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blankseplocked EVE online is NOT Carebear online
 
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Tesal
Posted - 2007.08.27 07:02:00 - [31]
 

The more dangerous you make transportation of goods, the more difficult, and as a result, expensive, you make the manufacturing process. The gate campers never see the irony in the situation, that they will be killing people with guns and ships built by, or transported by, the people they are killing. If you break AFK hauling by industrials and freighters in empire, EvE breaks. AFK hauling is essential, without it, the EvE economy won't work.

Whine all you want about the "carebears". There needs to be a place for industrialists and traders. And yes, Concord should kill the gankers and empire gate campers, if they don't, no freighter or industrial will be able to turn a profit over the long run. These ships can't be tanked like a combat ship. Thats one of the big problems facing Empire trade right now, it is increasingly unsafe to the point where some routes aren't worth flying. I think that is why you see trade die in those areas and why you can't buy a hull at a good price in a convenient location.

I think it has swung too far to pvp in empire. the other day I saw freight containers in 3 separate systems near Hek. Around Uedama, I had to get an Occator, I wouldn't want to risk the rigs on my Iteron V for what I haul. I have been attacked with zero cargo, nothing. A guy in my Corp got taken out for 70M in minor BPO. The PVP in empire has gotten excessive.

VicturusTeSaluto
Gallente
Metafarmers
MeatSausage EXPRESS
Posted - 2007.08.27 07:05:00 - [32]
 

/sign

If you want full immunity then go play a damned single player game.

Kastar
Paragon Horizons
THORN Alliance
Posted - 2007.08.27 07:11:00 - [33]
 

neither /signed nor /unsigned.

One of both would be an unsuitable answer, only generated for the e-peen of the OP.

Eve is whatever the player wants it to be in the setting CCP provides. FFS, stop whining about the people that whine Laughing and go have a good time.

Let them care for the bear and shoot all the ones you can. That's about it. Now quit posting or give me your stuff. YARRRR!!

SirMoric
Caldari
State War Academy
Posted - 2007.08.27 09:18:00 - [34]
 

What? Sign what??

Lazuran
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.08.27 09:37:00 - [35]
 

What a stupid post, full of incoherent babbling in bad English.



Lex Sebastion
Caldari
Copperhead Arsenal
Posted - 2007.08.27 09:47:00 - [36]
 

I think, far to many people spend far to much time worrying about if its "carebear this" or "pirate that." Its EVE-ONLINE. a game, developed to play in the style you wish how you wish when you wish where you wish.

Play the game. Play it how you like, when you like where you like and in what style you like and stop crying about others doing the very same.

that is how I take CCP's intentions of EVE-Online.

Carry On.

Banana Torres
The Green Banana Corporation
Posted - 2007.08.27 09:49:00 - [37]
 

Don't make me laff, of course this is Carebear Online. If it wasn't my alliance would not have been nerfed to oblivion.

As for your ePeen waving, I agree with 1,2,3 but 4 is bull****.

Eve is a sandbox, you define your own winning criteria, if your winning criteria is to have a faction fitted CNR then you can do this by killing a few NPCs.

AuroraStar
New Age Solutions
Posted - 2007.08.27 09:55:00 - [38]
 

Face it, youll quit for a couple weeks and come crawling back, tail between your legs.

Oh yeah kudos on the Ill quit threat, thats sure gonna make CCP not change any off that stuff....
Rolling Eyes

CharTest2
Posted - 2007.08.27 09:57:00 - [39]
 

<random alt agreeing with what i said ^^ >

Leandro Salazar
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2007.08.27 10:04:00 - [40]
 

Quote:
4) You can not just kill a few NPCs and feel sucessful. If you manage to kill, construct, or raid your way to the top it actually means something. You actually have to be "Better" then other REAL people to do "Better".


Oh you can. Especially you can feel successful by killing NPCs much faster than other real people do and thus beat them without causing direct misery. And end up with the space-equivalent of a Ferrari to fly missions with. That is killing and constructing my way to the top indeed, just without leaving someone else suffering for it.

