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Walextheone
The Red Circle Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.20 11:11:00 - [1]
 

Gallente have, as we all know, a weapon system that are inferior to the other races (+ Caldari ships). True it does the most damage but have some serious problem to apply the damage. Could an alternative to "fixing" the hybrid weapon platform be to enhance the drone part to better complement it.

- Webifing drones gets a serious buff bonus (specially for hybrid boats)
- Drone implants
- Low slot drone enhancing modules (damage, hitpoins)
- A slight drone bonus increase for hybrid weapon boats

sableye
principle of motion
Posted - 2011.04.20 11:17:00 - [2]
 

no body cares about drones in combat and they still would'nt.

Walextheone
The Red Circle Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.20 11:20:00 - [3]
 

Strange answer.

Today you can do about 500 dps with sentries + rig. If that would be buffed to let say 700 dps by using implants / mods / bonus would you still consider that nothing to care about?

shadowraven001
Posted - 2011.04.20 11:31:00 - [4]
 

This will not do anything but make drone boats even more overpowered in pve.

Blasters are acceptable pvp guns atm imo(but if you did want to give them a buff then increasing the base speed of galent hulls would be the way to do it helping blaster boats get in range).

The problem really lies with railguns which have little or no use in either the pvp or pve arena these need to be completly revisited imo.

Regards

Raven

Walextheone
The Red Circle Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.20 11:37:00 - [5]
 

Railgun buff would be very nice indeed.

As I see it, Gallente is very little used in 0.0 and in lowsec. Just check out any report.
Can't see that the drone system is overpowered for pve. Missiles are still the king there.

Blasters are good in wormhole space for pvp due to the close quarter fighting and maby for station games. That's it.

shadowraven001
Posted - 2011.04.20 12:02:00 - [6]
 

Megas still see a lot of use in null sec though it is becoming less and less. i did not say drones were overpowered atm they are just right enought dps to be useful and a vible pve option for those who want a resonable afk option( i personly use an afk rattlesnake on my alt) what i said is if drones were given a buff as previously suggested it would not lead to a more viable galent pvp boats but would lead to an overpowered pve boat take the aformentioned rattlesnake if given mods for lows to increase dps it would become imo a very overpowered mission running ship same goes for the domi though to a lesser degree here as it is an armor tank and therefore low slot compertion would come into play.

Regards

Raven

Rek Seven
Gallente
Zandathorn Industries
Posted - 2011.04.20 12:12:00 - [7]
 

Here is what i posted a couple day ago if you are interested: CLICK

Walextheone
The Red Circle Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.20 12:34:00 - [8]
 

I think the trick is to make every weapon system fun and viable. If hybrids becomes to much alike lasers or projectiles they could as well be taken out of the game.

If blaster boats could be more effective in range dampening they could fight at better terms or have more web bonus so they could get up close and personal.

Hence my idea of buffing the web drones to make it easier to fight close

shadowraven001
Posted - 2011.04.20 12:41:00 - [9]
 

mabe vible if they introdued a light version of the web drone i would be happy to see utility and ewar drones given a buff with the exception of the ecm drones but i don't think dmg drones are the answer.

i like your thinking sensor damps and mabe this could be interesting way around.

however all of this is aimed at blastes imo which are overly broken. rails still need a rethink on what they are trying to do.

Regards

Raven

shadowace00007
Amarr
Beyond The Gates
Posted - 2011.04.20 14:48:00 - [10]
 

they are fine the way they are. the reason you don't see that race of ships is because to put it simply Thanatos. All Gallente pilots train for comes to bear in this ship. also Gallente ships get primary because of the damage they can do when they get in close. Example if you have a Brutix MWDing in your direction and and Drake, or even a harb. what do you shoot first.

I can agree with rail guns tho. they are pointless right not but the blasters are dead on. and Drones need to die in general. they don't need a buff they need to die. Don't take something over powered and buff it.

Acac Sunflyier
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.20 20:53:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Walextheone
Railgun buff would be very nice indeed.




true that. Rails are pretty much like going up and hitting a ship with a foam bat while the other uses a metal bat. i put projectile artillery on my gallente battleships

Sakaras Lane
Posted - 2011.04.23 19:48:00 - [12]
 

The problem with blasters is range vs speed to close the gap, boosting the base speed of the thorax, incurses, brutix hulls/ship types would solve the problem. or add a bit more to the falloff put them more in line with autocannons. still enerngy neuts will be the death of you stick to op minmitar.

