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Sick Tight
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2011.06.24 22:59:00 - [1321]

You know, this whole MT scheme stinks of Sony.

I'm wondering is Sony have somehow become a major stakeholder in CCP and are now calling shot. I wonder how one could find something like that out.

Caldari SpyGlass
Posted - 2011.06.24 22:59:00 - [1322]

Edited by: Caldari SpyGlass on 24/06/2011 23:00:10
Originally by: Mukutep
I don't understand why some people are cancelling their subscriptions on something that might happen.

They're doing it show CCP what they stand to loose if they go ahead with it, we can just resub if things go fine.. but for now everyone has un-subbed because this **** isn't on and until its sorted out none of us are coming back.

Vote with your sub i'm afraid is all we can do.

Posted - 2011.06.24 22:59:00 - [1323]

I, like many others, cancelled my subscription after reading that internal newsletter.

I, like many others, cancelled my hope after reading the dev-blog.

Lemming Lass
Lemmings Online
Posted - 2011.06.24 22:59:00 - [1324]

I'm not sure how many billionaires play video games, but probably quite a few. All you need is a few who are willing to buy some $100,000,000 vanity items each year and voilà have a business model.

And no server lag anymore! Genius!

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:00:00 - [1325]

Originally by: Lilliana Stelles
I hate to say this, having sided with CCP almost 100% so far on this controversy.

Here's two points of feedback that I advise you take very carefully.

I shop at Nordstrom's, Neiman Marcus, and other high-end shops in America. I've paid $200 for an ordinary enough shirt before. But generally speaking, there are other options available. And the better looking clothing is of much higher quality. Generally, what costs more, lasts longer. I've had walmart pants, they tear up, fade, and look bad. You need to reflect this in game. If there's a $60 product, there also needs to be a $6 comparable product. And believe me, you'll sell more of them. Not everyone is the elite, but everyone deserves the right to wear clothes. If I want to stand out, I don't have to wear haute-couture. And if I do wear haute-couture, it should look extremely different from what you normally see in the streets. An ordinary virtual skirt shouldn't be $25 when it's the only skirt available. That's called monopolizing. Rather, if you have a normal skirt for $3, and a fancy skirt for $70, people will understand. But you don't have anything to compare to yet. For introductory prices, these are simply too high.

The most important advice you can take is that you should listen to your customers when it comes to pricing. If you want money (which you do, according to your newsletter), you have to be competitive. Your prices need to be on-par with those in other MMOs for similar quality products. If they aren't, no one is going to buy them. I'm all for vanity items. I have income and I want to buy them. You're not going to get my money until you lower the prices, and many other players feel the same way I do.

It's not appropriate for you to complain about a ****storm that resulted from your own actions. Keep better control of your newsletters, be more careful what you write, even internally, and if you do screw up, apologize for it. Don't ask people not to rage at you, that will only make it worse. At least let people vent on the forums. Things will blow over if you leave them alone. Most people are raging at the possibility of microtransactions breaking gameplay. This hasn't happened yet, so just let them debate it, listen to them, and then come to a decision. Publish this decision, and stick with it. That's the only way to calm players down.

+1. Total sense.

Vierego's Junk Imports
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:00:00 - [1326]

Jesus, zulu way to not answer the elephant in the room.

Also, are you really that dense? If I were to buy a pair of $1000 pants it is because I want some shallow gold digging bimbo to think I am rich and sleep with me.

What do your $50 dollar digital pants get me? Some cyber sex with a guy named Phil pretending to be the voluptuous female pirate Sexay Pants in her CCP lingerie(only $220!).

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:00:00 - [1327]

Originally by: Melody Xiasia
So what the Dev blog is really saying is, "Dont blame the authors of 'Is Greed Bad?' because it's a company thing. And, Bite me, we're doing it anyways."

Look, you Pee'd in our cereal, dont whine when we pee back in your oatmeal.

Actually they aren't telling us ANYTHING AT ALL.

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:00:00 - [1328]

Edited by: CERBERUS III on 24/06/2011 23:00:39
let me give you 2 pieces of senior management advice.

1. Act professional don't attack your customers they leave faster and take more people with them, don't use words like '**** storm' in an offical memo/blog.

2. Perception is Reality

I'm glad i'm not on your board.

United Pod Service
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:00:00 - [1329]

Originally by: Sigurs
Edited by: Sigurs on 24/06/2011 22:54:45
New DevBlog!

