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blankseplocked I must be the biggest idiot in EvE - history, --> Solved :)
 
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Haffrage
Regeneration
Posted - 2007.04.20 18:45:00 - [91]
 

Originally by: Argenton Sayvers
Originally by: Noig Lamaroz

I fail to see how this would work. In case that CCP gives the money back, they just deduct it from other char (dropping his wallet most certainly to negative) and give that isk to the correct owner. In no point, do they add extra isk into the game.


Exactly. Except the part where negative ISK dont exist. Nor matter much on certain types of characters.


Ahem.

I'm sorry, what were you saying?

ghard1
Posted - 2007.04.20 19:07:00 - [92]
 

Originally by: ry ry
Edited by: ry ry on 20/04/2007 12:49:22

Originally by: Mox Trident
so the OP would be left with 17.6 billion ISK, and a character worth 8.8 billion with a -8.8 billion balance. That equates to 8.8bil pure profit and the original character, the cost of laundering notwithstanding.

that's assuming he doesn't just ditch the original character and give all 17.6 to his new main, since he'd decided to sell the old character in the 1st place.


Your maths doesent add up as far as i can see.

what i see happening if they give the cash back and he has spent it is.

op has 0 isk transfered character has 8.8 billion isk that belongs to op

transfered character gives isk away to alt transfered character has 0 isk

ccp step in and take 8.8 bill from transfered char he now has -8.8 billion isk (and the resulting inabilities to use market and other facilities)

op gets 8.8 billion isk alt has 8.8 billion isk

so add it all up and you get 8.8 bill +8.8 bill -8.8 bill = 8.8 bill

howevere you are correct in that there will be an extra 8.8 bill arround on the characters alt
however if he wants to play the character he payed 8.8 bill for he will have to transfer it back to get him out of the -ve or be left with a broken character.

Draxelion Sofather
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.04.20 19:18:00 - [93]
 

Edited by: Draxelion Sofather on 20/04/2007 19:59:16
Mox Tridents math is...I mean ry rys math is right.

Mox Trident
Minmatar
Hellcratik INC.
Posted - 2007.04.20 19:56:00 - [94]
 

Originally by: Draxelion Sofather
Edited by: Draxelion Sofather on 20/04/2007 19:16:09
Mox Tridents math is right.


I did no math - honest! He quoted my name with someone elses post Confused Ah well Laughing

Cipher7
Posted - 2007.04.20 20:16:00 - [95]
 


I hope you get your iskies back, but you gotta admit it's pretty funny.

Ya know I think Eve's reputation as a scammer's paradise attracts all the scumbags, these aren't just bad people in a video game, they're bad people in RL.

I had some guy actually threaten to "grief" me.

No pretense of roleplaying, or anything else, he just flat out said, "I'm going to grief you."

When I responded that it was impossible to "grief" me due to my mindset (I feel no grief), he then said he was going to grief my sister.

It was then that I realized that some Eve players were the type of human beings I wouldn't mind strapping into an electric chair.

Protectories
Itto-Ryu
Cruel Intentions
Posted - 2007.04.20 20:30:00 - [96]
 

Edited by: Protectories on 20/04/2007 20:40:27
Guys, this is the buyer. I have sent all the isk to the rightful owner, i was never going to steal it, i was waiting for Gm's to verify the real person i should send it to. I explained this to the Gm that convo'd me and he sed that he can verify that it is indeed the original owner of that character and he can understand my position as well.

So plz dont mark me as a theif, i was only trying to be safe, as i had no way to contact the original owner because we traded through the char i recieved

Draxelion Sofather
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2007.04.20 20:32:00 - [97]
 

Edited by: Draxelion Sofather on 20/04/2007 20:30:47
^ Above poster, don't directly quote GMs, even if it dosnt matter. I know its a lame rule, but people will jump all over you for it.

Originally by: ProtectoriesFormerOwner
Edited by: ProtectoriesFormerOwner on 20/04/2007 20:23:32
* UPDATE *

There is God, and there are GMs.

Finally I nice GM took on my petition and got a hold of
the buyer. I've now got my money.

Thank you to all for the support \o/

******************




Rock on! you got your isk back!
(Everyone, Look at first post of thread to see)

CCP did the right thing, definatly.

Common sense is not so common these days. I can't beleive people in this thread actually said it would be wrong for GMs to help you, or that both accounts should be banned (WTF?). Good job.

