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Mitauchi
NOMAD.
Warped Aggression
Posted - 2011.08.07 03:08:00 - [1]
 

As a gamer who really enjoys both console and PC FPS games as well as Eve Online I have to say the announcement of Dust 514 a couple years back really excited me. The thought of being able to play another game type that I really enjoy and have it tied in any fashion to Eve Online really seemed like an awesome idea. Of course from the beginning many long time players (/trolls) have had rather nothing but negative things to say about the idea of an FPS tied in anyway to their beloved Eve.

I can appreciate their fear of such an implementation perhaps messing up something that many of us, for all our criticism, have grow to love. CCP have had their...well...challenges with deploying new expansions or "features" with Eve. That being said I still believe the best method is for those of us who want such an implementation as DUST to be successful is to get involved in the discussion rather than throw our hands up and emo to death about all the things that could possibly go wrong.

To this end I would like to hear from anyone who actually is looking forward to this game and what features or aspects whould you like to see implemented. I have read previous posts (can't think for the authors atm) that had some excellent points which would make the game a success in the eyes of both FPS players and Eve Online Players.


1. The game has to mirror Eve in complexity and depth rather than just being another cookie cutter FPS. Lets face if the game goes the cookie cutter route it will be buried by other FPS who just quite frankly have more experience and will probably do it better.


2. Give Eve players a reason to give a **** about DUST, but not hate it. People will find their own reasons to hate DUST 514 no matter what. The trick is making their involvement with DUST players beneficial enough to urge them to get involved but not make them. You force anyone to do anything against their will no matter how beneficial they will hate you for it.


3. Make sure that the RWMT does not = 'pay to win' or "gold ammo". I accept the fact that players will have the ability to buy weapons, vehicles etc through ISK or AUR which is in turn purchased via credit card. That being said a balance must be maintained similar to the methodology used in Eve where players who spend the time to grind ISK in DUST should be able to generate the same isk through the dedication of their time and efforts. Specialized weapons that are only available to players paying extra money to the game will make other players not want to play the game. ISK and item purchases should be designed to help players keep up with their friends and opponents when they do not have time to dedicate as much time to play DUST, rather penalize players who can not afford to make those purchases.


4. Make it fun to play. If you have to grind a map 40 times to take a territory then whats the point? The game has to be decent as a stand alone shooter and then let all the Eveish aspects make it complex, involved and great.


Hear if anyone has any thoughts on these types of items that would make DUST successful in the eyes of both Eve players and FPS players alike. I know this thread is a troll magnet but here are some items that have been said so many times they really are stale material for trolls and wont really be productive in this thread so I will just post them myself now so everyone can just get it out of their system now.

Hottest Troll responses to DUST 514 Topics
-Nobody cares about DUST 514...
-DUST will ruin Eve because...
-FPS players are too twichy, immature or young to get involved in a complex world such as Eve...
-I won't play it because it is only on PS3...

So reply if your interested in playing DUST 514 and have some input. If your trolling at least come up with new material so I can have a laugh.

Nth Ares
Posted - 2011.08.07 03:39:00 - [2]
 

The problem is that DUST will ruin the FPS genre by being too amazing. It has the frightening potential to unseat long-established franchises like Battlefield and Call of Duty. Sony itself is so scared, they will have to release Planetside 2 in an unfinished, barely-playable state before DUST launches, in the vain hope of locking in a few players before they discover this soon-to-be instant classic.

If DUST succeeds in dominating the market, other studios will simply cease to make FPS games. There will be no more funding for this kind of game, because investors will only want to support the obvious market leader. There will be no choice, no variety any more. No WWII shooters, no Borderlands sequels, no Tribes: Ascend. Probably even third-person shooters will suffer.

This could be disaster for an entire, beloved genre, and you think we should not be afraid???

Coeus Enderas
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.07 03:55:00 - [3]
 

the problem i think most EVE players have is that it will only be on the PS3, which is probably the lest popular current gen system.

if they had it on the 360 and PC as well, i don't think people would care as much

Morgaine Mighthammer
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:01:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Coeus Enderas
the problem i think most EVE players have is that it will only be on the PS3, which is probably the lest popular current gen system.

if they had it on the 360 and PC as well, i don't think people would care as much


this, i personally was ****ed when they said it was gonna be console only as i mainly play on my desktop, but i kept hope alive since i have a 360. now i'm primarily ****ed at them for being so short sided when it comes to their player base, as a lot more of us would be for it if it was on pc aswell.

