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mxzf
Minmatar
Shovel Bros
Posted - 2011.07.15 15:23:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: mxzf on 15/07/2011 15:27:42
Ok, I've gotten to the stage where I'd like to get a bit deeper into exploration, but I'm not positive where to go from here.

First off, my current status: Right now I'm exploring in the Heimatar region using a Helios to scan stuff down and an Ishkur to run sites. I fly Cal, Gal, and Min ships up to BS (though I don't fly BSes too well) and I can fly Gal and Min T2 frigs and Cal T2/3 Cruisers. I can armor or shield tank, but I definitely prefer shield. I have almost 2M SP in Drones and about 1.3M each in guns and Missiles. I'm decent with probing and can usually pin stuff down fairly quick, though I'm not maxed by any means (with Sisters Probes I have ~96 strength in my rigged Helios and 57.2 in a non-bonused ship).

What I would really like is a ship that I could fly around, in highsec and possibly lowsec, that could scan well, run most sites (atleast combat and Radar, Mag if the modules fit), and not need to change ships all the time.

I've looked around a bit, the standard setup seems to be Arbiter->Pilgrim, however I only have Amarr Frig 2 and Amarr ships don't really catch my eye (I'm less of a fan of lasers and armor tanking). I could train Amarr, but I'd prefer not to.

I've also thought about getting a Tengu, but currently I've only got ~160M to my name and I'd rather not drop more than 40M or so on a ship right now if I can help it, especially if there's the chance that I'd be taking it into lowsec.

What I'm looking for is both advice for what to use right now and also advice on what I should be targeting to use in the long run. EFT-Warriors, have at the.

Edit: Also, suggested fits would be welcomed.

Tabernack en Chasteaux
Posted - 2011.07.15 16:15:00 - [2]
 

Ishtar. With good skills you don't really need a scan bonused ship for highsec.

mxzf
Minmatar
Shovel Bros
Posted - 2011.07.15 16:33:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Tabernack en Chasteaux
Ishtar. With good skills you don't really need a scan bonused ship for highsec.


Ok, yeah, I have heard about Ishtars too. The only thing is that it's a 19d train for Gal Cruiser 5, and I'm just starting on Astrometrics 5 right now. What would a good target fit for that be? And what would you suggest using in the mean time, since that's 20+ days and a good bit of ISK away? I've looked at the Vexor before, but the 5-3-4 slots seem kinda weak.

Also, how much strength do you need to be able to scan down all the decent highsec sites (combat and radar) quickly? And how many of the good sites would I be locking myself out of with a Cruiser hull?

Tabernack en Chasteaux
Posted - 2011.07.15 17:06:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Tabernack en Chasteaux on 15/07/2011 17:07:12
Originally by: mxzf
Ok, yeah, I have heard about Ishtars too. The only thing is that it's a 19d train for Gal Cruiser 5, and I'm just starting on Astrometrics 5 right now. What would a good target fit for that be? And what would you suggest using in the mean time, since that's 20+ days and a good bit of ISK away? I've looked at the Vexor before, but the 5-3-4 slots seem kinda weak.


Vexor is a damn fine ship, very versatile. A general idea of how to all-purpose fit it: Salvager, drone link augmentor, and some guns of your choosing in the highs. Codebreaker, Analyzer, & three mids of your choosing (I like an Omni and a prop mod). Fit an armor tank in your lows. Load up with drones -- I use 3 sentries and 5 lights.

I would take this into any highsec site except a Watch or a Vigil -- I have not been able to fit a tank to do these sites comfortably. You might be ok with a kite fit in a Watch, but the spawn-triggering web tower in the Vigil would be the death of you.

Originally by: mxzf
Also, how much strength do you need to be able to scan down all the decent highsec sites (combat and radar) quickly? And how many of the good sites would I be locking myself out of with a Cruiser hull?


I can't speculate on the scan strength at this time (perhaps another forum-goer can comment on this?), but a cruiser will only lock you out of Hideouts. If you were to step up to a Myrmidon, which is a natural progression from the Vexor, you could do the harder combat sites above but would also be locked out of the 3/10 DED sites.