Walextheone
The Red Circle Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.24 08:18:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Sakaras Lane
The problem with blasters is range vs speed to close the gap, boosting the base speed of the thorax, incurses, brutix hulls/ship types would solve the problem. or add a bit more to the falloff put them more in line with autocannons. still enerngy neuts will be the death of you stick to op minmitar.


If the ship speed goes up and the falloff increases than Gallente with blaster will be a copy of Minmatar. A more creative solution is needed to make the 4 races distinct.

Gallente should have some mechanism that force enemy ships to fight close and also feels Gallente (like more dampeners / heavy webbing).

ACESsiggy
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.24 11:38:00 - [14]
 

Railguns suck and I wish I was told this 5 months ago so I didn't allocate sp into themCrying or Very sad

Ilike ithard
Posted - 2011.04.25 17:01:00 - [15]
 

If Gallente speed went up then Minmatar speed would also need to go up as they are supposed to be fastest. :P

Duchess Starbuckington
Posted - 2011.04.25 19:36:00 - [16]
 

- Buff blaster damage and tracking so they actually outdamage ACs in practical situations rather than purely on-paper
- Keep agility the same, but buff speed. Might be worth considering a removal of the trimark speed penalty on Gallente ships?

Lirinas
Posted - 2011.04.25 20:23:00 - [17]
 

This has been discussed at-length in many other posts over the last couple years. I am of the opinion that Gallente & Hybrids could use some TLC. Blasters aren't bad, perhaps a little better tracking & range, but Rails certainly could use an overhaul.

Likewise with Drones. They're not a bad weapon system, but they're considerably more difficult to use than any other weapon system. In PvP, drone ships are easy to counter. In PvE they shine, but improving NPC AI is making drone boats less viable ships to fly.

SGT FUNYOUN
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.26 02:21:00 - [18]
 

Ok ATM Blasters have a high DPS with short range and high ROF. This is fine if you are on either a small fast boat or a super heavy armored boat. Both are possible with Gallente. Just pay attention to the buffs and fitting and you should be fine.

I do agree though that big blaster ships need a small speed boost or something.

Duchess Starbuckington
Posted - 2011.04.26 10:31:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: SGT FUNYOUN
Ok ATM Blasters have a high DPS with short range and high ROF. This is fine if you are on either a small fast boat or a super heavy armored boat. Both are possible with Gallente. Just pay attention to the buffs and fitting and you should be fine.

I do agree though that big blaster ships need a small speed boost or something.


Umm, no. I think you'll find the problem goes much further than that.
Ok let me put it to you this way:

Please give me a reason to use blasters over projectiles, when projectiles have similar tracking, slightly less on-paper dps but higher range flexibility, easier fitting, selectable damage type (I can't stress enough how big an advantage that is) and no cap use.

I mean really, why bother when other weapon systems can do your job, but with a load of other advantages stacked on top?
Blasters have a defined role, they just need to be much better at it than the competition which right now frankly they just aren't.

Walextheone
The Red Circle Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.26 10:43:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Duchess Starbuckington

Please give me a reason to use blasters over projectiles, when projectiles have similar tracking, slightly less on-paper dps but higher range flexibility, easier fitting, selectable damage type (I can't stress enough how big an advantage that is) and no cap use.

I mean really, why bother when other weapon systems can do your job, but with a load of other advantages stacked on top?
Blasters have a defined role, they just need to be much better at it than the competition which right now frankly they just aren't.



+ 1


Haveing a ship that needs cap to keep the guns blazing means that you probably need to dedicate a mid slot to a capacitor booster, that also mean that you will run into even more fitting problems.

Lasers have the benefits of better range, fast switching between crystals, no ammo needed and still makes almost the same amount of DPS.

I hope CCP dedicates Team BFF to ship balancing

Duchess Starbuckington
Posted - 2011.04.26 13:28:00 - [21]
 

I like the idea of blasters as a close range, high damage weapon, and really don't want to see another gun that's functionally identical to an autocannon. So personally, I'm all for buffing the damage and tracking significantly on mediums and larges (smalls are alright, really) and possibly a moderate speed boost to Gallente. Nothing huge, but just enough so they're not insanely sluggish trimarked bricks like now.

Bevil Smyth
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.26 15:17:00 - [22]
 

I always thought that blasters themselves should have an innate webbing effect on hit. So as long as you hit your target there is a webbing effect applied by the shot.