Lord XSiV
Amarr
Kodar Innovations
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:07:00 - [5]
 

Why would the Eve playerbase be scared of it? After all, the only reason ccp is developing dust is so they can sell out. No one wants to buy a one trick pony in the gaming industry....

And besides, FPS titles using a third party engine only take about 6 months to complete, so the 2+ years ccp has already wasted on dust just indicate that it is indeed incompetant and most likely will run Eve further into the ground to the point where it will be picked up by another entity for a bargain.

As for impacting Eve, well the reality is that FPS players have the attention span of gnats so anyone giving the lifespan of the game longer than 3 months is surely dellusional.


Albetta
Gallente
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:10:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Lord XSiV
Why would the Eve playerbase be scared of it? After all, the only reason ccp is developing dust is so they can sell out. No one wants to buy a one trick pony in the gaming industry....

And besides, FPS titles using a third party engine only take about 6 months to complete, so the 2+ years ccp has already wasted on dust just indicate that it is indeed incompetant and most likely will run Eve further into the ground to the point where it will be picked up by another entity for a bargain.

As for impacting Eve, well the reality is that FPS players have the attention span of gnats so anyone giving the lifespan of the game longer than 3 months is surely dellusional.





Or the two years they have spent on it indicates it will be very, very good, and not a cookie cutter FPS. I hope.

Devai Starchild
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:30:00 - [7]
 

Unfortunately Dust is going to be a flop and I will tell you why:

1. There is too much competition in the genre from already established titles. Battlefield, Halo, Call of Duty, Medal of Honor are all established FPS franchises. In order to do that they will need to establish interest for a wide variety of players. That leads us to...

2. It is catering to a very small niche, that being EVE players that own a PS2. Honestly, besides that, PC players of EVE don't care about DUST and FPS players on the PS2 don't care about EVE. They are trying to bridge two unrelated and niche groups. So your actions on the game are going to affect EVE? Who gives a **** if you don't play EVE?

3. It is limited to one console. Bad decision. You will not be able to compete with established franchises that are already across all 3 consoles by keeping yourself to one system.

4. It will rely on real money for upgrades. Players of FPSs are know the importance of balance and hold it even closer than EVE players. While EVE has a focus on PVP, in FPS it is ALL pvp.

Mitauchi
NOMAD.
Warped Aggression
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:30:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Morgaine Mighthammer
Originally by: Coeus Enderas
the problem i think most EVE players have is that it will only be on the PS3, which is probably the lest popular current gen system.

if they had it on the 360 and PC as well, i don't think people would care as much


this, i personally was ****ed when they said it was gonna be console only as i mainly play on my desktop, but i kept hope alive since i have a 360. now i'm primarily ****ed at them for being so short sided when it comes to their player base, as a lot more of us would be for it if it was on pc aswell.


I think that CCP orginally wanted it on both consoles but Microsofts policies prevented the 360 from getting the game. Sony has allowed CCP the ability to pipe the game to their network from their own servers, whereas Microsoft has different rules which not allow such a thing to occur. As for PC I believe DUST will eventually find its way there. Notice they keep saying that it is an exculsive release but refuse to answer when asked if it will ever be available for any other platform. Besides with Dust natively allowing Mircotransactions for weapons and vehicles, even if it were on the PC most Eve players would just emo about that as well.

Brooks Puuntai
Minmatar
Nomadic Asylum
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:34:00 - [9]
 

Why would I be scared of a fail at launch FPS?

The only reason I was ****ed when I heard about Dust, was the fact that CCP was wasting time and money on it. Time and money that could be put to better use either on Eve or another game(WoD maybe?) that has a better chance of success in the market. The FPS market is heavily saturated and most FPS games have a short shelf life. Added to the fact that CCP is very unknown in the console/FPS market. Dust is nothing unique within itself its just another futuristic shooter which are a dime a dozen. The link between Eve has been their main selling point, which is not going to be enough to save it. The PS3 exclusive announcement means that CCP can no longer rely on its dedicated player base from Eve to help promote/help the games success.

