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blankseplocked unclaimed space (expansion suggestion)
 
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Jaik7
Posted - 2011.04.18 18:45:00 - [1]
 

the goal of this suggested expansion is to provide an option for a truely nomadic lifestyle in eve.

i want an area of space beyond 0.0. new space that COULD be claimed, but practically speaking, CAN'T.

the general idea is a number of wormhole type systems beyond the edge of space which can be "discovered" by anyone. after a system has been discovered, it is possible to use a new exploration ship to get there, and then light a cyno to get capital ships in. once there, the capital ships can begin to set up bridges that can be used to move subcapitals in. from there, a group can farm they system like it's nullsec, including putting up TCUs.

however, this area of space is extremly dangerous, not because the rats are worse/better, but because the area is randomly wasted by system wide storms that just clean the area. everything from pod to pos gets wiped out, including logged off people. being around when the storm blows through basicly means you get a shiny new clone. these storms would be timed randomly, so two might occur in the same hour, or a system might be left alone for ten years.

all people in the system would be able to see for a month in advance when a spacestorm was coming.

i think that all previous intersystem links put up by the corporations should be wiped out as well.

given a full month's warning, there's no reason why you'd have any excuse to get caught in this storm. i'd like a feature to be included in this where people outside the system can see that there is a storm, or have a few hours notice that a storm is coming to that system. that way nobody jumps into the new system and wonders why he's in a station.

i also think that unclaimed space should be set up so that it is possible to link the new systems together, making it entirely possible to live just in the unclaimed space.

Christina Yim
Posted - 2011.04.29 01:46:00 - [2]
 

Interesting idea... It would have to be tweaked a bit to make it lower maintenance. People, in general, are pretty lazy and wouldn't want to move around as often as they may have to in your suggestion.

I definitely like the idea of a part of space where the only viable manner of living is nomadic though. Maybe have the storms put the POSs into reinforced or shut them down or something, after the storm is over. Maybe if the storms lasted a long period of time, maybe one or two weeks, it would encourage people to move out rather than leave their POS behind, but if they don't, it can be claimed by someone else if another group can refuel and repair it.

As it is, you're right that you can't really see a profitable career in EVE while being nomadic.

Goose99
Posted - 2011.04.29 02:41:00 - [3]
 

A month's warning? You call that a storm? Make it 3 hours warning and you're onto something there. The last thing Eve needs is more safe systems for sov null blocks to farm in peace.

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2011.04.29 02:51:00 - [4]
 

How about a twist on this? Call it 'Mid-space'. No systems, and discovered areas are all moving locations which cannot be reached again a second time. I.E. Massive comets, nebula's, that sort of thing.

Instead of flying to a new system, your flying to a place that is only temporarily there and may be gone tomorrow. Take the wormhole idea, and turn it into the entire system. Stay there, log out, and log back in tomorrow looking at black space with only stars in the distance.

Add that some of these systems are TRULY dangerous and you don't know about it till you get there? Add on some amazing mining or combat options that could reap MASSIVE rewards for a very limited time?

You have an explorers dream.

sabre906
Posted - 2011.04.29 03:30:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
How about a twist on this? Call it 'Mid-space'. No systems, and discovered areas are all moving locations which cannot be reached again a second time. I.E. Massive comets, nebula's, that sort of thing.

Instead of flying to a new system, your flying to a place that is only temporarily there and may be gone tomorrow. Take the wormhole idea, and turn it into the entire system. Stay there, log out, and log back in tomorrow looking at black space with only stars in the distance.

Add that some of these systems are TRULY dangerous and you don't know about it till you get there? Add on some amazing mining or combat options that could reap MASSIVE rewards for a very limited time?

You have an explorers dream.


It always seemed strange to me why we don't have any truly dangerous pve environmental conditions in this game. Any source of danger come from players looking to pad their kb. It's pretty drool and gets old fast. We should have pve content that actually kills players, like lots of spawning of damaging nebulas off gates/stations, storms, roaming incursion style rat packs that kill players, etc.

Jaik7
Posted - 2011.04.29 03:37:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Goose99
A month's warning? You call that a storm? Make it 3 hours warning and you're onto something there. The last thing Eve needs is more safe systems for sov null blocks to farm in peace.


first, a reality based arguement. space is really big. you have no idea how mind bogglingly huge it really is. ect. there is nothing interacting with the wandering storms, giving them very predictable movements. the only reason meteorologists don't have the weather thought out past a decade is because they don't know all the variables, and here there are few variables to know.

now a game mechanics based arguement; you can't evacuate a pos in three hours. i want to force them to wander, not to be wasted at a moment's notice. given that they would rarely gather the strategic ability to make a cynostopper, which is completly determined by time the system was occupied, i'm guessing that this space would be rather fluid even without factoring in that they woulod be forced to up and move every once in a while.

