| Author |
Topic |
Tamoko
Damage Unlimited Inc
|
Posted - 2007.07.29 23:34:00 - [ 61]
 Originally by: Dristra
The new ships just made me train amarr frigate 5 :)
anyone know if they will be nerfed to oblivion before release?
Considering we've only found out about this like 12 hours ago, and there isn't even a devblog yet, anything official-sounding at this point is just heresay. |
Xequecal |
Posted - 2007.07.29 23:44:00 - [ 62]
Is the Heretic actually good at squashing interceptors now? Last I checked, missiles have a hard time hitting things that move as fast as inties do. |
Skarned
Inroads
|
Posted - 2007.07.29 23:46:00 - [ 63]
Edited by: Skarned on 30/07/2007 00:16:58 Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit
Originally by: Kerdrak
Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit
Originally by: Kerdrak
Sacrilege is like a short range Cerberus, and I like it.
They could make is both, it wouldnt overpower it, now 95% of the sacriledge setups will have this missiles, they will be so easily guessable and all a decent pilot would need to do is stay 15KM+.
Not a problem with Cap recharge bonus and 4 mid slots... MWD, web, scram, cap booster FTW
This is a nerf imo, I already fit that and do more dps with my lasers.
No you dont. This change represents a 25-40% increase in DPS from the previous iteration with better tracking issues, more range, and no cap use.
http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sacandcerbqw9.jpg Please visit your user settings to enable images.There's a basic comparison of the old Sac, the new Sac, and the Cerb. No damage mods in this one, but needless to say the new Sac gets slightly more benefit from them than the old Sac - if you fit them. Besides the obvious things like tracking vs explosion velocity, which I'm not qualified to get into, the changes as they are now seem to boil down to: more damage, more restrictive range, and far more cap to play around with. Unless you have a specific need to operate at 15~ km or more, it's hard to see this as anything but an improvement. |
Mr Hyde113
Shadows Of The Federation
R.A.G.E |
Posted - 2007.07.30 00:01:00 - [ 64]
Not saying the new sac should be nanoed but on test server i got mine to do over 3km/s with a y-t8 mwd(named t1), 3 tech II overdrives, 2 BCU II and 2x polycarbon rigs. Thats pretty good along with a cap booster web scram 5 heavy assault II with jav gets out of web range damage. It seems like a solid solo ship and if you active tank it with auxnano pumps and faction heavy assault missiles its also good. Im glad to see that ccp finally did something about the sac and other khanhid sihps also is it just me or did all the sac's get bought in essence and why did the price go from 60mill to 100mill in jita, now it costs as much as a vagabond ishtar and diemos wile cerb and zealot are 60mill. I still have to check domain prices though  damn market speculation kills everything |
Nos Klo
BALKAN EXPRESS
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 00:11:00 - [ 65]
FINALLY! I knew this day would once come, Amarr are back! Long live the Emperor! End of the gallente plague!!!  |
Yesyu |
Posted - 2007.07.30 00:51:00 - [ 66]
|
KD.Fluffy
Caldari
Sacred Templars
Black Swan. |
Posted - 2007.07.30 02:43:00 - [ 67]
Edited by: KD.Fluffy on 30/07/2007 02:42:57It seems like the sacrilidge will severly overshadow the cerb as a missle platform becuase it will have a better tank more mobility and similar damage  I don't mean to whine, but I kinda feel like this steps onto caldari toes quiete a bit. You can't fit a tank and hams at all onto a cerb :( |
murder one
Gallente
Death of Virtue
MeatSausage EXPRESS |
Posted - 2007.07.30 02:48:00 - [ 68]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy
Edited by: KD.Fluffy on 30/07/2007 02:42:57
It seems like the sacrilidge will severly overshadow the cerb as a missle platform becuase it will have a better tank more mobility and similar damage I don't mean to whine, but I kinda feel like this steps onto caldari toes quiete a bit. You can't fit a tank and hams at all onto a cerb :(
That's probably CCP's way of telling you not to fit HAMs and a tank on a Cerb then. |
Goumindong
SniggWaffe
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 02:55:00 - [ 69]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy
Edited by: KD.Fluffy on 30/07/2007 02:42:57
It seems like the sacrilidge will severly overshadow the cerb as a missle platform becuase it will have a better tank more mobility and similar damage I don't mean to whine, but I kinda feel like this steps onto caldari toes quiete a bit. You can't fit a tank and hams at all onto a cerb :(
How will it have similar damage AND a better tank AND mobility. Where does it get these magical slots? |
Dristra
Amarr
Idle Haven
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 03:03:00 - [ 70]
|
murder one
Gallente
Death of Virtue
MeatSausage EXPRESS |
Posted - 2007.07.30 03:04:00 - [ 71]
|
Speed Devil
Caldari
Oberon Incorporated
Morsus Mihi |
Posted - 2007.07.30 03:33:00 - [ 72]
looks like amarr frigate is finally worth it to train :) vengeance and malediction are awesome  |
Khanak Hryad
Amarr
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation |
Posted - 2007.07.30 04:17:00 - [ 73]
Quote:
Originally by: KD.FluffyEdited by: KD.Fluffy on 30/07/2007 02:42:57
It seems like the sacrilidge will severly overshadow the cerb as a missle platform becuase it will have a better tank more mobility and similar damage Embarassed I don't mean to whine, but I kinda feel like this steps onto caldari toes quiete a bit. You can't fit a tank and hams at all onto a cerb :(
1st off, that's the whole problem with this. Sacrilege isnt supposed to be a missile boat, dammit, its a uber-tanking pewpewmobile. That's what it was made for, that's how it should stay. The other thing: for all those complaining about the "added variety" of these changes, GO OUT AND TRAIN ANOTHER RACE'S SHIPS! Although I do agree that Amarr needs some dire assitance in the weapons dep't, this is not the answer, imo....fix lasers, then move on to other things, if you so desire...... |
Landrassa
Friendly Neighbourhood Extortion Company
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 05:31:00 - [ 74]
Originally by: Selene Le'Cotiere
Oh those ships are sexy... Long live the Caldari & Ammaran (Calamarran?) peoples. 