Protectories
Itto-Ryu
Cruel Intentions
Posted - 2007.04.20 20:38:00 - [98]
 

I sent the isk back, the gms only told me who to

ProtectoriesFormerOwner
Posted - 2007.04.20 20:39:00 - [99]
 

Originally by: Protectories
I sent the isk back, the gms only told me who to


I confirm this. Issue has been solved.

Jimer Lins
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2007.04.20 20:41:00 - [100]
 

Originally by: Protectories
Guys, this is the buyer. I have sent all the isk to the rightful owner, i was never going to steal it, i was waiting for Gm's to verify the real person i should send it to. I explained this to the Gm that convo'd me and he sed:

Hi,

*snip*

So plz dont mark me as a theif, i was only trying to be safe, as i had no way to contact the original owner because we traded through the char i recieved


(don't post GM conversations, they get snipped)

Glad to see the situation was not what it at first appeared. Seems that both parties were above-board and wanted to do things the right way, and that all of this was just a misunderstanding combined with an abundance of caution.

And really, who wouldn't be careful when there's 8 billion ISK involved. ;)

BAndOfDevs
Band of Dev's
Posted - 2007.04.20 20:56:00 - [101]
 

Edited by: BAndOfDevs on 20/04/2007 20:57:27
Originally by: Bistot Kid
I don't know what country you are from, but in the UK this would be covered by the 1968 Theft Act.

If the jury or magistrates are satisfied that you genuinely believe that you have the legal (not moral) right to keep the money, then by s.2(1)(a) of the 1968 Act you are not dishonest.

In your hypothetical example, I don't believe the Jury or magistrates would believe you to be the legal owner of the money, and you'd be guilty of a criminal offence.


1. USA
2. The car is not stolen.. See above (the car was sold IE paperwork etc is all done) Selling a vehical is done on paper..(Pink slip) It does not really matter if money is exchanged.

3 I am Unclear on how things are in the UK but i do not see how the seller would have any legal recorse if he left money in the vehical..

A better example would be.. Seller left change/personal items etc in the vehical when buyer drove off with it. Is the buyer legaly responsiable to return said items/money ?? I think not.

The original poster sold a account with assets. It is not the responsibility of the buyer to make sure the seller removed all of his posessions before or after making the transfer. It would be like me selling a charicter then asking ccp to give me back a few items/isk i forgot i had left on that charicter.

I highly doubt ccp will "Refund" any of the isk in question. Why ? Because there is no real proof of exactily what was agreed in on the exchange.

That said.. I really hope this guy does get his isk back. But i dont think it will happen.

Good luck mate

wow you got it back.. congrats and props to the honest buyer

Raeff
Body Count Inc.
The Requiem
Posted - 2007.04.20 21:05:00 - [102]
 

Originally by: Protectories
I sent the isk back, the gms only told me who to



\o/

we <3 you again Very Happy

Del Narveux
Dukes of Hazard
Posted - 2007.04.20 21:05:00 - [103]
 

Originally by: ProtectoriesFormerOwner
Originally by: Protectories
I sent the isk back, the gms only told me who to


I confirm this. Issue has been solved.


Yay everyones happy now Smile

PCaBoo
Ammo and Tag
Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns
Posted - 2007.04.20 21:07:00 - [104]
 

now that it's resolved, I think you should send all of us (supporters) 100m isk each!

Bistot Kid
The First Thing You'll Ever See
Posted - 2007.04.20 21:13:00 - [105]
 

Edited by: Bistot Kid on 20/04/2007 21:09:55
Originally by: BAndOfDevs
3 I am Unclear on how things are in the UK but i do not see how the seller would have any legal recorse if he left money in the vehical..



Flogging a dead horse here as it's all sorted, but under UK law the money does not become yours just because someone left it in your vehicle / house / whatever.

Unless you can satisfy the law that you genuinely believed you had the legal ownership of the money, then you are basically guuilty of stealing it. Silly though it sounds, an extreme example is if you even find money in the street, technically it doesn't belong to you. You should hand it in, and if the owner doesn't come forward within X weeks, ownership will pass to you. Probably get taxed on it too!

Of course in actuality it is never enforced at this level, but that's the actual law.

Edit: Congratulations to both the original and new owner. Glad it was all sorted amicably.

Argenton Sayvers
Posted - 2007.04.20 23:53:00 - [106]
 

Edited by: Argenton Sayvers on 20/04/2007 23:51:40
Originally by: Haffrage
Ahem.I'm sorry, what were you saying?


Heh it was bad wording on my part.

