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StuRyan
Posted - 2011.08.12 11:54:00 - [601]
 

Edited by: StuRyan on 12/08/2011 12:02:45
Like many, i am tired of being blobbed.

But everything about 0.0 needs blobs to negate some of the endless time of shooting things.

Even when i was part of the blob i was incredibly board doing it, it then was turned around and we became the victims of blobs....either way its only fun if things are even....

That being said, fun to me is catching the odd ratter, having a even numbered fight,

we dont bother with SOV stuff as it would take far too long - however i'd shoot some module that gives upgrades to a system which has the HP of a BS....for a reaction....
A short term goal such as shooting a system upgrade module which has the HP of a well tanked tech 2 bs.... a mid term goal such as claiming the resources in a system and a long erm goal such as shooting TCU's

I would spend isk on a ship that would deploy a system wide "No Cloak" sphere, or a "Deficit to to warp speed adds extra 15 secs to warp", type module so that there is a chance for conflict.

I'm not sure but i play to kill things - i do not rat becuase i do other things but its very frustrating going out in a gang of 10 to be killed by a gang of 100.....Thats life - but incredbily sole destroying knowing that if you try to get on the good resources you will not be able too.

Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.08.12 19:32:00 - [602]
 

Taking the opportunity of 5 free days of forum whoring to say this:

Any sov structures that have a hard number of hit points, will always encourage blobbing with the biggest ships possible in the game.

Your new sov system has to keep scaling in mind completely. From inception to upgrades. A huge force should be able to destroy something faster, but not by much than a much smaller force. Stay the hell away from hard, set in stone numbers. They may make sense the week you code it, but will feel idiotic very quickly after, as number of players and FOTM ships change.

John McCreedy
Caldari
Eve Defence Force
Posted - 2011.08.12 20:47:00 - [603]
 

Originally by: Marlona Sky
Taking the opportunity of 5 free days of forum whoring to say this:

Any sov structures that have a hard number of hit points, will always encourage blobbing with the biggest ships possible in the game.



Well we tried that before 2005 and it resulted in Station Ping Pong.

Evil Afoot
Lunar Tech
Posted - 2011.08.12 21:49:00 - [604]
 


Idea for Sov taking mechanics!!!

An alliance holding sov would have to have multiple TCU's "spread out" & "active" to maintain there grasp on territory.

For an another alliance to take sov they would have to attack ALL the TCU's simultaneously to be able to make it vulnerable. This would encourage fleets to split up an thus smaller fights.

Currently its a case of re-enforcing with a huge fleet then moving to the next structure to shoot when the timer says so.

Not saying this is a good idea but it would reduce the blob.




Foraminifera
Posted - 2011.08.12 21:55:00 - [605]
 

Originally by: Mioelnir


Supercaps: While I am biased as the owner of half a supercarrier (or a full Hel in this case), I do not think supercaps can ever be truly balanced in a rock/paper/scissors/lizard/spock fashion. From the background alone, they will either not live up to them at all and be close to worthless from a game tactics standpoint (leaving players disappointed), or they will pronounce their arrival on the battlefield in confident, bold letters. The last set of changes made supercap use explode, yes. But only because it stagnated for years. As players got older, numbers should have continually increased but did not.
The only people that got into them were basically doing it for the looks and the fluff (kind of similar to the reasons behind my Hel). So right now, we are seeing a big rebound to what the numbers should have been all along, meaning we should not overreact.

But, there are certainly tweaks that could and/or need to be made. Personally, I always find it incredible that you put a generic module on a frigate, and *boom* instant wormhole big enough for 250 Titans. Orly?! Often proposed is powering the jump drives up, but I think that is the right idea on the wrong side of the equation. Not the source should need to power up, but the target - the cyno.

So why not introduce a third cyno harmonic for supers, activated not by a feeble module, but a ship (event horizon style)?
This ship powers up and creates a cyno that needs cap with mechanics similar to w-space wormholes. Upon activation, and on its own cap, it can't sustain a cyno worth anything but could eventually be enough for one supercarrier if it survives long enough to increase its mass limit sufficiently. Now, if you want to move 40 supercarriers through it, you need to power it up. Feed it cap. Protect it. You need to run it for 7 minutes and constantly pump the output of 8-10 large energy transfer array IIs into it, to swell it to sufficient levels. You need an actual fleet protecting it, defending it, summoning the might of your fleet onto the battlefield. It is hard. It should be hard.
And if you succeed, it does have an impact. Your enemies' counter escalation is not instant either but needs to go through the same, and you can disrupt them like they tried to disrupt you. It is also a lot harder to have an escape cyno in place, so if you actually run into a trap, there is only fight and no flight.