Lord XSiV
Amarr
Kodar Innovations
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:37:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Mitauchi
Originally by: Morgaine Mighthammer
Originally by: Coeus Enderas
the problem i think most EVE players have is that it will only be on the PS3, which is probably the lest popular current gen system.

if they had it on the 360 and PC as well, i don't think people would care as much


this, i personally was ****ed when they said it was gonna be console only as i mainly play on my desktop, but i kept hope alive since i have a 360. now i'm primarily ****ed at them for being so short sided when it comes to their player base, as a lot more of us would be for it if it was on pc aswell.


I think that CCP orginally wanted it on both consoles but Microsofts policies prevented the 360 from getting the game. Sony has allowed CCP the ability to pipe the game to their network from their own servers, whereas Microsoft has different rules which not allow such a thing to occur. As for PC I believe DUST will eventually find its way there. Notice they keep saying that it is an exculsive release but refuse to answer when asked if it will ever be available for any other platform. Besides with Dust natively allowing Mircotransactions for weapons and vehicles, even if it were on the PC most Eve players would just emo about that as well.


This is actually incorrect. All ccp had to do was talk to MS which they failed to even bother to consider. The reason for that was Sony dangling the 'well we may talk to you about purchasing your little company if you do something, like say make your FPS exclusive to us' line and ccp bit it hook, line and sinker....

ccp is in deep trying to sell - they blew it on 'incarna'; their FPS is far behind schedule and bleeding like no tomorrow. Then you toss in their 'vapourware' emo vampire game which is going to be bested by a competitor rather shortly and you have a recipe for disaster.


Devai Starchild
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:39:00 - [11]
 

That doesn't explain why they don't release it on the PC, though.

I'd prob actually buy and play it if that were so.

Ayieka
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:53:00 - [12]
 

its releasing on ps3 so it can be available to a different audience.

and i for one (plus my friends who arent much into eve) am pumped for dust.

Mitauchi
NOMAD.
Warped Aggression
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:57:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Devai Starchild
Unfortunately Dust is going to be a flop and I will tell you why:

1. There is too much competition in the genre from already established titles. Battlefield, Halo, Call of Duty, Medal of Honor are all established FPS franchises. In order to do that they will need to establish interest for a wide variety of players. That leads us to...



CCP has stated that DUST will offer the following items that other FPSs such as the ones you named do not:

-A persistant world meaning that it is not just about playing the same board over and over. This is something many FPS players have wanted for a long time.

-A increased level of complexity. Sure some will stay and prefer COD, BF games etc, but many more experienced players who aren't 12 years old will be drawn to this type of game. The other games you fight for stats whereas here you will fight of territory and ISK. You have corps, politics and real game mechanics that have supporting mechanics in the game itself, I do not see that in any of these other mentions games.

Originally by: Devai Starchild

2. It is catering to a very small niche, that being EVE players that own a PS2. Honestly, besides that, PC players of EVE don't care about DUST and FPS players on the PS2 don't care about EVE. They are trying to bridge two unrelated and niche groups. So your actions on the game are going to affect EVE? Who gives a **** if you don't play EVE?


Whole fan sites of players actively following the game would probably dispute that game. Besides you don't need a million subs to make the game a success. Eve itself doesn't have that many subs when comparing to other MMOs and would probably fall under the niche category. Not sure they were lobby Eve players as the primary group anyways TBH. There are people interested in this type of FPS if they execute it right is the key. As for people not caring if they impact Eve? Do you seriously think an FPS player doesn't care if his winning a match potential impacts something other than his leader board? I think you do not give REAL FPS players enough credit there. Just as much as Eve players love to grief just for fun, players in FPS they get tangible rewards or just tears from players in Eve through winning is just as satisfying. Trust that.

Originally by: Devai Starchild

3. It is limited to one console. Bad decision. You will not be able to compete with established franchises that are already across all 3 consoles by keeping yourself to one system.



Microsoft I believe help with that decision through their own policies of not allowing their gaming companies to fully control their products. CCP went with who accomadated them the best and allow them to keep the game on their servers. And again I will mention they neve said it would never be on PC just an exculsive PS3 release. Other games with the same wording have gone on to being fully available on PC as well.