... nearly.

i laughed and cried a the same time...

cytex malrone
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:01:00 - [1330]

Im a new player I came here because of incarna because of internet spaceships after reading zed caynes blog and thought it was a cool game.

My Impressions Is this really how you treat your customers ccp .....Shocked

The newsletter it was discussing the issue of MT fair enough why were you discussing it ?? You told the player base that you were not going to introduce play to win fullstop you are caught out in a lie that dev blog basically says that you don't care what your player base thinks your going to go ruin eve anyway. Well if that is the way you want it fine i simply wont pay you my 1 month account has been canceled . i have 18 days left and that is as long as im giving this game .

Charging people like zed 99 bucks to get new people like me into this game is plain wrong no matter which way you cut it .

Personally i dont care about vanity items I dont care about dust or wod i want to play eve that is what i was intending to play but basically im not investing any more time into this game if you are going to make me pay to be competitive and to be honest that what this dev blog said you havent denied it so it must be true .

48 hours to be told "stfu people it is our game" I dont think any other game treated there customer base like this and was around a year later i hope dust can survive without eve and i hope wod is nearly finished because otherwise you are all out of a job.

Cya eve it been a fun 1 month but I think ill go spend my time and money on something else.

Kurj Valdoria
Guiding Hand Social Club
Dystopia Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:01:00 - [1331]

Okay. I think what they are saying with this dev blog is 'yes we are going to sell ingame items that greatly unbalance the game, but they will be so expensive only the 3 richest moon barons will be able to afford them.' Just like there'd only be 2 or 3 titans.

Cargo Container Rotation Collective
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:02:00 - [1332]

Originally by: Naomi Wildfire
but you should remember that we are talking about clothes. Look at the clothes you are currently wearing in real life. Do you have any specific brands? Did you choose it because it was better quality than a no-name brand? Assume for a short while that you are wearing a pair of $1,000 jeans from some exclusive Japanese boutique shop.

are you serious?

Lets talk a bit more eve/RL:

1 pair of jeans = 50$
1 pair of designer jeans = 1000$

For thousand bucks i could also buy a new PC, a small used Car or a few other things.

1 pair of designer jeans = ~230m ISK (i read that somewhere)
1 frigate sized spaceship = 200k ISK
1 cruizer sized spaceship = 4m ISK
1 bc sized spaceship = 20-30m ISK
1 battleship sized spaceship = 50-100m ISK


Posted - 2011.06.24 23:02:00 - [1333]

Edited by: diaufop on 24/06/2011 23:02:43
Originally by: Azran Zala

Jumpgate EVEolution is out soon :P

I'm not sure whether you're trying to be funny or not.....

Just in case you don't know: Jumpgate Evo got cancelled. Months ago. Development halted, Devs sacked, websites pulled.

Vladimir Ilych
Electus Matari
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:02:00 - [1334]

Edited by: Vladimir Ilych on 24/06/2011 23:07:45

Just an FYI. Only got a few folks in corp chat now (6) and three will leave if MT is introduced for game affecting items.


Our internal forum thread on this is now several pages. Don't think it is just people posting here that are upset.

Bodega Cat
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:02:00 - [1335]

Not for nothin, but if the crap thats up now represents the high end 1000$ designer jeans, then colour me stupid.

That stuff is ugly, dull, and plain looking. It's simply not cool looking and doesn't even appeal to the stylistically inclined if you ask me. Ugly ugly ugly, and you can't even show it to people right now anyway. What's the point?

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:02:00 - [1336]

Originally by: Hildulfr
Incarna hasn't done anything to break the game for me

Incursions + Incarna is mighty close to breaking the game for me. lag through the roof in Incursions was a big enough pain. the new "character creation" system that is massively slow at BEST is bloody irritating, and the resulting lag from overfancy portrait loading times SUCKS. The removal of "don't have to load portraits all the time" option sucked even HARDER.

Then Incarna. Lag through the roof EVEN MORE on gate jumps, dock and undock lag MASSIVELY INCREASED, lag in GENERAL in station increased a ton, even with the Incarna stuff turned OFF. *3* client updates in 2 days that have NOT EVEN STARTED to address these issues.

Then the while MT mess, THIS crap so-called response to the various issues raised THAT DID NOT ADDRESS ANY MAJOR ISSUE IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM, and also made it quite clear that CCP does not consider Incarna to HAVE issues .... "smooth" my ASS .... and then they wonder why folks are upset at them.