Cyno Harmonic 1 (regular cyno): Dread, Carrier, JFreighter, Rorqual, BlackOps, Titan bridge
Cyno Harmonic 2 (covert cyno): BlackOps
Cyno Harmonic 3 (cyno ship): Supercarrier, Titan itself



Unless of course you are attacking a well populated enemy system, which you eventually have to do, they have 5 titans sitting there and 20 supercarriers. You will never be able to attack them, as no Cyno will ever hold long enough. This would favor an defender way too much. Now if cynos were the only way for caps to travel however, even in systems, it might work.

Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.08.12 22:20:00 - [606]
 

Originally by: John McCreedy
Originally by: Marlona Sky
Taking the opportunity of 5 free days of forum whoring to say this:

Any sov structures that have a hard number of hit points, will always encourage blobbing with the biggest ships possible in the game.



Well we tried that before 2005 and it resulted in Station Ping Pong.


Not sure what you are saying really. I remember station ping pong. That is nothing like what I am saying it should be.

The Racketeer
Posted - 2011.08.13 05:20:00 - [607]
 

Edited by: The Racketeer on 13/08/2011 06:44:24
Edited by: The Racketeer on 13/08/2011 06:39:27
WOW...

WOW...

CCP is unhappy with nullsec...

WOW...

Your membership that plays in that particular sandbox have been unhappy with it since DOMINION!!!! We have only been filling these forums with epic threadnoghts about it for how long???

"EVE Online: Dominion on PC was released on Tuesday 01 December 2009."

Yea thats a long F'in time.

Many of the null sec pilots that lived in 0.0 pre-Dominion would happily go back to November 30th 2009 if they could...
>Back when ships were balanced.
>Back when owning SOV in a few systems could be done with an alliance of 1k players and did not require the need to join a Coalition of 30k other players to keep space.
>Back when 100 ships on the field of battle could not prevent 500-600 other pilots from having fun and having a chance in hell of defend their space.

Null sec is BEYOND broken... At this point, the minuscule number of benefits you get from living in null sec comes no where near the hassle that comes with it. Today, you have many ways to do PvP that do not require owning SOV and its preferred for most of the older PvPers then not. You have tons of ways to make more ISK that does not require SOV or even being located in 0.0. Outside of Super **** building and high end moon goop, industry can be done from High/Low sec without the need for SOV.

The risk vers reward for many of the 0.0 pilots have dropped to a point where it is not worth it. Some have left 0.0 entirely and gone to other regions of EvE. Still more have chose to move to a lower class B (pet) or C (renter) alliance where the risk is lower because little or no PvP is expected of them. Over time the coalitions got bigger and the chances for good PvP got fewer and further between. The last major changes in SOV happened with the almost sole use of a super capital fleet. Only a handful of systems were taken but once they were 3 regions full of players (around 20k players) ended up evacuating 0.0 because they could not find a way to defend it based on the imbalance CCP crated in super capitals. Now a similarly sized super capital fleet is in the process of removing an even larger Coalition off the map. But CCP thought null sec was fine and continued to keep DEVs cranking out Barbie online...


CCP needs to go to its membership to define goals this patch should meet and brainstorm some sensible ways to fix the issues. Stop relying on the out of touch Dev department you have that have been screwing over null for the last year or so.


John Maynard Keynes
Posted - 2011.08.13 09:37:00 - [608]
 

Edited by: John Maynard Keynes on 13/08/2011 10:02:34
Originally by: CCP Soundwave
Originally by: VaL Iscariot
"Nullsec features and content should always remind players why they left safe space, and never make them think about going back"

Was this considered when you applied the Nerf-Bat to half of null sec with the whole system security thing? No Havens or Sanctums in any system with a security above -.25? A few losses in and I was broke with no real income source beyond my market toon. That only goes so far, as one needs gold to breed gold. I made decent isk running the forsaken sites because they have a high chance to spawn a faction rat, but it didn't take long for others to realize this too and my income stream was terminated. Thus I went back to high sec/low sec to grind missions, and run tasty Radar sites. That was 6 months ago, and have I've not even considered going 'back' to null sec: The Land of Boredom. Go team.