I am fully aware that negative wallets exist, and that characters with negative wallets are useless for most types of gameplay (useable as Titan / mothership parking alt, POS research alt, RnD alt etc though). However, why would you care about a character having a negative wallet if you were planning a scam?

That was the point im making:
"oh noes, my 2m SP hauler alt now has -8b ISK, do i send 8b from one of my mains or do i use the 20 other characters spread over 7 accounts"?


Originally by: Protectories
I sent the isk back, the gms only told me who to

Heh. Kind of stupid that everyone (including me) forgot the part where [SoldCharacters]OldOwner could have been some kind of evil scam stunt. P

Congratulations that this issue got resolved based on mutual understanding, and not by setting a precedent that eve doesnt need.

Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas Alliance
Posted - 2007.04.21 00:05:00 - [107]
 

Originally by: Protectories
Edited by: Protectories on 20/04/2007 20:40:27
Guys, this is the buyer. I have sent all the isk to the rightful owner, i was never going to steal it, i was waiting for Gm's to verify the real person i should send it to. I explained this to the Gm that convo'd me and he sed that he can verify that it is indeed the original owner of that character and he can understand my position as well.

So plz dont mark me as a theif, i was only trying to be safe, as i had no way to contact the original owner because we traded through the char i recieved


It's good to hear it, I'm really glad to see this got sorted.

Consider yourself exonerated, good sir!

Kiyano
Caldari
Pilots Of Honour
Aeternus.
Posted - 2007.04.21 01:33:00 - [108]
 

Its good to see there is some justice out there and that things end up the right way. I'm happy that you got it resolved, I know how hard it is to earn that kind of cash in this game.

Emma Royd
Caldari
Maddled Gommerils
Posted - 2007.04.21 08:09:00 - [109]
 

Just happy the issue has been sorted for PFO :)

JVol
Amarr
The IMorral MAjority
Posted - 2007.04.21 08:27:00 - [110]
 

Naaa.. I was in a hurry to fit out a raven once and bought 2 makula crz launchers for 3.5m each..except it was really 3.5 BILLION each and trust me< no DEV gave me my isk back.

I felt a little sick to my stomach for about an hour untill I had a few beers and had a few laughs at my stupid A** for letting a *game* bug me. Still makes me laugh tho! hehehe

Ingols
Caldari
Half Moon Bay Ventures
Posted - 2007.04.21 09:45:00 - [111]
 

Judge Ingols say's

Darn right you should have gotten the ISK.

1. The contract was Character + raven for ISK.
2. Irrespective of the fact that he advanced you the ISK, when he received the Character with the ISK, it was as if he never paid.
3. Had you been doing two character trades at the same time, one for 1B, the other for 8B, and mixed them up and traded the 1B character with the 8B, then you would have been SOL.
4. Unlawfull enrichment.


SSgt Sniper
Gallente
SSgt Sniper Temporary corp
Posted - 2007.04.21 10:26:00 - [112]
 

Originally by: Monica Foulkes
I would be surprised if you got a single ISK returned tbh.


So I take it you are surprised?


Character transfers have always been very protected by CCP. They will always be.

OP, lesson here: don't do transfers without having plenty of coffee/rest. Laughing

Lynae
Caldari
Cold Steel Alliance
Posted - 2007.04.21 11:11:00 - [113]
 

Originally by: Protectories
I sent the isk back, the gms only told me who to


This was the right thing to do. Thank you. Smile

Splagada
Minmatar
Tides of Silence
Posted - 2007.04.21 11:14:00 - [114]
 

Originally by: ProtectoriesFormerOwner
Originally by: Protectories
I sent the isk back, the gms only told me who to


I confirm this. Issue has been solved.


nice =)

Monica Foulkes
Veto Corp
Posted - 2007.04.21 11:55:00 - [115]
 

Originally by: SSgt Sniper
Originally by: Monica Foulkes
I would be surprised if you got a single ISK returned tbh.


So I take it you are surprised?

Slightly, had been interesting to see what had happened if the buyer didn't have good intentions.

Anyway, the issue got resolved and everyone is happy. ugh

jinpoh
Posted - 2007.04.21 13:23:00 - [116]
 

Edited by: jinpoh on 21/04/2007 13:24:30

monkeyduck
Mithril Inc
Posted - 2007.04.21 15:46:00 - [117]
 

We laughed. Sorry OP
We got angry. "This will happen!" "No, I AM RIGHT" "Monkey poo."
We cried. OP doesn't count, he cried first.


I give you a 9/10. Good story Laughing


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