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blankseplocked So, who made a profit out of Phaser Inc. ?
 
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Solstice Project
Posted - 2011.08.12 21:21:00 - [1]
 


As there seems to be no thread about who actually profitted from them,
i thought i start one, because i was looking for others.

Of course it was a scam, i gave it a year.
I did believe it will take at least half a year,
because it makes no sense to pull it off in just a month or two.

So, i checked my wallet today.

100 Million isk invested around 31 weeks ago.
5% rate = 5 Million isk per week, sometimes more.

31x5 = 155 Million isk.

I admit, i didn't pull my money out, but i still made 55 Million isk from them
and that feels quite okay for me. And yes, of course it's not a HUGE sum,
but it's still profit in the end ... and besides that, investing too much makes no sense,
because OBVIOUS SCAM IS OBVIOUS ! *lol*

Anybody else who was playing early adopter to make some profit ?
Or, am i actually wrong, because i didn't grab the initial 100 Million isk before they pulled the plug ?

Thx. :)

Devai Starchild
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.12 21:34:00 - [2]
 

So for a years investment you lost 55 million?

Sounds like profit to me.

Paul L Atreides
Posted - 2011.08.12 21:39:00 - [3]
 

Eddie Lampert and the other guy ... both made quite a nice profit i might say

Kethas Protagonist
Protagonist Ventures
Posted - 2011.08.12 21:39:00 - [4]
 

As I read it, he gave them 100M to start, never took back this seed amount (and lost it), but took the 5M weekly payments, so, like he said, he got a total of 155M back.

That's earning roughly 6% a month. Not horrible, and better returns than you'll find on most collateralized offerings here on MD, but worse than most uncollateralized ones.

TornSoul
BIG
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2011.08.12 21:56:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: TornSoul on 12/08/2011 21:56:53

Good for you but...

Your profit, actually comes out of the pocket of all those that *did* end up getting scammed...
I personally wouldn't feel well having that profit in my wallet (the original 100M you put in is ofc no problem).

Maybe that's why you're not seeing that many talking about it too much if they managed to turn a profit on this one.

(and no I didn't invest so have no axe to grind either way)

Just my 0.02 ISK...


Skippermonkey
Tactical Knightmare
Posted - 2011.08.12 23:22:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Skippermonkey on 12/08/2011 23:22:35
Originally by: TornSoul
I personally wouldn't feel well having that profit in my wallet

How the hell do you think 'normal' traders turn a profit?

Its not like traders ADD anything to the economy, so in the end, all their profit has come out of somebody elses pocket.

How are the Phaser profits really much different from taking items from sellers at below costs and selling above costs, or manipulating the markets to your favor.

I think saying that what Phaser did is BAD, but what normal traders do is GOOD is a bit naieve

I think a good analogy of traders would be to look at them as a form of parasite, the economy would do fine without them

(im gonna end here, because now im rambling)

Middlemen, Rolling Eyes

edit - btw, to clarify, i think what Phaser did was awesome

egola
Amarr
Posted - 2011.08.12 23:37:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: egola on 12/08/2011 23:39:21
Originally by: Skippermonkey
Edited by: Skippermonkey on 12/08/2011 23:22:35
Originally by: TornSoul
I personally wouldn't feel well having that profit in my wallet

How the hell do you think 'normal' traders turn a profit?

Its not like traders ADD anything to the economy, so in the end, all their profit has come out of somebody elses pocket.

How are the Phaser profits really much different from taking items from sellers at below costs and selling above costs, or manipulating the markets to your favor.

I think saying that what Phaser did is BAD, but what normal traders do is GOOD is a bit naieve

I think a good analogy of traders would be to look at them as a form of parasite, the economy would do fine without them

(im gonna end here, because now im rambling)

Middlemen, Rolling Eyes

edit - btw, to clarify, i think what Phaser did was awesome


no one believes that what normal traders do is "good". there is no collective "we" that defines it. the only facts that people can say is that phaser scammed. there is no "good" or "bad" involved in that, its just a gaming style that eve supports. dunno why you would argue that people label something good or bad when theres no collective body to compare it to, they're probably the loud minority in any case. Moral relativism is a mandatory in EVE!

Umbriele
Gallente
Natural Inventions
Solyaris Chtonium
Posted - 2011.08.13 00:03:00 - [8]
 

I made about 500m profit by betting the scam day in time :))) thank you Phaser Inc I love you

Siri Buelle
Gallente
regener8ted inc
Posted - 2011.08.13 00:06:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Skippermonkey
Edited by: Skippermonkey on 12/08/2011 23:22:35
Originally by: TornSoul
I personally wouldn't feel well having that profit in my wallet

How the hell do you think 'normal' traders turn a profit?

Its not like traders ADD anything to the economy, so in the end, all their profit has come out of somebody elses pocket.

How are the Phaser profits really much different from taking items from sellers at below costs and selling above costs, or manipulating the markets to your favor.

I think saying that what Phaser did is BAD, but what normal traders do is GOOD is a bit naieve

I think a good analogy of traders would be to look at them as a form of parasite, the economy would do fine without them

(im gonna end here, because now im rambling)

Middlemen, Rolling Eyes

edit - btw, to clarify, i think what Phaser did was awesome




What traders do is offer you a service. They offer you an item at a certain price, instantly. They let you go through the trouble of setting up a buy order and waiting for it to be filled.

Same goes with buying. They offer sellers to buy their product instantly at a certain price, instead of them having to put up a sell order and waiting for the item to be sold.