Originally by: Devai Starchild

4. It will rely on real money for upgrades. Players of FPSs are know the importance of balance and hold it even closer than EVE players. While EVE has a focus on PVP, in FPS it is ALL pvp.


CCP Shadow has assured me that you will be able to buy everything in the game through grinding ISK in the just as you do in Eve. The transaction are just like the one in Eve now IMO. You buy PLEX or GTCs in EVE and turn that into ISK which then becomes new toys for use in game.

Brooks Puuntai
Minmatar
Nomadic Asylum
Posted - 2011.08.07 04:59:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Lord XSiV

This is actually incorrect. All ccp had to do was talk to MS which they failed to even bother to consider. The reason for that was Sony dangling the 'well we may talk to you about purchasing your little company if you do something, like say make your FPS exclusive to us' line and ccp bit it hook, line and sinker....

ccp is in deep trying to sell - they blew it on 'incarna'; their FPS is far behind schedule and bleeding like no tomorrow. Then you toss in their 'vapourware' emo vampire game which is going to be bested by a competitor rather shortly and you have a recipe for disaster.




As much as I love to bash CCP for their **** dicission making, I will say your reply is false and full of ignorance.

For one MS is horrible when it comes to negotiating with companies. CCP would have no chance convincing MS to allow them to run things the way they planned. However this does not excuse CCP from not making a PC version as well.

While the possibility of Sony trying to buy out CCP is there, it is highly doubtful that the Dusts exclusive offer was a bargaining chip to do so. As stated above with the complications with dealing with MS and then no PC version for whatever reason(exploits, hacks, etc) means that the PS3 exclusive was the smartest idea. Mainly because once development hits a certain point Sony will jump in and take over the finishing financial costs and handle its release.

As far as the WoD its only been in development for less then 2 years. Which isn't that long when it comes to a custom built engine and a MMO. So it has not hit vaporware status yet and at least from the setting they are basing it off of is far from "emo" style like twilight. Though I don't put much stock into CCP keeping their word on that. Even still WoD actually has a higher chance of success then Dust, at least when it comes to long term.

Mitauchi
NOMAD.
Warped Aggression
Posted - 2011.08.07 05:00:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Brooks Puuntai
Why would I be scared of a fail at launch FPS?

Dust is nothing unique within itself its just another futuristic shooter which are a dime a dozen.


Really? Have you actually even looked at any of the limited information about the game? Didn't think so.

Oberine Noriepa
Posted - 2011.08.07 05:06:00 - [16]
 

A light point to suspect for the lack of a PC version is that CCP signed some sort of temporary exclusivity deal. If that's the case, then we might see an announcement for a PC version six months after the PS3 version releases. I have a feeling this exclusivity may entirely be CCP's decision, however, as they've strongly stated that they want a completely new audience for Dust 514.

I'm looking forward to Dust a lot. I made a thread for it on NeoGAF that has a lot of information.

Coeus Enderas
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.07 05:09:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Mitauchi
Originally by: Brooks Puuntai
Why would I be scared of a fail at launch FPS?

Dust is nothing unique within itself its just another futuristic shooter which are a dime a dozen.


Really? Have you actually even looked at any of the limited information about the game? Didn't think so.


the key word being LIMITED. i could hype up a game about barney with guns if i released limited information

Mitauchi
NOMAD.
Warped Aggression
Posted - 2011.08.07 05:21:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Coeus Enderas
Originally by: Mitauchi
Originally by: Brooks Puuntai
Why would I be scared of a fail at launch FPS?

Dust is nothing unique within itself its just another futuristic shooter which are a dime a dozen.


Really? Have you actually even looked at any of the limited information about the game? Didn't think so.


the key word being LIMITED. i could hype up a game about barney with guns if i released limited information


Ya they really need to release more info and perhaps get the potential players involved with the discussion. You would think they would at least feed some info about the actually gameplay each month.

Noir Nana
Amarr
Noir Advesaries
Posted - 2011.08.07 05:24:00 - [19]
 

I believe one of the problems with Dust 514 is that it is using the money and development time from EVE Online, when those same resources could be used to fix up the many issues with EVE.

