open All Channels
seplocked Corporation, Alliance and Organization Discussions
blankseplocked State of Game - PvP tactics
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: 1 [2] 3

Author Topic

BoBoBich
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2007.02.17 20:47:00 - [31]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character or posting with characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. -Eldo Davip ([email protected])

Malachon Draco
Caldari
eXceeded
Posted - 2007.02.17 20:51:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: BoBoBich
Originally by: Drokar Gazer

Aggro Timer Abuse
The log off
Mass Log in


Just an observation. Why you make a such nice and shiny post after an aggro was used against titan and didn't make that when houndreds of pilots used seconds tactics on daily basis for YEARS? How is that biased? Can you be objective? I beleive not.


Just an observation from my side. WHY THE **** AREN'T THE MODS DELETING POSTS BY NOOBCORP ALTS WHEN ITS POSTING IN FAVOUR OF BOB???

mr passie
Minmatar
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas.
Posted - 2007.02.17 20:53:00 - [33]
 

I never thought to say this about a tri post, but I completely agree. (no flamebait)

I think it sucks to log off in combat but even more to kill a titan (the supposedly unkillable) this way. I do not have a solution, but I would hate to see people stop flying titans because they are exploits waiting to be happening.

I'd never use these tactics even it would cost my last bit of isk. Even if I got a killmail like that how would I ever be proud of my achievment?

Voculus
Minmatar
The Illuminati.
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2007.02.17 21:05:00 - [34]
 

Quote:
Even if I got a killmail like that how would I ever be proud of my achievment?

Pride has nothing to do with it. It's all about winning at any cost, no matter how bad you have to cheat to do it.

SSgt Sniper
Gallente
SSgt Sniper Temporary corp
Posted - 2007.02.17 21:24:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Trivas
Edited by: Trivas on 17/02/2007 17:44:02
People seem to forget this. The problem is how the game mechaincs work when you log off. Since Titans cannot dock there is no safe place to store them.




This is the primary problem I have with how BoB chooses to shoot titans, tbh. If they could dock with a deathstar or in a station, BoB wouldn't have a titan kill at all.

Cassandra Bloom
Gallente
D00M.
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2007.02.17 21:27:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: pershphanie
I know. Why don't we all stand in a line and someone type "fire" in local. Then who ever has the best mods and most SP wins.

Rolling Eyes Sounds exciting. Go play counterstrike.

Don't confuse creative tactics with poor gameplay.


Ya same ol' stupid comments and derrail from the point. I'm a 2004 pilot maxed out in gallente battleship warfare, I'm pretty sure that if you bring a fancy astarte to my domi you're dead meat even if i am a technical noob to you.

To answer to you derrailed reply: this is not how it works! Different shiptypes and specialization nulify the more SP or modules you have, so I don't care how many turret/missle or mining skills you have I will still kill you and your ship dude. Now shutup and try to contribute to the thread.

ER0X
Amarr
Eternity INC.
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2007.02.18 00:25:00 - [37]
 

Wait for it ,.,., Soft Eject ,.,., ahhh!

A momment of sanity in a game gone mad Very Happy

Let me state for the record I am in no way pointing fingers at any individual, corp or alliance in particular nor am I inferring that any pilots logged off deliberately to avoid destruction.

You state in your opening post Drokar that there are many tactics being used in todays Eve that are not in keeping with your idea of chivalry. I'm not a fan of many of these tactics either. However to be honest this comes as no surprise to me whatsoever. It could be argued that these tactics have evolved as the game has, respectively. Daon Khan makes some nice observations, reminders, on the psychology behind EvE in his posts in the thread. http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=477672 The concepts Daon highlights are more than likely the main reasons CCP has not interviened.

To reiterate the current state of play, if I have the gist of your argument, is; that battle tactics employed by certain individuals / corps / alliances are removing competitiveness from the game.

e.g.