Jaik7
Posted - 2011.04.29 03:40:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: sabre906
Originally by: Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
How about a twist on this? Call it 'Mid-space'. No systems, and discovered areas are all moving locations which cannot be reached again a second time. I.E. Massive comets, nebula's, that sort of thing.

Instead of flying to a new system, your flying to a place that is only temporarily there and may be gone tomorrow. Take the wormhole idea, and turn it into the entire system. Stay there, log out, and log back in tomorrow looking at black space with only stars in the distance.

Add that some of these systems are TRULY dangerous and you don't know about it till you get there? Add on some amazing mining or combat options that could reap MASSIVE rewards for a very limited time?

You have an explorers dream.


It always seemed strange to me why we don't have any truly dangerous pve environmental conditions in this game. Any source of danger come from players looking to pad their kb. It's pretty drool and gets old fast. We should have pve content that actually kills players, like lots of spawning of damaging nebulas off gates/stations, storms, roaming incursion style rat packs that kill players, etc.


i'd support this new space even if it is chosen over my pet idea of stable stormspace. however, it will be compared to the instances familiar to other MMOs. i'd suggest making your own thread about it, but add on a bit where the area is more easily found the more players are in it, that way there is still a lot of risk from pvp.

note the bolded part, don't derail me pleaseVery Happy

Yanshee
Posted - 2011.04.29 03:47:00 - [8]
 

Yes, very interesting.

I'd like to hear how you would imagine the system for finding these areas would work.

I guess you could simply build this into the W-Space system already fully realised in game. Simply create additional W-Space systems which are 'turbulent'. I feel you'd need to create new systems else established W-Space operations would get screwed by this...not that it bothers me, but empathy is nice :)

Simply have the whole system exist for a random amount of time then disappear for good, replaced by another new one somewhere. You could write in something to the effect that the new systems have solar phenomena where the sun, in some quasi-scientific way, implodes or whatnot.

You could choose to leave in or take out sleepers from this equation. Perhaps offer some amazing mining or salvaging opportunities to replace the ratting aspect. Or, you could make it such that the sleepers are there but they are trying to destroy systems by killing the suns, this might be cause for there to be some new and awesome sleeper ships to kill which offer big rewards since you don't know how long they're going to be there before they start their evil business...

Either way. EVE is too small or, at least, too explored. We need more uncharted space. I guess the only way to do this is make it such that things come and go. Once something becomes permanent it's no longer mysterious and I like the urgency of what you are proposing.

I think in game today the only really 'oooooh wicked, look what I've found' moments come with plex escalations.

El'Niaga
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2011.04.29 08:00:00 - [9]
 

The main problem is that the lighting of the cyno is not the problem, current wormhole space is outside the jump range of existing ships in terms of light years.

I'd love to see more regions added both of normal space and wormholes. To overcome the distance problems we probably need t2 or higher jump capable capitals.

The expansion of space has led to the greatest conflicts really I believe, look at Geminate and how often it changes hands. It is a crossroads both to the North and to the Drone Regions. Thus strategically it is important. Need more regions like that. (Thus need to add more distant regions like the Drone Regions).

Kara Sharalien
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
Posted - 2011.04.29 09:50:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Kara Sharalien on 29/04/2011 09:50:12
Originally by: Jaik7

first, a reality based arguement. space is really big. you have no idea how mind bogglingly huge it really is. ect. there is nothing interacting with the wandering storms, giving them very predictable movements.


It is impossible to see anything in space. Seriously, space is big, really big. You have no idea how mingbogglingly huge it is etc.

It is easy to plot the movement of superhot system-sized gasclouds. Once you know they are there.

But just you think how much trouble we have spotting asteroids about to pancake the earth that are within our local area moving slowly, and then think about the challenges of spotting something that size from 10 solar systems over.

But slow moving things arent the only danger in space. Gamma bursts are impossible to predict, because they are moving at light speed. Your first warning that a blast large enough to incinerate all life in your solar system is coming is when you all suddenly keel over and die. If you are watching the star that went nova to generate the burst at the exact time the light of it going nova reaches your observation location, you'll get maybe two minutes warning, although you'll probably spend most of that time yelling "GOD DAMN IM ****ING BLIND!", because looking at supernovas is bad for your ocular health.

edit: I'm in favor, sounds pro.

