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Kostolany
Gallente
TunDraGon
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.07.13 08:08:00 - [1]
 

In my blog you will find a selection of the best and trustworthiest investments of EvE-Online. In future we will translate all sites to english.
We want to secure this unreglemented market a bit in the future.
The tables are all easy to understand in in english, only the blog is german.

So if you are interested in that business, feel free to join our community on the blog, in our ingame channel our via mailinglist.

Kostolany's Blog

Serene Python
Posted - 2011.07.13 08:24:00 - [2]
 

And what makes you trustworthy enough to tell investors who is trustable or not?

Chevalleis
The Legendary Conquest
Posted - 2011.07.13 08:34:00 - [3]
 

We haze Moody's in eve?

Kaethe Kollwitz
Posted - 2011.07.13 08:45:00 - [4]
 

interesting service.

The answer, as it has always been is:

none.

Kostolany
Gallente
TunDraGon
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.07.13 08:46:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Serene Python
And what makes you trustworthy enough to tell investors who is trustable or not?


It's only your choice. Many people in EvE knows me long time and real life, too. So it's already your decision. You don't have to ;-)
My service is for people they want it, if you don't want, feel free to do your thing.

Kind regards

NotTheSmartestCookie
Posted - 2011.07.13 09:29:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Serene Python
And what makes you trustworthy enough to tell investors who is trustable or not?


But he is in Pandemic Legion. EVEs most trusted name since *erm* ...

Chevalleis
The Legendary Conquest
Posted - 2011.07.13 10:00:00 - [7]
 

Goonswarm.

RAW23
Posted - 2011.07.13 10:26:00 - [8]
 

This service could have some potential. However, at the moment it looks a little ... shall we say, 'eccentric'? Having PhaserInc as your top rated investment is a bit odd and there seems to be a general bias towards investments that pay very high interest rates (that you categorise by 'weekly interest' rather than monthly puts this a bit out of the mainstream of itself) and are not based on MD. There is also the issue of you adding rating points to investments that pay you to audit them. Not only does this raise the spectre of a conflict of interests but there is also a question of competence and trust. Could you link anything that might serve as evidence that you are both capable of carrying out a proper audit and that you can be trusted on this front?

In short, it might look a bit more compelling when you have some mainstream offerings listed there as at least this will make it easier to calibrate one's understanding of how you rank those that are currently covered.

Krythas
Posted - 2011.07.13 10:33:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Krythas on 13/07/2011 10:33:11
I clicked and saw phaser inc. and lol'd

I'd be quite interested in your reasoning behind listing them as trustworthy. How do you gauge trust ?

Serene Python
Posted - 2011.07.13 10:34:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: NotTheSmartestCookie
Originally by: Serene Python
And what makes you trustworthy enough to tell investors who is trustable or not?


But he is in Pandemic Legion. EVEs most trusted name since *erm* ...

Originally by: Chevalleis
Goonswarm.


lol'd

Originally by: Kostolany
Originally by: Serene Python
And what makes you trustworthy enough to tell investors who is trustable or not?


It's only your choice. Many people in EvE knows me long time and real life, too. So it's already your decision. You don't have to ;-)
My service is for people they want it, if you don't want, feel free to do your thing.

Kind regards


Works for me :P

Kostolany
Gallente
TunDraGon
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.07.13 12:06:00 - [11]
 

First of all,

i rate only investments, that i signed by my own. That's basicly.
On the other side may audits are very young and for testing at moment. MD is o.k., but not my way to give my money to other people to work with it.

I want to have a weekly income to pay my way of EvE-life ;-)

The way to assess trustworthness is mainly based on weekly payouts. For example:
I invest 1 bn and get a weekly interest of 5%. That meens, that the ROI is after 20 weeks. After every weekly payment my trust to this company is going a bit higher.

It's impossible to ensure such business, but we have several ways to reduce risk. If you know EvE-Companies, which are more trustable than the ones in my chart, feel free to post it here. Maybe i will try an investment to find out scam ;-)

Krythas
Posted - 2011.07.13 12:57:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Kostolany
First of all,

i rate only investments, that i signed by my own. That's basicly.
On the other side may audits are very young and for testing at moment. MD is o.k., but not my way to give my money to other people to work with it.