If you just want to pick off radars & mags, you can have great fun putzing around in an Imicus :) It's scan-bonused as well, so you can find everything with ease and BM more difficult sites for later.

bartos100
DARK ADAMA
Terra Axiom
Posted - 2011.07.15 18:22:00 - [5]
 

you can fly a tengu if i read correct

fly that most likely the best ship for the job

mxzf
Minmatar
Shovel Bros
Posted - 2011.07.15 18:27:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Tabernack en Chasteaux
Edited by: Tabernack en Chasteaux on 15/07/2011 17:07:12
Originally by: mxzf
Ok, yeah, I have heard about Ishtars too. The only thing is that it's a 19d train for Gal Cruiser 5, and I'm just starting on Astrometrics 5 right now. What would a good target fit for that be? And what would you suggest using in the mean time, since that's 20+ days and a good bit of ISK away? I've looked at the Vexor before, but the 5-3-4 slots seem kinda weak.


Vexor is a damn fine ship, very versatile. A general idea of how to all-purpose fit it: Salvager, drone link augmentor, and some guns of your choosing in the highs. Codebreaker, Analyzer, & three mids of your choosing (I like an Omni and a prop mod). Fit an armor tank in your lows. Load up with drones -- I use 3 sentries and 5 lights.

I would take this into any highsec site except a Watch or a Vigil -- I have not been able to fit a tank to do these sites comfortably. You might be ok with a kite fit in a Watch, but the spawn-triggering web tower in the Vigil would be the death of you.

Originally by: mxzf
Also, how much strength do you need to be able to scan down all the decent highsec sites (combat and radar) quickly? And how many of the good sites would I be locking myself out of with a Cruiser hull?


I can't speculate on the scan strength at this time (perhaps another forum-goer can comment on this?), but a cruiser will only lock you out of Hideouts. If you were to step up to a Myrmidon, which is a natural progression from the Vexor, you could do the harder combat sites above but would also be locked out of the 3/10 DED sites.

If you just want to pick off radars & mags, you can have great fun putzing around in an Imicus :) It's scan-bonused as well, so you can find everything with ease and BM more difficult sites for later.


That all sounds like great advice. I think you're mis-remembering the Vexor's slots though, it's 5-3-4, I think you might be remembering the Ishtar, which does have 5 mids.

And that does look like good advice, I'm not sure the Vexor is the answer though, if I'm going to be using a non-bonused ship for scanning, it seems like I might as well just use my Ishkur. There are less slots free for stuff, but I can fit a probe launcher in the utility high and a Codebreaker in the free mid and still have a better tank against Angels than the Vexor I was able to build (with 1/3 the Sig and 2x the speed to boot, there's just half the buffer).

And I had been running some un-guarded sites in my Helios, but that lone drone just can't handle all the rats alone when there are guards.

The more I look at it, the more it seems that, for highsec atleast, the Ishkur might be my best bet, assuming I can scan everything I need to with it. And the only upgrades I really see for lowsec would be the Tengu or Ishtar (the Tengu being the only one with a bonus to probing).

In the past I've done a bit of lowsec probing for plexes, but the only one I found that was any good, a 6/10, was too much for my Drake to handle properly solo, and none of my corp-mates are well enough skilled in combat (much less nullsec) to be much help, I might have to wait for the HAC/T3 to run those.

Thanks for the advice, keep it coming.

mxzf
Minmatar
Shovel Bros
Posted - 2011.07.15 18:29:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: bartos100
you can fly a tengu if i read correct

fly that most likely the best ship for the job


I can, and I would love to. The problem being that I only have 160M liquid right now and those are in the range of 0.5B+ to buy and fit, which is a bit beyond my current budget. If I manage to find a couple Gistii A-Type shield boosters and sell them though, that's near the top of my wish list, lol.

Tommy Machiavelli
Posted - 2011.07.15 18:53:00 - [8]
 

You're good to go with either an Arbitrator or an Ishkur. Since you're so drone specced, you should have no trouble putting on some utility mods and keeping range from rats while your drones do the work.

Seriously though, once you get the cash, the Tengu is the answer. Its the perfect tool for what you're looking for right now.

Tabernack en Chasteaux
Posted - 2011.07.15 19:20:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: mxzf
That all sounds like great advice. I think you're mis-remembering the Vexor's slots though, it's 5-3-4, I think you might be remembering the Ishtar, which does have 5 mids.

Derp, you're right. I use codebreaker/analyzer/MWD on my Vexor.

