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Jerry Pepridge
Posted - 2011.08.23 23:05:00 - [31]
 

move to null
shoot nerds

stay in highsec
wardec a smaller corp, chest beat in local

Olleybear
Minmatar
I R' Carebear
Posted - 2011.08.23 23:07:00 - [32]
 

Just adding my 0.2 isk perspective from being in a large 0.0 alliance for about a year out of my 6 or so years playing eve.

At first 0.0 was fun. Large scale battles were fun even with some lag, exploration for 6/10 to 10/10 plexes was fun, mining ore I'd never mined before was fun, some gate camping and trying to chase down the rare lonely pvp'er was fun. At first.

Over time, these activities got boring. Over time, the people in 0.0 got more and more on my nerves. Nothing like listening to childish epeening on the forums and in local to get under an older guys skin. CTA's that took 3 or 4 hours only to not shoot a single thing. Scanning down plexes for income got old faster than I thought possible. Hardly any small scale pvp of any kind.

Pretty amazing that for most of my 6 or so years playing, the most fun I have is in high and low sec.

Screw 0.0, screw their politics, screw the childish epeening, and screw the mindnumbing boredom. I'll stay in low for my pvp and high to earn my isk thankyou.

Sullen Skoung
Posted - 2011.08.23 23:31:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: MsValentineWiggin

If you and the CCP devs get their way and you significantly reduce CCP's revenue and thus resources, where do you think CCP will cut efforts:




You fail at reading and the internets if you think Im on CCP's side in this

Anya Ohaya
Posted - 2011.08.23 23:40:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Olleybear
Nothing like listening to childish epeening on the forums and in local to get under an older guys skin.


COAD is enough to put me off any of the null alliances, and many of the rest.

I don't care if they remove all missions, t2 manufacturing, faction drops and even concord, I'd rather spend the rest of EVE's dying days ratting in a cheap frigate in high/low and giving the finger to the blobs.

Tau Cabalander
Posted - 2011.08.24 00:30:00 - [35]
 


Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr
Divine Power.
Atlas.
Posted - 2011.08.24 01:21:00 - [36]
 

Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 01:25:23
Originally by: Dusty Warrior
How to make null more attractive?

Someone posted what I think would be an awesome thing to do.

"Remove all sov mechanics."

I think a little refinement along with removing sov would attract more people. Yes... I know the big bot alliances are already in place and have supercaps on top of supercaps but think that can be dealt with. Don't underestimate the power of noobs in mass numbers

They already did this a few times with lowsec, w-space and NPC 0.0.

Anyways, all of this could be solved by removing NPC corps and forcing/allowing hisec players to engage in direct competition over resources and markets, decreasing the vast low-end mineral injection into the world economy and forcing hisec players to choose between fighting over a belt in hisec or fighting over a belt in 0.0 instead of the current "fight over ____ in 0.0 or grind isk 23/7 in hisec". While also limiting the logistic capabilities of 0.0 NPC corp freighter alts to boot, forcing nullsec to be more self-sufficient.

Pok Nibin
Amarr
Posted - 2011.08.24 01:46:00 - [37]
 

Go to null sec. Be a victim.
Come to null sec! Be my victim!

Please. Get real. Eventually when Goonswarm/s****/whatever winds up diddling with themselves, even they may get bored and leave. Then, with all the predators GONE, it might not be STUPID to go out to null sec.

AS it is now, a fool and his money are soon parted, it is stupid to go to null sec to be warp bubbled, robbed and podded. I can't help but think the folks trying to INVITE other players out there to make it more FUN, have an idea of fun the rest of us just don't share. FUN is not getting podded by a sociopathic PLAYER/Corp/Alliance.

Have fun out there, while you can. Even what you do will become mind-numbingly boring. How clever of you.

Asuri Kinnes
Caldari
Adhocracy Incorporated
Posted - 2011.08.24 02:03:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 01:25:23
Originally by: Dusty Warrior
How to make null more attractive?

Someone posted what I think would be an awesome thing to do.

"Remove all sov mechanics."

I think a little refinement along with removing sov would attract more people. Yes... I know the big bot alliances are already in place and have supercaps on top of supercaps but think that can be dealt with. Don't underestimate the power of noobs in mass numbers

They already did this a few times with lowsec, w-space and NPC 0.0.

