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Tla Atij
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:24:00 - [1051]
 

Edited by: Tla Atij on 27/06/2011 10:24:26
1. Claim there have been no plans to sell non-vanity items.
2. Claim there are currently no plans to sell non-vanity items.
3. Let some time pass.
4. Make plans to sell non-vanity items.
5. Sell non-vanity items.
6. (there is no 6)
7. Profit.

Weak.

DarkTemplarCrimsonWolf
Amarr
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:32:00 - [1052]
 

It will take years of NeX vanity only items to redeem yourself CCP and even one hint of non-vanity will cause an even bigger threadnaught to spawn and even more subscriber $$ to go away.

Morar Santee
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:33:00 - [1053]
 

Originally by: Buzzmong
@Trebor Daehdoow, Seleene, Mittens and the rest of the CSM:

When you get to Iceland, state unequivocally that:

1) Doing things outside of the CSM knowing (Nex prices) or completely ignoring the CSM (last dev blog) is a massive no-no and not only undermines the entire point of the CSM, but upsets the playerbase even more.

2) Full removal of the NeX store is the only way to fully go back and make up for this sheer sh*tstorm and restore the trust of the playerbase due to it being the only way to remove shadow of P2W that will now loom over EvE (actions speak louder than words).

3) It should always have been Space->Hanger->(optional) Captains Quarters+WiS, and it needs to be implemented as such due to CCP's own lore. It's especially important due to the performance issues people have been having and the fact the release of CQ is only 25% complete. It's up to CCP to develop features in CQ/WiS that want to make us leave the pods (they are planning on this anyway)

4) Communication needs to be improved massively. The current rules about Dev's not being able to speak their minds needs to be chucked out the window and the rules about not speaking on topics they don't know relaxed so that people can at least put some blue bars and go "I'll find out for you from the proper scrum team".

5) The Playerbase needs concrete information on what CCP's plans are with Incarna and it's expansions, and *needs* to find out what CCP are doing to fix the big problems with the core spaceship game.

I'll EvEmail this as well to the CSM members as I suspect you'll miss this.


Bears repeating. Would be good if CSM were able to cover these points during their meeting. Because Zulu's devblog sure didn't.

Jannx
Gallente
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:40:00 - [1054]
 

Edited by: Jannx on 27/06/2011 11:05:27
Originally by: Morar Santee
Originally by: Buzzmong
@Trebor Daehdoow, Seleene, Mittens and the rest of the CSM:

When you get to Iceland...


Bears repeating. Would be good if CSM were able to cover these points during their meeting. Because Zulu's devblog sure didn't.

Sorry to be a pain, but is there a place that lists links to the current CSM's blogs?

DarkTemplarCrimsonWolf
Amarr
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:42:00 - [1055]
 

Originally by: Morar Santee
Originally by: Buzzmong
@Trebor Daehdoow, Seleene, Mittens and the rest of the CSM:

When you get to Iceland, state unequivocally that:

1) Doing things outside of the CSM knowing (Nex prices) or completely ignoring the CSM (last dev blog) is a massive no-no and not only undermines the entire point of the CSM, but upsets the playerbase even more.

2) Full removal of the NeX store is the only way to fully go back and make up for this sheer sh*tstorm and restore the trust of the playerbase due to it being the only way to remove shadow of P2W that will now loom over EvE (actions speak louder than words).

3) It should always have been Space->Hanger->(optional) Captains Quarters+WiS, and it needs to be implemented as such due to CCP's own lore. It's especially important due to the performance issues people have been having and the fact the release of CQ is only 25% complete. It's up to CCP to develop features in CQ/WiS that want to make us leave the pods (they are planning on this anyway)

4) Communication needs to be improved massively. The current rules about Dev's not being able to speak their minds needs to be chucked out the window and the rules about not speaking on topics they don't know relaxed so that people can at least put some blue bars and go "I'll find out for you from the proper scrum team".

5) The Playerbase needs concrete information on what CCP's plans are with Incarna and it's expansions, and *needs* to find out what CCP are doing to fix the big problems with the core spaceship game.