Mass logoff / logon to catch an unsuspecting fleet moving through a system.

Filling a node to critical levels, with players, while assaulting a POSition. The result being node failure, which on restart favours the fleet jumping into the system and not the fleet defending it.


Likewise other less chivalrous, in your opinion, tactics are also being used.


The use of Sleepers to gain an unnatural advantage of agression timers. Black ops specialists, pinpointing enemy positions calling in Counter strike at a momments notice.


Might I suggest that the later example could be percieved as a counter to the former and that these types of tactics are progressing on a natural evolutionary time line in keeping with the nature of the game in which we find ourselves playing.
We as players have a choice to make. One choice being - Quit.

We can hit the forums and complain about it hoping the developers take notice of our concerns and change the nature of the game to be one with a more consensualy oriented combat model removing the opportunity of surprise attacks completely.

OR

We can be observant remain quiet, objective and see it played out till a natural conclusion has been drawn. To finish, and im paraphrasing here ' improvise, adapt, overcome, take a handful of young fire pi$$ers, excersise some personal initiative and kick some a$$ '.

Stickey Crak
Caldari
Swedish Gimp Squad
Posted - 2007.02.18 03:21:00 - [38]
 

to the OP and the crying club:

well..i figure the game is here to be played and enjoyed. if you can't do that than i sencerely hope noone is holding a gun to your head. nothing is perfect in this world, as long as people are involved, and as soon as u've realised that you'll be a happer person.


Whining won't help you, suggestions might.

Audri Fisher
Caldari
Burning Bush Enterprises
Posted - 2007.02.18 04:56:00 - [39]
 

Originally by: Xelphior
eve was intended to be like life, and tbh its a good representation.

you can scam/cheat/doublecross/spy and kill

Life isnt Fair, in Real War you dont hold onto your morals, its them or you, and its the same in eve

you see an oppurtunity to get the advantage you take it, same as RL.

Moral of the Story.

eve isnt fair, eve dont promote fairness, but neither does life.



Uhm, NO. In fact, That is a gross insult to the most storied, and succesful military organizations in Earth's history. Unit pride and a sense of honor and duty have carried many an organization far more than cheating ever has. By cheating IRL I mean crossing the line of what is considerable honble and decent.

A case in point, even though there were standing orders from ****** himself, and there were some casses where his orders were carried out, most U-boat Captains never did execute shipwreck survivors. They also took 90% losses throughout WWII, mostley due to decisions made over them by ******, and they mantained a credible and cohesive threat to the allies until the bitter end. No other military organization in modern history has ever come close to matching that, especialy since they almost won the war for Germany.
Millions of Soldiers, Sailors, Marines, and Airmen from many countries roled over in there grave when you made that statement.

Nastratu
Minmatar
Serefon Creatin
Posted - 2007.02.18 05:59:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: BoBoBich
Originally by: Drokar Gazer

Aggro Timer Abuse
The log off
Mass Log in


Just an observation. Why you make a such nice and shiny post after an aggro was used against titan and didn't make that when houndreds of pilots used seconds tactics on daily basis for YEARS? How is that biased? Can you be objective? I beleive not.

QFT

Also, instead of relying on "honor" of pilots and explaining to players in EVE how it is lame and how it is a cheatxploit to be doing this or that, why don't you spend you efforts on coming up with ways to curb such behavior in EVE using game mechanics, modifying the game so it becomes no longer beneficial or possible? You can't rely on anybody's honor because some people will place ends above the means, so you can't just post here on the forum and expect them to listen. And all of you who are blaming CCP for allowing Titans to be lost in such "dishonorable" ways, may be you should have thought about it and started talking before you invested 150 bil and countless hours and so much effort into building such ships.

Marcus Quo
Gallente
Axe Gang
Posted - 2007.02.18 09:53:00 - [41]
 

So far I see a lot of crap in this thread about "honor" and "real warfare" not being fair. Guess what, none of this crap matters.

