open All Channels
seplocked Assembly Hall
blankseplocked [Proposal] EVE needs MT for skill points to survive.
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5

Author Topic

PaulTheConvoluted
Posted - 2011.08.05 14:58:00 - [91]
 

Originally by: Malcanis
Why do governments tax people? I hate being taxed, the government should just print more money instead. What's the difference?
SP aren't really currency, you can't trade stuff with it.

It does allow you to do stuff, much like money does, but in my eyes, SP don't have a value and is therefor not susceptible to inflation like money is.

The only inflation it will cause is more ppl able to fit X module or fly Y ship, and that is already happening, because CCP is already 'printing money' / handing out SP to everyone. Is that a bad thing?

Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
Posted - 2011.08.05 17:21:00 - [92]
 

Originally by: PaulTheConvoluted

It does allow you to do stuff, much like money does, but in my eyes, SP don't have a value and is therefor not susceptible to inflation like money is.

The only inflation it will cause is more ppl able to fit X module or fly Y ship, and that is already happening, because CCP is already 'printing money' / handing out SP to everyone. Is that a bad thing?


...character bazaar.

PaulTheConvoluted
Posted - 2011.08.05 19:02:00 - [93]
 

Edited by: PaulTheConvoluted on 05/08/2011 19:02:53
Edited by: PaulTheConvoluted on 05/08/2011 19:02:14
Originally by: Grey Stormshadow
...character bazaar.
Thank you for agreeing with me. At least, I suppose that is what you do...

Korg Leaf
Super Batungwaa Ninja Warriors
0ccupational Hazzard
Posted - 2011.08.05 21:56:00 - [94]
 

Originally by: PaulTheConvoluted
Originally by: Kali Omega
Wait wait Canipost please did you just support buying a toon from the bazar in that last statement or am I just that groggy from waking up?
Most of the ppl against purchasable SP seem to be in favor of the Bazaar (no, I don't have statistics, that's the general idea I got from reading this thread and a few like it), so what is the difference between buying a few PLEXs, convert them to ISK and then going to the Bazaar?

Buying SP instead of characters is a lot more granular, but it amounts to (roughly) the same thing: You pay money, you get skillpoints. If I wanted to, I can create and pay for 10 characters, skill them up, then sell them at the bazaar: Bam, 10* X million SP extra in game, without anyone at the controls doing anything with the characters. The mechanism is already there, so what's the problem?


Because those characters still had to go through the process of getting trained, instantaneously creating a titan character is different from buying one that has already been trained the old fashioned way.


Sarrgon
Caldari
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.08.05 23:17:00 - [95]
 

But either way, they buyer isn't doing the training, they are still buying SP cause they don't want to spend the time training a toon up to do what they want to do. Can say whatever you like about this, but buying a toon via the car bazaar or buying SP, is still in the end buying SP.

Just this way, people get to keep their mains and not buy another toon with a different name that other people may know, for good or bad, not have to worry about character scams etc in the process.

Ranka Mei
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.05 23:57:00 - [96]
 

Originally by: Kaelie Onren

Congratulations, please add yourself to the Econ 101 flunkies list.
We are protecting the universal economy and everyone right to a fair system. In American terms, we are protecting everyones FREEDOMs and liberties.

Again, sp buying is EXACTLY like counterfeiting money.
Character bazaar is FINE and does not disturb the economy because somebody EARNED those sp. They contributed to the economy to do it, as well ( in so far as they sat and studied and paid for skillbooks. Most importantly they took the time.

It's amazing how you can talk about other people flunking Econ 101, when your own notion of likening buying sp to 'counterfeiting money' is abysmally flawed. In fact, it's so wrong, I don't even know where to begin... Well, I do. For one, what, pray-tell, is counterfeit sp? Sp that remarkably looks like sp, but with a UV scanner and a good loupe can be exposed as fake? /sarcasm

No, I think the 'Econ 101 qualification class' term you were looking for is inflation. Which, mind you, has nothing to do with counterfeiting whatsofrikkin'ever. Buying sp, to use the correct terminology, is like printing (legit, not counterfeit) sp out of thin air, thus causing a devaluation of the total sp pool; and thus causing inflation (you need a toon with higher sp for the same value).

N.B. For completeness, it's truly out of thin air when you buy sp with RL money; because, yes, you pay for it, but the EVE economy is not 'cognizant' of said currency/transaction; so, as to the EVE economy, it just appears to be coming out of thin air.

So much fail in this thread.

