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Illwill Bill
Svea Crusaders
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:13:00 - [271]
 

Free Riverini is a go!


Miilla
Minmatar
Hulkageddon Orphanage
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:14:00 - [272]
 

Originally by: Tla Atij
Wait, so... Someone makes a PDF and everyone assumes it's authentic?


It is authentic so far by aligning with CCP's actions.

Their actions have been in line with this document so far.

Actions speak louder than words, so far it is real.


Average Black Woman
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:14:00 - [273]
 

i think CCPs pretty cool guy eh MT's his game and doesn't afraid of anything

Marcus Vorenius
Caldari
Task Force 42
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:14:00 - [274]
 

The Disclaimer on page 1 is quite interesting. If these are private opinions of employees then any intellectual property clauses in contracts are void ... more importantly, the responsible director is an arse hat.

Hesperius
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:15:00 - [275]
 

Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy?

Bologna Brains
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:15:00 - [276]
 

CCP hasnt denied it in 10 pages, and something like this, if easily fake, would be denied by CCP quickly.

Iyuvai Myoisi
Minmatar
Calx Holding
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:15:00 - [277]
 

Originally by: Nimbat
Guess we don't need an official CCP response anymore...


Yes, we've got it from the horse's mouth.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:15:00 - [278]
 

Originally by: Hesperius
Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy?


Not a whole lot tbh. Its not going to tie me down and **** me at night, fortunately. Smile

Miilla
Minmatar
Hulkageddon Orphanage
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:16:00 - [279]
 

Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 23:17:16
Originally by: Hesperius
Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy?


our fears, that we have been shouting loud all along and being called naysayers.

The fact that the revenue generated by this is not for the benefit of Eve, it is for the benefit of their other PRODUCTS that we do not play!


Erichan
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:17:00 - [280]
 

For those that missed the editor's post in the unedited full version of the pdf:

"However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE
needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further
revenue – revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you."

The sale pitch internally is.. "EVE has to subsidize the costs of the other games otherwise we can't pay your salary, trusted developer."

I'm a realist but let's face it. MT is just a vehicle to fund development of other titles.

Linar Mardolak
Minmatar
Phlogiston Absorption
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:17:00 - [281]
 

Originally by: Hesperius
Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy?


Real money for game-changing options. Selling faction standings. Aurum rewards for gaining sov. Real-money direct purchase ships and ammo.

Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [282]
 

Edited by: Emperor Cheney on 22/06/2011 23:18:04
Originally by: Miilla
Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:41:14
Originally by: Emperor Cheney
Originally by: Miilla
Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:29:47


Let's not forget this point..

http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534552&page=4#101

If you happen to be economically challenged or just don’t trust the PlayStation Network with your credit card details, you can trade ISK with other players for some real money currency, just like you can with PLEX today. You can also do the opposite and exchange purchased realmoney currency for ISK, too.

Both work for us as long as money is being spent.


In reading that they want to complete the money life cycle and allow us to take currency OUT of the game?

That is their way to gain acceptance..

However the gameplay impacting purchases are a sickening.


Basically, ENTROPIA but allowing money to flow out?





Allowing money to flow out would put them under various nations banking and gambling laws. Not going to happen. It's just a lazily worded paragraph. I think they mean buying PLEX or equivalent with real money in DUST.



Unless CCP are gona apply for Icelandic Bank status :)

PayPal became a bank in Luxembourg so the standard isnt high these days.




I know you're being tongue in cheek, but in case anyone is thinking this is a possibility - there are miles between what this would entail v. what Paypal does. And paypal is in compliance (to the best of my knowledge. I know they have programs to this effect) with all the annoying U.S. banking laws (Bank Secrecy Act, Patriot Act, etc). For CCP to comply with those would be unimaginable. And that's just one country.

And that's not even getting started on the gambling laws. . .

Plus, MMO money being 'virtual currency' has long shielded MMO's from litigation for, say, a game glitch or unjust banning causing a player harm. Turning into an ISK/cash two way exchange would shatter that.

It's just not going to happen.

Ophelia Ursus
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [283]
 

Originally by: Hesperius
Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy?


How about this, from the section talking about microtransactions in Eve:

Quote:
Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright.

"Vanity only" my arse.