Originally by: mxzf
And that does look like good advice, I'm not sure the Vexor is the answer though, if I'm going to be using a non-bonused ship for scanning, it seems like I might as well just use my Ishkur. There are less slots free for stuff, but I can fit a probe launcher in the utility high and a Codebreaker in the free mid and still have a better tank against Angels than the Vexor I was able to build (with 1/3 the Sig and 2x the speed to boot, there's just half the buffer).


Very good points. The Vexor is kind of squishy, of that there is no doubt - especially against Angels. I mostly fight Sanshas so the explosive hole isn't a big issue. I wouldn't discount the ability to use 3 sentry/heavy drones, though, as it lets you apply significantly better firepower to larger targets. On the other hand, the only noteworthy highsec sites with big targets (Watch/Vigil) will eat a Vexor for breakfast regardless. So yeah, you'd probably do OK in your Ishkur.

Originally by: mxzf
And I had been running some un-guarded sites in my Helios, but that lone drone just can't handle all the rats alone when there are guards.

This is precisely what the Imicus is good at, at least in high sec. It packs 3 light drones, compared to the Helios' one. I have never found a highsec radar site that it couldn't handle. Ultimately, less oomph than the Ishkur, but better at scanning.

Originally by: mxzf
The more I look at it, the more it seems that, for highsec atleast, the Ishkur might be my best bet, assuming I can scan everything I need to with it. And the only upgrades I really see for lowsec would be the Tengu or Ishtar (the Tengu being the only one with a bonus to probing).

In the past I've done a bit of lowsec probing for plexes, but the only one I found that was any good, a 6/10, was too much for my Drake to handle properly solo, and none of my corp-mates are well enough skilled in combat (much less nullsec) to be much help, I might have to wait for the HAC/T3 to run those.

Thanks for the advice, keep it coming.


I think maybe I was premature in recommending the Ishtar. In addition to what you've stated, it might cost a bit more than what you've set as your price point (I don't have access to the market right now to check).

From what I've been reading, you have three requirements: cheap, versatile (good slots/scan-bonuses), and powerful in combat. Any given ship will only excel in two categories :) The Tengu is the obvious best ship for the job, being very versatile and very powerful, but it ain't cheap. The Ishkur is middling in all 3. The Imicus is very cheap and very versatile, but is about as powerful as a small malnourished child.

Adyar
Posted - 2011.07.15 19:42:00 - [10]
 

Also don't forget the Gila. It is basically a shield tanked Ishtar. Since you already have Caldari Cruiser V and probably Gal Cruiser 4 you would get most of the drone bonus out of it. Then you will not have to wait the full 19 days to get gal cruiser 5, although it would provide an additional bonus to your drones.

It is a little bit pricey, but generally cheaper than Ishtar. Plus on a side note with the skills you probably already have you can run level 4 missions with it as well.

mxzf
Minmatar
Shovel Bros
Posted - 2011.07.15 20:01:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Adyar
Also don't forget the Gila. It is basically a shield tanked Ishtar. Since you already have Caldari Cruiser V and probably Gal Cruiser 4 you would get most of the drone bonus out of it. Then you will not have to wait the full 19 days to get gal cruiser 5, although it would provide an additional bonus to your drones.

It is a little bit pricey, but generally cheaper than Ishtar. Plus on a side note with the skills you probably already have you can run level 4 missions with it as well.


I'd actually completely forgotten about the Gila, thanks. It's a bit out of my price range right now ('till I can actually find some stuff to sell), but that's definitely a ship to keep in mind. I think that'd be second only to the Tengu for me, since it plays off all my best skills (shield, missiles, and drones).

I think my current plan is to try out probing with the Ishkur and see how tough it is to get a lock on stuff tonight. If it's manageable, I think I'll stick with that in highsec for now, and right now I plan to work towards the Gila and Tengu (I have the skills for both, I just need more ISK). Hopefully by the time I'm in one of those with the ISK to spare, some corp-mates will have the ISK/skills to bring BCs and help out in clearing lowsec plexes.

Thank you everyone for your helpful advice, and feel free to post more stuff if you think of it (especially about how much probe strength you actually need to lock down stuff).

Sam Redshift
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.15 21:51:00 - [12]
 

Edited by: Sam Redshift on 15/07/2011 21:52:47
Search forum or google Gila exploration ship or Gila versus Ishtar.