I'll EvEmail this as well to the CSM members as I suspect you'll miss this.


Bears repeating. Would be good if CSM were able to cover these points during their meeting. Because Zulu's devblog sure didn't.


Here here.

I would like to add in a 6th:
6) Have the devs (along with Hilmar) sign a simple piece of paper with the question with their answer next to their signature: Non-vanity items, yes or no.. This will tell us right away if it's planned and a scanned copy should be distributed amongst every fan of EVE, if they ever break their word we send said document to a gamer publication.
This will not be legally binding in anyway, it would just be a show of good faith from CCP as a whole towards the community and more over will show the company is willing to risk itself for its community.

zzlep Alduin
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:45:00 - [1056]
 

I unsubbed two of my three accounts for other things - this was kinda close to the bone man, I mean clothes and fairy dust are one thing but to pay once for the game and then pay again to have the best items or large amounts of ISK brings in the debate about who exactly plays this game - in money terms my cost of living has risen so much over the last 18 months that i am getting very close to cancelling all together with the game direction - simple put i want to keep the good memories i have rather than the last 12 months that, in my opinion, has seen the game deteriate quicker then the worlds economy.

That being said I will wait for the CSM meeting minutes to decide if CCP have managed to put out the fire, my feeling is this is just the start - its not enough they ruined null sec, which in my opinion makes the Dominion patch completely worthless (shame really I thought it had promise).

We will see,



C4LYP50
Solarwind Interstellar Mining and Production Ltd
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:46:00 - [1057]
 

Edited by: C4LYP50 on 27/06/2011 11:02:30
Originally by: Invier
Soldarius, this is just paranoia.

Have you ever tought about the fact that a char does not have a face because the user did not care about it ?

CCP is not in all things you know ;)


Of course, you DO realize that you cannot log in to play without a face, right? So really, you either haven't played the game (at least on this character), or you are too gutless to polish this turd with your main. GJ.

O/T: What you DO, CCP, trumps what you SAY. I believe that since this blog took you 6 hours to write (with 100% more love) , you chose your ambiguity carefully. Flying the CSM in looks terribly like a delaying tactic. Answer the damn question, in CLEAR and CONCISE language. Thanks.

Edited for clarity (think believe > think)

RaTTuS
BIG
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:46:00 - [1058]
 

as long as it's only pretties I don't care what you sell,
if it makes a game differnece then don't do it.
let them have that in WOD if you want,
eve- leave alone

Majmuna
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:55:00 - [1059]
 

Edited by: Majmuna on 27/06/2011 11:36:40
Curiously enough, Zulu has not convinced me at all.

1) CSM+CCP meeting = buying time.

2) "no gold ammo" =/= "no p2w".

3) "there are and never have been plans to implement..." together with the Fearless newsletter stating "we will..." (for those among you who would like to object "he said it is not official policy and is out of context", well if you write into your corporate magazine a sentence containing "we will do so and so" - that doesnt really sound like internal discussion, does it?)

"Bah" to your "realities", Zulu.

Majmuna out.

EDIT: Although, I must admit that I am thankful for at least such response, and for the "For that I am sorry".

Esceem
Gallente
Suns of New Eden
Posted - 2011.06.27 10:59:00 - [1060]
 

CCP Zulu, I'll make it plain and simple, just for you:

STOP THE GREED!

Hana Steelethorne
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:01:00 - [1061]
 

I'll be watching the actions CCP takes in regards to the issues raised by the kerfuffle over the issues of MT and the leaked 'Fearless' newsletter. But really...flying CSM's to Iceland? They have things like teleconferencing these days.

Angeliq
Minmatar
Soimii Patriei
Vera Cruz Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:01:00 - [1062]
 

Here's a presentation from the creators of BF:Heroes that explains why Hilmar gives no fcks about the forums.

http://www.slideshare.net/bcousins/paying-to-win



This is a very interesting presentation. Everyone should... MUST watch it!

This presentation will tell you why EVE Online WILL have a Cash Shop WITH GAME CHANGING ITEMS beyond vanity ones!!
It shows that the business model works and why it will work in EVE too.