Nullsec isn't guaranteed to make everyone happy. If you like empire better, that's life.


I do understand the reasoning behind the Nullsec income nerf, but to nerf null sec income below high destroys the risk reward system. Increase the risk isteas (remove local or something) or create really difficult "sanctums" which require teamwork (like sansha sites. Alternatively, buff the industry in 0.0...

..................

some thoughts...

Change some mechanics in somthing like...

1)To get sov for a constellation one has to coquer several strategic targets within this constellation located in different systems. Each of this strategic targets(kind of stations) gives special bonuses to the owner of the constellation (like cyno jamming).
Mechanics:
- Onlythe first Rfed target in the constellation gets a timer.. after that all other strategic target can be conquered without a timer.
- THe attacker has to conquer all of them without losing a single one. A soon as the defender manages to conquer one of them back all other targets go into RF mode for 24h and the attackr has to start from the scratch...

2) Make cynos more like WHs... Limit the mass of ships that can get through...


Those are just ideas...


MidnightWyvern
Posted - 2011.08.13 17:22:00 - [609]
 

Originally by: Louis deGuerre
Edited by: Louis deGuerre on 03/08/2011 15:18:41

I hope you pass the points about 'mandatory chores that players hate' on to the PI team Evil or Very Mad

Looks like you agree with many of the actual players on what the 0.0 experience should be like.

You want the solution to your isk problems and stationary alliances that gobble up all the good stuff ?
Make moon goo resources dynamic, being able to be mined into exhaustion, and 'new deposits' appearing on random moons.
Then alliances actually have a reason to move around on the map and fight.
Same for system truesec. When it is being ratted to death, the security should quickly start to approach 0.0.
Meanhwile 'empty' systems should get more 'lawless'/pirate infested and thus their 0.0 should drop towards -1.0.
This has the added advantage of spreading out players more and making life harder for botters and AFK cloakers, and easier for new alliances to get some good space and maybe even a good moon for a little while.

Yeah I know, I'm a genuis Razz



I wholeheartedly second this one. Obviously speculation is far easier than implementation, but a restructuring like this one would enhance the 0.0 experience significantly.

Infinion
Caldari
Awesome Corp
Posted - 2011.08.13 19:02:00 - [610]
 

Originally by: CCP Greyscale


Originally by: Rainus Max

Anywho, you need to remember that 0.0 isn't 100% about teamwork, there are people out there that want to run the odd plex or mine a belt solo. Whilst I like the idea of introducing incursion like plexes for 'small gang' ratting I also want the opportunity to run one on my own and keep all the goodies for myself. Perhaps bring back the old keycard system used for the old DED sites and only permit one ship to enter - but allow the gate to be hacked with a codebreaker.


Very much agree with this, we always need solo content available in nullsec. (This is mentioned in the next blog IIRC.)

And yes, starbases need work. Also, we're resurrecting fuel pellets again, because yesterday someone came up with a face-punchingly simple solution to the big implementational problem that was holding us back. Seriously, I wanted to hit myself, it was so obvious.



Wormhole space is all about teamwork to make money off of sleepers in dangerous and deadly classed wormholes, but there are days where the system you are living in has no static to a low-class wormhole and there aren't enough people to fight with the required numbers in yours. Can't there be solo-able encounter sites that require little effort to find, and minimal rewards just to fight boredom when theres absolutely nothing else to do? The reason why people abandon wormhole space is due to inactivity from players not logging in, and they don't log in because they can't do anything and would rather play another game than to spin their ship.

tl;dr can you give players in isolated space something they can do by themselves at all times so they stay active, online, and willing to endure isolation in a teamwork-exclusive environment

Dragonia Redtail
Posted - 2011.08.13 20:25:00 - [611]
 

The Jita problem,
Solving this problem can be verry simple. All you realy need to do is place a tax system on the item sold, multiplied by the amount of items sold vs the price / base price of the item.