Alex Sinai
Mining And Probing Specialists
Posted - 2011.08.06 07:16:00 - [97]
 

Originally by: Ranka Mei
Originally by: Kaelie Onren

Congratulations, please add yourself to the Econ 101 flunkies list.
We are protecting the universal economy and everyone right to a fair system. In American terms, we are protecting everyones FREEDOMs and liberties.

Again, sp buying is EXACTLY like counterfeiting money.
Character bazaar is FINE and does not disturb the economy because somebody EARNED those sp. They contributed to the economy to do it, as well ( in so far as they sat and studied and paid for skillbooks. Most importantly they took the time.

It's amazing how you can talk about other people flunking Econ 101, when your own notion of likening buying sp to 'counterfeiting money' is abysmally flawed. In fact, it's so wrong, I don't even know where to begin... Well, I do. For one, what, pray-tell, is counterfeit sp? Sp that remarkably looks like sp, but with a UV scanner and a good loupe can be exposed as fake? /sarcasm

No, I think the 'Econ 101 qualification class' term you were looking for is inflation. Which, mind you, has nothing to do with counterfeiting whatsofrikkin'ever. Buying sp, to use the correct terminology, is like printing (legit, not counterfeit) sp out of thin air, thus causing a devaluation of the total sp pool; and thus causing inflation (you need a toon with higher sp for the same value).

N.B. For completeness, it's truly out of thin air when you buy sp with RL money; because, yes, you pay for it, but the EVE economy is not 'cognizant' of said currency/transaction; so, as to the EVE economy, it just appears to be coming out of thin air.

So much fail in this thread.


Ranka would you care to clear up your thinking a bit? It seems so clouded that i did not understood what's the connection between what you say and protests against MT in EVE. You want to spend your money or dont know what to buy with them. Hey I have great useless thin air for sell only for you very exclusive 1000$. You will have your own canister of pure air. And a monthly fee to keep it lets say 10$. Oh don't look at these other people who bought it. Yours is unique. Sounds dumb? Well that same dumbness you support with MT in EVE.

Dawnmist
Posted - 2011.08.07 01:04:00 - [98]
 

No support.

Rip Minner
Gallente
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
Posted - 2011.08.07 02:43:00 - [99]
 

Originally by: souhyeahright
Counter-proposal: drink bleach.


You are the winner! ugh

Kali Omega
Immortalis Inc.
Posted - 2011.08.07 03:06:00 - [100]
 

Truthfully we are all just wasting our breathe with this debate.... ccp isn't going to implement this....it has as much chance of getting in game as golden ammo getting in game.

Toovhon
Posted - 2011.08.07 16:09:00 - [101]
 

Edited by: Toovhon on 07/08/2011 16:14:06
Originally by: PaulTheConvoluted
Originally by: ShahFluffers
They felt this was too much so they took out the training multiplier.
Oh my, god forbid new players having a fighting chance, or even a bit of fun, can't have that...

Having to wait, and wait, and wait until you can do pretty much anything gets old, especially if you're new to the game.

Vet: Hé friend, come play Eve with me, in Eve you can do X, Y, Z ...
New player: Oh, sounds cool!
New Player tries X: Can't, have to train for ages
New Player tries Y: Can't, have to train for a while
New Player tries Z: Can't, have to train 3 days to be able to board the ship and fit some modules and still have to warp out every 30 seconds.
New player: Oh boy, I can mine 34 m3/minute or do level 1 courier missions, joy joy


Why are lower level ships not fun? I had fun with them. Most everyone else I know in Eve had fun with their first frigates and cruisers. Why are you unable to? Perhaps the problem lies with you? *gasp* *unthinkable*

PaulTheConvoluted
Posted - 2011.08.07 20:22:00 - [102]
 

Originally by: Toovhon
Why are you unable to?
I never said that. However, the veteran friend will likely tell the new player all glorious things about the game which require at least some training. The new player will have all sorts of glorious ideas about the game, and then it turns out he has to go through a lengthy process to do those things.

Sure, he can do a lot of other things in the mean time, but those aren't the things that lured him to the game, and quite likely in a different area of the game than what his friend is doing.

While you can't alleviate that entirely (playing the market needs isk, running missions needs standing) quite a few thing get a lot better with a few SP (like more cap, pg, cpu, being able to actually fit that second gun or a bit more EHP instead of getting blown up in 2 seconds or taking ages to accomplish anything).