Not that I don't enjoy popping pirates, so they are a very important part of EVE. But it is NOT all about direct PvP combat. And not everyone enjoys spoiling some innocent guy's day to make his own. (I do greatly enjoy spoiling the days of those who enjoy spoiling innocent people's days though.)

Miki Fin
Gallente
New Eden Population Control
Posted - 2007.08.27 10:05:00 - [41]
 

Why is it always people in alliances that whine the most?

Venkul Mul
Gallente
Posted - 2007.08.27 10:25:00 - [42]
 

As I am stealing some of Imperator Jora'h words, but not quoting him verbatim, a token of appreciation.

/unsigned

You are painting with too broad a brush here. Yes there are those who seem to want Hello Kitty Online in space.
But the number seem equally divided between those that want to get free life without any danger from other players and those that want free ganking without any danger from other players.

For some example of the second specie of carebears, look the thread about removing gate guns in low sec and adding bubbles and all the whines about the too hard penality on security status, as for killing some player they can't enter high sec and that is unjust and so on.

In EVE action should have consequences. If I choose to afk haul in high sec I know I can loose my ship and cargo and take my precautions. I weight the advantage of going AFK against the risk of losing the cargo and if the risk is low enough I do it. If I am moving something really valuable I use a BS or an interceptor never leaving the keyboard.

But the people killing my industrial outside a war in high sec should lose the ship and get the security hit. Crying that the security hit is too hard is simply wanting Pirate Hello Kitty.

So point 1-2-3 are generally valid, as long as you apply them to both side of the equation.

Imperator Jora'h has done a good list of Pirate Hello Kitty option, option that a lot of "hard PvPers" try to defend with tooth and claw on the forum.


Point 4 is totally out of order. EVE has not a top tier (and if it has one it is based on isk). It is a sandbox game.

I cold feel perfectly succesfull never killing any player, but besting them with my building and market capabilityes.


Ethaet
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.08.27 10:59:00 - [43]
 

/unsign for one thing:

getting concorded should not make your insurance pay out! You should get no insurance at all.

Laah T'Sin
Caldari
S.A.S
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2007.08.27 11:05:00 - [44]
 

Edited by: Laah T''Sin on 27/08/2007 11:05:38
hehe i think the list of facts in the first post should appear as a popup during character creation with a big "accept" button underneath. Very Happy

i basically love EVE for those reasons so i think i'm a /signed Wink

DubanFP
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.08.27 12:25:00 - [45]
 

Edited by: DubanFP on 27/08/2007 13:09:29
Originally by: Awox
Originally by: DubanFP
4) You can not just kill a few NPCs and feel sucessful. If you manage to kill, construct, or raid your way to the top it actually means something. You actually have to be "Better" then other REAL people to do "Better".


Say DubanFP, where did you get that 4.7 sec status from?

Judging by your killboard activity (pve fit raven losses especially) I would say you are just a carebear poser.

1) You don't lose sec-status for your actions in 0.0 which is where you'll usually find me.

2) For a month or two prior to Querious I've been saving up for something "special", hence no normal kills. Now that we're busy with Fix i'm usually stuck shooting PoSes and sitting next to sniper BSes as they get all the "fun". Almost regret not having more fun, but it was worth it in the end. The battle has been going on for a long time. Things really slowed down in the middle there & I mostly just sat around a lot for a while there.

3) Where did I ever say I PVP a lot? Honestly I haven't had a lot of time for it lately. If I did PVP as much as I'd like to lately you'd be whining that I'm only saying this because i'm a "griefer" myself. If anything that just makes my point more valid because it proves I'm not saying this for my own benifit.

4) Hmm anyways I guess I didn't make enough room for legitiment complaints & it came back to bite me in the ass in this thread. Anyways at least most people were constructive in their posting. I gotta admit that looking back i didn't do as good a job in this thread as I Should have.

5) 2 of my 4 Raven losses were to concord when i tried suicide ganking "ONLY against people with - standing toward D-L". It's really not as profitable as people make it out to be. I spent more isk then I made.

Aphroditi
Posted - 2007.08.27 13:02:00 - [46]
 

/signed

DubanFP keep the good work mate.