I'm starting to be reminded strongly of Microsoft in the days immediately following the release of MS-DOS 4.0 - and Bill Gates himself blowing me off shortly after when I brought up the "smartdrive debacle" at a presentation he was making to the Indianapolis Computer Society.

What was his response? He blew me off at first, then when I REFUSED to be blown off he handed me off to a "software engineer" who flat out refused to answer my questions (apparently had no clue why I was even bothered enough TO ask the questions) - IN PUBLIC IN FRONT OF A LARGE GROUP. Yeah, showed how much they CARE about their customer base - and THIS whole mess is starting to have a familier stench.....

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:02:00 - [1337]

Btw, Vanity-items affect gameplay. My character looks different -> changed gameplay.

You had a chance to get your hybrid-mt-idea throught. But you failed it with that blog.

Last chance: removte MT @ all and don't think about it again in the next 2-3 years. You don't think so ? The subscriber-drop and negative-press may show it to you.

Howard Atkins
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:03:00 - [1338]

I'am gamer press. Be sure this will be taken care of.

Austherus Sialomaet
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:04:00 - [1339]

Originally by: Tamahra
Originally by: Sigurs
Edited by: Sigurs on 24/06/2011 22:54:45
New DevBlog!

... nearly.

i laughed and cried a the same time...

LOL! This is CCP...

Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:04:00 - [1340]

What is this talk of Liang being banned?

Oh HELL no they didn't! Evil or Very Mad

**** just got real!

Republica Winder
State War Academy
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:04:00 - [1341]

An ominous warning to CCP, and no, this isn't off topic.

Star Wars Galaxies is closing 12/15.

THAT is what going against your customers wishes gets you.

Sunbird Huy
White Noise.
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:05:00 - [1342]

@ CCP.

You guys keep going from bad to worse. and beyond. Instead of that PR guy calming us down, he's(tho maybe unintentionally) lit an even greater fire. And about CCP Zulu's level of arrogance, perfidy and blatant condescending tones, I have not yet witnessed.

CCP. Your PR sucks. Your customer relation SUCKS. Your vision of game, FING SUCKS. And I am talking about EVE online. For FPS, I have COD4MW and others. The **** you think we are playing this game for? Sunglasses? Ocular implants? Get your **** straight.

Pathetic beyond belief.

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:05:00 - [1343]

Yep I'm going do it. At this point I'm mad and without shame and it's worth a try.

I what to make clear that I in no way want or will play a MT game. And frankly after the Dev blog… it looks like it's coming no matter what. Others have stated most of my reasons why much better than I could on the… well The Thread. But it really comes down to, I play video games to escape RL. I already live in a society that favors the wealthy and is run by people with rich person entitlement attitudes. I do not want my RL social darwinistic hell to follow me into my online space ship social darwinist hell. Monopoly is a game about greed, selfishness and ruthlessness, so is EVE. But both are fun since the players are all on the same field in the game (mostly). Adding MT to EVE is like letting players in monopoly buy extra board moves with RL cash. Whats the point of the "game" then? So I'm out.

But! I am not leaving until the day those changes are put in game. I'm only been playing a year and a half, and six months of that where just flying around going "ohhhh pretty". So I'm not to "bitter vet" status yet, Hell in eve time I'm still a noob. But I love this game. It has become a part of my life practically… no not practically, it is. I feel cheated by CCP in not letting me get to experience this for a longer time of my life. This feels like my parents are dragging me home with them on labor day weekend, just when I found the girl at the beach that likes me. So I'm milking it up to the last non-MT moment.

So yea, I'm asking for your stuff. Not original I know, but sincere, and at least more than five words. I'm not real good yet, and I want to spend my last few weeks just blowing stuff up. I don't want to grind one more damn mission to replace my blown up ship while my time in EVE is short. I don't want to "error on the side of caution" when picking a fight in anything more expensive than a frig or curser. No more nights of thinking "can I really afford to try and take that?" I just want to get in the damn ship with no care for it's ISK and attack someone not expecting it. So if you want to contribute to a P'd-off ex-carberaish pilot who just wants to blow everything up his last few weeks in game, then yea, I'll take you stuff.

Or donate them to PLEX for good, that's probably a better idea.

Anyway this mess just depresses me. I'm off to the pub for pints, and when I stubble back I'm getting some ships blown up.

Blood Fart
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:05:00 - [1344]

Before you wrote that I thought the wheels probably fell off over I'm 100% sure.