Please do remember, when you started you probably either started with 800.000 SP or still had the multiplier, so you got to fly something decent quite quickly :)

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Posted - 2011.08.07 21:27:00 - [103]
 

Originally by: PaulTheConvoluted

Please do remember, when you started you probably either started with 800.000 SP or still had the multiplier, so you got to fly something decent quite quickly :)


The 800k SP was killed awhile back (Apocrapha I think?).As for the training multiplier... bear in mind that when they were in place, "Learning Skills" were there as well. Generally, one's entire training multiplier "phase" was spent training up those "Learning Skills" which provided no tangible gameplay ability outside of "training as fast as everyone else."

With the removal of Learning skills and the addition to everyone's base attributes (quite basically, all learning skills became inherent and permanent), there was no need for the multiplier as everyone was now training at "max speed" from the get-go. Just drive right into training up ships and other stuff.

PaulTheConvoluted
Posted - 2011.08.08 09:25:00 - [104]
 

Originally by: ShahFluffers
Generally, one's entire training multiplier "phase" was spent training up those "Learning Skills" which provided no tangible gameplay ability outside of "training as fast as everyone else."
Even the new guys?

On an alt, I can see you'd start with the learning skills, but I'd say it's the new guys that started with things that were actually fun, instead of training something that would, in a few months/years, earn itself back :)

eocsnesemaj
Keskerakond
Posted - 2011.08.08 09:32:00 - [105]
 

Originally by: souhyeahright
Counter-proposal: drink bleach.


this XD

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Posted - 2011.08.08 19:47:00 - [106]
 

Originally by: PaulTheConvoluted

Originally by: ShahFluffers

Generally, one's entire training multiplier "phase" was spent training up those "Learning Skills" which provided no tangible gameplay ability outside of "training as fast as everyone else."



Even the new guys?

On an alt, I can see you'd start with the learning skills, but I'd say it's the new guys that started with things that were actually fun, instead of training something that would, in a few months/years, earn itself back :)


Back then, if any "new guys" asked about what to train first they'd be greeted with "get your tier 1 learning skills to 5 and your adv. learning skills to 4. No exceptions." It was actually pretty hostile. Sad

The basis for this was that Learning Skills took about 2 or 3 months to fully complete and usually paid for themselves in under a year.
If you didn't train them and just dove right into training ships, weapons, and other stuff then you'd be "left behind" after that 1 year mark (I believe I read somewhere that after a year you would have 20% less SP if you didn't train your learning skills compared to someone who did).

Baaldor
Black Sail Anarchists
Yarr Collective
Posted - 2011.08.08 22:06:00 - [107]
 

Originally by: PaulTheConvoluted
Originally by: Toovhon
Why are you unable to?
I never said that. However, the veteran friend will likely tell the new player all glorious things about the game which require at least some training. The new player will have all sorts of glorious ideas about the game, and then it turns out he has to go through a lengthy process to do those things.

Sure, he can do a lot of other things in the mean time, but those aren't the things that lured him to the game, and quite likely in a different area of the game than what his friend is doing.

While you can't alleviate that entirely (playing the market needs isk, running missions needs standing) quite a few thing get a lot better with a few SP (like more cap, pg, cpu, being able to actually fit that second gun or a bit more EHP instead of getting blown up in 2 seconds or taking ages to accomplish anything).

Please do remember, when you started you probably either started with 800.000 SP or still had the multiplier, so you got to fly something decent quite quickly :)


actually when I started..you had to train up the Learning skills pretty quickly to get any where. I do not even remember what we started with at the time, I keep thinking it was pretty anemic. you were nto going to be able to do ****.

However now I guess a veteran can tell new guys "Hey it is much better than when I started, CCP holds your **** for you now"

Bo Tosh
Posted - 2011.08.09 08:24:00 - [108]
 

Not supported.

Kaelie Onren
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.08.15 10:35:00 - [109]
 

Edited by: Kaelie Onren on 15/08/2011 11:42:25


Originally by: CanIPost Please


Money is an "unfair" advantage? It sounds like you just don't like the fact that some people have lots of money and want to use the game of EVE Online to try to get back at them . . . which is kind of sad and pathetic. (no offense)



PS, I didn't bother responding to your other post because you were wildly going off topic (you admittedly like to argue) and if I didn't have a full time job making tonnes of real money, I may have had the time to fully expunge your points. I still can, if you insist, but I don't think it will really pertain to this discussion anymore. You will no doubt declare victory by my refusal to retort, and if that is what makes you happy then go ahead and declare victory. :)