I want to have a weekly income to pay my way of EvE-life ;-)

The way to assess trustworthness is mainly based on weekly payouts. For example:
I invest 1 bn and get a weekly interest of 5%. That meens, that the ROI is after 20 weeks. After every weekly payment my trust to this company is going a bit higher.

It's impossible to ensure such business, but we have several ways to reduce risk. If you know EvE-Companies, which are more trustable than the ones in my chart, feel free to post it here. Maybe i will try an investment to find out scam ;-)



I think you have a funny understanding of the word 'trust'

Kostolany
Gallente
TunDraGon
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.07.17 15:51:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Krythas
Originally by: Kostolany
First of all,

i rate only investments, that i signed by my own. That's basicly.
On the other side may audits are very young and for testing at moment. MD is o.k., but not my way to give my money to other people to work with it.

I want to have a weekly income to pay my way of EvE-life ;-)

The way to assess trustworthness is mainly based on weekly payouts. For example:
I invest 1 bn and get a weekly interest of 5%. That meens, that the ROI is after 20 weeks. After every weekly payment my trust to this company is going a bit higher.

It's impossible to ensure such business, but we have several ways to reduce risk. If you know EvE-Companies, which are more trustable than the ones in my chart, feel free to post it here. Maybe i will try an investment to find out scam ;-)



I think you have a funny understanding of the word 'trust'


Did you mean syntax or semantic? Maybe confidence will be better? I don't understand your statement, sry.

Brock Nelson
Posted - 2011.07.17 16:52:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Kostolany
The way to assess trustworthness is mainly based on weekly payouts. For example:
I invest 1 bn and get a weekly interest of 5%. That meens, that the ROI is after 20 weeks. After every weekly payment my trust to this company is going a bit higher.


So, did you get your investment back from any of the investment you made?

Kaelie Onren
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.18 07:52:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Kostolany
First of all,

i rate only investments, that i signed by my own. That's basicly.
On the other side may audits are very young and for testing at moment. MD is o.k., but not my way to give my money to other people to work with it.

I want to have a weekly income to pay my way of EvE-life ;-)

The way to assess trustworthness is mainly based on weekly payouts. For example:
I invest 1 bn and get a weekly interest of 5%. That meens, that the ROI is after 20 weeks. After every weekly payment my trust to this company is going a bit higher.

It's impossible to ensure such business, but we have several ways to reduce risk. If you know EvE-Companies, which are more trustable than the ones in my chart, feel free to post it here. Maybe i will try an investment to find out scam ;-)



some fundamental problems with your method:

companies know that you are the auditor, so they would be stupid to scam you. That doesn't mean that they don't scam others.

You are building trust on consistent coupon payments.... which is good, but you are only counting coupon payments to YOU. A companies credit rating should be based on its ability to pay ALL of its investors on schedule. Not 1.

You should not be taking any money from the companies for your service. That is conflict of interest. You should instead charge people to subscribe to your ratings. You need to rate ALL companies. Not just ones you invest in yourself.

You could in theory setup an investment registry which will allow investments to be registered and a place given to people who can complain about failure to pay or breach of trust, and then you can rank investments on how long they have been running without any such complaints. Each new complaint will need to be investigated by you (this is where you earn your pay) and if valid it shows up as a strike against the company.

But this would likely be a full time job.

Florestan Bronstein
24th Imperial Crusade
Posted - 2011.07.18 08:20:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Kaelie Onren

You are building trust on consistent coupon payments.... which is good, but you are only counting coupon payments to YOU. A companies credit rating should be based on its ability to pay ALL of its investors on schedule. Not 1.

"building trust on consistent coupon payments" is not good, it's foolish. Any ponzi scheme can pass that benchmark.

assessing the companies' ability to pay its investors is a better idea.


Faith Clothos
Posted - 2011.07.18 11:36:00 - [17]
 

The ability to pay back doesn't matter either. There is nothing that will make someone that doesnt want to give your money back do so.