Here's what does matter: EvE is a game, it's designed to be fun. If anyone thinks that shooting at a logged off ship is enjoyable, they need to play a single player game on easy difficulty, not an MMO. I gotta give BoB props for doing what they did and thinking outside the box, but if you ask them if they would have prefered to kill the Erebus in a pitched battle and gotten to see it go down with guns blazing while a D2 cap fleet made an attempt to save it, I can guarentee they'll all say yes.

The real problem is that the game currently encourages fights to happen when one of the pilots involved is offline. You can destroy your oppenent without risking your own ships, clearly everyone who can is going to do this. This does NOT make for good gameplay. It's boring to shoot at a stationary ship, and it sucks ass when it happens to the pilot, no one has any fun.

What can change? The aggro timer is fairly stupid, I'm sure there's other ways around it. Maybe just getting rid of the emergency warp off so you can safely log out at friendly POSs, would also keep people from logging in bubbles. Other option is to make it easier to kill titans/moms with traditional means, so that people to have to resort to killing them while logged out.

The point is combat should be fun. Real war sucks ass, let's not try to emulate it in-game.

Goldstriker
Amarr
Anti Tard Inc
Posted - 2007.02.18 10:35:00 - [42]
 

*snip* Posting with an unidentified character or posting with characters in NPC corporations in this forum is prohibited. If you wish to participate in the discussions here, be sure to have your corporation and or alliance status ticked in your forum settings. -Eldo Davip ([email protected])

Steel Rat
Amarr
Dirty Deeds Corp.
Axiom Empire
Posted - 2007.02.18 11:55:00 - [43]
 

To the OP: Interesting post even if your logic is somewhat flawed with regards to the Agro timer. Can you not see Agro timer is abused because so many people in Eve use the logoff trick to avoid combat. Agro timer is the only thing that even comes close to keeping some people honest when they mouth off about wtfpwning people.

As I said in another post recently, Eve is a game where you never have to lose anything. If you are careful and patient and use the logoff tricks you are never forced to put your assets at risk. The Titan is a prime example of something that people try very hard to not lose. Its massive weapon firing never puts you at risk, if your careful, you never have to put it in jeopardy. So you can sit back, beat your chest and laugh at them when they try to get you. If the odds aren't in your favor, logoff and its safe.

If everyone wants to see the Epic titan battle, then I think you need to talk to the pilots flying them, not the people who use in game mechanics to engage them. Because frankly, none of them have engaged willing and probably never would unless FORCED to, as has been shown by both the D2 and ASCN kills. There to much time, labor and isk tied up in them for most people to risk in a true battle.

The bigger problem of exploiting the game mechanics in Eve is based on 2 things. Killmails and Cost to build. Yes for alot of us veterans, cost is minimal, but for many people that play eve, whether it be greed or true lack of isk, they don't want to NPC/MINE/etc to make isk. Many would prefer the Quake or CS or UT model where you die, poof, back into a new body with a gun and go headhunting again. For some people, getting that uber ship/clone/implants is alot of time and effort. Because of that, when they see themselves screwed, like hitting a bubble camp, they log. Secondly, I think killmails and a k/l ratio has skewed the game for the more epeen crowd. Those people play to look better than everyone else and prefer to log than add to their death ratio.

But I think you miss another group. The group that builds the nanophoons, the mwd ravens of the past, the vaga's, etc. They are also exploiting game mechanics with the same intention of not being caught. You can also throw in the login traps as part of this. But the whole intention is not to have a fight. The intention is to gank/grief the enemy. And when they get setup or cornered by a huge fleet, they log. The BE ravens of the past were part of this as well and a good example of someone using a very effect setup that for the most part, was not to induce a fight, but to gank/grief. The only effective way was to bait and trap these guys and exploit the game mechanics in your favor.