Lord XSiV
Amarr
Kodar Innovations
Posted - 2011.08.07 06:18:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Brooks Puuntai
Originally by: Lord XSiV

This is actually incorrect. All ccp had to do was talk to MS which they failed to even bother to consider. The reason for that was Sony dangling the 'well we may talk to you about purchasing your little company if you do something, like say make your FPS exclusive to us' line and ccp bit it hook, line and sinker....

ccp is in deep trying to sell - they blew it on 'incarna'; their FPS is far behind schedule and bleeding like no tomorrow. Then you toss in their 'vapourware' emo vampire game which is going to be bested by a competitor rather shortly and you have a recipe for disaster.




As much as I love to bash CCP for their **** dicission making, I will say your reply is false and full of ignorance.

For one MS is horrible when it comes to negotiating with companies. CCP would have no chance convincing MS to allow them to run things the way they planned. However this does not excuse CCP from not making a PC version as well.

While the possibility of Sony trying to buy out CCP is there, it is highly doubtful that the Dusts exclusive offer was a bargaining chip to do so. As stated above with the complications with dealing with MS and then no PC version for whatever reason(exploits, hacks, etc) means that the PS3 exclusive was the smartest idea. Mainly because once development hits a certain point Sony will jump in and take over the finishing financial costs and handle its release.

As far as the WoD its only been in development for less then 2 years. Which isn't that long when it comes to a custom built engine and a MMO. So it has not hit vaporware status yet and at least from the setting they are basing it off of is far from "emo" style like twilight. Though I don't put much stock into CCP keeping their word on that. Even still WoD actually has a higher chance of success then Dust, at least when it comes to long term.


You should consult a dictionary for the definition of the word ignorance as you are using it incorrectly.

Let's just say that once you either work for any of the aforementioned entities in a significant capacity then you would be entitled to provide some input. Until then you are just guessing, truly ignorant or just a dumb troll. I guess you could also be all of them as well.

ccp is trying to sell to Sony. It is no big secret in the industry that ccp has been trying to sell for a number of years now. They should have taken advantage of Bioware's offer when they had the chance; now they are going to be ground up begging for Sony to give them a fraction of what their valuation used to be before they made some horrible management decisions.

Too be honest, I think it is quite comical. Especially since ccp is fairly stupid when it comes to areas, such as m&a, where it has no expertise in and think that they can 'figure it out as they go along'.....


Mitauchi
NOMAD.
Warped Aggression
Posted - 2011.08.07 06:53:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: Mitauchi on 07/08/2011 06:55:30
Originally by: Lord XSiV
Originally by: Brooks Puuntai
Originally by: Lord XSiV

This is actually incorrect. All ccp had to do was talk to MS which they failed to even bother to consider. The reason for that was Sony dangling the 'well we may talk to you about purchasing your little company if you do something, like say make your FPS exclusive to us' line and ccp bit it hook, line and sinker....

ccp is in deep trying to sell - they blew it on 'incarna'; their FPS is far behind schedule and bleeding like no tomorrow. Then you toss in their 'vapourware' emo vampire game which is going to be bested by a competitor rather shortly and you have a recipe for disaster.




Trolls will troll. Selling to Sony? Let the accusations fly boyz!!! I love EMO rage in this game. I hate to love Eve or is it love to hate? trololololol ANyone got anything on topic? :)
As much as I love to bash CCP for their **** dicission making, I will say your reply is false and full of ignorance.

For one MS is horrible when it comes to negotiating with companies. CCP would have no chance convincing MS to allow them to run things the way they planned. However this does not excuse CCP from not making a PC version as well.

While the possibility of Sony trying to buy out CCP is there, it is highly doubtful that the Dusts exclusive offer was a bargaining chip to do so. As stated above with the complications with dealing with MS and then no PC version for whatever reason(exploits, hacks, etc) means that the PS3 exclusive was the smartest idea. Mainly because once development hits a certain point Sony will jump in and take over the finishing financial costs and handle its release.

As far as the WoD its only been in development for less then 2 years. Which isn't that long when it comes to a custom built engine and a MMO. So it has not hit vaporware status yet and at least from the setting they are basing it off of is far from "emo" style like twilight. Though I don't put much stock into CCP keeping their word on that. Even still WoD actually has a higher chance of success then Dust, at least when it comes to long term.