Gwenywell Shumuku
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [284]
 

Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 22/06/2011 23:23:04
Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 22/06/2011 23:22:51
Originally by: Xervish Krin
Perhaps not the apocalypse.

DISCLAIMER:
The views put forward in
this magazine do not refl ect
general CCP company policies
or decisions and are strictly
individual opinions, written by
CCPers or about CCPers who
feel strongly about these issues.





Well, if it wasn't the lead game designer for EVE Online that had this opinions....


Tla Atij
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [285]
 

Originally by: Miilla
Originally by: Tla Atij
Wait, so... Someone makes a PDF and everyone assumes it's authentic?


It is authentic so far by aligning with CCP's actions.

Their actions have been in line with this document so far.

Actions speak louder than words, so far it is real.



It is authentic, so far? Rolling Eyes
It is real, so far? Laughing
Put down the propaganda machine and take a course in logic.

If I was working for other MMOs' PR dep. I'd make a PDF like this too. "Authentic so far" doesn't cut it.

Joao Duarte
Selflessness
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [286]
 

I don't know what to think of all this.

To be fair, players ALREADY CAN buy isk, using the plex system. A player with money to spend in eve can get any amount of isk he wants. Noone seems very concerned about it.

I think the question for me is: the instant I'm required to pay more money besides my 2 subscriptions to be competetive in eve, the game died for me.


So. Preemptive measures:

1. switched my long term subscriptions to 1 month recurring.

2. scouting for new long term, player-run market, sci fi MMOs (Perpetuum is not bad and has lots of room to grow; Black Prophecy maybe; SWTOR will try it for sure but I doubt it will keep my brain as exercised as Eve does.

3. be sad.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [287]
 

Originally by: Linar Mardolak
Originally by: Hesperius
Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy?


Real money for game-changing options. Selling faction standings. Aurum rewards for gaining sov. Real-money direct purchase ships and ammo.


But it isn't going to tie you down and **** you. Life - and Eve - will likely go on.

Just without me.

Or you, most likely.

Or Hesp, to be fair. Razz

-Liang

Brujo Loco
Amarr
Brujeria Teologica
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:19:00 - [288]
 

Well, check this out said by The Mittani LOL
<originally by Seelene in its blog>
****
Our never boring CSM Chairman, The Mittani, had this to day about it all:

"I think the island culture has to do with it. It's very easy to develop a consensus about how the world works when you're in a rinky-dink town like Reykjavik (which is lovely, but it's ******* tiny) and you drink with/hang out with/bump into your coworkers all the goddamned time.

Iceland also has a very charming culture of Just Not Giving A **** About Trivial ****. 'Trivial ****' in the Icelandic view seems to include smashing glasses in the street, ****ing on walls like you just don't care in front of other people, parking your car in a way which blocks traffic/parking your car on a sidewalk, and just doing basically whatever the **** you feel like because you're on an island full of ****** supermodels and there's nothing to do but drink, ****, do drugs and party.

It's a great island, but there's a serious cultural disconnect between Reyk and the rest of reality."

Seems what is happening here har har har

Mehrdad Kor-Azor
Amarr
Iure Divino
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:19:00 - [289]
 

Quote:
"However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue – revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you."


That there shows that CCP clearly sees the EVE community as a way to get money, not as a loyal customer base that should be respected.

Caladan Broood
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:20:00 - [290]
 

Disclaimer that those are only the personal opinoins of the company. Who the hell do you think makes up the company? Is it some robot that randomly selects what to do or is it the developers who pitch their "great ideals" to the managers on how to make the game better (read: profitable and draw more money). These are the personal opinions of the CCPers but they are the opinions being pushed the hardest and suprisingly implemented in the game.Evil or Very MadCrying or Very sad

Marcus Vorenius
Caldari
Task Force 42
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:20:00 - [291]
 

the fact that they say MT will only be vanity items, while at the same time they are planning to introduce items that have a major influence on the game

Xervish Krin
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:21:00 - [292]
 

I'm not so sure that they would be quick to deny a fake.

Think how much we jump upon anything CCP says and tear it to shreds, sometimes deservingly, sometimes not.

If I were them, I'd want to be very careful about how to approach responding to this; even if it's a fake, most of us here believe it's real at least to a small degree. That means a crapload of planning, drafts and redrafts to ensure that nothing can be taken the wrong way, to ensure that the reply doesn't create even more rage, and so on.