The guristas faction cruiser combines Caldari/Gallente features with awesome shield tank and max drone dps to do most plexes. Couple of pilots say it is an excellent all-in-one exploration ship short of a Tengu .. easier skill and isk wise anyway.

I fly also Gallente/Caldari and plan Imicus->Vexor->Ishtar->Gila->Tengu Cool

Akuma Tsukai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.07.16 04:37:00 - [13]
 

change that last one to rattlesnake and ur good to go :)
Why people so obsessed with tengu i have no idea, all that ship has is omfg tank.

DemetRYS
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2011.07.16 05:44:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Akuma Tsukai
change that last one to rattlesnake and ur good to go :)
Why people so obsessed with tengu i have no idea, all that ship has is omfg tank.


Quoting sweet irony.

Julien Brellier
Posted - 2011.07.16 12:14:00 - [15]
 

I've had success using a Huginn for exploration.
T2 resists, plenty of mid slots for analyzers and codebreakers, plenty of highs for weapons, cloak and salvager.

Stack'em High
Posted - 2011.07.16 13:00:00 - [16]
 

I started high sec exploration in a heron and a drake. Then got into a Cov Ops and a full T2 Drake. I ran high sec sites (DED and Radar) in an AF, even stealing the 'drop' from under the Tengu farmers Very Happy

Then got into a Gila for low sec 'raids' - it's an excellent ship.

Also, if you're willing to risk low sec why not run C!/C2 wormholesQuestion You'll make tons more ISK than high sec exploration ugh

Mintala Arana
Amarr
Posted - 2011.07.16 14:00:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Julien Brellier
I've had success using a Huginn for exploration.
I don't suppose you'd be willing to share a fit? I've used force recons for exploration (Pilgrim, Rapier), but not a combat recon.

mxzf
Minmatar
Shovel Bros
Posted - 2011.07.16 14:22:00 - [18]
 

Well, I went out wandering around for a bit in my Ishkur fitted with probe launcher and Codebreaker and I have to say it performed admirably. I found a Radar site, a Angel Hideout, and an Angel Watch and I was able to run them all fine (the Watch took atleast an hour to solo, but I was able to permatank it easily and kept full shield (I'm running a speed+shield booster tank). And I didn't mind it taking so long, the feeling of accomplishment was similar to when I soloed a BS rat in lowsec with a crappy Rifter fit). I have also noticed I'm having to use more probes to get a lock on targets, but it's not so bad once you get used to it (if I didn't know about Shift and Alt though, it'd be miserable, lol).

I did actually get an escalation from the Hideout, but it petered out after the first room, which is the second time that's happened to me. Which makes me wonder, how often does escalations make it all the way through? Have I just been unlucky that both of mine died, or is it only like 5% that make it all the way to where you can get real money?

In a further note, I've actually moved my exploration along a bit (since I have everything on one ship) and I'm going to try working a bit in a highsec pocket, we'll see how it goes; there do seem to be MANY more sites, and I don't have any issue flying a AF around in lowsec, I know how to avoid people decently.



Originally by: Stack'em High
I started high sec exploration in a heron and a drake. Then got into a Cov Ops and a full T2 Drake. I ran high sec sites (DED and Radar) in an AF, even stealing the 'drop' from under the Tengu farmers Very Happy

Then got into a Gila for low sec 'raids' - it's an excellent ship.

Also, if you're willing to risk low sec why not run C!/C2 wormholesQuestion You'll make tons more ISK than high sec exploration ugh


Yeah, I've done a bit of lowsec exploration in a Drake. And I do absolutely love my Drake, but there's no escaping the truth, it's a brick. I like ships with a bit more get-up-and-go if I can get them. I'll probably still use my Drake for running lowsec stuff, and any highsec stuff where it's nearby, but I like roaming in a faster ship.

And I have done some low level WHs, but when you're doing that it's a bit more work to go and make sure there aren't people already living there and such. And I did live in a C1 wormhole by myself for a bit, and I might do so again sometime, but doing it solo (since all of my corp are miners and didn't want to risk it) is quite a lot of work, even with a small POS and PI going. And when I ended up taking a break from Eve for a bit (partially intentionally, partially because my account ran out), someone popped the POS and I lost a ton of stuff (~1-2B worth, including my first Tengu). I'm still working on building my ISK back up after that.