  • For those of you that think this business model can never apply to EVE


1. A business model does not mean that all the details must be exactly the same from one business to another. That's why it's called a model, a template. You need to come up with specific, personalized approaches for your own business. A business model is based on marketing, mass psychology, customer thinking patterns, habits, social behavior, statistics, etc.

2. EVE is P2P! This is not a valid argument. The numbers show that a lot of ppl already bought monocles and clothing and are willing to pay for customization and power items in NEX shop. We are in target. CCP might even try a hybrid dual-pay scheme.

3. It is possible EVE Online will go F2P. Especially if SOE will takes over. Those of you that believe CCP Fallout, it's your choice, I don't give a fck... BUUUT DUST514 for PS3 only! Hello!?! SOE has invested a lot of time (and money) in this project.

Here is John Smedley, President of SOE answering a question (full interwiew HERE)
Q: So you don't think that sandboxes (and sandbox systems) are dead for SOE? Will you ever make a new sandbox with SWG's pioneering features?
The answer is... stay tuned on the subject of sandboxes. We're super excited about the future of sandbox gaming. Let me just leave it at that!

4. The average age is different. Not entirely true. The average age of a BF:Heroes player is only 3-4 years younger. In the last years EVE Online became more and more dumb proof, more accessible to the younger player. This culminates with Incarna and the new player tutorial being a very appealing experience for a new (young) player.

5. The EVE Online player is not a peacck. Ofc not all players are peaccks but a very significant % are. If "you" are not a peacck, then why did "you" spent so much time on the customization of your character and why CCP had to give ppl the chance to "remodel" their characters a few times after the initial release of the new characters? Cos ppl were unhappy with their "creations", cos they care about looks, that bug was ment to be . Why do you think they gave us the "possibility" to recreate our characters as much and as many times as we want to now?
Most important, the majority of EVE players are competitive, otherwise they would've chosen a different MMORPG.

6. There were no surveys. Wrong. There is the annual CCP survey, tho if I remember right, there were no questions regarding NEX Store, the questions in that survey were meant to gather info on customer behavior, addiction, alternative games we might migrate to... all kinds of "useful" information.
"Dear xxxxxx,
You are invited to participate in a survey being conducted by CCP...."
The other "surveys" were conducted in-game by crunching numbers, statistics. For example: how much time the player spent designing and redesigning the new character model. I'm sure there are many aspects, numbers and indicators to be interpreted.

7. EVE has depth. Yes, it does but we made it like this. It can make money without all that obscure 0.0 politics, without all those well thought war plans, without any plans at all. Just a bunch of players running around popping stuff. Might be fun.

8. NEX current Prices -> Price anchoring

Invier
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:03:00 - [1063]
 

Originally by: C4LYP50
Originally by: Invier
Soldarius, this is just paranoia.

Have you ever tought about the fact that a char does not have a face because the user did not care about it ?

CCP is not in all things you know ;)


Of course, you DO realize that you cannot log in to play without a face, right? So really, you either haven't played the game (at least on this character), or you are too gutless to polish this turd with your main. GJ.

O/T: What you DO, CCP, trumps what you SAY. I think believe that since this blog took you 6 hours to write (with 100% more love) , you chose your ambiguity carefully. Flying the CSM in looks terribly like a delaying tactic. Answer the damn question, in CLEAR and CONCISE language. Thanks.


You do realize that you can have a character without a face as long as you did not use it in game for a long time, before incarna, right ? You can log in EVE but you cannot enter the game with that char if it is faceless. The paranoia suspicion still remains :)

Trebor Daehdoow
Gallente
Sane Industries Inc.
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:04:00 - [1064]
 

Originally by: Laendra
Why is a CSM visit required to understand that we don't ****ing want non-vanity RMT?

To my mind, this visit isn't just about discussing the failures that lead to the current uproar, but also the underlying issues, both inside CCP, and in their relationship with CSM, that need to be addressed.

A lot of what has happened in the last few weeks could have been avoided if CSM had been consulted more and earlier.