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:05:00 - [1345]

What a load of empty air, nothing was covered by the blog.

So, real life money applyes because its CLOTHES... right, what about holoreels, should they be 20 € a piece, since.. that's the going rate for DVD's?

How about spaceships, ask NASA what a shuttle would be, translate it to ISK, and EVE dont have enough ISK to buy ONE real shuttle.

It's NOT good enough, and I dont buy your "we're going to act like greedy monkeys in this issue of fearless, so dont blame our designers for "acting"

You've had 4 days to make up this lie, you could actually have made a better one.

But on the other hand, your blog just confirms how far CCP has gone from their player base. It didnt show any vision or future that i wish to be a part of.
As i posted in a former post, my (last) account runs out tomorrow, and this blog made me damn sure, i'll not resub at all.
Thanks - i'll have plenty of time to exel in other games, now that EVE takes up none of my time.

Gurgeh Morat
7th Interval
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:06:00 - [1346]

Edited by: Gurgeh Morat on 24/06/2011 23:09:38
Originally by: Mukutep
I don't understand why some people are cancelling their subscriptions on something that might happen. As of right now there are no MT's beyond vanity when I look. CCP hasn't said there's going to be. Agreed, they haven't denied it, but lack of denial doesn't mean certainty. Seems to me like people (as usual) have overreacted.

If MT's that are more than just vanity actually show up in game, I'll be first in line to leave. But leaving over an un-verified assumption of a possibility seems silly.

You are exaclty the person that their refusal to answer that question is aimed at. If they don't deny it they are not lying. At this point in the forum rage the lack of a denial, especially in this dev blog is a 100% yes, non vanity items are on their way. This is a strategy that has been planned for quite some time. A risk analysis has been conducted. Contingency is in place for the inevitable loss of subs. However I think it happened a little earlier than expected.

The only options left are.

1) Change the long planned strategy - can't be done because they have used this strategy to acquire resources & investment.

2) Come clean now - they could do that but they would instantly lose a lot of subs, more than planned and earlier than expected.

3) Lie now & implement later. They lose 100% goodwill and get no carry over into dust or WOD.

4) String the player base along, accept the early losses and milk the hopeless romantics prepared to keep paying them until the knife is buried in their chests.

You're only fooling yourself if you hang around.

Nika Maskirovka
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:06:00 - [1347]

People have been shocked by the price range in the NeX store, but you should remember that we are talking about clothes.

Even clothes on Stardoll, which by the way is the biggest online dress-up site in the world, don't cost that much.

Look at the clothes you are currently wearing in real life. Do you have any specific brands? Did you choose it because it was better quality than a no-name brand?

Ok: Yes and yes.
That's why I prefer spending my well-earned money on those clothes rather than digital versions. I spend a lot of money on microtransactions in other games (I'm for example an avid Neopets and Sims fan) but I've never seen prices like this.

Whatever you choose to do reflects what you are and what you want others to think you are.

In Eve, noone but me can see my overpriced spaceship clothes.

You don't need to buy expensive clothes. In fact you don't need to buy any clothes.

I won't. But that's your problem rather than ours.

I hope I‘ve addressed your concerns and cleared up a lot of the issues you‘re having.

Please address our concern about microtransactions and paying real money for gameplay/functionality. That's our big issue.

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:06:00 - [1348]

Originally by: Crunchmeister
You know, this whole MT scheme stinks of Sony.

I'm wondering is Sony have somehow become a major stakeholder in CCP and are now calling shot. I wonder how one could find something like that out.

Are you talking SWG:NGE or more recent things like the "warrior nerf and resulting complete revamp to fix a simple little issue that just changing the DI and DB entries in the mob damage tables would fix easier"?

I think it's more likely that CCP has hired one or more game designers that worked for SoE, or they're BOTH hiring marketing managers from Mickey$loth.

Nedak Pather
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:06:00 - [1349]


Animus Furandi
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:07:00 - [1350]

"Dear Star Wars Galaxies™ Community Member,

We write to you today to inform you that on December 15, 2011, Sony Online Entertainment (SOE) and LucasArts will end all services (MMO and Trading Card Game) for Star Wars Galaxies (SWG). The shutdown of SWG is a very difficult decision, but SOE and LucasArts have mutually agreed that the end of 2011 is the appropriate time to end the game."

Listen to your customers or suffer the same fate CCP!

The NGE killed SWG.

These "proposals" if they ever go live, WILL kill Eve.

It really is that simple.

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