BUT, to your point above, I would like to appeal to your common sense here, you do agree that real money is an advantage. It sure is, and good on you to notice it. But keep in mind that there are a LOT richer people in the world than you. (I'm making an educated guess here, given my impression of your age range and education, feel free to correct me by posting your tax return statements) and you know that once you start down the dark path of RM for SP then you are going to get swamped by people with lots of money, lots of time, and willing to start a goonswarm-like tactic of insta-equipping 100 noob alts with stealth bombers or battleships to gank your butts to kingdom come. And it would be possible because of SP for RL. And this doom fleet can be made in 1 day and thrown away. Heck, I know a lot of people in RL who would throw away $1000 a night for fun. Why not blow that cash to total pwn some geeks on this game called EVE online?

Be careful what you ask for. For every 'legit' player like you who just wants to 'catch up' in the game, there a 100 rich bastards in real life who just love to poop in other people's cereals, just for laughs.

It all boils down to this, if you make this a game about real life money, then you are putting a big part of the gaming population in New Eden at a disadvantage to anyone in real life who happens to have more money. These people may not really care that much about the game, and not represent a large part of the 'contributing' community. You then remove a big part of the game, and replace it with the meta game of real life economic worth. And friend, I really don't think you really want to do this as much as you think you do. :)
And once this meta game is allowed, then what happens when meta-meta games like when all the money made from selling WOW characters from china farms are used to built uber insta-fleets in EVE? Or if Blizzard decided to run a EVE whispering campaign, by paying its employees to buy up SP'd EVE characters (called PlayWOWInstead[0-99]) and start a ganking campaign in Jita and highsec in order to frustrate new players. meta-gaming is bad.


still not supported.

CanIPost Please
Posted - 2011.08.16 03:58:00 - [110]
 

Originally by: Kaelie Onren
. . .


My philosophy on argument is that it is not a win-lose activity. It's an exercise in arriving at the truth, and ideally, two parties can arrive there with a smile on their face, without any hard feelings.

EVE is harsh, supposedly. There are all sorts of different kinds of players with all sorts of different advantages. Even now, some of them are overwhelming. I'm not afraid to lose to someone with an overwhelming advantage, because I guess I believe that losing to someone with an overwhelming advantage isn't really losing at all.

But, yeah . . . I agree. We disagree.

Windjammer
Gallente
Posted - 2011.08.16 20:39:00 - [111]
 

Four pages, 111 posts and 3 supports. The math is simple.

Sarrgon
Caldari
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.08.16 21:25:00 - [112]
 

Edited by: Sarrgon on 16/08/2011 21:27:45
Why if anything like this is going to happen in the future, needs to be via a plex, so anyone has the option to buy one, not just the rich people IRL. People already use RL cash as an advantage over others, buy 100000000 plex and sell them and buy what ever they want while others are trying to save up ISK for something good. To be able to buy a Super carrier or titan or get that faction BS pimped out with officer mods and go roam low sec. Yeah, that's not a big advantage for them. (sarcasm)

To me that is a much bigger advantage they will get then getting some SP via plexes. For most people, to get them lvl 5's done, getting another 2 - 5% on something isn't going to be overwhelming. But also, if something like this would ever be implemented, needs to be a limit, maybe like 1 plex = 1 month worth of training extra but only can do it 6 times a year per acct. o that someone can't get a max SP toon in a day Laughing

P.S. and out of them 111 posts against and I know there is more then 3 for, but out of them 111, how many are the same people who keep checking this post to keep on bashing it???

Kaelie Onren
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.08.16 22:50:00 - [113]
 

Originally by: CanIPost Please
Originally by: Kaelie Onren
. . .


My philosophy on argument is that it is not a win-lose activity. It's an exercise in arriving at the truth, and ideally, two parties can arrive there with a smile on their face, without any hard feelings.

EVE is harsh, supposedly. There are all sorts of different kinds of players with all sorts of different advantages. Even now, some of them are overwhelming. I'm not afraid to lose to someone with an overwhelming advantage, because I guess I believe that losing to someone with an overwhelming advantage isn't really losing at all.

But, yeah . . . I agree. We disagree.


Oh the irony. I agree with everything in this last post of yours. Every statement. Fancy that! That rarely happens for me. :)

Anyway, where the problem lies in this proposal, is that while losing to someone with an advantage is fine and dandy, if you make this a meta-game, then it's not really a game within its own system anymore, its a real-life game. Not a computer game. And I think that most people play computer games expect a system that it treats all players fairly regardless of who they are in the real world. If you didn't want this kind of game, then you would be playing sports, or the stock market in real life instead of EVE ;) So making a computer game a real-life game is a double-edged sword. Some lessor games may do it (online poker), but they tend to be simple games with little depth, not MMOs (or MMOs with little depth :). In EVE, a game and community that prides itself on being hard to 'earn' your place and status, this 'dumbing down' is not going to happen, unless CCP wants to kill it.