So the more of the same people offer to sell, the more tax CCP will assup on the marketprice of the item. That stops supermarkets.

No, its not something i want, but it does solve a few issues in the game like the ever dropping of mineral prices, the overfull systems, the station ganking games, sales only work in jita and nowhere else bec noone buys there etc.

0.0 has a few problems, and that requires a few solutions too.
Acces to 0.0 is constantly gatecamped. Wich means you need to jump over, cloak under, or outfleet them to get in on most entries. This can be sorted by having random " wormhole acces routes that allow small pvp gangs to find and use them too.

The BLOB`s conquer all and contorll the market. Yeah kinda feels like real life, do you want to destroy that? Maybe it is more worth of npc raids as well as normal raids to their systems to make sure they know they need to protect their home as well as blobfest...

Bigger is better.. Where have i seen that before, its not always true. Sure big ships do big DPS.. Send a fleet of frigates trough a dreadnought fleet, and encounter who has a problem... Balancing this out is a delicate problem. Instaid of restructuring the system EVE uses, why not make it smarter?

IG like the more space controled in EVE (not alliance) the more difficult it get to control systems of that race. The harder the NPC ships will fight back for their lands.. Incursions might be a valuable option to takedown the ever expanding force of Players VS players and the big blobfests.

The same goes for an option of like 2 or 3 alliances to hold a flag on one station if they want this to overconquerer their attackers...

Its just some idea`s, but who knows what you can think of beside the box..

After all, life is a sandbox, but that doesnt mean you can not drag in knowledge from outside the box as well as tools, to make your game more interesting.

Nikuno
Posted - 2011.08.14 07:37:00 - [612]
 

Hopefully CCP's still checking this thread, so here's my 2 cents worth.

When capital ships and then supercapital ships came out CCP threw away the big guiding principle of Eve which is that for everything you bring there's going to be a counter. For capital ships the counter has only ever been to bring more and yet the sci-fi genre is full of examples of the bigger you get in ship size the easier it becomes for small ships to get through your defences. This was partly written into the idea of fighters - a small npc piloted ship under your control rather than the AI drone we were used to. So why did CCP miss the opprtunity to either create something new for players to fly that worked this way, or to re-role an existing ship type? Why not take one of the assault frigates for example and give it the 4th (missing) bonus in the form of a massive damage multiplier against capital size ships? Say 100% per level. Suddenly I can go out on a roam in a frig fleet and be able to function at all levels. It closes the circle between capitals and sub capitals. It's still vulnerable to a wide range of counters itself, yet it now has functionality that stretches beyond it's current rather underused position.

Just a thought.

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2011.08.14 09:23:00 - [613]
 

Originally by: CCP Greyscale


We generally want players to claim space, settle down, develop it etc, and if doing so means their space becomes worthless, what's the point?


Sorry to pull this quote out of context Greyscale - but I think what you describe here goes to the fundamental core of null sec. i.e the claiming of space and why we should wish to do so and how.

I think the "whys" and "hows" are separate here. Why should we claim space? Its is purely for wealth (ISK)? Or shouldnt we be looking at enabling players to build, for want of a better term, societies. Those who have within that given region of space their own ethos, culture, LAWS that are applicable.

This would naturally lead to different means of 'claiming' null sec. Could one 'claim' dominion over a region of space through industrial might? The vote of the masses? Those are the 'cans' I think you should be looking for - rather than the 'musts'.

C.

Dragonzchilde
Minmatar
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2011.08.14 13:44:00 - [614]
 

CCp has since long forgotten what 0.0 is like, the influence of the fail CSM is clearly present in current 0.0

0.0 need to be raw, harsh and hard. No room for error is to be left

1. remove all jump bridges: 0.0 didn't use to have them and it was fine, now it seems like all the ******s in eve can't move 2 jumps since their introduction

2. bring back AoE doomsdays to counter the massive blobs running around

3. pos guns where moved outside pos shields so small groups could kill them ... err right

4. you need to change your probing mechanics so that sniping becomes a valid pvp style again. right now every sniper fleet can be probed in 5- 8 seconds and killed within minutes after that. Don,t believe us.. try us on the test server

5. stay the **** of the moms, for once they are worth anything in pvp. Funny that you want to change supers when the old NC loses their space and the CSM needs something to turn it back towards their advantage

6. get rid of the CSM as they lack just as much insight in the hardcore place 0.0 is, just like you

7. moon goo needs to get depleted just like ores in RL get depleted.