Squid people ftw? |
Ron Lycan |
Posted - 2007.07.30 06:10:00 - [ 75]
Being someone that uses the Vengeance and Other Amarr Ships.
This is a godsend.
/signed with love |
Malcore Trisus
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion |
Posted - 2007.07.30 06:20:00 - [ 76]
This is awesome. |
Kel Dario
Amarr
Blue Sky Inc
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 08:34:00 - [ 77]
I'm loving these changes  The Sacrilege a sexy ship that pwns yes please, but I hope the missile bonus is not locked to HAM's only. The rest looks very promising too. //Kel |
volly
Amarr
Full Contact
Blade. |
Posted - 2007.07.30 09:00:00 - [ 78]
I tested the new Sacri, Malediction and Damnation and i must say these are very good changes.
I dont understand people who are whining...
To all Caldari whiners: These new Khanid Ships are different, they are CLOSERANGE.
Compare Sacri vs Cerberus: Sacri closerange, Cerberus longrange. Same for the Malediction vs Crow.
None of these Ships are "better" than its counterparts, just different.
In a 1vs1 i would assume the Khanid Ship would win (if it manages to catch the Caldari). In a Grp vs Grp situation the Caldaris would win.. a fair solution - not very different if you compare basterships and pulselaserships.
And for all Amar whiners: Try these new Ships. If you dont like them donīt fly them.
You still have the Lasercounterparts.
With old Khanid Design the Zealot for example was better than the Sacri in every single term - No reason to fly a Sacri over a Zealot (Maybe the price but that says all).
Now you can choose what Ship you take.
Take a Zealot for Gangs and a Sacri for Solo for example.
Take a Crusader for long range tackling and a Malediction for Solo Ceptor hunting or webbing etc etc....
CCP i love these changes. Finaly more versality for Amarr Ships |
sandamar
Gallente
The Scope
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 09:23:00 - [ 79]
Omg i really like it :)
Now i am happy, i trained laser and missile :) just need to get this amarr frigs lvl V, i never bothered to get cuz i prefered their caldari/gallente counterpart :)
Come on guys the new command ship can be awesome, so does the HAS. Be happy maybe we can finally get a decent pve ship and pvp ship :) I would so like to have a nano sac or plated sac :) |
Gibbal Slogspit
Amarr |
Posted - 2007.07.30 09:43:00 - [ 80]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: Xequecal
Originally by: Gibbal Slogspit
According to EFT I hit 193 dps with 4 focused pulse II and 2 HAML II, which is my current fit. This dps is with scorch in which I get 28K optimal in this ship. Which is almost 10KM more than what I get with the t1 heavy assualt missiles I have fitted. With the changed sacriledge I get 181 dps, bare in mind I set the rapid launch to 5 to even this dps test out.
The only thing you are correct on is the cap use, I have no problem tracking destroyers upwards with my focused pulse, anything smaller I cant hit, but also anything smaller wont take much damage from unguided heavy assualt missiles either.
I find it very hard to believe that 5 missile launchers with a double damage bonus are hitting for less DPS than 4 lasers with a single damage bonus and 2 launchers with none. You're fudging these numbers somehow, either running the test with maxxed gunnery and gimped missile skills, or accounting for damage mods in one instance but not the other.
He is using ****ty missile skills.
New sacri is EXACTLY same as cerb with kinetic HAMs (with maxed skills).
Rage HAMs (qfit doesnt have faction ones... they are tad worse than rage) do 300dps with maxed skills. Faction ones will do about 280 or so (without ANY damage mod)
Here ya go mr. "my damage got gimped". Your damage went up by over 50%.