CCP : bring the servers back to 2003 :) No Concord or Sentries and Cruisers were HUGE investment. Too much inflation brought problems.




wamingo
Amarr
Imperial Shipment
Posted - 2007.08.27 17:47:00 - [47]
 

This game can provide, by far, the single greatest adrenaline rush that you'll legally find in this altitude.
Fail and it'll become your job away from work. Succeed and you can claim an epeen the size of a house!
In this game you can create things greater than anything you'll ever achieve in your real life. In it you can lose things more valuable than anything you've ever owned.
With a few clicks of a mouse, without ever having to move your arse from your chair you can conquer great lands, bring prosperity, and affect more people than you ever otherwise would.
And how do you achieve this? By bringing out the absolute worst humanity has ever produced... Greed, lies, fraud, destruction, arrogance, pain, misery, murder, persecution and dispair and many other evils you're all far too cowardice to ever experience in your precious real life, all forming under a single banner - vanity. You are better than all of us. Because only then could you achieve the ultimate goal... Fornication...
This game favours the arsholes. This game is made for arsholes. And the arsholes don't want it to change. Suprise, suprise.
But I like it! Though the reason I like it not what it used to be. I used to like the potential more than the game itself. The concept, the idea, that the game could be actually -- fun. Heh. Today I like it because there are precious few ways to enjoy masses of arsholes beat eachother up...

Aceoil
Black Serpent Technologies
R.A.G.E
Posted - 2007.08.27 17:55:00 - [48]
 

/signed

d026
temp holding
Posted - 2007.08.27 18:01:00 - [49]
 

i don't really care.. where i play mainly there is nothing like concord anyway.. buff them remove them doesn't matter :)


Lorissanna
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
Posted - 2007.08.27 19:09:00 - [50]
 

Edited by: Lorissanna on 27/08/2007 19:09:57
EDIT: Yes I know what the cartoon Carebears are. Smile

I've seen the term carebear used in every mmo I have ever played. Now I am curious as to what everyones definition of the term is.

Is it just someone that does not want to PvP?
Is it someone that seems to think that PvP should not exist?

I am genuinely curious about this.

DubanFP
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.08.27 19:23:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: Lorissanna
Edited by: Lorissanna on 27/08/2007 19:09:57
EDIT: Yes I know what the cartoon Carebears are. Smile

I've seen the term carebear used in every mmo I have ever played. Now I am curious as to what everyones definition of the term is.

Is it just someone that does not want to PvP?
Is it someone that seems to think that unconsentual PvP should not exist?


It can be either of the above depending on the context. The first one being "ok" to be, but the second use is pretty much an insult. Also made a minor change to the second one.

Tesal
Posted - 2007.08.28 23:05:00 - [52]
 

Quote:
If you want full immunity then go play a damned single player game.


Never said I wanted full immunity. You are aware that Concord is partially broken aren't you? You can be attacked, and Concord does not always show up.

Risk and reward is the key. Industrials and freighters were designed to be weak and vulnerable, thats part of the game. But risk management is also part of the game. If you are able to take the time to limit risk, you are expected to take steps to protect your cargo, but you should have the tools to do it in a way that doesn't take huge amounts of manpower, like it currently does. Tools for reporting camps are in need, and map tools that help you plan routes based on those reports. Perhaps new autopilot skills, perhaps an advanced evasive maneuvering skill. That would be very useful for convoy and fleet planning as well. We need logistical map resources anyway.

And when a ship is attacked, perhaps a "Mayday module" for broadcasting the location, and an automatic gang invitation for people in range, so alliance or corp forces can rapidly know where to respond. We could make the reponse timer cumulative, with 5 additional minutes for every attacker, so you have enough time to gather a practical response force. EvE is almost entirely without defensive response systems. It makes counterattacking almost impossible unless they are on top of your home base, and puts defenders at a severe disadvantage.

We also should have better warning systems. Having your entire screen blink yellow as an option as a way to know you have been targetted as an option, so you notice aggro more easily or an alarm you can configure on your computer for sound, "warning, you are being targetted" or "warning, you are being scanned". Scanner sensors to trigger an alarm when you warp near a cargo scanner in use and a jammer in an industrial high slot to stop the scanner or slow it down. Why not ECCM for industrials, if they can scan, why can't we jam?