Zues Brute
Posted - 2011.04.29 16:12:00 - [11]
 

We need eve space to be bigger and more remote period..lets expand!!!!!!!!!!

Goose99
Posted - 2011.04.29 17:43:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Jaik7
Originally by: Goose99
A month's warning? You call that a storm? Make it 3 hours warning and you're onto something there. The last thing Eve needs is more safe systems for sov null blocks to farm in peace.


first, a reality based arguement. space is really big. you have no idea how mind bogglingly huge it really is. ect. there is nothing interacting with the wandering storms, giving them very predictable movements. the only reason meteorologists don't have the weather thought out past a decade is because they don't know all the variables, and here there are few variables to know.

now a game mechanics based arguement; you can't evacuate a pos in three hours. i want to force them to wander, not to be wasted at a moment's notice. given that they would rarely gather the strategic ability to make a cynostopper, which is completly determined by time the system was occupied, i'm guessing that this space would be rather fluid even without factoring in that they woulod be forced to up and move every once in a while.


Yeah, we should create farmers' heaven devoid of risk.ugh

Jaik7
Posted - 2011.04.30 22:12:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Jaik7 on 30/04/2011 22:12:46
Goose, there's plenty of risk here because these systems are at once cut off and accesible to anyone who bothers finding them. forcing them to clear out every once in a while prevents the long waiting periods of sbu online, pos bashing, and pos reinforced. it would be more dangerous out there than it would be in wormholes.

please explain why you think this would be a carebear playground. there seem to be plenty of risks run by investing in this space, and the investment would eventually be wiped clean anyways, forcing carebears to begin building all over again.

i've had another idea about the unclaimed space. i think that this space should be easier to find the more assets that are in there. an empty system would take a lot of work to locate, possibly a multi man effort. a system with many pos and capital ships could be found by nonspecialized ships and should be huge targets.

captain skinback
Posted - 2011.05.03 10:46:00 - [14]
 

blowout soon fellow stalker

El Geo
Group 2
Posted - 2011.05.03 11:43:00 - [15]
 

mmm, sounds nice
just a thought, sleeper technology was first introduced via minmatar cosmos i believe, theres also talacon, yan jung and i forget the other
so my 2 cents
new set of wormhole systems with one of the cosmos races inhabiting it, instead of "storms" just make a sort of incursion within that system where anything player orientated (like a pos) would come under attack by increasingly dificult rats (im well aware that some player are likely to find a way to farm this but its kind of inevitable, ofc if its an increasingly dificult event and capitols, even npc ones start turning up to bash the pos's its gonna be very hard to keep up)

bartos100
DARK ADAMA
Terra Axiom
Posted - 2011.05.03 12:00:00 - [16]
 

the only problem you have with a nomadic lifestyle is the lack of supply's

and the only way to get more supply's is to go back to high sec or to anchor a POS and build the stuff you need

if thee was a way to build stuff like ammo, drones and other things that are needed to keep going in a ship it would help towards real nomads in EVE

Jetkar1965
Posted - 2011.05.03 17:15:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: bartos100
the only problem you have with a nomadic lifestyle is the lack of supply's

and the only way to get more supply's is to go back to high sec or to anchor a POS and build the stuff you need

if thee was a way to build stuff like ammo, drones and other things that are needed to keep going in a ship it would help towards real nomads in EVE


Very true!

However CCP should consider an expansion on the wormholes being a remote small galaxy say of 4 or 5 or more systems in the far reaches of the eve realm that may be able support a nomadic lifestyle. Having similar patterns as the current ones available in game. That can be claimable.

Danika Princip
Minmatar
Tactical Narcotics Team
Posted - 2011.05.03 18:33:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Jetkar1965
Originally by: bartos100
the only problem you have with a nomadic lifestyle is the lack of supply's

and the only way to get more supply's is to go back to high sec or to anchor a POS and build the stuff you need

if thee was a way to build stuff like ammo, drones and other things that are needed to keep going in a ship it would help towards real nomads in EVE


Very true!

However CCP should consider an expansion on the wormholes being a remote small galaxy say of 4 or 5 or more systems in the far reaches of the eve realm that may be able support a nomadic lifestyle. Having similar patterns as the current ones available in game. That can be claimable.