8. stations need to be destructible, way too many of that crap in 0.0

9. balance your BS/ BC. as it stands today a BC holds just as much power as a BS and it seems BC>BS

10. damps need to be reinstated towards the point where they are usefull again

11. CCP needs to stop nerfing and instead need to boost players to think about tactics that don't involve blobbing

12. fix your hyena, the most useless ship in the game. in other words, fix webs

13. fix your rockets. we have been asking that for like 3 years

14. fix your blasters, we have been asking that for more than 3 years

15. fix your cruise missile so that they can actually kill something


basically undo all the goddamm nerfs since red moon rising. the pvp in this game has gone downhill ever since

pvp used to be an art in eve that involved preparation, cunning and skills. today it just is about bringing the biggest blob.

the reason it is about the biggest blob is because you gave in to the winers and nerfed every possible way to pvp solo or in small groups.

Numerous times we have offered to assist in helping you out in your pvp design, you have declined just as much. Guess where it got youQuestion

We have been around since beta, survived your nerf after nerf after nerf, adapted over and over to show that a small group of 15 players can still do something against major coalitions. Today you left us with only one option which is joining the blob.

you don't need the playerbase to help you out in fixing 0.0, undo all the major crap you introduced since red moon rising and the game will be playable again


Infinion
Caldari
Awesome Corp
Posted - 2011.08.14 17:59:00 - [615]
 

Originally by: Nikuno
Hopefully CCP's still checking this thread, so here's my 2 cents worth.

When capital ships and then supercapital ships came out CCP threw away the big guiding principle of Eve which is that for everything you bring there's going to be a counter. For capital ships the counter has only ever been to bring more and yet the sci-fi genre is full of examples of the bigger you get in ship size the easier it becomes for small ships to get through your defences. This was partly written into the idea of fighters - a small npc piloted ship under your control rather than the AI drone we were used to. So why did CCP miss the opprtunity to either create something new for players to fly that worked this way, or to re-role an existing ship type? Why not take one of the assault frigates for example and give it the 4th (missing) bonus in the form of a massive damage multiplier against capital size ships? Say 100% per level. Suddenly I can go out on a roam in a frig fleet and be able to function at all levels. It closes the circle between capitals and sub capitals. It's still vulnerable to a wide range of counters itself, yet it now has functionality that stretches beyond it's current rather underused position.

Just a thought.


a few years ago CCP mentioned on their drawing board that they wanted to evolve combat and introduce targetable ship subsystems such as engines, sensors, weapons, etc. like in Nexus and at the same time, make ships tougher to destroy if certain subsystems are ignored. I don't know where the idea was lost, but it would be a great counter for subcaps against caps or supercaps

Chris Tukker
Posted - 2011.08.14 18:48:00 - [616]
 

Edited by: Chris Tukker on 14/08/2011 18:50:54
For the local I got an idea.

-To have a local you need to upgrade gate (or planets) at least 3 scan module (for triangulation)
-And you will see in this local only the region covered by the scan module
-give limitation in the number of mod ( size of the system + sov level...)

So if one if destroy you're lost the local, so it can be a new kind of tactics. Also you can conturn the scanning zone if the system is large of if the mods aren't at the right place...

Just an idea, I hope I'm clear , because my english sucks....

Amber Villaneous
Posted - 2011.08.14 19:35:00 - [617]
 

Originally by: CCP Greyscale
We generally want players to claim space, settle down, develop it etc, and if doing so means their space becomes worthless, what's the point?


Seriously? You have the fuggin balls to say that after fugging anoms making the billions invested in the upgrades worthless and removing the main source of income for the average grunt?

Fugg you.

John McCreedy
Caldari
Eve Defence Force
Posted - 2011.08.14 19:40:00 - [618]
 

Originally by: Marlona Sky
Originally by: John McCreedy
Originally by: Marlona Sky
Taking the opportunity of 5 free days of forum whoring to say this:

Any sov structures that have a hard number of hit points, will always encourage blobbing with the biggest ships possible in the game.



Well we tried that before 2005 and it resulted in Station Ping Pong.