Anyways, all of this could be solved by removing NPC corps and forcing/allowing hisec players to engage in direct competition over resources and markets, decreasing the vast low-end mineral injection into the world economy and forcing hisec players to choose between fighting over a belt in hisec or fighting over a belt in 0.0 instead of the current "fight over ____ in 0.0 or grind isk 23/7 in hisec". While also limiting the logistic capabilities of 0.0 NPC corp freighter alts to boot, forcing nullsec to be more self-sufficient.


I don't know how you think this would have *any* effect what-so-ever... You've been posting it in every thread. It is *stupid* easy to avoid a war-dec (which is what I'm assuming your talking about) by Corp Hopping. Because of the time it takes to call a vote, put it through, declare war, wait for the warm-up period to end, your *targets* can form a new corp, and leave the wardec'd corp... never actually getting to the whole "war" part.

Until *that* changes, player corps are no different than NPC corps.... Suicide Ganking is the only option atm to perform non-consensual pvp in Hi-Sec.

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr
Divine Power.
Atlas.
Posted - 2011.08.24 02:22:00 - [39]
 

Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 02:25:09
Originally by: Asuri Kinnes

I don't know how you think this would have *any* effect what-so-ever... You've been posting it in every thread. It is *stupid* easy to avoid a war-dec (which is what I'm assuming your talking about) by Corp Hopping. Because of the time it takes to call a vote, put it through, declare war, wait for the warm-up period to end, your *targets* can form a new corp, and leave the wardec'd corp... never actually getting to the whole "war" part.

Until *that* changes, player corps are no different than NPC corps.... Suicide Ganking is the only option atm to perform non-consensual pvp in Hi-Sec.
Okay, so kill NPC corps and fix the broken wardec system. Now the two main barriers to players entering nullsec have been fixed, and none of the ore or ice have been taken away.

Jerry Pepridge
Posted - 2011.08.24 02:24:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Pok Nibin
Go to null sec. Be a victim.
Come to null sec! Be my victim!

Please. Get real. Eventually when Goonswarm/s****/whatever winds up diddling with themselves, even they may get bored and leave. Then, with all the predators GONE, it might not be STUPID to go out to null sec.

AS it is now, a fool and his money are soon parted, it is stupid to go to null sec to be warp bubbled, robbed and podded. I can't help but think the folks trying to INVITE other players out there to make it more FUN, have an idea of fun the rest of us just don't share. FUN is not getting podded by a sociopathic PLAYER/Corp/Alliance.

Have fun out there, while you can. Even what you do will become mind-numbingly boring. How clever of you.



I lol when i get podded. saves me a trip back.

Ira Theos
Posted - 2011.08.24 03:01:00 - [41]
 

Originally by: Ad'Hakim Tahous
Originally by: Bane Necran
Making it more attractive has never worked, and they've been trying for years now. Throwing ISK at 0.0 dwellers just further entrenches the people already there, who are actively forcing out any newcomers, and greedily claiming space they have no intention of ever using.


THIS! The only little ray of hope may come from the current round of brainstorming around Smallholdings.... in which small groups can hide, set up some sort of small station, and still earn significant ISK outside of the wealth concentrators run by Alliance leaders.

CCP just doesn't seem to get it! People might indeed like to try out 0.0, but they have absolutely no intention of becoming meat-shield wage *****s for Alliance Directors. For the moment these folks move to w-space.... all the benefits with none of the politics.

It isn't 0.0's capacity to generate more ISK that may attract new pilots, its how that ISK will go to those new pilots rather than be concentrated in the hands of those running 0.0!

Laughing Of course, since the successful introduction of w-space pilots did have a challenging and profitable volume of space to explore and settle..... and since that clearly doesn't benefit 0.0 space both the CSM and CCP seem poised to swat w-space with the nerf bat....

Want more people in 0.0? Find ways for them to earn ISK without contributing to the Alliance treasuries! Laughing "... Build it and they will come...."

*****

QFT !

Dusty Warrior
Posted - 2011.08.24 03:07:00 - [42]
 

Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 01:25:23
Originally by: Dusty Warrior
How to make null more attractive?

Someone posted what I think would be an awesome thing to do.

"Remove all sov mechanics."

I think a little refinement along with removing sov would attract more people. Yes... I know the big bot alliances are already in place and have supercaps on top of supercaps but think that can be dealt with. Don't underestimate the power of noobs in mass numbers

They already did this a few times with lowsec, w-space and NPC 0.0.

Anyways, all of this could be solved by removing NPC corps and forcing/allowing hisec players to engage in direct competition over resources and markets, decreasing the vast low-end mineral injection into the world economy and forcing hisec players to choose between fighting over a belt in hisec or fighting over a belt in 0.0 instead of the current "fight over ____ in 0.0 or grind isk 23/7 in hisec". While also limiting the logistic capabilities of 0.0 NPC corp freighter alts to boot, forcing nullsec to be more self-sufficient.