Easy example: if we'd been on the "Fearless" distribution list, when it came out, we'd have said "Holy spaceturds, guys. Does this really represent your thinking? If the players see this, they'll go berserk!"

And from the discussion that would follow, we would have had a better understanding of what it really represented, so that if it ever did leak, we'd have been able to give you guys that context.

The bottom line is, despite all the "CSM is useless" talk, when the **** hits the fan, CSM is more credible than CCP simply because you know that we have a different perspective on things that is more aligned with player consensus.

Originally by: CAAN0N
Haven't read the thread yet but has anyone yet considered the fact that CCP might be inviting the CSM to Iceland to go all snuff film on there asses? Careful guys could be a TARP!

Not a problem. We have CCP Xhagen on our side. Those who have seen him will understand. He's a full-on Viking Berserker with a mohawk.

Also, the main conference room is easily defensible, we could hold out in there for weeks.

Originally by: Lidia Prince
Are we talking about whole CSM? Will UAxDeath and Mittani participate? I love those guys.

We don't know yet who is going to be able to make it in RL, but we will skype in people if possible.

Jannx
Gallente
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:12:00 - [1065]
 

Originally by: Trebor Daehdoow
The bottom line is, despite all the "CSM is useless" talk, when the **** hits the fan, CSM is more credible than CCP simply because you know that we have a different perspective on things that is more aligned with player consensus.

Is the meeting likely to be minuted? And will we be able so see the minutes if it is?

DarkTemplarCrimsonWolf
Amarr
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:16:00 - [1066]
 

Transcripts available the second day Treb, not that we don't trust the CSM it's that CCP doesn't always follow through.

Alice Quin
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:22:00 - [1067]
 

If you wan't to gain trust, why not stream the meetings.
Not that you can't 'cheat' that way but it might be another way to gain some confidence back.
(CCP has the server capacity for a stream like this, I'm sure of it.)
I know this may sound more like an interogation but hey, anything to save our beloved EvE atm ...
This is just something that popped to mind so sorry if it sounds a bit 'over the top'.


Neo160
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:26:00 - [1068]
 

your request for parley has been granted.

I look forward to the CSM meeting. We will be watching what you do, not what you say, as you have clearly proven that we cannot possibly trust what you say, nor can we hope to truly understand what you mean when you say something. What you have been doing and saying have been two different things, at-least it seems, to the community.

Meissa Anunthiel
Redshift Industrial
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:29:00 - [1069]
 

Originally by: Morar Santee
Originally by: Buzzmong
@Trebor Daehdoow, Seleene, Mittens and the rest of the CSM:

When you get to Iceland, state unequivocally that:

1) Doing things outside of the CSM knowing (Nex prices) or completely ignoring the CSM (last dev blog) is a massive no-no and not only undermines the entire point of the CSM, but upsets the playerbase even more.

2) Full removal of the NeX store is the only way to fully go back and make up for this sheer sh*tstorm and restore the trust of the playerbase due to it being the only way to remove shadow of P2W that will now loom over EvE (actions speak louder than words).

3) It should always have been Space->Hanger->(optional) Captains Quarters+WiS, and it needs to be implemented as such due to CCP's own lore. It's especially important due to the performance issues people have been having and the fact the release of CQ is only 25% complete. It's up to CCP to develop features in CQ/WiS that want to make us leave the pods (they are planning on this anyway)

4) Communication needs to be improved massively. The current rules about Dev's not being able to speak their minds needs to be chucked out the window and the rules about not speaking on topics they don't know relaxed so that people can at least put some blue bars and go "I'll find out for you from the proper scrum team".

5) The Playerbase needs concrete information on what CCP's plans are with Incarna and it's expansions, and *needs* to find out what CCP are doing to fix the big problems with the core spaceship game.

I'll EvEmail this as well to the CSM members as I suspect you'll miss this.


Bears repeating. Would be good if CSM were able to cover these points during their meeting. Because Zulu's devblog sure didn't.


I can speak only for myself, but
I agree with points 1 (why we weren't consulted on price just baffles me).

Same with point 3. Optional CQ until/unless performance when docking is identical to that of the "non-CQ". At that stage it doesn't change anything except when it comes to metrics CCP use to determine how much people participate in InCarna

4 is a given. 5 as well.