Sarrgon
Caldari
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.08.17 00:50:00 - [114]
 

If you notice, with people like you complaining to no end about what CCP plans on doing, the number of people logged on when I log on is still slowly dropping. So if you keep doing it like this, soon Eve will be dead. Look at other MMO's, they have XP potions, double XP weekends etc, I know Eve is not them or even played like them, but that is something they do to attract new players. So many won't start up a older game like Eve cause of the SP gap.

So unless there is a way to help attract new players, Eve will slowly die and less and less will log on. SO if we keep doing it your way, your dooming Eve to a slow death. CCP is trying to do what other popular MMO's are doing and what works to help attract new players and to keep the ones they have.

Kaelie Onren
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.08.17 01:23:00 - [115]
 

Originally by: Sarrgon
If you notice, with people like you complaining to no end about what CCP plans on doing, the number of people logged on when I log on is still slowly dropping. So if you keep doing it like this, soon Eve will be dead. Look at other MMO's, they have XP potions, double XP weekends etc, I know Eve is not them or even played like them, but that is something they do to attract new players. So many won't start up a older game like Eve cause of the SP gap.

So unless there is a way to help attract new players, Eve will slowly die and less and less will log on. SO if we keep doing it your way, your dooming Eve to a slow death. CCP is trying to do what other popular MMO's are doing and what works to help attract new players and to keep the ones they have.


Though your argument is steep full of pathos, if only it were backed up by facts instead of anecdotal evidence. (1 player, noticing that less people log on at their times recently, does not a real trend make) If you would like to pursue this line of reasoning, please provide some evidence to support it that doesn't require the rational among us to 'just trust you'.

Anyway, I personally think that you folks are going about this the wrong way. Perceived problem or not (and for argument sake, let's assume that their IS a problem of subscriberships. It's irrelevant anyway), the problem here (and in fact, with most proposals here on forums) is that people try to solve their tiny problems with BIG BIG solutions. It's like killing rats in your house with RPGs. And they wonder why people don't support them. If you have a problem, you have to distill it down to its fundamental core, and them make a solution that addresses just that core issue, and not affect anything else.

For this 'problem' making SP buyable is just plain ludicrous, and will create more damage to the game than good.

If your problem is that players find it hard to 'get up to speed' when starting the game, then make some SP packages that are given to you as rewards for completing the Training courses for the career professions, which are SP that you can instantly assign to select skills that have to do with that profession. Just finished the industry training course? Then you get 200k SP to put into industry skills. Advanced Military course done? Then you get 200k to put into Electronics or Gunnery skills.

Simple. Elegant. Direct solution. I will encourage people to finish their training schools, and not be repeatable so you don't have abusers who can 'buy' up to a stealth bomber pilot in just 1 day of starting to play the game.

If your problem is that you think that EVE isn't fair because you can never catch up to people before you, then you really have to ask yourself, what does catching up achieve? There is no contest for who has the most SP. Many many times already people in the game (who have played for a long time) have explained to you noobies that SP means little in terms of being a contributing player to a team, or having fun, or you being able to shoot down a veteran with more SP than you. (heck goonswarm proved it. google it!) If you still think that you will never get satisfaction out of the game unless you have more SP than your enemies, then go get a penile enlargement, buy a porche, or a harley instead, because the problem is your self esteem, not the game!




Sarrgon
Caldari
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.08.17 03:17:00 - [116]
 

All you have to do is look at the amount of people online when you go to log on, plain and simple, nothing fancy about that. Like 6 months ago when I logged on, would be around upper 40k people online to lower 50k people online, now about a good 20k less people then that when I log on. Atleast people like me is trying to solve a problem instead of trolling these threads saying we're all nuts.

And how would you solve the problem of new players trying out this game and seeing the huge SP gap. Sure you can specialize, but to be good at only 1 thing really limits the fun you can get out of this game. For most people, they like to be versatile and that takes time. Or to say, hmm, today I feel like missioning, tommorrow I may feel like mining and a few days later I may want to pvp. That's literally how it is for me and my 3 toons I have. Sure a lot of others are like that also. Why so many other MMO's have something similar to this in effect now to help out with that and that helps them to get new players. And even a lot of vets in that game like it cause they get to train up alts faster and to get more people close to their level faster.