Not sure what you are saying really. I remember station ping pong. That is nothing like what I am saying it should be.


I'm saying that if you have something easy to attack due to a lack of HP, some joker is going to come along while you're in bed and you'll wake up to find all your sov has gone meaning you then spend the day retaking it. Reducing structure hit points isn't the cause of blobbing, its the fact that the blob is the easiest, most efficient way of taking sov. Want to stop the blob? Make it so the blob is no longer the easiest, most efficient way of taking sov.

Tuggboat
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.08.14 21:32:00 - [619]
 

Edited by: Tuggboat on 14/08/2011 21:38:16
Originally by: Vincent Athena
Originally by: CCP Soundwave


Nullsec isn't guaranteed to make everyone happy. If you like empire better, that's life.


That is in direct contradiction to:

"# Everyone should be able to see how to get involved

* For a given nullsec feature or activity, any player should be able to figure out a plan that ends with them participating in that activity/feature"

Also there is my situation. Here the issue is I do not get The Rush.

The Rush is a good felling one gets with and after a burst of adrenaline associated with an exciting experience, like PvP combat. Not everyone gets The Rush. Some get no pleasure from adrenaline, and some actually feel bad or sick from it. According to Dr. Drew Pinsky, the difference between these people is genetic. You are born to get The Rush, or you are not. The result is some players will not enjoy PvP and actively seek to avoid it, and no amount of game tweaking will change that, because game tweaking will not change their genes. After all this is a game, people will tend to avoid game activities that make them sick. Instead they do cooperative activities, industry, missions and the like.

If you think I'm alone, check the population level of High Sec huggers. So how do you plan for players like me to "be able to figure out a plan that ends with them participating in that activity/feature" ("that feature" being everything but combat) in null sec where the much dreaded combat could occur at any time?


Vince, you put out some good arguments against the popular framing of people by their geography.

Like myself usually, CCP here put the cart before the horse. They are trying to define a product before defining their customers. Since this thread is about nullsec, null sec dwellers or past dwellers over represent the responses here.

Programmers break down their problems, Project managers define their stakeholders and Good sales people pigeon hole their customers. While CCP is a programming culture, it is the customers they are programming for and the world could be their oyster. Strategic selling starts with identifying buying forces.

While their are a lot of ways to classify people, a lot of psychological profiling work has already been done on developing the four races. So sort them by race you say? While many people hold true to their originally picked race, newer balancing efforts have not always remained parallel enough to the races to keep people from crosstraining.

So look at forum balance to get a clue, or the ships they are actually flying while they try to perform whatever function they are choosing to be involved in? Not bad but we still don't have a simple framework to drop people into so that a proper product can be defined and built for them, all of them.

Not everybody will want to group, not everybody has time to fleetup, some people just don't like other people and other's necessary game functions are too clumsy in a group. How few organized Industrial corps exist compared to PVP corps? Team MArketers? You have to jump into building caps to use groups.

Back to these groups, Theres bee a lot of network analysis on people being done via the social and marketing network apis. Python has some graphing stuff that lends itself to analyzing groups of people also. Saw a fun one in 3d also. The axis are pertinent and interesting. Without going into to much depth they were altruism, fear and passion.

Imagine our new starmap but the stars were as people and they grouped like the constellations and regions. Now simplify that,flatten it into 2d and rescale it like our influence map. Divide that 3d map into 4 quadrants. Now start dropping people into those empty quadrants based on personality type instead of geographical region.

People group or blob because of shared goals or vision or because of shared threat or fear. They isolate out of hopelessness or distrust. The degree to which they do this is governed by their passion a sense of "Eve is Real"

Infinion
Caldari
Awesome Corp
Posted - 2011.08.14 21:37:00 - [620]
 

Originally by: John McCreedy
Originally by: Marlona Sky
Originally by: John McCreedy
Originally by: Marlona Sky
Taking the opportunity of 5 free days of forum whoring to say this:

Any sov structures that have a hard number of hit points, will always encourage blobbing with the biggest ships possible in the game.



Well we tried that before 2005 and it resulted in Station Ping Pong.


Not sure what you are saying really. I remember station ping pong. That is nothing like what I am saying it should be.