I am not saying any of this is "wrong" or "right". I am simply stating this is the life of Eve today. I have always said I preferred the old days of Eve and get laughed at and poo poo'd. I don't miss the old days of Eve for the game, I miss it for the pilots. People were more eager to fight, period. It was a hell of alot more enjoyable to PvP in the first year of Eve than I find it to be today. Today, everyone is more interested in winning every battle at all costs. They don't play for the battle and the thrill, win or lose. Maybe theres more at stake now, with the POSs and Outposts, but whatever it is, its really taken something out of Eve for me.

I honestly don't know if CCP can make any changes to the game to change how people play. You could probably give away free, fully fitted Navy Apoc/Mega/your choice here, everytime someone dies and you would still have people not fight. But I hope CCP continues to try and who knows, they might stumble on something to make PvP great again. Cause frankly right now, with the lag added in as well, its not at its best.

Steel Rat
CEO DDC


MacDuncan
Minmatar
Evoke.
Ev0ke
Posted - 2007.02.18 12:06:00 - [44]
 

Originally by: Steel Rat
I am not saying any of this is "wrong" or "right". I am simply stating this is the life of Eve today. I have always said I preferred the old days of Eve and get laughed at and poo poo'd. I don't miss the old days of Eve for the game, I miss it for the pilots. People were more eager to fight, period. It was a hell of alot more enjoyable to PvP in the first year of Eve than I find it to be today. Today, everyone is more interested in winning every battle at all costs. They don't play for the battle and the thrill, win or lose. Maybe theres more at stake now, with the POSs and Outposts, but whatever it is, its really taken something out of Eve for me.


Well written, even if i missed the early stages of EvE (sadly).

Stitcher
Caldari
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2007.02.18 12:14:00 - [45]
 

may as well just quote myself from another thread on the same topic:

Originally by: Stitcher
Originally by: Lori Carlyle
Personaly I don't think any alliance would not do the same if there chance came up.


EVE is a game. Unlike in real-world wars, the losses and victories are not measured in human lives or livelihoods, but in honour and prestige. in true war, the underhanded, sneaky tactics are the ones that save lives and bring about the most efficient victories with the minimum of death and suffering. That said, "Victory at any cost" is a mantra wholly at odds with the spirit of any game. When removed from the framework of true consequence - of death and territory - in-game wars should in theory become defined by honour and fair play.

What we are instead seeing happen is people bringing the real world thinking of "We need to win, so we will stop at nothing to attain victory" into the game, thereby tainting it.

This game is still populated by people who hold to the belief - whether consciously or subconsciously - that the fights and wars in this game should be fought with honour and unflinching respect for the enemy. The reason there is so much outcry over the destruction of this titan, I think, is because it was characterized by underhanded back-alley tactics and a total disregard for the spirit of fair play.

In the real world, such a kill would be considered the skillful culmination of a well-worked plan. Nobody is denying that this titan kill took skill, daring, patience and precision to pull off - what's causing upset is the fact that it flies in the face of the spirit of the game.

Nobody remembers the man who snuck up to the sleeping dragon and shot it in the head with a ballista. They remember the knight who went toe-to-toe with it while it was awake and bested it in a fair fight. Why? the latter is a more honourable kill, an epic victory. The former is disrespectful to the whole concept of dragon-slaying. And Titans are the Dragons of EVE.

So yes, given a choice between assassinating a Titan behind the lines as happened here, or letting it live on, I'd definitely pass up the opportunity... and come back later to take it on in a straight fight.


Even if this is a thread about the way people are playing the game rather than specifically being about the D2 Titan, the point still stands. This is a game. In-game victories should be about skill, competence, and honour. More and more people are taking these wars seriously enough that the spirit of the game suffers.