What traders do is GOOD, and they dont make money out of thin air, it is what SERVICe is called. You have the option to use that service or ignore it.

Borkers
Posted - 2011.08.13 00:26:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Skippermonkey
Edited by: Skippermonkey on 12/08/2011 23:22:35
Its not like traders ADD anything to the economy, so in the end, all their profit has come out of somebody elses pocket.

How are the Phaser profits really much different from taking items from sellers at below costs and selling above costs, or manipulating the markets to your favor.


Trying to rabble the Space Proletariat?

There is no "taking items from sellers" by traders. No game mechanic for it. Do you think I blew up their POS in my Iteron? When I buy something at below cost, it's because I made an offer and the seller accepted it, or because the seller made an offer previously and I accepted it. Anything that changes hands is explicitly agreed upon beforehand. Accepting my offer might be a mistake, but at least the terms of the trade are out in the open.

Compare to a Ponzi scheme, which is all lies and illusion. So, yes, normal traders good, Ponzi scheme bad.

What I add to the economy is convenience. You pay more for Liquid Ozone in Dodixie than in Jita because I schlepped a freighter full of it the long way 'round Rancer and so you don't have to. Or you insta-buy it a little cheaper in Jita today than yesterday because I tended low buy orders last night and flipped it for a lower price than my competitors.

You're welcome.

P.S. Please buy Liquid Ozone in Dodixie.

Daal Mastrom
Posted - 2011.08.13 01:10:00 - [11]
 

I made about 300-400 mil from them, I had various investments in there which made about 100 mil total on their own and then I stole 350 mil from them when they withdrew my account twice and kindly just reset my account. I did have 100 mil in at the end when it closed but overall i'm a good 450 mil up from the scam

Tamblyn Mironne
Posted - 2011.08.13 03:08:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Daal Mastrom
I made about 300-400 mil from them, I had various investments in there which made about 100 mil total on their own and then I stole 350 mil from them when they withdrew my account twice and kindly just reset my account. I did have 100 mil in at the end when it closed but overall i'm a good 450 mil up from the scam



So Monopoly's "Bank error in your favor" really happens !

Laughing

Wyke Mossari
Gallente
Posted - 2011.08.13 03:36:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Skippermonkey

Its not like traders ADD anything to the economy, so in the end, all their profit has come out of somebody elses pocket.



Traders provide liquidity, without traders, most primary producers would and do crash the prices well into the minerals are free margins.

Solstice Project
Posted - 2011.08.13 10:33:00 - [14]
 

Wow, quite some ... but not so many either.

Nobody else ?

Congrats for the one guy who made 300-400 Million isk, that's really nice. :D

Originally by: TornSoul
Edited by: TornSoul on 12/08/2011 21:56:53

Good for you but...

Your profit, actually comes out of the pocket of all those that *did* end up getting scammed...
I personally wouldn't feel well having that profit in my wallet (the original 100M you put in is ofc no problem).

Maybe that's why you're not seeing that many talking about it too much if they managed to turn a profit on this one.

(and no I didn't invest so have no axe to grind either way)

Just my 0.02 ISK...




Well ... if this concerns you, i wonder if you check every product you buy IRL
for coming from a company that pays really low wages, or chinese workes with even less.

Besides, you didn't really think this through.
There's nothing to it, when you realize that people who are driven by greed
pretty much deserve to lose their money anyway.


Originally by: egola
no one believes that what normal traders do is "good". there is no collective "we" that defines it. the only facts that people can say is that phaser scammed. there is no "good" or "bad" involved in that, its just a gaming style that eve supports. dunno why you would argue that people label something good or bad when theres no collective body to compare it to, they're probably the loud minority in any case. Moral relativism is a mandatory in EVE!


Nice POV. Altough i'd say, defining stuff in "good" and "bad" is pretty moronic and shows lack of
knowledge about how reality and perception work. *lol* but that's totally offtopic.

Originally by: Umbriele
I made about 500m profit by betting the scam day in time :))) thank you Phaser Inc I love you


Nice work man ! :D

Before this post get's too long ...
congrats to everyone who made some money from those who deserved to lose it ! :)

Levija Saplina
Supremacy Inc.
Not Found.
Posted - 2011.08.13 10:57:00 - [15]
 

I made 150 mil in interests.

Pulled out everything (initial deposit + interest payments) about a week ago, because I felt like it.

AureoLion
Posted - 2011.08.13 18:08:00 - [16]
 

i made a corpmate pull out his half bil + compounding interest of 4 months 3 days ago.
Whoah.

Amon Tyr
Posted - 2011.08.15 02:49:00 - [17]
 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero%E2%80%93sum_game

"Many economic situations are not zero-sum, since valuable goods and services can be created, destroyed, or badly allocated, and any of these will create a net gain or loss. Assuming the counterparties are acting rationally with symmetric information, any commercial exchange is a non-zero-sum activity, because each party must consider the goods it is receiving as being at least fractionally more valuable than the goods it is delivering. Economic exchanges must benefit both parties enough above the zero-sum such that each party can overcome its transaction costs."

Senior Executive
Posted - 2011.08.15 20:00:00 - [18]
 

Having some real life experience dealing with ponzi schemes and an appreciation for a good scam I invested in Phaser Inc. Unfortunately I didn't have much to invest, but I also won the bet on when it was going to happen, more or less. I only made about 100 million.


 

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