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blankseplocked Tired of paying for sup par expansions?
 
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Cipher Jones
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.11 15:43:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Cipher Jones on 11/07/2011 15:43:40
You're not.

Originally by: EULA
E. New Releases of the Software
You are not entitled to receive any new releases of the Software, or any expansion packs, updates, upgrades or similar products under the EULA, but CCP may, in its sole discretion, offer any or all of the foregoing to you. CCP may update, upgrade or otherwise enhance the Software at any time, in its sole discretion, without obligation to you. Periodically, CCP will require all users to migrate to new releases of the Software in order to continue accessing the System and playing EVE. You will be informed when a new release is available and will have a period of time in which to procure and install the new release. You must install and use the new release before the period of time has lapsed to continue accessing the System and playing EVE. If you fail to install the new release when required, CCP shall not be responsible in any way for your inability to access the System or play EVE, and you shall not be entitled to receive a refund of any prepaid subscription fees or any other form of compensation. New releases could be offered to you at a discounted price.



Reading is fundamental.

Abrazzar
Posted - 2011.07.11 15:48:00 - [2]
 

My PLEXes run out January. Until then they'll have to put up with me.

Khamal Jolstien
Caldari
THORN Syndicate
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2011.07.11 15:49:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Cipher Jones
Edited by: Cipher Jones on 11/07/2011 15:43:40
You're not.

Originally by: EULA
E. New Releases of the Software
You are not entitled to receive any new releases of the Software, or any expansion packs, updates, upgrades or similar products under the EULA, but CCP may, in its sole discretion, offer any or all of the foregoing to you. CCP may update, upgrade or otherwise enhance the Software at any time, in its sole discretion, without obligation to you. Periodically, CCP will require all users to migrate to new releases of the Software in order to continue accessing the System and playing EVE. You will be informed when a new release is available and will have a period of time in which to procure and install the new release. You must install and use the new release before the period of time has lapsed to continue accessing the System and playing EVE. If you fail to install the new release when required, CCP shall not be responsible in any way for your inability to access the System or play EVE, and you shall not be entitled to receive a refund of any prepaid subscription fees or any other form of compensation. New releases could be offered to you at a discounted price.



Reading is fundamental.


Just because they tell you you're not paying for it, doesn't mean you're not.

$15/mo still isn't free.

Amsterdam Conversations
Posted - 2011.07.11 15:50:00 - [4]
 

Wow you can read the EULA, you're super smart.

Wait, you're not.

Cipher Jones
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.11 15:52:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Cipher Jones on 11/07/2011 15:54:28
Originally by: Amsterdam Conversations
Wow you can read the EULA, you're super smart.

Wait, you're not.


The problem is that there are people running around who think they are both super smart and entitled. I was just attempting to thwart some of that.

For example look at this quote:

Quote:
Just because they tell you you're not paying for it, doesn't mean you're not.



ChaeDoc II
Gallente
Sigillum Militum Xpisti
Important Internet Spaceship League
Posted - 2011.07.11 15:59:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Khamal Jolstien
Originally by: Cipher Jones
Edited by: Cipher Jones on 11/07/2011 15:43:40
You're not.

Originally by: EULA
E. New Releases of the Software
You are not entitled to receive any new releases of the Software, or any expansion packs, updates, upgrades or similar products under the EULA, but CCP may, in its sole discretion, offer any or all of the foregoing to you. CCP may update, upgrade or otherwise enhance the Software at any time, in its sole discretion, without obligation to you. Periodically, CCP will require all users to migrate to new releases of the Software in order to continue accessing the System and playing EVE. You will be informed when a new release is available and will have a period of time in which to procure and install the new release. You must install and use the new release before the period of time has lapsed to continue accessing the System and playing EVE. If you fail to install the new release when required, CCP shall not be responsible in any way for your inability to access the System or play EVE, and you shall not be entitled to receive a refund of any prepaid subscription fees or any other form of compensation. New releases could be offered to you at a discounted price.



Reading is fundamental.


Just because they tell you you're not paying for it, doesn't mean you're not.

$15/mo still isn't free.


Sure, you're paying for it but you're not paying to get it.