It's sad, but it's always the loud and unpleasant types who stand out from the crowd. The majority of the EVE community, I believe, are still a bunch of straight-up folks who would prefer to lose a straight fight, than "win" and be accused of cheating. And the way to avoid the latter is to always stand tall, stare your enemy in the camera drone, and fight it out, hard.

darth solo
Caldari
Celestial Apocalypse
Posted - 2007.02.18 12:22:00 - [46]
 

EVE was full of this sort of thing at the start, i lost so many ships to bugs like the dampener bug which made u CTD'd.. ppl knew about it and used it. like the lag out can exploit where u didnt even load and found urself dead. like i keep saying eve is a game where its win at all costs regardless of what it does to the game. its very sad.

EVE has done a full circle, from the early days of bug exploiting to where it is the now, the bit inbetween was much better.

Im sure many of our days are numbered.


d solo.

Engelious Angelion
Minmatar
Squishy Force
Posted - 2007.02.18 12:29:00 - [47]
 

Originally by: Drokar Gazer
While i am sure I will get flamed for this from the immatures out there, it has to be said. The state of EVE is unfortunately, not good. Devs caught cheating doesnt help but i think that can happen anywhere, so this is not really about that.

Its about pvp tactics. Its about honor in a fight. Its about fighting for your space, or fighting for someone elses space. When you die. You are supposed to STFU. You acknowledge a good fight or you dont, but thats it. Win or lose. That has been the rule of consensus in EVE since day 1. But there are other rules.

Tactics that occur in eve everday that are not true spaceship tactics, they are game mechanics. Using game mechanics to win a fight which was never intended by the devs, but impossible as yet to find alternatives it seems, is the worst type of gameplay and without honor.

Aggro Timer Abuse For what takes billions upon billions of isk and time and team work to create, one persons stupidity (i'll admit) while flying the most expensive ship in EVE, he loses it all. Twice. (different pilots losing their titans). I admit they were really paying attention. Why do you log off in a titan with ANYONE in the system? Even if its a corp/alliance mate?

That being said.. it does not absolve the pilots who used game mechanics to destroy the titans in question (both occurances by BoB pilots). Now there is nothing Devs can do about this issue unless they change how loggin off occurs (such as 30 second loggoff rule like in other games) but they havent for whatever reasons. Still, it is upon our honor that pilots do not use game mechanics to win a battle (ie shuttles with thousands of bookmarks surrounding a POS) Why is this acceptable. Did they use teamwork to accomplish the feat? Yes, but thats not theh issue. They cheated. While its possible to do ingame, its still cheating, because you are using mechanics that have nothing to do with honor. You did not 'bring it' to D2, you used an aggro timer, again.

This is absurd. Perhaps the game is going downhill. Perhaps the devs dont care that all that work to produce these titans were lost not because they died in a straight up fight, but because another team decided to cheat by using game mechanics.

How utterly pathetic (yes i know this will be locked but i dont give a rats right now).

The log off Somehow, this is still being used to avoid dying. This is without honor. If you are flying your ship (that you should be prepared to lose if your flying it) and you get caught at a gate camp bubble.. well duh.. ur dead. And you know what.. its your fault for not flying a scout. Game mechanics to save your ship. How pathetic.

Mass Log in Since the early days of the game, this has been used, and still is being used. The whole "well me and my friends who all know each other in real life decided to play eve at the same time, all 150 of us" .. cough Bullshiznit. You are using game mechanics to win at EVE and you have no honor, and are cheating. Perhaps Devs allow because they have no fix for it and cannot prove, but you as a pilot know just because the game allows it, it is using game mechanics to win.


The state of EVE is bad, and its not the game.. its the players.


SIGND

Stickey Crak
Caldari
Swedish Gimp Squad
Posted - 2007.02.18 12:32:00 - [48]
 

can you please tell me what honor in a online game is? i've never understood this.. ppl expect others to act honorable in a place where everyone is faceless, no RL contact no nothing.. just bits and pixles. You'll get more "honor" from a stranger on a street than you ever get from online character. For you who are crying honor this honor that, get a grip EvE isn't real nor is honor. And as i understand it, "honor" for you ppl would be where... Well tbh i have no idea what you mean by honor.