I disagree with point 2. Done right, a NeX store for clothes/hairdos/painted ships can be a good thing. The content and pricing are obviously big big issues there however.

Janx, there's a list of CSM blogs in the CSM section of the forums.

Shandir
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:31:00 - [1070]
 

Edited by: Shandir on 27/06/2011 12:01:52
I don't believe you, CCP

Your internal leaked documents, both of them, match your actions much closer than your intentially released PR does. The stonewalling approach that we can all see regarding pretty much every loudly voiced complaint about Incarna, and those issues that you do acknowledge - you continue to stride on forward with no regard to our concerns.

Actions which imply you wish to milk us for all we're worth, whether we like it or not:
1) Newsletter
2) Leaked email
3) Refusal to give ANY reason for the forced disembarking
4) Ludicrous price of MT items
5) Someone on your own team felt the need to leak this info, at no doubt considerable risk to their current and future employment
6) Refusal to reply to our one, simple question for many days while you worked out how to carefully word a reply
7) Your previous stated desire to strip out the free clothes we currently have
8) You 'discussing' how non-vanity MT would apply to EVE, in spite of the fact that you have promised never to add non-vanity MT to EVE. Why?
9) Your repeated plans to add minor non-vanity MT items to EVE, follwed by a similar backpedalling only after community RAGE. (Attribute reset, Scorpions)
10) Your disregard for the CSM's advice on your previous devblog
11) Leaving this issue over the weekend in the hopes that it would 'calm down'

Action which imply you don't wish to abuse your current customer base:
1) It would be extremely stupid
2) Your PR, if taken at face value

Ravcharas
GREY COUNCIL
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:38:00 - [1071]
 

I too believe that streaming this meeting would be a very interesting idea. If CCP wants the players to understand the process then why not show it to us?

Sing Xing
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:47:00 - [1072]
 

Edited by: Sing Xing on 27/06/2011 11:50:44
Originally by: Meissa Anunthiel
Originally by: Morar Santee
Originally by: Buzzmong
@Trebor Daehdoow, Seleene, Mittens and the rest of the CSM:

When you get to Iceland, state unequivocally that:

1) Doing things outside of the CSM knowing (Nex prices) or completely ignoring the CSM (last dev blog) is a massive no-no and not only undermines the entire point of the CSM, but upsets the playerbase even more.

I'll EvEmail this as well to the CSM members as I suspect you'll miss this.





I can speak only for myself, but
I agree with points 1 (why we weren't consulted on price just baffles me).

Same with point 3. Optional CQ until/unless performance when docking is identical to that of the "non-CQ". At that stage it doesn't change anything except when it comes to metrics CCP use to determine how much people participate in InCarna

4 is a given. 5 as well.

I disagree with point 2. Done right, a NeX store for clothes/hairdos/painted ships can be a good thing. The content and pricing are obviously big big issues there however.

Janx, there's a list of CSM blogs in the CSM section of the forums.


Tbh, I dont know why the CSM should be involved in the pricing strategy. Honestly, that seems like something CCP should figure out on their own, not something you'd want the playerbase involved in - customers dictating price? That's bound to end well.

Then again, I didnt get why people were suddenly ****ing their pants in hysteria over the expensive vantiy crap in the first place, they really wanted that stupid monocle so badly and couldnt afford it? I mean, I get the massive uproar over pay2win (if it was actually implemented, other than in it's current plex form) but prices in the vanity shop? Major issue? Really? Space-doll outfit too expensive? Who gives a ****. Run some level 4s and buy it that way, if you dont like the dollar price.

Desert Ice78
Gryphon River Industries
R-I-P
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:54:00 - [1073]
 

Originally by: Trebor Daehdoow
Originally by: Laendra
Why is a CSM visit required to understand that we don't ****ing want non-vanity RMT?

To my mind, this visit isn't just about discussing the failures that lead to the current uproar, but also the underlying issues, both inside CCP, and in their relationship with CSM, that need to be addressed.

