:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Alex Harumichi
I personally don't care too much about the DPS, but it needs to be useful as a fleet support ship. Currently it's mostly a paperweight, compared to the other three. It has horribly conflicted design, and no real role.



Explain how you justify this. It gets all the same bonuses, has about just as many high slots with the added versatility of having them be turret hardpoints as well. I just don't see how you figure it doesn't compare in design. If you can fit a gun, you can fit a link module, its much less taxing on the ships resources.

Naviset
Posted - 2007.11.09 12:03:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Setana Manoro
Originally by: Naviset
Originally by: Zendoc
Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 10:45:38
What the hell are you talking about? It has the same Warfare link bonuses as any other race and on top of that it has 2 more turret hardpoints that you can use instead of using those as warfare links. It has the same 3% bonus to a race specific warfare link mod (EW links)Read the bonuses of other ships before you complain FFS.

Look at the minmatar for example. The claymore has 8 high slots, 5 of which are turret hardpoints, all fleet command ships can use up to 3 warfare link mods simultaneoulsy, meaning those extra 3 slots are for warfare link modules.

The Eos has 7 high and 7 turret slots, so what? you give up a a 5th turret for an extra warfare link module and hey now you are down to 4 turrets instead of 5 and blasters do more damage than autocannons anyway. Not to mention you have a bigger drone bay. You have the same battle cruiser damage bonus, and the same battelcruiser tanking bonus. FFS why are you crying? Plus you even have an extra low slot, you armor tank so you don't have to fill your mids with shield bull**** and you can use it for EW.

Your ship got hit by the balance train, quit crying and look at everybody else's ship before you call the whaaambulence. It's still a good ship for what its meant for. Its about time the gallente started to get some balance.


qft. The eos was out of balance before, overpowered, doing stupid amounts of damage. Now, its underbalanced, doing too little damage and having useless gangmods. The Three other fleet commands have extremely beneficial gangmods, tank better than said Eos does (Even with the lowslot), and now deal roughly the same damage. So as it is, theres no reason to fly an eos.. might as well just get an Astarte. I agree the Eos needed to be brought back in line but this nerf is a bit extreme. They could at least make efforts to modify the ship so that its useful, not just nerf it out of the role it did fill and not make sure it had a fallback role to keep it useful.


Let me get this right. The fact that a fleet command ship does fleet command ship damage is what you consider undesirable ?
Any other race has to live with this but somehow gallente are special ?
And as for reasons to fly EOS, train links.
If you put it like "why should i fly the eos when astarte is better" then, you miss the point of using a fleet command ship. Pick the astarte and pray it doesn't get turned into a 3 mid ship - this would be a nightmare for all you gallente whiners ... you might understand the pain of the amarr users.



You can qft too. It's not that fleet cs damage is underdesirable, its that fleet cs damage on a fleet command that has useless fleet capabilities is undesirable.

I'm not omgwhining because the eos is getting nerfed I simply don't see the point in it anymore. It doesn't matter to me cause I don't fly it, I agree that in a lot of ways it was probably too powerful before and now I believe that the nerf was necessary but overdone. A point to note... just because you're amarr and your ships suck doesn't mean that you need to be vindictive or accuse me of being biased because my fotm ship is nerfed. I don't fly it, I wasnt gonna fly it even before the nerf, and I sure as hell wouldnt fly it now.

Point of Note: Damnation > Eos. Revel in it.

Zendoc
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2007.11.09 12:03:00 - [28]
 

Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 12:05:51
Edited by: Zendoc on 09/11/2007 12:03:19
Originally by: Setana Manoro
Let me get this right. The fact that a fleet command ship does fleet command ship damage is what you consider undesirable ?
Any other race has to live with this but somehow gallente are special ?
And as for reasons to fly EOS, train links.
If you put it like "why should i fly the eos when astarte is better" then, you miss the point of using a fleet command ship. Pick the astarte and pray it doesn't get turned into a 3 mid ship - this would be a nightmare for all you gallente whiners ... you might understand the pain of the amarr users.



Seriously, I want to know how the EW Links are useless mods. And its not like you can ONLY fit those mods, its just the only type of mod that fits your ships bonus. Boohoo I fly a claymore, it only gives a bonus to skirmish warfare mods, but I still fit 2 skirmish and a seige warfare mod. Not all three mods in every class are good.

I want to understand what you guys are saying by claming "it's bad for fleet combat."
Are you saying EW is bad for fleets?
Are you saying you can't fit gang warfare mods with 7 high slots?
What is it that makes it undesirable for fleet combat?

Naviset
Posted - 2007.11.09 12:04:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Zendoc
Originally by: Alex Harumichi
I personally don't care too much about the DPS, but it needs to be useful as a fleet support ship. Currently it's mostly a paperweight, compared to the other three. It has horribly conflicted design, and no real role.



Explain how you justify this. It gets all the same bonuses, has about just as many high slots with the added versatility of having them be turret hardpoints as well. I just don't see how you figure it doesn't compare in design. If you can fit a gun, you can fit a link module, its much less taxing on the ships resources.


Because.. its link mods dont do anything anyone REALLY cares about? Especially devalued now that TDs and Damps got nerfed.

Alex Harumichi
Gallente
Gradient
Electus Matari
Posted - 2007.11.09 12:07:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Setana Manoro

Let me get this right. The fact that a fleet command ship does fleet command ship damage is what you consider undesirable ?
Any other race has to live with this but somehow gallente are special ?



I'm not the person you responded to, but: I think you're missing the point. It's quite ok and good that the Eos now does fleet-command -class (i.e. low) dps. Most sane people agree on that.

But:

Originally by: Setana Manoro

And as for reasons to fly EOS, train links.



Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.

The problem is that the infowar gang links are far and away the worst of the four. They are only useful when you're specifically supporting a dedicated EW squad. The other three are useful pretty much anywhere.

If you're not running infowar gang links on the Eos then you're doubly stupid, since with one of the other fleet command ships you'd both get a bonus and get better ship stats.

So the only role left to the Eos is EW-squad booster, and even there it's pretty crap because it has problems fitting weapons with suitable range (250mmIIs) and can't reasonably fit a plate making it fragile in fleet / gang situations.

Compare to the almost universally useful role of the other 3, and you might start to see the problem. The Eos has been pushed into a niche role, in which it's not really good either.

I've seen tons of Damnations, Claymores & Vultures flying fleet support with ganglinks. To date I've seen an Eos used with gang links once. There is no reason for those statistics to improve now, since the Eos remains as crap at fleet support as it always has.

Again, I don't care about dps that much. I care about useful role, and balance as compared to the other three fleet commands. Right now the Damnation Claymore and Vulture are vastly better.

The Eos needs a boost to its fleet / gang support capability.


Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only