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blankseplocked This just hit me hard: EVE's weaponry is over the top
 
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Gibbo5771
Posted - 2011.08.04 16:50:00 - [61]
 

Originally by: Jekyl Eraser
sorry to disapoint you, EMP L is only 0.025 cubic meters. The size of your thumb...


Megan fox thumbs

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.08.04 16:58:00 - [62]
 

Edited by: Tippia on 04/08/2011 16:58:31
Originally by: Gibbo5771
Originally by: Jekyl Eraser
sorry to disapoint you, EMP L is only 0.025 cubic meters. The size of your thumb...
Megan fox thumbs
Not even her thumbs are that deformed… ugh

We're talking about something the size of a small child here.

stoicfaux
Gallente
Posted - 2011.08.04 17:13:00 - [63]
 

Originally by: dexington
Originally by: stoicfaux
Which probably explains why Eve railgun rounds have exotic warheads (e.g. anti-matter) instead of just being a solid slug of nickel that relies on kinetic energy to do damage.


Antimatter does have mass, don't know if it's anything close to tungsten which have been used to test railguns. Add to that that 1kg antimatter releases around the same amount of energy as the largest nuclear bombs tested.


What's your point? =) Anti-matter is pretty powerful stuff, yet Eve also has Lead and Iron railgun rounds, which would imply that anti-matter isn't as uber in Eve as science fiction junkies would assume.

Never mind that the various railgun ammo types, despite all having the same volume and mass, dramatically affect a railgun's range in space and also affect the amount of power necessary to fire the round.

Finally, the coup de grâce is this line from the railgun description: "Railguns use magnetic rails to fire solid chunks of matter at hypersonic speed." Lead is non-magnetic. Anti-matter rounds can't be solid chunks of matter. Hypersonic speeds in space are trivial to achieve.


Eve's physics and technology just plain haven't been thought out. It's less defined than even Star Trek's or Star Wars' writer's-fiat-magic-tech.


E man Industries
Posted - 2011.08.04 17:56:00 - [64]
 

Ammo could use a sabot that is magnetic.

Also maybe we can't shoot 500km simply because the ship would move.
No laser weapons would take time and in that time the ship would move, faster ammo types can hit farther out as they hit near instantly.

lasers range is because that is where they are focused or some other techno babble.

You can shoot farther with skills because you get use to how a ship typically moves.

Be nice if eve had a better sence of scale though. I need to be reminded judt how big a battle ship is.

Jak Silverheart
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.08.04 18:07:00 - [65]
 


Takamori Maruyama
Amarr
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.08.04 18:43:00 - [66]
 

Originally by: Jak Silverheart
Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest son of a ***** in space


Wow I was about to link that haha, nice :3.

*brofist*

Callic Veratar
Posted - 2011.08.04 20:40:00 - [67]
 

I'm a little surprised that nobody brought up warp speed yet:

The slowest warpers are the frieghters are 0.75AU/s.

Using a little math that's equivalent to about 374c.

E man Industries
Posted - 2011.08.04 20:44:00 - [68]
 

Originally by: Callic Veratar
I'm a little surprised that nobody brought up warp speed yet:

The slowest warpers are the frieghters are 0.75AU/s.

Using a little math that's equivalent to about 374c.


We can jump around faster than light, have stargates and FTL communication across the universe..and you take issue with the fact that our warpdrive is not subject to the limit of light speed?because no sci fi propulsions has ever done that?with say a warp tunnel....

Todd4921
Gallente
Pioneer's of the Galantic Wars
IMPERIAL LEGI0N
Posted - 2011.08.04 21:01:00 - [69]
 

FYI antimatter is NOT a single substance With a certain weight but could be anything from anti hydrogen to anti lead.
Also AM could be ****ty and weak because the ammo uses a real small amount of it due to the fact it Would be very expensive to make.

dexington
Caldari
Baconoration
Posted - 2011.08.04 21:13:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: Callic Veratar
I'm a little surprised that nobody brought up warp speed yet:

The slowest warpers are the frieghters are 0.75AU/s.

Using a little math that's equivalent to about 374c.