The only right answer is : none. Twisted Evil

Kostolany
Gallente
TunDraGon
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.07.18 18:19:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Kaelie Onren
Originally by: Kostolany
First of all,

i rate only investments, that i signed by my own. That's basicly.
On the other side may audits are very young and for testing at moment. MD is o.k., but not my way to give my money to other people to work with it.

I want to have a weekly income to pay my way of EvE-life ;-)

The way to assess trustworthness is mainly based on weekly payouts. For example:
I invest 1 bn and get a weekly interest of 5%. That meens, that the ROI is after 20 weeks. After every weekly payment my trust to this company is going a bit higher.

It's impossible to ensure such business, but we have several ways to reduce risk. If you know EvE-Companies, which are more trustable than the ones in my chart, feel free to post it here. Maybe i will try an investment to find out scam ;-)



some fundamental problems with your method:

companies know that you are the auditor, so they would be stupid to scam you. That doesn't mean that they don't scam others.

You are building trust on consistent coupon payments.... which is good, but you are only counting coupon payments to YOU. A companies credit rating should be based on its ability to pay ALL of its investors on schedule. Not 1.

You should not be taking any money from the companies for your service. That is conflict of interest. You should instead charge people to subscribe to your ratings. You need to rate ALL companies. Not just ones you invest in yourself.

You could in theory setup an investment registry which will allow investments to be registered and a place given to people who can complain about failure to pay or breach of trust, and then you can rank investments on how long they have been running without any such complaints. Each new complaint will need to be investigated by you (this is where you earn your pay) and if valid it shows up as a strike against the company.

But this would likely be a full time job.



Many thanks for your mind. Sounds logic. I will think about that and will diskuss it with other investors to include these options instead of.

To the negatives here: your postings are dispensable and unqualified.

I got no money back... whatfor? I want to get interest week for week for week... that's the idea of longterm investment. Maybe it works, good for me, maybe not i will loose isk - who cares? But some of the negative people here will lough ;-) but who cares?

No risk, no fun... and its only a game, guys. So feel free and relax a bit.

Kostolany's Blog

Cyaxares II
Posted - 2011.07.18 21:40:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Kostolany
Maybe it works, good for me, maybe not i will loose isk - who cares? But some of the negative people here will lough ;-) but who cares?

You pretend that you can gauge the risk of an investment failing and bet what little rep you have here on the accuracy of these predictions.

You make big claims and while we don't take you seriously (you are not the first one to try this after all) we are of course curious about the train-wreck your project could become (imagine people investing because of your predictions, then getting scammed, claiming you were an alt of the scammers to begin with, ... there is def. some potential for drama here; if nothing else we will get to point fingers and laugh at you).

Trying to chicken-out by saying "I didn't care anyways, not serious, trololol" before the fun has even started is just meh...

Thomas Phillippe
Posted - 2011.07.18 22:44:00 - [20]
 

trusting pandemic legion is always a good idea.

i'm in.

Kaelie Onren
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.19 15:56:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Florestan Bronstein
Originally by: Kaelie Onren

You are building trust on consistent coupon payments.... which is good, but you are only counting coupon payments to YOU. A companies credit rating should be based on its ability to pay ALL of its investors on schedule. Not 1.

"building trust on consistent coupon payments" is not good, it's foolish. Any ponzi scheme can pass that benchmark.

assessing the companies' ability to pay its investors is a better idea.




You are of course correct, it's a 'better' approach, but not possible at all times**. "foolish" ?? Hate to break it to you, but your RL credit industry is built around the fact that your credit rating gets better the more bills you pay on time. It's a tried and true method. SURE, ponzi schemes can pass this test for a while, but they will sputter out eventually. Especially if new joiners are capped. So the very simple way of putting a corp to the test is if they showed their books, and membership, and capped it, they should be able to pay their debts still. If not, they are a ponzi.

**The key fact that you missed, is of course, balance sheet auditing is only feasible for public companies. Private ones, including individuals, can only have their credit worthiness gauged by 'external' means.

Corps like Phaser and other bonds in EVE are essentially asking for venture cap funding, without any business plan or explanation to the investors. This makes for terrible investments, but does not preclude the small chance that there are legit funds out there. But my personally litmus test is, if they can't explain to you how they make their money, then steer clear.




 

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