I appologize for this, as I loaded Torrent which I thought were kinetic missiles into the cerb. Terror are actually kinetic. So yes it will do like 20-30 more dps over current However I still stick to my guns thank you. Although I am changing my mind on this new sacriledge, I didnt realise it had +50 cpu, which will allow for a comfortable fit of a ballistic control, where as current, in order to fit a heatsink I need to screw around a little. I still think it needs a heavy missile launcher damage bonus too. |
Deva Blackfire
Viziam
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 09:47:00 - [ 81]
I guess sacri wont get hvy missile damage bonus. It would lose "DMG to all" for "DMG to EM" missiles then. |
Altai Saker
Rapier Innovations
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 09:47:00 - [ 82]
The Malediction is still a joke... why does it have an em missile bonus? It will lose to any taranis setup and if you try to use EM rockets you will do 10 or 15 dps against minmatar t2 stuff. It is better... but still sub-par |
Heelay Ashrum
Caldari
Crimson Logistical |
Posted - 2007.07.30 10:02:00 - [ 83]
Edited by: Heelay Ashrum on 30/07/2007 10:02:38 Originally by: Altai Saker
The Malediction is still a joke... why does it have an em missile bonus? It will lose to any taranis setup and if you try to use EM rockets you will do 10 or 15 dps against minmatar t2 stuff. It is better... but still sub-par
since the crow have a "kinetic only" bonus it's fair have an "EM bonus ". But together with the "rocket only" bonus make this ship quite crappy. IMHO: frigate: 5% missile ROF ( istead of rocket) 5% tanking bonus intie: 5% EM dammage 5% reduction in Signature Radius |
n0thing
Executive Intervention
Controlled Chaos |
Posted - 2007.07.30 10:09:00 - [ 84]
Originally by: Altai Saker
The Malediction is still a joke... why does it have an em missile bonus? It will lose to any taranis setup and if you try to use EM rockets you will do 10 or 15 dps against minmatar t2 stuff. It is better... but still sub-par
Malediction cant be compared to Ranis imo. Theres 2 types of Inties, traditional race philosophy one and the alternate one: Crow-Taranis-Crusader-Claw Raptor-Ares-Malediction-Stiletto |
Grytok
KL0NKRIEGER
|
Posted - 2007.07.30 11:46:00 - [ 85]
I was waiting for Khanid MK II, and I do hope, that CCP bring them into game exactly like they're right now on the Test-Server.
Everybody who says that HAMs are too short of range -> take a look at the T2-HAMs. You can get up to 50km of range with insane RoF.
Anyways. With a good tank, like they'll have with the actual SiSi-stats, the new Khanid-Ships will have no problem with going close-range.
Don't screw up on that one CCP, and bring them exactly the way, they're on SiSi atm! |
Gawain Hill |
Posted - 2007.07.30 11:49:00 - [ 86]
so anyone goin to tell me when these new changes are going to happen?
/me would like them by weekend |
Sey'ada
Evoke.
KrautbreaK |
Posted - 2007.07.30 11:54:00 - [ 87]
They could make is both, it wouldnt overpower it, now 95% of the sacriledge setups will have this missiles, they will be so easily guessable and all a decent pilot would need to do is stay 15KM+.
Therefor they made the sacri faster. I can already see the nerfbat incoming, giving her bonuses to hams and heavy missiles and leaving her as slow as shes on tq because of people like you  |
Varshyll |
Posted - 2007.07.30 12:58:00 - [ 88]
|
Heelay Ashrum
Caldari
Crimson Logistical |
Posted - 2007.07.30 13:09:00 - [ 89]
Edited by: Heelay Ashrum on 30/07/2007 13:10:51 Originally by: Varshyll
Originally by: Heelay Ashrum
Edited by: Heelay Ashrum on 30/07/2007 10:02:38
Originally by: Altai Saker
The Malediction is still a joke... why does it have an em missile bonus? It will lose to any taranis setup and if you try to use EM rockets you will do 10 or 15 dps against minmatar t2 stuff. It is better... but still sub-par
since the crow have a "kinetic only" bonus it's fair have an "EM bonus ". But together with the "rocket only" bonus make this ship quite crappy.
IMHO:
frigate:
5% missile ROF ( istead of rocket)
5% tanking bonus
intie:
5% EM dammage
5% reduction in Signature Radius
Am I the only one to notice that this inty has FOUR bonuses ?
i noticed too, but u should check better: Crow have 1 bonus from frigate skill ( +10% kin missile damage) + 2 bonuses from intie skills, the malediction get from frigates 2 bonuses but halfed ( "2x 5%" instead of "1x 10%") and 2 from intie skills. Pretty the same thing as u can see if the skills are maxed. Malediction get another 5% dammage bonus from intie skills so with intie lev 5 will get the same dammage bonuses as a maxed crow pilot. The only thing that should be fixed on this ship is to give EM bonus restriction OR rockets restrictions, not both. |
Great Artista
Caldari
Veto.
Veto Corp |
Posted - 2007.07.30 13:30:00 - [ 90]
DOUBLE REP CAP-BOOSTING ROCKET VENGEANCES OH YEAH!I feel all -05 again! Cap boosting AF's ftw |
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