You do know a constelation like that would be under the heel of an aliance pretty fast, right? If the 0.0 lot don't get it, someone else will. It's hrd to be a nomad when the guys who own the space are hunting you down, and they will get you eventually.

Jetkar1965
Posted - 2011.05.03 20:19:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Danika Princip
Originally by: Jetkar1965
Originally by: bartos100
the only problem you have with a nomadic lifestyle is the lack of supply's

and the only way to get more supply's is to go back to high sec or to anchor a POS and build the stuff you need

if thee was a way to build stuff like ammo, drones and other things that are needed to keep going in a ship it would help towards real nomads in EVE


Very true!

However CCP should consider an expansion on the wormholes being a remote small galaxy say of 4 or 5 or more systems in the far reaches of the eve realm that may be able support a nomadic lifestyle. Having similar patterns as the current ones available in game. That can be claimable.


You do know a constelation like that would be under the heel of an aliance pretty fast, right? If the 0.0 lot don't get it, someone else will. It's hrd to be a nomad when the guys who own the space are hunting you down, and they will get you eventually.


As a nomad u have to face whatever risk is out there. Nomads are small corps / alliances. TBH this would be more geared towards them rather than large alliances, as they already maintaining their soverign known 0.0 space, that are alot larger and difficult for smaller alliances to get a foothold and take over. But I may be wrong.

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2011.05.03 22:12:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Jetkar1965
Originally by: Danika Princip
Originally by: Jetkar1965
Originally by: bartos100
the only problem you have with a nomadic lifestyle is the lack of supply's

and the only way to get more supply's is to go back to high sec or to anchor a POS and build the stuff you need

if thee was a way to build stuff like ammo, drones and other things that are needed to keep going in a ship it would help towards real nomads in EVE


Very true!

However CCP should consider an expansion on the wormholes being a remote small galaxy say of 4 or 5 or more systems in the far reaches of the eve realm that may be able support a nomadic lifestyle. Having similar patterns as the current ones available in game. That can be claimable.


You do know a constelation like that would be under the heel of an aliance pretty fast, right? If the 0.0 lot don't get it, someone else will. It's hrd to be a nomad when the guys who own the space are hunting you down, and they will get you eventually.


As a nomad u have to face whatever risk is out there. Nomads are small corps / alliances. TBH this would be more geared towards them rather than large alliances, as they already maintaining their soverign known 0.0 space, that are alot larger and difficult for smaller alliances to get a foothold and take over. But I may be wrong.


The hard facts is that before there was sovereignty, players, then corporations, then alliances went out and held space that was defined as 'uncontrolled'. Just because something doesn't have a specific mechanic to grant control, doesn't mean organized groups won't go through large hoops to make it happen.

Examples of 'free' systems that CCP has tried before:
- Losec, which though owned by an Empire, still can be taken and controlled by players.
- Original Nulsec, from which player control convinced CCP to implement Sovereignty
- Drone Regions, added to be nearly profitless so that nobody would hold it.
- Wormhole space, which random entries was supposed to make impossible to control outright

This ain't to say that a system supporting nomads wouldn't be a great addition. But in short, if the system is static with static entries, EvE players have proven time and time again they will find a way to locate, consume, and control.

Danika Princip
Minmatar
Tactical Narcotics Team
Posted - 2011.05.03 22:20:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Jetkar1965
Originally by: Danika Princip
Originally by: Jetkar1965
Originally by: bartos100
the only problem you have with a nomadic lifestyle is the lack of supply's

and the only way to get more supply's is to go back to high sec or to anchor a POS and build the stuff you need

if thee was a way to build stuff like ammo, drones and other things that are needed to keep going in a ship it would help towards real nomads in EVE


Very true!

However CCP should consider an expansion on the wormholes being a remote small galaxy say of 4 or 5 or more systems in the far reaches of the eve realm that may be able support a nomadic lifestyle. Having similar patterns as the current ones available in game. That can be claimable.


You do know a constelation like that would be under the heel of an aliance pretty fast, right? If the 0.0 lot don't get it, someone else will. It's hrd to be a nomad when the guys who own the space are hunting you down, and they will get you eventually.


As a nomad u have to face whatever risk is out there. Nomads are small corps / alliances. TBH this would be more geared towards them rather than large alliances, as they already maintaining their soverign known 0.0 space, that are alot larger and difficult for smaller alliances to get a foothold and take over. But I may be wrong.


Even if the sov holders all stay out, how long do you think it would take for one nomad alliance to start kicking the others out and locking the place down?

Not very.