Giving people tools to plan, and tools to know what is going on and the tools to react are what is needed.

Tesal
Posted - 2007.08.28 23:32:00 - [53]
 

Quote:
If you want full immunity then go play a damned single player game.


Never said I wanted full immunity. You are aware that Concord is partially broken aren't you? You can be attacked, and Concord does not always show up.

Risk and reward is the key. Industrials and freighters were designed to be weak and vulnerable, thats part of the game. But risk management is also part of the game. If you are able to take the time to limit risk, you are expected to take steps to protect your cargo, but you should have the tools to do it in a way that doesn't take huge amounts of manpower, like it currently does. Tools for reporting camps are in need, and map tools that help you plan routes based on those reports. Perhaps new autopilot skills, perhaps an advanced evasive maneuvering skill. That would be very useful for convoy and fleet planning as well. We need logistical map resources anyway.

And when a ship is attacked, perhaps a "Mayday module" for broadcasting the location, and an automatic gang invitation for people in range, so alliance or corp forces can rapidly know where to respond. We could make the reponse timer cumulative, with 5 additional minutes for every attacker, so you have enough time to gather a practical response force. EvE is almost entirely without defensive response systems. It makes counterattacking almost impossible unless they are on top of your home base, and puts defenders at a severe disadvantage.

We also should have better warning systems. Having your entire screen blink yellow as an option as a way to know you have been targetted as an option, so you notice aggro more easily or an alarm you can configure on your computer for sound, "warning, you are being targetted" or "warning, you are being scanned". Scanner sensors to trigger an alarm when you warp near a cargo scanner in use and a jammer in an industrial high slot to stop the scanner or slow it down. Why not ECCM for industrials, if they can scan, why can't we jam?

Giving people tools to plan, and tools to know what is going on and the tools to react are what is needed.

Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
Posted - 2007.08.29 04:54:00 - [54]
 

No offense but does this thread serve a purpose? Cause all I see is blah blah blah wall of text about the vast carebear conspiracy thats keepin the pirate down, etc.

Nanobotter Mk2
Posted - 2007.08.29 08:54:00 - [55]
 

Quote:
EVE online

1) Concord provides consequences not absolute protection

2) If you screw up you actually pay for it. If you die 99.9999% chances are you did something to cause it. Fly with a poorly tanked ship with over 200 mil in loot? Go into low-sec without proper knowledge on what you're doing? Not pay attention to the rules & take from someone else's can? Join a strange gang? It's YOUR fault, not ours, not the pirates, not CCPs

3) The game does not hold your hand. You're responsible for your own losses, and assessing risk vs reward. Keep all your eggs in 1 basket? Ok, but you're accepting the risk, not us or the pirates.

4) You can not just kill a few NPCs and feel sucessful. If you manage to kill, construct, or raid your way to the top it actually means something. You actually have to be "Better" then other REAL people to do "Better".

The day one of the above changes is the day I quit
This is to prove once and for all that CCP would lose far more players from ruining the game and giving into the whiners. Please /sign or /unsign so we have a clear unarguable yes/no or agree/disagree in addition to your comments.

.
.
.
/signed DubanFP



LOLZ EVE online is most definitely carebears online, you just need to know the loopholes to acheive carebear status.

I mean sitting in cheap insured ships which are on alts in NPC corps to suicide gank to make big money = extreme carebear make over. You will never get ganked as you sit around ovbious to everyone you are a suicide ganker camping xxx gate. when you decide to suicide even if somehow you screw up your loss in extremely small aka carebears in space!

Faction/sec rating is meaningless you get your cake and eat it hello carebear pirates online! It is uber easy to fix, and if you are too lazy to fix it you can just have alts or friends supply you up and do everything else you might need.

Spawn camping errr opps in eve we call it gate camping need I say more most every and any other pvp game has long banished this completely chicken arse carebear pvp exploit EVE promotes it LOLZ!