You should consult a dictionary for the definition of the word ignorance as you are using it incorrectly.

Let's just say that once you either work for any of the aforementioned entities in a significant capacity then you would be entitled to provide some input. Until then you are just guessing, truly ignorant or just a dumb troll. I guess you could also be all of them as well.

ccp is trying to sell to Sony. It is no big secret in the industry that ccp has been trying to sell for a number of years now. They should have taken advantage of Bioware's offer when they had the chance; now they are going to be ground up begging for Sony to give them a fraction of what their valuation used to be before they made some horrible management decisions.

Too be honest, I think it is quite comical. Especially since ccp is fairly stupid when it comes to areas, such as m&a, where it has no expertise in and think that they can 'figure it out as they go along'.....





Troll detected.. Anyone got anything constructive to say to redirect the convo or we just continuing to build the trololololol bridge here :)

mkint
Posted - 2011.08.07 06:56:00 - [22]
 

Let's do some hypotheticals...

hypothetically:
CCP opens up information and actually tells us all about dust before it launches, and asks for feedback.
Most likely result:
Players recognize serious fundamental flaws in CCP's game design (and face it, it's pretty safe to say that the Dust launch will be bad. Miserably bad. All-time low PCU bad.)
Most likely response:
CCP, blackwalls all the feedback, sticks their fingers in their ears and goes "la la la la". Dust launches without any beta testing and so buggy it is barely playable.
Most likely result:
With the poor launch quality, Dust activity is abysmally low. The public outcry, criticisms, and bad media forces CCP to issue a public apology, have an emergency meeting with the CSM. They make some miniscule changes to mask (not fix) the bugs involved, and the game is playable but all the copies in stores are already in the bargain bin. CCP makes some change to EVE to make Dust mandatory. If you want to succeed in some activity (say sov warfare) your alliance will be forced to buy PS3s, Dust, and about $300 per person in MT. There will not be enough real Dusters to fill the mandatory quota.

That end is inevitable. It is the way CCP does business. Trying to give feedback (even though none was even asked for, and there is no information on which to give feedback), or even giving feature ideas is a waste of time. CCP is going to do it their way, and it is going to go on record as one of the worst failures in gaming history. No amount of feedback and warning to CCP will make any bit of difference.

Brooks Puuntai
Minmatar
Nomadic Asylum
Posted - 2011.08.07 07:01:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Lord XSiV


You should consult a dictionary for the definition of the word ignorance as you are using it incorrectly.

Let's just say that once you either work for any of the aforementioned entities in a significant capacity then you would be entitled to provide some input. Until then you are just guessing, truly ignorant or just a dumb troll. I guess you could also be all of them as well.

ccp is trying to sell to Sony. It is no big secret in the industry that ccp has been trying to sell for a number of years now. They should have taken advantage of Bioware's offer when they had the chance; now they are going to be ground up begging for Sony to give them a fraction of what their valuation used to be before they made some horrible management decisions.

Too be honest, I think it is quite comical. Especially since ccp is fairly stupid when it comes to areas, such as m&a, where it has no expertise in and think that they can 'figure it out as they go along'.....




Curious on what your experience is. Or better yet what information/proof do you have that CCP has been gearing up for a buyout? Just because CCP did the path of least resistance when it comes to the PS3 Exclusive offer doesn't mean they want to be bought out by Sony.

You show no facts yet make blatant accusations based off of rumors.

handige harrie
Posted - 2011.08.07 09:21:00 - [24]
 

I would love to see the whole weapon/armour and vehicle thing being run like EvE. You can buy Plex to sell for isk [or just grind/transfer isk from EvE] and EvE gets Blueprints for every weapon (and ammo) in Dust, so if you want a weapon, you have to purchase it on the market.

Keep the prices a bit lifelike, so a weapon can cost anywere between 150 and 50000 isk, but if you want big toys like a tank, it'll cost you a good couple of million. This way anyone can buy cheapish weapons and ammo to do pew pew, but big toys, are still for big boys, or a lot of smaller boys.