The casimir effect can in theory enable faster then light travel using a energy depleted vacuum, or may be used to stabilize wormholes. With current technology scientist have been able to slightly increase the speed of light, and with much more advanced technology it may be possible to use it for space travel.

Eve Background seems to hint at this is the theory they use for the FTL technology.

Ayieka
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.04 21:20:00 - [71]
 

i think we can go bigger. 425m autocannon sounds more like it.

Vanity Duchess
Posted - 2011.08.04 21:49:00 - [72]
 

You jerks have ruined eve for me. I can't play this science fiction game ever again now that I know that some elements of it are not completely realistic.

Curse you all.

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.08.04 21:55:00 - [73]
 

Originally by: Ayieka
i think we can go bigger. 425m autocannon sounds more like it.
…so what you're suggesting is that Hurricanes should be shooting themselves at the enemy? Ehmmmmmmm… Razz

dexington
Caldari
Baconoration
Posted - 2011.08.04 22:29:00 - [74]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Ayieka
i think we can go bigger. 425m autocannon sounds more like it.
…so what you're suggesting is that Hurricanes should be shooting themselves at the enemy? Ehmmmmmmm… Razz


Just make sure the guns are pointing the opposite direction of the warp drive, and switch on the warp drive right when you start shooting.

Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari
Emminent Terraforming
O.G.-Alliance
Posted - 2011.08.04 22:33:00 - [75]
 

Originally by: stoicfaux
Originally by: dexington
Originally by: stoicfaux
Which probably explains why Eve railgun rounds have exotic warheads (e.g. anti-matter) instead of just being a solid slug of nickel that relies on kinetic energy to do damage.


Antimatter does have mass, don't know if it's anything close to tungsten which have been used to test railguns. Add to that that 1kg antimatter releases around the same amount of energy as the largest nuclear bombs tested.


What's your point? =) Anti-matter is pretty powerful stuff, yet Eve also has Lead and Iron railgun rounds, which would imply that anti-matter isn't as uber in Eve as science fiction junkies would assume.

Never mind that the various railgun ammo types, despite all having the same volume and mass, dramatically affect a railgun's range in space and also affect the amount of power necessary to fire the round.

Finally, the coup de grâce is this line from the railgun description: "Railguns use magnetic rails to fire solid chunks of matter at hypersonic speed." Lead is non-magnetic. Anti-matter rounds can't be solid chunks of matter. Hypersonic speeds in space are trivial to achieve.


Eve's physics and technology just plain haven't been thought out. It's less defined than even Star Trek's or Star Wars' writer's-fiat-magic-tech.




Star Wars is even less thought out than Star Trek. I mean we have the movies as our official source and know they use lasers yet can build a death star planet blowy up gun but do not seem to equip their ships with plasma beam weapons... id imagine the Stargate Command ships with Asgard Beams could cut an SSD in half.

of course an EVE Drake hardened to EM and Thermal would laugh off the Death Star superlaser while tanking the entire Imperial starfleet.

Stitcher
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.05 01:47:00 - [76]
 

Edited by: Stitcher on 05/08/2011 01:51:20
Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker
Star Wars is even less thought out than Star Trek. I mean we have the movies as our official source and know they use lasers yet can build a death star planet blowy up gun but do not seem to equip their ships with plasma beam weapons... id imagine the Stargate Command ships with Asgard Beams could cut an SSD in half.

of course an EVE Drake hardened to EM and Thermal would laugh off the Death Star superlaser while tanking the entire Imperial starfleet.


Nah, EVE's big advantage is advanced nanotech assembly techniques that allow a ship the size of a Drake to be constructed in less than four hours by a skilled pilot.

We don't just have ships with insane firepower and even more insane defences. We have THOUSANDS of them.


Quote:
Finally, the coup de grâce is this line from the railgun description: "Railguns use magnetic rails to fire solid chunks of matter at hypersonic speed." Lead is non-magnetic. Anti-matter rounds can't be solid chunks of matter. Hypersonic speeds in space are trivial to achieve.


Actually, what a railgun fires is a tungsten and steel can full of suspended plasma in a magnetic containment field.