Miilla
Minmatar
Hulkageddon Orphanage
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:21:00 - [293]
 

Originally by: Brujo Loco
Well, check this out said by The Mittani LOL
<originally by Seelene in its blog>
****
Our never boring CSM Chairman, The Mittani, had this to day about it all:

"I think the island culture has to do with it. It's very easy to develop a consensus about how the world works when you're in a rinky-dink town like Reykjavik (which is lovely, but it's ******* tiny) and you drink with/hang out with/bump into your coworkers all the goddamned time.

Iceland also has a very charming culture of Just Not Giving A **** About Trivial ****. 'Trivial ****' in the Icelandic view seems to include smashing glasses in the street, ****ing on walls like you just don't care in front of other people, parking your car in a way which blocks traffic/parking your car on a sidewalk, and just doing basically whatever the **** you feel like because you're on an island full of ****** supermodels and there's nothing to do but drink, ****, do drugs and party.

It's a great island, but there's a serious cultural disconnect between Reyk and the rest of reality."

Seems what is happening here har har har


You also forgot that they are wreckless with money.


flapie 2
Gallente
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:21:00 - [294]
 

Edited by: flapie 2 on 22/06/2011 23:21:53
Originally by: Howdy Kitty
Originally by: Caladan Broood
I wanted to post this as someone asked. Meta data from the document shows some hard work went into its creation.

It was initially created 4/14/11 at 12:56 in Adobe InDesign 7.0. It had 414 revision saves. The last main save was 5/20/11 at 15:47 using Adobe InDesign 7.0. No Author information.


interesting, gotta love the PDF/A standard and metadata.
*conspiracy theory - the author, when faking this, changed her system date


They only removed somenames and personal data from the file, i have the original and it doesnt change that much tbh.

Isil Rahsen
Gallente
Ferrum Superum
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:21:00 - [295]
 

Originally by: Ophelia Ursus
Originally by: Hesperius
Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy?


How about this, from the section talking about microtransactions in Eve:

Quote:
Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright.

"Vanity only" my arse.
Exactly, it's nothing less than a bald face lie.

Hesperius
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:22:00 - [296]
 

BUT, that is CCP Soundwave talking liberally in a company news letter. Even the way it is structured, it sounds like he has some fighting internally to do to even get to bring it in front of us. I really don't care what they do with dust and wod, and outside of showing their hand of viewing us as numbers they can use and abuse more than customers, there is nothing that revealing in that document.

ovenproofjet
Caldari
Therapy.
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:22:00 - [297]
 

Originally by: CCP Document
similarly, it would be silly to buy sunglasses for my avatar and pay the same price that I would for a faction battleship


Guess this logic doesn't apply to Monocles costing the same as dreadnaughts then?

I'll be honest, I'm all for Microtransactions in Eve, just (for lack of a better quote) "never go full r*tard" about it...

Skogen Gump
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:22:00 - [298]
 

Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor
Quote:
"However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue – revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you."


That there shows that CCP clearly sees the EVE community as a way to get money, not as a loyal customer base that should be respected.


This just in, CCP is a company ...

sheesh.

Caladan Broood
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:22:00 - [299]
 

Originally by: Xervish Krin
I'm not so sure that they would be quick to deny a fake.

Think how much we jump upon anything CCP says and tear it to shreds, sometimes deservingly, sometimes not.

If I were them, I'd want to be very careful about how to approach responding to this; even if it's a fake, most of us here believe it's real at least to a small degree. That means a crapload of planning, drafts and redrafts to ensure that nothing can be taken the wrong way, to ensure that the reply doesn't create even more rage, and so on.


A denial would have to come from someone pretty high up in the food chain and posted here. A simple denial by some CSM would be laughed at since they repeatedly said before they don't know what the developers are thinking.

Tea Ester Elliot
Posted - 2011.06.22 23:23:00 - [300]
 

8 accounts canceled, around two weeks of time left on most to see how much CCP can backpeddal/damage control before I biomass the lot of my characters.

Thanks to whomever leaked this, the community has a right to know when it's going to get ****ed. See you all in the next mmo worth playing (not WoW).


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