Its not honorable to kill a titan while aggroed and logged? Anyone here who WOULDN'T do the same thing if the opportunity came along? Whoever says no is a pure liar and a hipocrit.

Bah theres no point in this. As i said before. You'll never get "honor" as long as people are involved. If you want "honor" while killing someone go kill NPCs. They'll fight on you terms

Stitcher
Caldari
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2007.02.18 12:37:00 - [49]
 

Edited by: Stitcher on 18/02/2007 12:34:38
Originally by: Stickey Crak
can you please tell me what honor in a online game is? i've never understood this.. ppl expect others to act honorable in a place where everyone is faceless, no RL contact no nothing.. just bits and pixles. You'll get more "honor" from a stranger on a street than you ever get from online character. For you who are crying honor this honor that, get a grip EvE isn't real nor is honor. And as i understand it, "honor" for you ppl would be where... Well tbh i have no idea what you mean by honor.


Reputation, respect. People knowing you're as good as your word.

In a situation where you are almost totally anonymous and faceless, these qualities are infinitely more valuable than they are in real life, because people can't read your expression or body language to judge your sincerity.

Honour means the same thing in a game as it does in real life... but I believe that it is worth much more.

Quote:
Its not honorable to kill a titan while aggroed and logged? Anyone here who WOULDN'T do the same thing if the opportunity came along? Whoever says no is a pure liar and a hipocrit.


I wouldn't. I'd take the opportunity to fight and try and kill one, sure. But I wouldn't do it by stealthily aggroing it and then ganking it while the pilot is logged off.

Oh, and I don't think you have the meaning of "hypocrite" down correctly. It means "to say one thing and do another". You can call me a hypocrite if I ever go gank a titan that can't fight back. Until then, the word doesn't apply.

Quote:
Bah theres no point in this. As i said before. You'll never get "honor" as long as people are involved. If you want "honor" while killing someone go kill NPCs. They'll fight on you terms


Nobody is legally allowed to be this cynical before the age of sixty-three.

Doragee
Minmatar
Unknown Society
Posted - 2007.02.18 12:37:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: Stickey Crak
Well tbh i have no idea what you mean by honor.


Well....seems exactly THAT's the point...Neutral

Liu Kaskakka
Caldari
PAK
Posted - 2007.02.18 13:00:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: Drokar Gazer
Now there is nothing Devs can do about this issue unless they change how loggin off occurs (such as 30 second loggoff rule like in other games) but they havent for whatever reasons.


And how are you going to ever kill a titan if it vanishes after 30 secs from logging off? Oh, yeah, people (other than bob) play this game fair and they would not log off?

Gaz Widdow
Caldari
Red Sky Morning
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2007.02.18 14:18:00 - [52]
 

Good post: although slightly concerned about the recient dev thing, it didnt interfere with my game play in the slightest.

What Im more concerned about is the ultimate Doomsday, (node crashing) to gain a stratigic advantage which effects hundreds if not thousands of players in time spent training skills and building to be sat looking at a logon screen whist what they have achived is being ripped apart

Noone allience ingame can fight that abuse and I hope CCP
get to grips with it before its used more common place

I dont blame anyone party but titans and poss warfare dont help. nor do I have the answer.

But I feel its going to be the straw that broke the camels back and will kill the game unless CCP do something real quick with the esculation of the 0.0 wars.

Any player who has spent time training and building to not be able to use iether must be asking them selfs some serious questions right now if it was even worth the effort.

Sidrat Flush
Caldari
Eve Industrial Corp
Posted - 2007.02.18 14:47:00 - [53]
 

"Life is about memories the more the better" (There's a slightly x rated version so fill it in your own head).

If I personally can say, I helped my alliance as much as I could with my final breathe in a way that I can still a) look in the mirror and b) have my alliance mates still speak to me, then I'll be a happy guy with a lot of memories.