Tutskii
Posted - 2011.07.11 16:01:00 - [7]
 

http://www.eveonline.com/features/

Quote:
EVE Online is host to the largest virtual universe in the world, and is the fastest-growing Massively Multi-Player Online Game (MMPOG) of the genre. Set tens of thousands of years in the future, EVE is a breathtaking journey to the stars, to an immersive experience filled with adventure, riches, danger, and glory.


Massively multiplayer
Epic 5,000 solar system persistent single universe
Dynamic player controlled economy
Exclusive offline skill advancement
Unmatched versatility in game play
Free expansions and game enhancements included with subscription

Abrazzar
Posted - 2011.07.11 16:04:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Tutskii

Free expansions and game enhancements included with subscription

They're no longer really free when you have to pay for access to the content on top of normal subscription fees.

Tutskii
Posted - 2011.07.11 16:12:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Tutskii on 11/07/2011 16:19:17
Originally by: Abrazzar
Originally by: Tutskii

Free expansions and game enhancements included with subscription

They're no longer really free when you have to pay for access to the content on top of normal subscription fees.


I'd say that they are not free at all because they are one of the advertised features of the game, and the EULA simply gives them an out should they want to change this.

In this usage "free" means that there is no additional charge for them, not that there is no charge for them whatsoever (as there is an ongoing charge to access the game at all).

There is no denying that the expansions are one of the main selling points of the game, however.

Wile EC
Posted - 2011.07.11 16:12:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Abrazzar
Originally by: Tutskii

Free expansions and game enhancements included with subscription

They're no longer really free when you have to pay for access to the content on top of normal subscription fees.


Drugs are bad, they make you stupid, like your post.

baltec1
Posted - 2011.07.11 16:13:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Abrazzar
Originally by: Tutskii

Free expansions and game enhancements included with subscription

They're no longer really free when you have to pay for access to the content on top of normal subscription fees.


What content do I have to pay extra for exactly?

Abrazzar
Posted - 2011.07.11 16:13:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Wile EC
Originally by: Abrazzar
Originally by: Tutskii

Free expansions and game enhancements included with subscription

They're no longer really free when you have to pay for access to the content on top of normal subscription fees.


Drugs are bad, they make you stupid, like your post.

I see you're a veteran from first hand experience.

Wile EC
Posted - 2011.07.11 16:17:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Abrazzar
Originally by: Wile EC
Originally by: Abrazzar
Originally by: Tutskii

Free expansions and game enhancements included with subscription

They're no longer really free when you have to pay for access to the content on top of normal subscription fees.


Drugs are bad, they make you stupid, like your post.

I see you're a veteran from first hand experience.


News flash, EVERYONE knows you can buy the new items with ISK, NO ONE except the pouting children and druggies, is dumb enough to fall for your implication that AUR items are part of the game cost.


Cipher Jones
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.11 16:26:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Tutskii
http://www.eveonline.com/features/

Quote:
EVE Online is host to the largest virtual universe in the world, and is the fastest-growing Massively Multi-Player Online Game (MMPOG) of the genre. Set tens of thousands of years in the future, EVE is a breathtaking journey to the stars, to an immersive experience filled with adventure, riches, danger, and glory.


Massively multiplayer
Epic 5,000 solar system persistent single universe
Dynamic player controlled economy
Exclusive offline skill advancement
Unmatched versatility in game play
Free expansions and game enhancements included with subscription



They have already provided 15 expansions and are in no way obligated to provide more. Just saying read and understand.

Oyuki Sada
Posted - 2011.07.11 17:35:00 - [15]
 

Well someones been paying for the expansions. If not us then who? Some anonymous benefactor?

Cipher Jones
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.11 17:41:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Oyuki Sada
Well someones been paying for the expansions. If not us then who? Some anonymous benefactor?


CCP, obviously.

Oyuki Sada
Posted - 2011.07.11 17:51:00 - [17]
 

I see, so the devs are volunteers working for tea and biscuits.

Rion Deteisan
Posted - 2011.07.11 17:55:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Oyuki Sada
Well someones been paying for the expansions. If not us then who? Some anonymous benefactor?


We pay for access to ccp's product. They then take that money to spend it as they please.

Ever hear of a GTC (Game Time Code)? You pay for game time. CCP takes that money and pays people to do stuff. CCP owes you one thing as a business - game time. The obligation has been fulfilled when your account management page reflects the amount of game time you have purchased.

Simetraz
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:07:00 - [19]
 

Just thinking about other MMO's I have played.