Blasters just rip the end off the can, suck out the plasma, and fire that "naked".

and "hypersonic" just isn't a precise term. It simply means "faster than Mach 1". Between there and lightspeed is an enormous range of speeds the round could be fired at, all of which are "hypersonic"

Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari
Emminent Terraforming
O.G.-Alliance
Posted - 2011.08.05 05:30:00 - [77]
 

and just think combine two great space things and you could be totally overpowered!!

Drakes produced in 4hrs powered by Zero-Point Modules and packing Asgard Beam Weapons *nod*


Valei Khurelem
Posted - 2011.08.05 06:27:00 - [78]
 

Edited by: Valei Khurelem on 05/08/2011 06:29:29
Edited by: Valei Khurelem on 05/08/2011 06:27:26
It's science fiction, live with it.

People who keep going on about realism in a game like it's their religion and not even taking into account the genres they are playing annoy the crap out of me.

If you aim for realism then you're going to end up with something similar to Arma 2 except with better A.I and character movement and that's pretty much all you can have. I'll make a list of things you wouldn't have in EVE Online if we were aiming for realism.

. Massive weaponry

. Cynosural fields

. Huge spaceships that wouldn't have a hope in hell of going into the atmosphere because they'd just plonk to the ground with the amount of weight they have

. Lasers capable of ripping through armour heavy armour

. Missiles that fly through space like they're in an atmosphere or water ( I'd say they look like torpedoes sometimes but that's just me )

. Un-Aerodynamic spaceships, you wouldn't have ships like the myrmidon in real life, yet again they'd just plonk right out of the sky and veer of course a lot

. Drones capable of flying like fighters

. Mining lasers that go through solid rock ( we are nowhere ****ing near getting this sort of technology yet )

. Any sort of projectile that can fire through space properly hasn't been properly developed yet because MOST of them would require oxygen to fire

. Clones is the obvious one, we've developed very basic cloning with animals but none that allow people to switch their conscience between them and take over a different body

. Giant ships that are piloted by one person, you keep having people and CCP trying to cite some silly lore that claims that there are ship crews, I'm sorry but unless I can go in my ship and actually look at them all working or have some kind of statistics on the game itself declaring this is the case then that is meaningless to me

. Numerous fictional minerals and ore types that simply don't exist, we've found asteroids with precious metals in space that we are all familiar with but nothing new

. Wormholes, no such evidence yet that has been found that they can be real

. Deadspace, stupid idea designed for mission grinding and nothing else, I for one think that CCP need to gtfo with this idea and come up with a more fun way of getting some pew pew action for newbies this is why I mine

. Titans and doomsday devices, these would be the most impractical and ridiculous ships known to the human race, EVE Online has just managed to get this right but essentially it's very similar to the Yamato battleship. All that's going to happen is the second it breaks off from the main fleet or is outnumbered it will get swarmed and destroyed, I'm happy to hear stories about this being the case in EVE Online. It's just a shame it can't work as well with cruisers or battleships

I could go on and on listing what's wrong with realism in EVE but that's the basic jist of it, if you want realism then all the stuff you like in games is going to go. I think taking realistic aspects from realism is a great idea, but the main thing you should aim for in a multiplayer game is making a game that is equal to everyone not matter what they want to play.

Too much of EVE is broken in this respect.

Zey Nadar
Gallente
Unknown Soldiers
Posted - 2011.08.05 07:00:00 - [79]
 

Edited by: Zey Nadar on 05/08/2011 07:00:55
There is this thing called
Suspension of disbelief" in fantasy/scifi/movies/etc. Even if some things in scifi are unrealistic, they need to be believable and consistent for the viewers to enjoy the whole thing.

If things are too fantastic to be believed, or too random. then the viewers wont enjoy the work too much. As long as its only small group of us wondering about these things, like people in this thread, Eve is doing ok.

What Im saying is that people who post "Shut up, its scifi" -comments don't get it that theres a reason for us to examine these things. Sometimes CCP even does something to help the suspension of disbelief, before Tyrannis the planets temperatures were grossly out of joint for example. "Earth-like planets" with surface temperature around melting point of iron etc. Apparently done by someone with random number generator who didnt know the difference between Kelvin and Celsius. They fixed the temperatures somewhat during Tyrannis.

ps. Guys, take a look at what size ammo does dreadnought-size artillery guns use, hehe.