Anya Ohaya
Posted - 2011.08.07 09:33:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Coeus Enderas
the problem i think most EVE players have is that it will only be on the PS3, which is probably the system I don't own.

if they had it on the 360 and PC as well, i don't think I would care as much


Fixed that for you.

Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
Posted - 2011.08.07 09:47:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: handige harrie
I would love to see the whole weapon/armour and vehicle thing being run like EvE. You can buy Plex to sell for isk [or just grind/transfer isk from EvE] and EvE gets Blueprints for every weapon (and ammo) in Dust, so if you want a weapon, you have to purchase it on the market.


I bet that's a goal, but no way it's launching without all items being vended by NPCs.

BLACK-STAR
Posted - 2011.08.07 09:51:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Emperor Cheney
I bet that's a goal, but no way it's launching without all items being vended by NPCs.
this would flop the dust market. if CCP wants to immerse dust, the markets are going to be completely networked with eve. if ccp doesn't do this, very sad and stupid.

Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
Posted - 2011.08.07 10:05:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: BLACK-STAR
Originally by: Emperor Cheney
I bet that's a goal, but no way it's launching without all items being vended by NPCs.
this would flop the dust market. if CCP wants to immerse dust, the markets are going to be completely networked with eve. if ccp doesn't do this, very sad and stupid.


The basis of Eve's markets are locality. From what we've seen of Dust's gameplay, as described, it is not local. You, the Dust player, can end up pretty much anywhere in short order. I don't see how those two can be integrated without some fundamental changes.

Gameplay wise, on launch, it must be possible for a Dust player to buy items with either ISK or $, or it's going to go down in flames.

Though it was before my time, I understand EVE itself had a robust NPC marketplace on launch as well.

Marchocias
Posted - 2011.08.07 10:26:00 - [29]
 

Edited by: Marchocias on 07/08/2011 10:26:56
I think people are concerned rather than scared... I'm looking forward to it, but I really hope it is done right.

Conceptually I actually like the idea but I'm worried that there is a tradeoff between making the link do something meaningful, and having it break Eve.

The main problem I can see is with the currency and/or any method of directly trading with Dust players:

Either: Having the same currency would be required, assuming there is some direct way of transfering cash, or the realmoney-for-isk situation will not work (as people will buy isk in whichever game is cheaper, and then transfer it).

Or: If there is no transfer of currency, but there is trading of Dust-produced stuff for Eve-produced stuff, then this will be tricky to balance... any stuff which is used in one game (eg small arms used in Dust) but possible to produce in the other (small arms is a commodity in Eve) will have to be cheaper to produce in the other (to make the link in any way meaningful the markets should interact), but not so cheap as to break the market in the game where it is used (small arms should not be so cheap in Eve that we can flood the dust market with them).

AlleyKat
Gallente
The Unwanted.
Posted - 2011.08.07 10:31:00 - [30]
 

The trailer they put together for the Sony conference was awful.

To anyone not playing EVE [which I can only imagine must be their target audience] none of it would have made sense - I think I've commented on this before, but all it needed was explosions and guitars.

The net result is that IGN's 'best of E3' list didn't even mention Dust or CCP, and worst of all the best trailer award was given to new/antiquated Tomb Raider.

You want to impress your target audience CCP? Learn to appeal to them and maybe IGN will start adding you to their important list - instead, they are always going to focus on "super-mega-kill-frenzy IIXIVX".

OT:

No, I don't think we are concerned about Dust, just that if it fails we are going to very very angry at them for wasting X years on something when that money and resources could have been spent on making EVE bigger and better.

EVE is in Dire circumstances right now, we all know it. With a list a mile long on necessary fixes, content, balance, mechanics and general house keeping, the player-base will go utterly ape$hit if Dust fails.

The main thing that makes me not believe it'll be a success is nothing to do with the content, but the fact that CCP cannot afford a global marketing campaign right now.

We've all seen the figures, we know what the balance sheet looks like - and a global FPS launch to be competitive will take siro 25-50 million dollars, money that CCP simply do not have. [Battlefield 3 will have a $100 million marketing budget alone]

It's a bold move, and kudos to them if they manage to have their cake and eat it - but it doesn't land until December 2012, so we will continue this debate until then I imagine.

AK


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