So maybe instead of complaining about this problem, try coming up with a solution yourself or just be quiet. So many people who create threads like this don't do it to get ridiculed by people like you.

foksieloy
Minmatar
Rockets ponies and rainbows
Posted - 2011.08.17 08:59:00 - [117]
 

Except that the reason why there is so much less players is CCPs continued attempts at introducing RMT.

Kaelie Onren
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.08.17 09:08:00 - [118]
 

Originally by: Sarrgon
All you have to do is look at the amount of people online when you go to log on, plain and simple, nothing fancy about that.



Right, and the number hasn't changed significantly for me. But that doesn't mean squat, which is my point. Anecdotal evidence IS anecdotal. IE does not pass muster.

Quote:

today I feel like missioning, tommorrow I may feel like mining and a few days later I may want to pvp.


Maybe I'm being too obtuse, but if you wanted to do that, then why wouldn't you just complete ALL the career training courses? Are they insufficient? Then why not propose CCP to add more that make sense? Make them part of storyline mission rewards, etc etc? Put the RPG away!

The only logical reason that people argue for the RPG approach (lemme buy what I want!) is that they secretly just want to be 'kicking butt super cool' flying that Cerberus, or hacking like a pro, or maxxed out their arty specializations immediately. Which breaks the game dynamic.

Velicitia
Gallente
Open Designs
Posted - 2011.08.17 14:37:00 - [119]
 

Originally by: Sarrgon
Like 6 months ago when I logged on, would be around upper 40k people online to lower 50k people online, now about a good 20k less people then that when I log on.


It is summer afterall, online numbers are always lower in the summer. Not that this accounts for the entire slump... but a lot of the vets are *still* ****ed about NEX.

Originally by: Sarrgon
And how would you solve the problem of new players trying out this game and seeing the huge SP gap. Sure you can specialize, but to be good at only 1 thing really limits the fun you can get out of this game.

Funny, I "specialised" in T1 Sensor/Tracking links a week or two "in" (after the requisite 2-4 weeks of Learning Skills). Had a great time with the (non-rookie) people I flew with at the time and the bonuses I could grant... yeah, they weren't much, but enough that the other guys could target a little farther, or hit something that was normally out of range or too fast to track...

Granted on one of the early forays into low/null, I got insta-popped by an assailant (which was painful)

Originally by: Sarrgon
For most people, they like to be versatile and that takes time. Or to say, hmm, today I feel like missioning, tommorrow I may feel like mining and a few days later I may want to pvp.

Funny story, mission running and PVP use the same skills. You might need a few thousand "extra" for PVP though (MWD, point, webber), but it's not like you CAN'T do different things every day.

As for mining -> The frigates aren't *bad* at mining (yes, there are better ships... but they take time). L4 frig, and the L4 basic mining skills takes maybe a week (probably not even that). You'll be pretty close to mining as well as a barge (few per cent difference, tops).

I'd say to become "easily" versatile in things takes about 4-6 weeks; where "easily" means skills in enough areas that they can give fair DPS, have a fair tank, or mine a fair amount -- roughly L3 across the board, a few L4's here and there... probably no L5's yet.

Or, in that same 4-6 weeks, a rookie can be 80% - 90% as effective in one area as a vet (give or take, some areas will take longer ... skills and percentage based modifiers only. Player skill only comes with time).


Sarrgon
Caldari
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.08.17 23:37:00 - [120]
 

Some was due to MT, for sure, but the decline started, from what I saw when the Anomaly nerf happened. That started it, then MT, then BC fell. Sure by that point, thousands basically said screw this, especially with all the doomsayers about MT, OMG, Eve will die unless we get rid of all MT. Saying so many worse case scenerios, kinda like 2012 and people making billions of the fear of others. Is there some danger in MT, sure, but was a much better way of handling that and scaring so many who didn't know better.

http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/QEN/QEN_Q4-2010.pdf
http://www.brighthub.com/video-games/mmo/articles/35992.aspx

And CCP has stopped the quarterly reports giving that kind of info. Maybe, cause, they don't want people to know how many accounts that have lost this year??????? And sure it is due to several reasons, but the bottom line, if Eve doesn't get new accounts and be able to keep them, things don't look that good for us that still love and play this wonderful game. And once Black Prophecy comes out, is in beta now, will probably get worse since that is a space based game also.


Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only