A lot of what has happened in the last few weeks could have been avoided if CSM had been consulted more and earlier.

Easy example: if we'd been on the "Fearless" distribution list, when it came out, we'd have said "Holy spaceturds, guys. Does this really represent your thinking? If the players see this, they'll go berserk!"

And from the discussion that would follow, we would have had a better understanding of what it really represented, so that if it ever did leak, we'd have been able to give you guys that context.

The bottom line is, despite all the "CSM is useless" talk, when the **** hits the fan, CSM is more credible than CCP simply because you know that we have a different perspective on things that is more aligned with player consensus.

Originally by: CAAN0N
Haven't read the thread yet but has anyone yet considered the fact that CCP might be inviting the CSM to Iceland to go all snuff film on there asses? Careful guys could be a TARP!

Not a problem. We have CCP Xhagen on our side. Those who have seen him will understand. He's a full-on Viking Berserker with a mohawk.

Also, the main conference room is easily defensible, we could hold out in there for weeks.

Originally by: Lidia Prince
Are we talking about whole CSM? Will UAxDeath and Mittani participate? I love those guys.

We don't know yet who is going to be able to make it in RL, but we will skype in people if possible.


Trebor,

And the rest of the CSM infact.

I pretty sure that I can guess as to how CCP is planning to play this when you all get to Iceland, so I was hoping that all of you of the CSM could give us an undertaking while over there, and that is to:

Please abstain from alcohol and/ or drugs and/ or hookers for the duration of your stay.

Alfacinha
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:55:00 - [1074]
 

after so many lies, how can trust be the same? I pay two accounts on EVE, but i will cancel one now. Only the future will tell whether or not to continue with the other: P

STOP THE GREED CCP, OR WILL LOSE MANY PLAYERS

Meissa Anunthiel
Redshift Industrial
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:56:00 - [1075]
 

Originally by: Sing Xing

Tbh, I dont know why the CSM should be involved in the pricing strategy. Honestly, that seems like something CCP should figure out on their own, not something you'd want the playerbase involved in - customers dictating price? That's bound to end well.

Then again, I didnt get why people were suddenly ****ing their pants in hysteria over the expensive vantiy crap, they really wanted that stupid monocle so badly and couldnt afford it? I mean, I get the massive uproar over pay2win (if it was actually implemented, other than in it's current plex form) but prices in the vanity shop? Major issue? Really? Space-doll outfit too expensive? Who gives a ****. Run some level 4s and buy it that way, if you dont like the dollar price.


In a perfect world, we wouldn't need to be. However one thing we're good at and CCP terrible at is determining what the player perception is going to be. And they should have used us for that if nothing else.

As a player, before the whole PDF/email, my stance was that "well, I would have purchased a skirt and boots and a blouse for Meissa had they been $4ish, but as it is I'm not going to". That's it. No emoraging foaming at the mouth. And I don't care about monocles (actually I welcome terribly overpriced "status symbol" items).

I also find it a shame that the pricing structure effectively cuts off a large part of the playerbase. But like I said, this is not why I'm angry.

My reason for being angry is because I spent lots of time during CSM 5 telling CCP "no vanity item", CCP agreed, I repeated the message in CSM 6, CCP agreed, the leaked PDF seems to indicate they're considering it and, when asked to clarify, CCP fails/doesn't want to dispel the notion. That's where most of my irritation comes from.

Considering the other factors, it mothballs into *this*

Jonathan Priest
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:57:00 - [1076]
 

Edited by: Jonathan Priest on 27/06/2011 12:01:14
Edited by: Jonathan Priest on 27/06/2011 11:57:49
Originally by: Angeliq

Here's a presentation from the creators of BF:Heroes that explains why Hilmar gives no fcks about the forums.

http://www.slideshare.net/bcousins/paying-to-win

+more words



This is a presentation that talks about how they can be profitable with 2 million people paying them an average of $1.50/month for in game advantages. When they started it was just $.25/month. All the higher numbers in the presentation come from striping out the people not engaging in micro transactions, which is just a way of making things look better on paper.