Tabernack en Chasteaux
Posted - 2011.07.16 21:20:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: mxzf
I did actually get an escalation from the Hideout, but it petered out after the first room, which is the second time that's happened to me. Which makes me wonder, how often does escalations make it all the way through? Have I just been unlucky that both of mine died, or is it only like 5% that make it all the way to where you can get real money?


In my experience, getting the initial escalation is the uncommon part, and having it continue to the final stage is pretty common by comparison. Good loot still isn't guaranteed, though. All parts of the escalation tend to have faction spawns as well -- I got a Succubus blueprint from the second stage of Nation on the Rise.

mxzf
Minmatar
Shovel Bros
Posted - 2011.07.16 22:38:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Tabernack en Chasteaux
Originally by: mxzf
I did actually get an escalation from the Hideout, but it petered out after the first room, which is the second time that's happened to me. Which makes me wonder, how often does escalations make it all the way through? Have I just been unlucky that both of mine died, or is it only like 5% that make it all the way to where you can get real money?


In my experience, getting the initial escalation is the uncommon part, and having it continue to the final stage is pretty common by comparison. Good loot still isn't guaranteed, though. All parts of the escalation tend to have faction spawns as well -- I got a Succubus blueprint from the second stage of Nation on the Rise.


Ok, maybe it was just my bad luck that all 3 escalations I've gotten have died out after the first stage. Unless I'm understanding them wrong that is, they do show up in the Journal in the same place that the first escalation does, right?

Mintala Arana
Amarr
Posted - 2011.07.17 12:29:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: mxzf
Ok, maybe it was just my bad luck that all 3 escalations I've gotten have died out after the first stage. Unless I'm understanding them wrong that is, they do show up in the Journal in the same place that the first escalation does, right?
Yes. An escalation has a good chance of petering out at any stage.

DeMichael Crimson
Minmatar
Republic University
Posted - 2011.07.17 13:13:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: mxzf

In a further note, I've actually moved my exploration along a bit (since I have everything on one ship) and I'm going to try working a bit in a highsec pocket, we'll see how it goes; there do seem to be MANY more sites, and I don't have any issue flying a AF around in lowsec, I know how to avoid people decently.


I seen you at the Island mon.

Very Happy

I got there about the time you were getting close to completion and you did a good job...



A little friendly advice - please do not make any more reference's to High Sec Pockets, Region names, lot's of sites, etc.

Mums the word.

Wink

mxzf
Minmatar
Shovel Bros
Posted - 2011.07.17 23:57:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: DeMichael Crimson
Originally by: mxzf

In a further note, I've actually moved my exploration along a bit (since I have everything on one ship) and I'm going to try working a bit in a highsec pocket, we'll see how it goes; there do seem to be MANY more sites, and I don't have any issue flying a AF around in lowsec, I know how to avoid people decently.


I seen you at the Island mon.

Very Happy

I got there about the time you were getting close to completion and you did a good job...



A little friendly advice - please do not make any more reference's to High Sec Pockets, Region names, lot's of sites, etc.

Mums the word.

Wink


lol, yeah, I remember seeing you. Feel free to say hi sometime, I don't bite, lol.

Headerman
Minmatar
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2011.07.18 01:28:00 - [24]
 

What about an armour tanked cane? that could do the job ok

Flakey Foont
Posted - 2011.07.18 03:12:00 - [25]
 

Edited by: Flakey Foont on 18/07/2011 03:13:16
Edited by: Flakey Foont on 18/07/2011 03:12:39
For high sec this will work:


[Hurricane, FF Armor]
Armor Explosive Hardener I
Armor Explosive Hardener I
Medium Armor Repairer I


Cap Recharger II


Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Y-S8 Hydrocarbon I Afterburners

650mm Medium 'Scout' Artillery I, EMP M
650mm Medium 'Scout' Artillery I, EMP M
650mm Medium 'Scout' Artillery I, EMP M
650mm Medium 'Scout' Artillery I, EMP M
650mm Medium 'Scout' Artillery I, EMP M
Prototype Cloaking Device I
Expanded Probe Launcher I, Core Scanner Probe I
I would use Sisters gear to offset lack of bonus.

Medium Projectile Collision Accelerator I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Medium Nanobot Accelerator I


Warrior I x4


 

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