I'm not at all sure removing NPCs would be a great idea. IMO this would allow predators to eat the "true" noobs alive hindering CCPs rentention of new accounts/players.

You know as well as I it would be like throwing chum into shark infested waters. The chum being the new player of course. Just a thought.

Asuri Kinnes
Caldari
Adhocracy Incorporated
Posted - 2011.08.24 04:08:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Okay, so kill NPC corps and fix the broken wardec system. Now the two main barriers to players entering nullsec have been fixed, and none of the ore or ice have been taken away.


LOL! THOSE aren't the "main barrier" into 0.0! The reputations that the 0.0 corps have created for themselves is the barrier!

You think the 3% of the Eve Player base (roughly, according to the last QEN) that lives in WH's couldn't hack it in 0.0? I've got news for you, they *can* and *do* hack it in 0.0! Just not the "sov" 0.0.

CCP can tweak, and change and manipulate all they want, there is *always* going to be players who have no interest or motivation to play Sov War games...

Sullen Skoung
Posted - 2011.08.24 04:16:00 - [44]
 

Originally by: Pok Nibin
Go to null sec. Be a victim.
Come to null sec! Be my victim!

Please. Get real. Eventually when Goonswarm/s****/whatever winds up diddling with themselves, even they may get bored and leave.



why? theyre pretty much ruining er I mean running the show right now lol

Amber Villaneous
Posted - 2011.08.24 04:22:00 - [45]
 

Originally by: Ramalamadindong
They can easily force people to go there


But what they cannot do is force people to renew their subs.

Sullen Skoung
Posted - 2011.08.24 04:28:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Originally by: Ramalamadindong
They can easily force people to go there


But what they cannot do is force people to renew their subs.


This. They can push towards 0.0 all they want. How long does the game keep going when 80% of the players leave?

CCP knows better than the players whats good for their game.
SOE knew what was best for SWG too. Better than all those players that left too.

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr
Divine Power.
Atlas.
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:00:00 - [47]
 

Originally by: Dusty Warrior
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 01:25:23
Originally by: Dusty Warrior
How to make null more attractive?

Someone posted what I think would be an awesome thing to do.

"Remove all sov mechanics."

I think a little refinement along with removing sov would attract more people. Yes... I know the big bot alliances are already in place and have supercaps on top of supercaps but think that can be dealt with. Don't underestimate the power of noobs in mass numbers

They already did this a few times with lowsec, w-space and NPC 0.0.

Anyways, all of this could be solved by removing NPC corps and forcing/allowing hisec players to engage in direct competition over resources and markets, decreasing the vast low-end mineral injection into the world economy and forcing hisec players to choose between fighting over a belt in hisec or fighting over a belt in 0.0 instead of the current "fight over ____ in 0.0 or grind isk 23/7 in hisec". While also limiting the logistic capabilities of 0.0 NPC corp freighter alts to boot, forcing nullsec to be more self-sufficient.


I'm not at all sure removing NPCs would be a great idea. IMO this would allow predators to eat the "true" noobs alive hindering CCPs rentention of new accounts/players.

You know as well as I it would be like throwing chum into shark infested waters. The chum being the new player of course. Just a thought.
Hm, true. I remember in a few earlier revisions of this proposal I was all for letting trial accounts/rookies have access to NPC corps until they can join EVE society proper. NPC corps should be restricted only for new characters at best, really.

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr
Divine Power.
Atlas.
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:10:00 - [48]
 

Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 05:14:37
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 05:13:21
Originally by: Asuri Kinnes
LOL! THOSE aren't the "main barrier" into 0.0! The reputations that the 0.0 corps have created for themselves is the barrier!

You think the 3% of the Eve Player base (roughly, according to the last QEN) that lives in WH's couldn't hack it in 0.0? I've got news for you, they *can* and *do* hack it in 0.0! Just not the "sov" 0.0.
Who mentioned wormholes? Take a deep breath and remember that we're talking about the removal of NPC corps here.
Quote:
CCP can tweak, and change and manipulate all they want, there is *always* going to be players who have no interest or motivation to play Sov War games...
True, that's why removing NPC corps (and fixing the broken wardec system) is a good idea as it allows highsec miners recourse to actively fight for resources in highsec beyond undercutting prices, letting lowend mins and ice be subject to the same market forces that drive the rest of EVE. This addition of incurred cost in both ships & time to hisec life makes nullsec industry more fiscally alluring, while taking nothing away resource-wise from the region (WH and hisec pos fuel access is still safe).