Its probably a safe assumption that the average eve player has at least 2 accounts, so thats $30/month right there. Why would you risk that for micro transactions, even if you manged to pull it off as well as battlefield heroes I doubt it would make up for the lost subs.

Keep in mind eve is not free to play, so you aren't going to get the millions of people neccesary to make micro transactions work. And even if you could, imagine if eves population increased 6 times or so. It wouldn't be playable.

Meissa Anunthiel
Redshift Industrial
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2011.06.27 11:59:00 - [1077]
 

Originally by: Desert Ice78

Trebor,

And the rest of the CSM infact.

I pretty sure that I can guess as to how CCP is planning to play this when you all get to Iceland, so I was hoping that all of you of the CSM could give us an undertaking while over there, and that is to:

Please abstain from alcohol and/ or drugs and/ or hookers for the duration of your stay.


You're kidding. For once we get the opportunity to get us CCP to get us hookers and we're going to pass it over? No way...

In all seriousness, what good would us coming back to you saying "everything is fine and dandy, CCP plans on selling pink rifters that do the damage of a titan, but it's cool". The community would rightfully bash us and progress wouldn't be made.

Believe me when I say I want to make your/our stance clear to CCP and get them to address our concerns adequately, period.

Aidan Brooder
Caldari
Dynasphere Ltd.
Posted - 2011.06.27 12:04:00 - [1078]
 

Biggest problem: Pay-to-win.

And truly don't see why it is so hard to just give us a NO to non-vanity items clear and straight.

The rest of the shop could even be successful, if the on-station content to come will be interesting enough. And if the pricing is changed. I don't care about monocles and clothes that much.

There were on-station shops mentioned though, that could be player-owned.
Now, I already see this will be something bound to Aurum, if it comes. If a monocle comes at 70$ or so, what will the price for a virtual bar be? A thousand dollars? Is that even enough?

So, get real. And stay away from anything that affects the game. In an ideal world, you'd stray away from the whole Aurum concept, but I see that is not going to happen.

Asmodeus Et'Mort
Amarr
Imperial Academy
Posted - 2011.06.27 12:05:00 - [1079]
 

Originally by: Pr1ncess Alia
Originally by: Obsidian Hawk
u a further understanding of what it is then there are no and never have been plans to sell "gold ammo" for Aurum.


HOW COULD THIS BE ANY MORE CLEAR???


lol

Originally by: Obsidian Hawk
That practically says Aurum will be for vanity items only.




lololololol

u be trippin or trollin?


Mental, Trebor said be more specific thatn that dont just sday "gold Ammo" you would have thought after fridays disaster they would have listened. Why did ZULU not say no non vanity, it was easy to say. When you teach children to answer a question you always tell them to use the question in the answer so it is clearly understood. Basic comprehension skills. The fact Zulu did not say it demonstrates there is a plan for non vanity items, be it fittings that we used to have or standings, or bars and shops in station. Honestly its spin, SWG here we come.

Lederstrumpf
Posted - 2011.06.27 12:08:00 - [1080]
 

Edited by: Lederstrumpf on 27/06/2011 12:09:57
Originally by: Angeliq

Here's a presentation from the creators of BF:Heroes that explains why Hilmar gives no fcks about the forums.

http://www.slideshare.net/bcousins/paying-to-win






So the math would be to say "forget about forum posters" despite them paying ten times more than non forum folks, as the number of non forum folks is 75% of all users?! Interesting.

But there are some things to note here:

a) Battlefield Heroes is FREE TO PLAY + ads + micropayment

b) There is no indication Battlefield Heroes had/has any loyal customer base at all. The daily active user graph is not raising not to say declining, monthly new user count is stalling. It's important to look at current month revenues. But if you're any good at what you do you're correct at predicting what your revenue in three months will be like.
Driving away customers who did return since plenty of years usually doesn't help with that.

c) There's no indication of any BF Heroes third party developers filling in game functionality gaps.

d) "What do consumers want virtual good games to be?" EA obviously did pay attention. And did add new content people optionally can pay for.

e) There's no concept of "the user shapes the sandbox" at all, is it?

f) Do you assume EVE to be a polished product?


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