This way blaster boats would be able to keep enemies in range once they get there and the skill would be getting that initial hit on your opponent to nuke their speed.

Duchess Starbuckington
Posted - 2011.04.26 16:59:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Bevil Smyth
I always thought that blasters themselves should have an innate webbing effect on hit. So as long as you hit your target there is a webbing effect applied by the shot.

This way blaster boats would be able to keep enemies in range once they get there and the skill would be getting that initial hit on your opponent to nuke their speed.


Why implement a complicated and stupidly difficult to balance thing like that when simple buffs would suffice?

Bevil Smyth
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.26 18:24:00 - [24]
 

because its my idea goddamnit! Razz

Quade Warren
Posted - 2011.04.29 18:34:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Bevil Smyth
I always thought that blasters themselves should have an innate webbing effect on hit. So as long as you hit your target there is a webbing effect applied by the shot.

This way blaster boats would be able to keep enemies in range once they get there and the skill would be getting that initial hit on your opponent to nuke their speed.


I don't think that would be a viable option. Take the Vindicator (ignore Minmatar buff to web). With the appropriate skills trained, the tracking is insane for blasters. Higher tracking means more consistent hits/DPS, which means this ship is consistently webbing you... which means your transversal has dramatically gone down while the tracking on the turrets has not decreased at all. So now the ship is consistently doing more damage, within optimal and you're stuck. All he'd need was scram/disruptor and you're pretty much toast. Trade out one high for a heavy neut... now that's just getting nasty.

Now imagine running across this ship at every gate.

Rails need a buff. I've never found a reason to use them over blasters, I'd rather fit a MWD or AB on my ships anyway. Plus, the damage for blasters and rails is not appropriate for the amount of cap they use. Not only do you handicap yourself, you're such easy prey for neuts. Increase range on blasters, increase tracking on rails while decreasing range (slightly).


Duchess Starbuckington
Posted - 2011.04.29 22:57:00 - [26]
 

Quote:
Rails need a buff. I've never found a reason to use them over blasters


Umm, what? Why are you comparing rails to blasters? Compare them to beam lasers and arties.

Quote:
Increase range on blasters


No. This game does not need another (inferior) autocannon clone.
I still say buff blaster damage and tracking. They have a defined role, they just need to be better at it than autocannons.

Quote:
increase tracking on rails while decreasing range


Right. Yeah. Cripple the one advantage they actually have in favour of something totally irrelevant while totally ignoring the biggest issue:

Railgun damage barely chips paint.

El'Niaga
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2011.04.30 04:11:00 - [27]
 

The problem is that in original development Gallente were meant to pair their remote sensor dampeners with their short range blasters to make an effective combo. The problem is that CCP has never given them a suitable Battleship EW ship like the Caldari Scorpion with their EW type so basically its not a workable combo when the enemy can 1 shot your remote sensor dampener Celestis.

Given a Remote Sensor Dampening Battleship, you'd see many concerns of the Gallente short range blasters disappear as new tactics would make them viable.

Duchess Starbuckington
Posted - 2011.04.30 11:15:00 - [28]
 

Edited by: Duchess Starbuckington on 30/04/2011 11:17:05
Originally by: El'Niaga

Given a Remote Sensor Dampening Battleship, you'd see many concerns of the Gallente short range blasters disappear as new tactics would make them viable.


Hardly.
1. No other turret type in the game needs a dedicated EWAR just to be viable. Hybrids should not be the first.
2. Brilliant, so the Gallente would have all of one ship with your sensor damp miracle cure.
3. Fix the problems with hybrids and you'll go a long way to fixing the problems with Gallente.

The Djego
Minmatar
Hellequin Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.30 11:35:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Duchess Starbuckington

1. No other turret type in the game needs a dedicated EWAR just to be viable. Hybrids should not be the first.


Actually blasters do need a dedicated EW module(today it is mostly 3-5) to be effective and always where this way.

But yeah, it never was lol damps.

Duchess Starbuckington
Posted - 2011.04.30 12:32:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: Duchess Starbuckington on 30/04/2011 12:33:36
Quote:
Actually blasters do need a dedicated EW module(today it is mostly 3-5) to be effective and always where this way.


If you're talking webs, all turrets benefit from those in scram range and with few exceptions they all need them.

Autocannons don't need target painters, lasers don't need tracking disruptors etc. etc. - so blasters should not need damps.

I'll repeat: buff damage and tracking to the point where they're actually worth it over autocannons/lasers, and then look at the ships themselves.


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