Sullen Skoung
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:24:00 - [49]
 

lol yeah remove the npc corps so the fun griefers can wardec anyone they want and cause them to leave the game lol

man theres so many ppl tryin to kill this game lately

Si Omega
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:24:00 - [50]
 

Quote:
True, that's why removing NPC corps (and fixing the broken wardec system) is a good idea as it allows highsec miners recourse to actively fight for resources in highsec


When are people gonna learn that NOT everyone wants to fight to play? I'd really like to see just how many carebears are REALLY in Eve that DO NOT fight or want to. Perhaps the very existence of PvP is what creates the opportunities for players to come in and NOT play PvP by mining etc.

Consider this ephiphany. If carebears are forced to PvP, they'll just go elsewhere.

I love to PvP. I just can't be bothered doing it for no reason. Seriously, if null continues to be same ol' same ol' that it's become and high becomes the new warzone (blob the Hulkers instead yeah?) then I would just move on too.

And NO, you cannot have my stuff and the door can stay just like it was when I walked through it dammit!

Sullen Skoung
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:35:00 - [51]
 

The number of ppl living in high sec is said to be 80% of the total population of the game.

Si Omega
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:37:00 - [52]
 

Well hey. How about this for an original idea then.Laughing

Quote:
By making it MORE attractive
and NOT making everything else LESS attractive


Ne'er a truer word spoken imho.

TL;DR >> Don't nerf it, buff it...


Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr
Divine Power.
Atlas.
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:40:00 - [53]
 

Originally by: Si Omega
Quote:
True, that's why removing NPC corps (and fixing the broken wardec system) is a good idea as it allows highsec miners recourse to actively fight for resources in highsec


When are people gonna learn that NOT everyone wants to fight to play? I'd really like to see just how many carebears are REALLY in Eve that DO NOT fight or want to. Perhaps the very existence of PvP is what creates the opportunities for players to come in and NOT play PvP by mining etc.
EVE is a deeply interconnected game where all actions by all players affect others no matter how miniscule.

Collectively, the existence of NPC corps forces small-mid scale industrialists out of 0.0 by making them unnecessary for the day-to-day functioning of 0.0 alliances. Way easier to just jump freighter rock bottom-sold lowends from hisec then bringing in your mining character, who can't compete with the NPC corp members fiscally because you have to attend CTAs, dock up from hostiles, inevitably replace ships, etc. while they mine ice/veld 23/7.

This thread is about "bringing people in to nullsec", and increasing the incurred costs of highsec life would make that happen, and better balance the game as a whole.

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr
Divine Power.
Atlas.
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:44:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: Si Omega
Well hey. How about this for an original idea then.Laughing

Quote:
By making it MORE attractive
and NOT making everything else LESS attractive


Ne'er a truer word spoken imho.

TL;DR >> Don't nerf it, buff it...
That was already attempted with the original Dominion anomalies. The massive increase in isk availability in all regions of sov-holding 0.0 that wound up getting smacked with the nerf bat didn't bring enough people in. So no buffing is not the answer.

Si Omega
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:48:00 - [55]
 

So you restrict the ability of miners to mine by, as is being suggested by CCP, shifting ALL high-ends to null. You don't need to turn high into a warzone to do that.

Even then, problem still remains that CONTROL of resources is left for the blobbosses to hand out as candy to anyone stupid enough to believe they are fighting for a cause.

The minerals will be the new tech moon goo, nothing changes.

Alliance monopolies need to be busted and profits distributed so a grunt can become a rich grunt IF HE WANTS TO.

Ad'Hakim Tahous
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:55:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Originally by: Si Omega
Quote:
True, that's why removing NPC corps (and fixing the broken wardec system) is a good idea as it allows highsec miners recourse to actively fight for resources in highsec


When are people gonna learn that NOT everyone wants to fight to play? I'd really like to see just how many carebears are REALLY in Eve that DO NOT fight or want to. Perhaps the very existence of PvP is what creates the opportunities for players to come in and NOT play PvP by mining etc.
EVE is a deeply interconnected game where all actions by all players affect others no matter how miniscule.