ChromeStriker
Posted - 2011.08.05 08:02:00 - [80]
 

Edited by: ChromeStriker on 05/08/2011 08:02:50
Originally by: Valei Khurelem
Edited by: Valei Khurelem on 05/08/2011 06:29:29



please be quiet your looking silly! every point you just went through has eather already been explained or can be pretty easilly, i mean REALLY...

"Un-Aerodynamic spaceships, you wouldn't have ships like the myrmidon in real life, yet again they'd just plonk right out of the sky and veer of course a lot"

did you even think about what you said???????????

Hecatonis
Amarr
Posted - 2011.08.05 08:25:00 - [81]
 

Originally by: stoicfaux
Originally by: dexington
Originally by: stoicfaux
Which probably explains why Eve railgun rounds have exotic warheads (e.g. anti-matter) instead of just being a solid slug of nickel that relies on kinetic energy to do damage.


Antimatter does have mass, don't know if it's anything close to tungsten which have been used to test railguns. Add to that that 1kg antimatter releases around the same amount of energy as the largest nuclear bombs tested.


What's your point? =) Anti-matter is pretty powerful stuff, yet Eve also has Lead and Iron railgun rounds, which would imply that anti-matter isn't as uber in Eve as science fiction junkies would assume.

Never mind that the various railgun ammo types, despite all having the same volume and mass, dramatically affect a railgun's range in space and also affect the amount of power necessary to fire the round.

Finally, the coup de grâce is this line from the railgun description: "Railguns use magnetic rails to fire solid chunks of matter at hypersonic speed." Lead is non-magnetic. Anti-matter rounds can't be solid chunks of matter. Hypersonic speeds in space are trivial to achieve.


Eve's physics and technology just plain haven't been thought out. It's less defined than even Star Trek's or Star Wars' writer's-fiat-magic-tech.




if memory serves you are confusing a railgun with a gauss rifle. a rail run holds the shot in a carriage and that carriage is propelled forwards using magnates. a guass rifle uses a magnetic field to propel the shot forwards.

eve physics are not as bad as many people think it is. yes they have had to make up a couple things so it is more fun to play, but in the end its fairly sold (wow i am opening myself up to get flamed here)

Sofa Raddis
Posted - 2011.08.05 12:07:00 - [82]
 

Originally by: Valei Khurelem


Any sort of projectile that can fire through space properly hasn't been properly developed yet because MOST of them would require oxygen to fire




Actually even a common handgun would fire in space as there is oxygen in the saltpeter contained in the powder, I could still shoot you in space..... you just wouldn't hear it. Just saying hehe ;)

Smagd
Encina Technologies
Namtz' aar K'in
Posted - 2011.08.05 14:47:00 - [83]
 

I kind of always assumed that the "425 mm" refers to barrel length, not calibre.

That would explain neatly why EMP M fits in either Dual 180mms, 220mm vulcans, or 425mm autocannons, and why smaller size guns track better.

Ehranavaar
Gallente
Posted - 2011.08.05 16:48:00 - [84]
 

Originally by: Gibbo5771
Originally by: Jekyl Eraser
sorry to disapoint you, EMP L is only 0.025 cubic meters. The size of your thumb...


Megan fox thumbs


really doubt fox has an average thumb size of 1.25 litres.

Ehranavaar
Gallente
Posted - 2011.08.05 16:57:00 - [85]
 


ps. Guys, take a look at what size ammo does dreadnought-size artillery guns use, hehe

Rolling Eyes
the rounds are obviously only fully inflated just prior to being fired.

Esna Pitoojee
Amarr
Knighthood of the Merciful Crown
Posted - 2011.08.05 18:03:00 - [86]
 

Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker


Star Wars is even less thought out than Star Trek. I mean we have the movies as our official source and know they use lasers yet can build a death star planet blowy up gun but do not seem to equip their ships with plasma beam weapons... id imagine the Stargate Command ships with Asgard Beams could cut an SSD in half.

of course an EVE Drake hardened to EM and Thermal would laugh off the Death Star superlaser while tanking the entire Imperial starfleet.