If I need to cheat or come under the command of a cheater, I'd feel about two inches tall and a tad dirty.

As the character represents myself in game (I'm not a great roleplayer), I have to be true to myself in all my actions. My own sense of morality expects this of me.

There are no real lives that are going to be lost through Eve, apart from a few extra grey hairs from all the flames, it's not as if any of us will have real blood on their hands, so people, let's have a true measure of ability with tactics, modules, ships and FC orders before thinking about the easiest way of taking down expensive and hard targets.

I suppose, when Eve Online has had it's final server turned off, there will be those players that can say they did everything in order to win and those that will have to say, I thought of every exploit and cheap tactic to win.

I know which camp I want to be a part of.

Boliknar
Minmatar
Divine Republic Holding LLC.
Posted - 2007.02.18 15:58:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: Cosmic Flame
Using a spy to aggro a careless pilot who thinks that just because he is alone in the system and only a "friendly" pilot aggroed him he is safe, and then killing him by jumping in a fleet is in no way cheating as you put it.
This type of ganking happens every day all over EVE. An aggroed pilot logs off and gets probed and killed. In this case it was careful planning from BoB and poor judgement and carelessness by the D2 pilot.

You talk about "fair" fighting. There is none anywhere in any game or RL for that matter. The victor is always the side with some advantage: tactical, firepower, numbers, something that can make the outcome favorable. "Spying" is within game rules, friendly fire is within game rules and probing down a ship with aggro is within game rules. Hence it is not cheating.

Fair play you say? Talking about something other than pvp... Trust is not the most rich group of T2 production corps by "playing fair". They are probably the biggest cartel in this game. They have ripped off many people for much longer than BoB has been around. They don't make "fair" prices, and have huge profits. They gather up bpo's to have control over the market. There's nothing "fair" about that, ooo but wait..... lemme guess, that doesn't count right? It's all fair when it suits you, but not all fair it doesn't. Right...

Biased views suck.


I for one am glad i still care about honor and essesntial fairness. I could never take advantage of another players real life situation just so i could somehow feel better about myself. But I guess there are some in Eve not saddled with my (as in me the player's) morals and ethics. I have been a game player for a real long time in a lot of different formats. What was done is no different that the sad little role player who needs to pencil whip his character into a god on paper in order to have some sense of self worth. I think the saddest part is those who have a sense of gamesmanship and honor are quickly becoming the minority in this game and its really sad.

so until such time as the e-peeners take over the game entirely I will still be playing trying to win but I will never give up part of who I am or what I believe to win a computer game. That may be why I will never win some will say...might be true but at least I am still me.

If you must become what you fight in order to beat it... then is there really any point in fighting?

Boliknar
Minmatar
Divine Republic Holding LLC.
Posted - 2007.02.18 16:07:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: mr passie
I never thought to say this about a tri post, but I completely agree. (no flamebait)

I think it sucks to log off in combat but even more to kill a titan (the supposedly unkillable) this way. I do not have a solution, but I would hate to see people stop flying titans because they are exploits waiting to be happening.

I'd never use these tactics even it would cost my last bit of isk. Even if I got a killmail like that how would I ever be proud of my achievment?


See thats where your misguided the people using these tactics dont really care about perceptions or honor or pride really all they care about is showing off there e-peen and trying to make themsleves feel better. Whereas you and I would never take pride in such a kill these people get congratulated on one such kill by a CCP rep in local. So its really no wonder the game has gone down this road.

Wulfgard
Minmatar
Section XIII
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2007.02.18 16:37:00 - [56]
 

CCP, you better start hiring some people with a little more professionalism. Congratulating an alliance for killing a player who wasn't even ONLINEugh

Is that what you had in mind when you designed that superb game? Clearly, by not fixing these borked codes, you are encouraging your player base to resort to such underhanded tactics. Contrary to what most of the posters in these forums think, your average subscriber doesn't wish to play in a community who prides itself in playing dirty, using lies and deceit to obtain a questionable victory.