Lastly getting to the top is meaningless it takes ZERO skill, just the tried and true play your life away to get to the top with a healthy heap of exploit FTW! Most wealthy or powerful people in this game got it by taking advantage of the myriad of bugs like bugged complex spawns, broken T2 market monopolies, market scams, broken mission spawns and who knows how many other exploits CCP fixes and creates with each patch.... but when in doubt suck a nut on the biggest alliance and bam YOU WIN, hide out deep in your 0.0 territory and carebear it up in 100% safety! Heck if that isnt enough you could always just be mr flavor of the mouth overpowered module humper to fool yourself into beliving you are good at pvp, that is when you are not buisy blobing people 20 on 2 and such thinking you roxors da house in dis mad harcore pvp game RAWR!

If all the above fails just pretend eve is really dark, hardcore, and unforgiving and you are some uber mad leet gamer with insanes skills a rare breed indeed being one of few who can handle such a raw risky and dangerous game!

Nanobotter Mk2
Posted - 2007.08.29 08:58:00 - [56]
 

Quote:
/sign

If you want full immunity then go play a damned single player game.



funny that is what suicide gankers get right now, and whine like crazy to defend everytime somone makes a post suggesting that the immunity be taken away and some balanced risks be added, but na you go girl being all hardcore in your t1 insured cruiser safely and riskfree camping gates waiting for a noob to transport goods in a defenseless hauler! RAWR you bad ass balls to the wall risk taking pvp hero!

SiJira
Posted - 2007.08.29 09:02:00 - [57]
 

sure its carebear online

heck we cant even enjoy cloaking gameplay because some carebears out there are too dumb to get at least one single ship to defend them while they do their defenseless activities
1 full pvp fit ship vs 1 cloaker = 1 dead cloaker soon as he uncloaks

but these kids cant handle having a cloaker afk on them all day Rolling Eyes

framolia
The Fated
E.Y
Posted - 2007.08.29 09:13:00 - [58]
 

/unsigned

People play this game how they want to play it!

DubanFP, I suggest you wind yer neck in!

Ethaet
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.08.29 09:34:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: Lorissanna
Edited by: Lorissanna on 27/08/2007 19:09:57
EDIT: Yes I know what the cartoon Carebears are. Smile

I've seen the term carebear used in every mmo I have ever played. Now I am curious as to what everyones definition of the term is.

Is it just someone that does not want to PvP?
Is it someone that seems to think that PvP should not exist?

I am genuinely curious about this.


Well, most players in eve are 1.
there are a few who are 2, but they are mainly ex-WoW players, the same people who say 'z0mfG W3 need ship crews!111oneone11'

Venkul Mul
Gallente
Posted - 2007.08.29 10:06:00 - [60]
 

Edited by: Venkul Mul on 29/08/2007 10:15:52
Originally by: DubanFP
Originally by: Lorissanna
Edited by: Lorissanna on 27/08/2007 19:09:57
EDIT: Yes I know what the cartoon Carebears are. Smile

I've seen the term carebear used in every mmo I have ever played. Now I am curious as to what everyones definition of the term is.

Is it just someone that does not want to PvP?
Is it someone that seems to think that unconsentual PvP should not exist?


It can be either of the above depending on the context. The first one being "ok" to be, but the second use is pretty much an insult. Also made a minor change to the second one.


You will find it used ofthen enough for people that want to change the system for their interest PvPers or not.

Exampes are gankers wanting to use bubbles in every security level or asking that warp stabber disable any offensive system on a ship, industrialists asking for total immunity when moving items in high sec or suicide gankers asking for the removing of warp to 0 so they can gank freighters in high se with 100% success and so on (on both side of the PvP fence).

With her usual "light" Very Happy touch SiJira has hit a perfect example of carebearisness from 0.0 (sorry SiJira it want to be only a light jest, today I must say that I have really appreciated your post).

Originally by: SiJira
sure its carebear online

heck we cant even enjoy cloaking gameplay because some carebears out there are too dumb to get at least one single ship to defend them while they do their defenseless activities
1 full pvp fit ship vs 1 cloaker = 1 dead cloaker soon as he uncloaks

but these kids cant handle having a cloaker afk on them all day Rolling Eyes


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