Dimerx
Caldari
Firebird Reborn
Firebird Alliance
Posted - 2011.05.03 23:02:00 - [22]
 

It's a challange for any upcoming small alliance which would refreshing!!

Kampfsani
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.05.04 09:04:00 - [23]
 

Very nice idea.

But let see it as a little problem solver.

The Big Allys holding the Moon goo, and the T2 prices going up like crazy (i remember a Vaga cots around 70-80m now around 110-130)

What if this "Deep 0.0" systems can not reached by any Capitals, only from new ships like Long Range Jump Freighter's and such kind of ships.
so the Small Corps/ Allys can mine the Minerals and Moon goo like in 0.0, Low, Highsec.
they can setup a "Long Range Cyno Jammer" (should be destroyd by around 10 Bomber's in aournd 30-60 min.),
so how to get ships in this system... lets get the Black Ops ships into it, and make them able to create a Portal to this system.

yeah and add the Storm' but don't let them wipe out the system and the Pos in there, maybe put the Pos Shield to 10%, so if an Attack force wana get in this system they can use this Natural phenomenon.

maybe this can fix some problems?
what you guys think?

regards Kampfsani

bartos100
DARK ADAMA
Terra Axiom
Posted - 2011.05.04 09:13:00 - [24]
 

if you make new systems for a nomadic lifestyle you don't need anything to support a group staying in there for longer times

so remove planets and moons in those systems and sites like in WH with a new set of skills that allow you to use the loot/salvage from those NPC's to improve/ repair your ship as you see fit

a nomad will modify his ship to his own needs as he finds new tech and materials

and if you have no way to make a "base" (pos) then it will be hard for any group to control those systems

Van Derka
Posted - 2011.05.04 13:17:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: bartos100
if you make new systems for a nomadic lifestyle you don't need anything to support a group staying in there for longer times

so remove planets and moons in those systems and sites like in WH with a new set of skills that allow you to use the loot/salvage from those NPC's to improve/ repair your ship as you see fit

a nomad will modify his ship to his own needs as he finds new tech and materials

and if you have no way to make a "base" (pos) then it will be hard for any group to control those systems


a mobile station warps into/through the systems, semi-regularly to trade stuff...

bartos100
DARK ADAMA
Terra Axiom
Posted - 2011.05.04 14:21:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Van Derka
Originally by: bartos100
if you make new systems for a nomadic lifestyle you don't need anything to support a group staying in there for longer times

so remove planets and moons in those systems and sites like in WH with a new set of skills that allow you to use the loot/salvage from those NPC's to improve/ repair your ship as you see fit

a nomad will modify his ship to his own needs as he finds new tech and materials

and if you have no way to make a "base" (pos) then it will be hard for any group to control those systems


a mobile station warps into/through the systems, semi-regularly to trade stuff...


i was thinking more along the lines of direct trade between ships if they are on the same grid
and you can always make a trip back to high sec (might take a few days to get back if you are deep in uncharted space)

would be more realistic then a flying market :)

Ruze Ahkor'Murkon
Amarr
No Applicable Corporation
Posted - 2011.05.04 17:16:00 - [27]
 

There is already nomadic NPC's (correct me if I'm wrong, but Thucker Tribe, maybe?). Allow them a special mothership that when they travel through, players can buy-sell from said ship. Items the players put on for sell continue to travel with the mothership, so range purchases and costs would be unique from normal markets.

Basically, your 'station' may be within your region or not, and travels through different systems.

Very Gypsy.



On a side note, the issue of how to keep said systems from being claimed is still a huge issue. Roaming environmental hazards may be a PART of a solution, but wouldn't solve the whole issue. I would also suggest that belts have a MUCH longer respawn (as in, weeks instead of a single downtime). The issue of planets and moons could be solved by removing them completely.

As far as where: There is a nebula near the old-man's star which was some type of supernova event by the backstory. Used to be systems, might still have gateways, but maybe very few planetary bodies and all of them in the act of forming (as in, not stable enough to mine from, dust clouds and debris surrounding them, highly dangerous and volatile to go near).

bartos100
DARK ADAMA
Terra Axiom
Posted - 2011.05.04 20:51:00 - [28]
 

i think that if you get that ship moving around there will be pirates following it and trying to kill anyone who comes close

i think the best is to have as less concentrated functions as possible so everything is spread out and you don't get dens populations as those can't be supported

and belts are a big NO

just use the same system as in WH with perhaps a lower spawn rate/amount of ore in it


 

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