Who wants victory without glory... in a game? Rolling Eyes



Wolf Fang
Caldari
2plus2isfive
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2007.02.18 16:49:00 - [57]
 

Originally by: Cosmic Flame

Fair play you say? Talking about something other than pvp... Trust is not the most rich group of T2 production corps by "playing fair". They are probably the biggest cartel in this game. They have ripped off many people for much longer than BoB has been around. They don't make "fair" prices, and have huge profits. They gather up bpo's to have control over the market. There's nothing "fair" about that, ooo but wait..... lemme guess, that doesn't count right? It's all fair when it suits you, but not all fair it doesn't. Right...

Biased views suck.


Agreed Stop with the inflation crap and mabey people wont have to resort to dirty fighting because a ship that cost them 300mil+ only pays back 50mil

Drokar Gazer
Caldari
DISORDERLY CONDUCT.
Posted - 2007.02.18 16:51:00 - [58]
 



I think in the end this post was about me deciding whether or not this game was worth playing anymore. NOt because of the titan.. again.. its not mine and i dont really care. Its about how alliances/corps go about the way they do battle.

CEO's have the ability to 'choose' how they direct their members to act. If honor among pilots is so dead in this game.. then it ceases to be a game, and now is just a grief fest.

What has become of my beloved EVE is no more than a child's game with everyone fighting over who has the largets e-peen rather than attempting to earn respect by bringing it in battle and staying a sport whether you win or lose.

Just because this is a game does not negate this. Some of you say, well 'what is honor', and 'honor has no place in EVE', well i say why? When a game has become so serious to so many that they would rather cheat, yes CHEAT, using game mechanics.. game mechancs is not winning.. its using facilities of the game that were not intended to but do provide for an outcome or event that, whos purpose was not intended. Those who defend the actions of these players who 'choose' to be the lessor of honorable, and decide to out maneuveur their opponents by using such horrid tactics rather than meeting on the battlefield.

Whether its a login tactic, logging out to save your ship, manipulating the nodes to cause lag on purpose, in any way shape or form using anything except your ship, your wits, and tactics that do not depend on game mechanics to win... the traits of what it is to be human, or scoundrel... you make these choices everyday.. and for those who cannot comprehend honor.. well then there is a large dividing gap between us.

I will move on and hope for better days in EVE. Thank you to those who provided criticism to my post, good or bad, the flames, well you just show your nature. I am not mad even if i sound so but i have played this game for 3 years, and it is time to step back and watch this great game slide into chaos. Too many new players , i would bet younger players from other games such as WoW, etc.. this game didnt need you.. we were fine as we were. You came and you ruined our game.

Congrats. Your e=peen is larger.. you win. I'm out.

Been a great ride these 3 years. Thanks for the memories.

Mordrake
Caldari
Freelance Economics Astrological resources
Tactical Narcotics Team
Posted - 2007.02.18 21:52:00 - [59]
 

I truely hope that players who have the moral fiber to see these underhanded tactics being used for what they are do not decide to leave the game.

Situations like this will test the resolve of any player to stick to the high road and not have a good overall effect on the "Feel" of EVE.

Personally I want the people who see the wrong in this to stay the course and be there by my side or to stand against me at some point in the future.

The day I stand with a handfull and face the throng of L33t D0od$ who will never face battle with Honor is the day I quit EVE.


w0rmy
Caldari
Destructive Influence
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2007.02.18 21:55:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: Mordrake
I truely hope that players who have the moral fiber to see these underhanded tactics being used for what they are do not decide to leave the game.



Considering the number of "OMG A titan, IM MY TROUSERS!!!" threads of late, I'm not too sure the eve community has the maturity or moral fiber to do anything but find themselves other underhanded tactics to use.



Pages: 1 [2] 3

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only