I'm saying that if you have something easy to attack due to a lack of HP, some joker is going to come along while you're in bed and you'll wake up to find all your sov has gone meaning you then spend the day retaking it. Reducing structure hit points isn't the cause of blobbing, its the fact that the blob is the easiest, most efficient way of taking sov. Want to stop the blob? Make it so the blob is no longer the easiest, most efficient way of taking sov.


There is no solution to stop blobbing unless restrictions are added, which eve is all about not doing. Doing stuff with a bunch of people will always be more efficient than doing stuff with a few people

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2011.08.14 21:51:00 - [621]
 

Originally by: Infinion


There is no solution to stop blobbing unless restrictions are added, which eve is all about not doing. Doing stuff with a bunch of people will always be more efficient than doing stuff with a few people


That's not correct. The more resources you use to defeat an opponent the more inefficient you are. e.g using 20 titans to kill say one frigate is not an 'efficient' use of those resources. Effective, yes, efficient - not so much.

C.

Fon Revedhort
Monks of War
DarkSide.
Posted - 2011.08.15 05:18:00 - [622]
 

Edited by: Fon Revedhort on 15/08/2011 13:51:29

Alright, few things you need to change in order to make supercaps balanced.

1) Supers are unable to warp. Instead they rely on a brand new cyno made especially for them. Sure thing, this new cyno will actually cost some isk and you won't be able to lit it using a mere frigate. A hull cost of 500 mil is more appropriate.

2) This new cyno may be ever activated only at planets and moons. In this case supercaps become really interesting ships and will be used at appropriate tasks like sov warfare.

3) Both cyno generators are to have the following effects:
- clear and distinct animation which will warn all the players in the vicinity that this given ship is fitted with such a module
- the ship liting a cyno will lose all the locks and will not be able to lock anything while the cyno is on
- no ship can ever jump through a cyno without getting warmed-up first. Sure thing, the bigger the hull is the longer you'll wait. At the very least this timer is to be 30 seconds or a minute for the smallest craft.

4) As supers are no longer allowed to warp around, you can also remove EW-immunity altogether. Either grow a pair and admit that your EW-mechanics is fubar and rewamp it thoroughly or do what I say

5) Supers are not allowed to fit cloaks

6) Make sure supers have to activate a special new gear like siege module of dreads before they are actually of any significant use. This way supercaps will stay committed for a fight just like they should.

7) Finally, there should never be such an fugly thing as Doomsday capable of vaporizing any ship just cause some jerk owning it pressed a button. You should use your current tracking formulas. And like I told, the ship will stay on the battlefield commited for further actions after making such a shot.

I believe those steps combined will result in us getting a game where supercapitals will finaly occupy their role full of dignity. Superweapons have always been vulnerable throughout the whole history of mankind and EVE should never forget it. There's no dignity whatsoever in supercaps being able to fly around like mere bees. No. No way. Instead, your soldiers of lower ranks must protect you and the other personell is to prepare the battlefield for you.

And sure thing after those changes you won't see every Ivan, Pete and Alex saving up for them in a pathetic hope to finally gain the world domination.

And it's also pretty clear that sov mechanics, too, is to be changed along with the ships.

Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.08.15 06:03:00 - [623]
 

Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Originally by: CCP Greyscale
We generally want players to claim space, settle down, develop it etc, and if doing so means their space becomes worthless, what's the point?


Seriously? You have the fuggin balls to say that after fugging anoms making the billions invested in the upgrades worthless and removing the main source of income for the average grunt?

Fugg you.


It was the main source of income BECAUSE it was the best source of income. Why would anyone decide to make less money in a practically zero risk environment?

So FUGG YOU!

"I can't make 100+ million ISK per hour nonstop no matter where in null sec my alliance decided to plop its fat ass in. WWHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!" Crying or Very sad -Null sec bear

Furb Killer
Gallente
Posted - 2011.08.15 11:56:00 - [624]
 

So you think that is fixed by making highsec more profitable than something like 80% of 0.0?

Anyway the only thing that I think will work for 0.0 sov is making it activity based: You get sov if your pilots are active in a system (supplemented by stuff you can have bigger fights over, like stations), but no blobbing a few timers, and then having sov while in the day to day life the system is completely controlled by others.
Then you immediatly got the solution against blobbing: you can blob a system to take it, but you cant keep the blob there forever (well you can, but then you lose all other systems). In other words: if you are 3 times stronger than your opponent you should be able to take three times more space (roughly), but right now you will simply take all their space easily, and defend it even easier.