There you buy a box for new content if you want to see the new area's.
IF not you deal with the current content and that is it.

Then something like Mechwarrior where if you wanted to use other mechs you had to buy another box.

So what CCP could have done besides charge the monthly fee like every other MMO.
Want T3 cruisers buy the expansion
Want to enter worm holes buy the expansion
Want to use captains quarters buy the expansion
Want to use capital ships buy the expansion
Want to use ore t2 and ore capitals buy the expansion
Want to use super capitals buy the expansion

Want t3 frigates buy the expansion
Want all kinds of things they could have charged you a 5 dollars/euro here or there a small charge for each one.
CCP could have been MTing or forcing you to buy boxes for years.

It still wouldn't change SOV changes or graphics updates are all still patches and are going to happen to support new content.
Changes in ships or guns or cyno or anything still are going to happen.
Those come under the base monthly charge.

But whatever.

Gabba Tron
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:10:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Amsterdam Conversations
Wow you can read the EULA, you're super smart.

Wait, you're not.


Holy ****, your avatar is as ugly as mine!

B00T INI
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:11:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Cipher Jones
Reading is fundamental.

So is spelling but that doesn't stop you making dumb posts trying to imply others are stupid.

Simetraz
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:16:00 - [22]
 

OH wait let take this one step farther sense the game mechanics already exist as far as ships.

Let just move ship skill books over to to the NEX.
Hmmm wouldn't that be interesting.

CCP could do a lot of things, you might just want to think twice about complaining about expansions you don't pay for.



Avon
Caldari
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:18:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Wile EC

News flash, EVERYONE knows you can buy the new items with ISK, NO ONE except the pouting children and druggies, is dumb enough to fall for your implication that AUR items are part of the game cost.




Well, to a point. Someone has to splash some extra bucks at some stage to get those items in to the game (either by buying plex directly, or buying plex for ISK - in which case the person who originally put the plex in to the game stumped up the $$), even if they are eventually resold for ISK.

Ultimately all NEX items have, at some stage, given money above and beyond the normal subscription income to CCP and so, by that definition, the items introduced in the "free" expansion can only be used if someone pays $ for them.

I'm not saying that I am bothered by it at this stage, but I get Abrazzar's point.

Amsterdam Conversations
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:23:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Gabba Tron
Originally by: Amsterdam Conversations
Wow you can read the EULA, you're super smart.

Wait, you're not.


Holy ****, your avatar is as ugly as mine!


But I stole your hair.

Cipher Jones
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:32:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: B00T INI
Originally by: Cipher Jones
Reading is fundamental.

So is spelling but that doesn't stop you making dumb posts trying to imply others are stupid.


Just because you are making inferences does not mean I am making implications.

TBH there is a difference between ignorance and stupidity, but intentional ignorance is debilitating. I am just trying to stop some of the deliberate ignorance.



chardeth
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:34:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: chardeth on 11/07/2011 18:34:37

Khamelean
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:37:00 - [27]
 

Your subscription fee is to cover access to the servers and to cover previous development costs. Plus you choose to give a little bit of profit to CCP because you like what they do.

If you don't like what they do, stop paying.

Oyuki Sada
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:38:00 - [28]
 

CCP can do what they like. But if the majority of customers have an expectation for ongoing development, and they don't deliver on that expectation, CCP wears that risk.

They can push the EULA in front of the customer's face all they like, but if the service they offer is not acceptable, the customer walks (as many are doing). That's business, quite simple.


Khamelean
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:42:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Oyuki Sada
CCP can do what they like. But if the majority of customers have an expectation for ongoing development, and they don't deliver on that expectation, CCP wears that risk.

They can push the EULA in front of the customer's face all they like, but if the service they offer is not acceptable, the customer walks (as many are doing). That's business, quite simple.




Indeed it is business, how successful would a business be if it continually tried to cater to customers with unreasonable expectations? There are some customers who are simply more trouble then they are worth.

jackaloped
Posted - 2011.07.11 18:46:00 - [30]
 

I think the op misses the point.

I don't think anyone ever claimed that ccp could legally abandon development of gameplay in eve in favor of incarnatransactions, dust and wod.

Its certainly legal for ccp to do this.

However knowing CCP is going to do this, makes allot of players reconsider what they do with their time and money in relation to eve.


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