Entirely offtopic, but lasers in Star Wars aren't lasers. The best theories I've seen pin them as some kind of hybrid EM/particle-beam weapon (think blasters that hit you from several thousand KM...). Star Wars also has some pretty funky shielding technology - an escape pod of all things was able to escape detection by hostile forces by hiding inside the outer corona of a star for several hours.

:Clarkesthirdlaw:

Originally by: Hecatonis

if memory serves you are confusing a railgun with a gauss rifle. a rail run holds the shot in a carriage and that carriage is propelled forwards using magnates. a guass rifle uses a magnetic field to propel the shot forwards.



Actually, both rail and railguns ("gauss guns") could theoretically use a "carriage" to accelerate an nonmagenetic/nonconductive round, but it isn't inherent in either design. Railguns use a conductive material mounted between two rails that serve as oppositely-charged contacts; as current flows through the conductive material, a force is generated that pushes it parallel to the two rails. Coilguns use coils of a conductive material wrapped around the barrel to project a magnetic ("gaussian") field into the barrel; the magnetic projectile is either drawn to or respulsed away from the magnetic field. Most coilguns use a multistage design in which, as the projectile reaches the magnetic field, that set of coils is switched off and one somewhere farther down the barrel is switched on.

Interestingly, if we go just by name, EVE's "railguns" seem to use both technologies.

Barbelo Valentinian
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2011.08.05 18:31:00 - [87]
 

In reality, military spaceships would be spherical, with the most squishy things (like crew) deep inside.

Doddy
Excidium.
Executive Outcomes
Posted - 2011.08.05 19:07:00 - [88]
 

Originally by: Cpt Greagor
Originally by: WeirdCulture
425mm how sweet...

Quad 3500mm Siege Artillery




This is a very rough idea of what 3500mm is, this might be a little on the small side.


Not unless that Korean is 3m tall.

Doddy
Excidium.
Executive Outcomes
Posted - 2011.08.05 19:13:00 - [89]
 

Originally by: stoicfaux
Originally by: dexington
Originally by: stoicfaux
Which probably explains why Eve railgun rounds have exotic warheads (e.g. anti-matter) instead of just being a solid slug of nickel that relies on kinetic energy to do damage.


Antimatter does have mass, don't know if it's anything close to tungsten which have been used to test railguns. Add to that that 1kg antimatter releases around the same amount of energy as the largest nuclear bombs tested.


What's your point? =) Anti-matter is pretty powerful stuff, yet Eve also has Lead and Iron railgun rounds, which would imply that anti-matter isn't as uber in Eve as science fiction junkies would assume.

Never mind that the various railgun ammo types, despite all having the same volume and mass, dramatically affect a railgun's range in space and also affect the amount of power necessary to fire the round.

Finally, the coup de grâce is this line from the railgun description: "Railguns use magnetic rails to fire solid chunks of matter at hypersonic speed." Lead is non-magnetic. Anti-matter rounds can't be solid chunks of matter. Hypersonic speeds in space are trivial to achieve.


Eve's physics and technology just plain haven't been thought out. It's less defined than even Star Trek's or Star Wars' writer's-fiat-magic-tech.




Hybrid munitions are just that, charged particle core in a metalic sabot. In railguns the sabot is what is repulsed out, it carries the destructive core to the target. In blasters the sabot is dsicarded and it is the charged material itself that is repulsed(not by magnetism).

From the antimatter s descritpion; - Consists of two components: a shell of titanium and a core of antimatter atoms suspended in plasma state. Railguns launch the shell directly, while particle blasters pump the plasma into a cyclotron and process the plasma into a bolt that is then fired.


Playing Eve
Posted - 2011.08.05 19:53:00 - [90]
 

Originally by: Jekyl Eraser
sorry to disapoint you, EMP L is only 0.025 cubic meters. The size of your thumb...


That's equivalent to 6.6 US gallons in volume. You've got some freaky huge thumbs.


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