Collectively, the existence of NPC corps forces small-mid scale industrialists out of 0.0 by making them unnecessary for the day-to-day functioning of 0.0 alliances. Way easier to just jump freighter rock bottom-sold lowends from hisec then bringing in your mining character, who can't compete with the NPC corp members fiscally because you have to attend CTAs, dock up from hostiles, inevitably replace ships, etc. while they mine ice/veld 23/7.

This thread is about "bringing people in to nullsec", and increasing the incurred costs of highsec life would make that happen, and better balance the game as a whole.



Sorry, but no deal. I will NOT become a 3rd class, meat-shield wage-w***e for Alliance Directors with multi-billion ISK treasuries, delusions of greatness, and seats on the CSM.

So long as 0.0 is geared so that servitude = playability, and "reward" = ship replacement, this region of space is and will remain of no interest to many pilots. This didn't happen through game mechanics... look to those who run the Alliances and see what they have made.... Laughing

Sullen Skoung
Posted - 2011.08.24 05:59:00 - [57]
 

Edited by: Sullen Skoung on 24/08/2011 06:00:52
All theyre gonna do, all they seem to WANT to do is push and control the players to do what THEY want.
wonder if they realize were here cause this, NOW is what WE want.

Push us too hard an we'll leave.
But given the "**** the players we know whats best for EVE" attitude, it looks like they WANT ppl to leave. It looks lees like "**** the players..." and more "play the way WE want or get out."

as for the CSM, High sec needs representation too. Or we get squeezed out of the game by the 0.0 *******s like we're seeing now.

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr
Divine Power.
Atlas.
Posted - 2011.08.24 06:05:00 - [58]
 

Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 06:06:17
Originally by: Ad'Hakim Tahous

Sorry, but no deal. I will NOT become a 3rd class, meat-shield wage-w***e for Alliance Directors with multi-billion ISK treasuries, delusions of greatness, and seats on the CSM.

So long as 0.0 is geared so that servitude = playability, and "reward" = ship replacement, this region of space is and will remain of no interest to many pilots. This didn't happen through game mechanics... look to those who run the Alliances and see what they have made.... Laughing
How is removing NPC corps going to force you into 0.0 man? I mean, if you have no problem making 7 mil isk an hour mining ice because the system is geared to pay you as little ISK for your work as possible so those megalomanical plutocrat 0.0 Alliance leaders you hate can fuel their million billion POS towers, more power to you. I was just throwing out ideas that would make high/null industries more evenly distributed.

Ad'Hakim Tahous
Posted - 2011.08.24 06:46:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Edited by: Nicolo da''Vicenza on 24/08/2011 06:06:17
Originally by: Ad'Hakim Tahous

Sorry, but no deal. I will NOT become a 3rd class, meat-shield wage-w***e for Alliance Directors with multi-billion ISK treasuries, delusions of greatness, and seats on the CSM.

So long as 0.0 is geared so that servitude = playability, and "reward" = ship replacement, this region of space is and will remain of no interest to many pilots. This didn't happen through game mechanics... look to those who run the Alliances and see what they have made.... Laughing
How is removing NPC corps going to force you into 0.0 man? I mean, if you have no problem making 7 mil isk an hour mining ice because the system is geared to pay you as little ISK for your work as possible so those megalomanical plutocrat 0.0 Alliance leaders you hate can fuel their million billion POS towers, more power to you. I was just throwing out ideas that would make high/null industries more evenly distributed.



W/ respect pilot, my game play is my own... on my terms... in corps of my choosing.... and I'm not alone...

Take a good look at the growing numbers of people (pure Carebears, Worm-holers, and ex-Alliance pilots alike) who are posting on ALL of these threads... pilots fed up with the leadership of the big Alliances and what they have made of 0.0

I do so hope that the Devs are taking note.

fgft Athonille
Posted - 2011.08.24 07:27:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: Asuri Kinnes
Originally by: Nicolo da'Vicenza
Okay, so kill NPC corps and fix the broken wardec system. Now the two main barriers to players entering nullsec have been fixed, and none of the ore or ice have been taken away.


LOL! THOSE aren't the "main barrier" into 0.0! The reputations that the 0.0 corps have created for themselves is the barrier!

You think the 3% of the Eve Player base (roughly, according to the last QEN) that lives in WH's couldn't hack it in 0.0? I've got news for you, they *can* and *do* hack it in 0.0! Just not the "sov" 0.0.

CCP can tweak, and change and manipulate all they want, there is *always* going to be players who have no interest or motivation to play Sov War games...


wormholes is just as dirty bear infested as nullsec

just because your space is slightly dangerous doesnt change the fact you are all dirty bears.


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