The problem isnt that you can blob, there shouldnt be game mechanics that prevent you from making friends. The problem is that the only way to get and hold sov currently is by blobbing the crap out of your opponent.

Alexander Yukari
Posted - 2011.08.15 12:43:00 - [625]
 

I see promises of more teamwork related content.
More small scale content.

But there is one thing, does current null-sec inhabitants want this ?

Most of null sec incursions is left untouched, alliances/corporations are happy with them. Free cyno jammers that can`t be taken down.

At this moment there are 3 null-sec incursions, and only one is being taken down, after mobilizing. They could be great way to generate income for whole alliance, but as now they are treated as free cyno jammers.

Someone at start of this thread suggested how to fixing whole sanctum problem "make them like incursion vanguards".

Great idea indeed, 3 logi + 7 dps hulls (hac/t1 bs) can handle vanguards easy. Can still be fitted with point in case of PVP. Hell you can take typical omni/buffer tanked pvp fits to them with logi support. Make sanctums as hard as vanguards but taking more time to complete, to scale with rewards.

If that would happen, I can see lots of tears. Why ? Simple null-sec people want to kill sanctums solo.

Hopefully changes towards small/mid scale gangs will follow with change of mindset of null inhabitants.

Cearain
Caldari
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
Posted - 2011.08.15 13:57:00 - [626]
 

Originally by: CCP Soundwave
Originally by: StarScream Xion
I'm sure I'm not going to be the only person who asks, 'but what about low-sec?'


This release will be about 0.0. What I'd like to do though, is repeat the process we've done for 0.0 on Low-sec, but that would be at a later time.


I'm glad to hear this. Null sec can be a very high maintance game. So people in it should make *reasonably* more money.

I hope the ideals for low sec are that it 1) won't require so much time consuming boring organization/social/political stuff, but 2) have the most frequent small scale pvp action, and 3)have rewards that are fair for the risks taken.

Good luck with your work.

Eliki Morjem
Posted - 2011.08.15 16:11:00 - [627]
 

Well, this is one way to remove ALL the carebears from the game :) All the small corporations will get eaten alive and have no way to recover so they will be gone too or forced into slavery. 6 month old characters with 10 mil skill points forced to share space with 200 mil skill point players that have hundreds of billions of isk... lol it's like throwing kittens out to the wolves and wondering why the kittens aren't having fun lol. Maybe Eve not for the kittens ;)

Hakaru Ishiwara
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2011.08.16 20:00:00 - [628]
 

Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Originally by: CCP Greyscale
We generally want players to claim space, settle down, develop it etc, and if doing so means their space becomes worthless, what's the point?


Seriously? You have the fuggin balls to say that after fugging anoms making the billions invested in the upgrades worthless and removing the main source of income for the average grunt?

Fugg you.
This. Greyscale is a disingenuous ****sucker who can't get the visions of throbbing pork sword shoved down his throat out of his head long enough to muster up a decent null-sec plan.

The manner in which CCP and Greyscale implemented the anomaly nerf (announced right after Fanfest with less than 2 weeks warning before the code went gold) ****ed a whole bunch of smaller entities who had dumped serious ISK into sovereignty infrastructure and upgrades only to see the planned return evaporate.

That was a terrible way to treat customers and generated plenty of ill-will towards CCP and the EVE product.

Kazini Jax
Gallente
Starlight Operations
Starlight Network
Posted - 2011.08.16 21:13:00 - [629]
 

Forest through the trees...

I think you need to look at the whole picture to properly go forward. You need to look at Hi/low/null sec as a whole to get where you want to go.

Ignatius Gnarl
Paladin Order
Fidelas Constans
Posted - 2011.08.17 11:17:00 - [630]
 

Very encouraging. Going from the 'high velocity trajectory of a kitten on amphetamines' as the Mittani put it to actually thinking is a big step forward. I was particularly excited that CCP seem to be pausing to think for two seconds before implementing more 'awesome' things which break the game.

Please can we have less 'stuff' and more interesting ways for the current stuff to interact.


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