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Opertone
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.18 20:08:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: suZy pLaIn
I am seeing a lot of discontent in the EVE community lately. I do understand that the forums are filled with 50% cry babies, 40% trolls, and 10% community activists but, it still seems CCP is driving the car off the cliff with all the anger I see.

What can CCP do make "us" (the EVE community) happy and excited to play again?



There is discontent. And a lot of posters are biased, while some use alts to make extra forum noise about anything.

CCP must remain consistent in their game development course, resist the urge to listen to nerds rage and trolls and actually provide a level playing field for all players.

Most complaints come from exploits and unfair gaming conditions, not game balance or game development pace. One problem is macro cheating, another is massive lag, which affects players in unequal manner. More often than not people prefer equality over imbalance, fair play over cheating. And CCP must enforce that.

Calathea Sata
State War Academy
Posted - 2011.04.18 20:26:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Opertone

There is discontent. And a lot of posters are biased, while some use alts to make extra forum noise about anything.

CCP must remain consistent in their game development course, resist the urge to listen to nerds rage and trolls and actually provide a level playing field for all players.

Most complaints come from exploits and unfair gaming conditions, not game balance or game development pace. One problem is macro cheating, another is massive lag, which affects players in unequal manner. More often than not people prefer equality over imbalance, fair play over cheating. And CCP must enforce that.


I've underlined the things your are utterly wrong about.

NinjaSpud
Posted - 2011.04.18 20:52:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: Ridley Tree
Originally by: Mashie Saldana
Rabble rabble rabble!!!!!


Rabble Rabble Rabble!!!!



Rabble Rabble Rabble!!!!

Luminak Narz
Posted - 2011.04.18 20:59:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Kristina Vanszar
1. New UI
2. 2 Releases with little things that bother ( + new directional scanner)
3. Ship Redesign
4. Mining revamp
5. real NS revamp

from my point of view.


Definitely agree with 1,2,3. Don't have too much of an opinion on 4, and 5. Apparently, factional warfare is also broken. I still haven't joined the militia, but it seems like if that feature was done well, it would be great. I've only done a few incursions, and that didn't seem all that earth shattering. Yet I was only in the beginning stages of them; maybe they get more interesting if you see them to the end.

I've been playing EvE on and off for a few years, and CCP seems to do a great job of getting you excited about new features. But after their releases, inevitably, it seems like the same old game. That being said, I still think it's a great game.

Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
Posted - 2011.04.18 21:03:00 - [35]
 

Just expect absolutely nothing from CCP and take the game as it is, it's amusing enough .. (which doesn't prevent me from arguing in favour of changes ofc)! ^^

voiddragon
Posted - 2011.04.18 22:29:00 - [36]
 

It's the natural order of things. EVE was dying 3 years ago, trolls and whiners still say the same thing now.

Stupid McStupidson
Gallente
Hoek Lyne and Sinker
Posted - 2011.04.18 22:45:00 - [37]
 

This just in: Internet forums found to contain an overall negative tone. Film at 11

Shivalla
Gallente
Financial Removal
THE SPACE P0LICE
Posted - 2011.04.18 22:50:00 - [38]
 

When I started to play this game at '06, eve was dying because of lag.

5 years later, eve is dying because of lag, RMT, corruption and NC being the CSM.

So in general, I think it took 2 years to get the corruption, then 2 years for NC to be formed, and CSM as the last.

I, for one, am looking forward for the next 5 years to see what kinda new exiting whiners we get in that time.


Yours,

Troll... I mean Shivalla...


Mister Rocknrolla
Posted - 2011.04.19 00:01:00 - [39]
 


An age may come to an end and be replaced by a new age where different realities are present. This transition from one age to another is often the subject of eschatological discussion. So, instead of "the end of the world" we may speak of "the end of the age" and be referring to the end of "life as we know it" and the beginning of a new reality.

Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
Posted - 2011.04.19 00:06:00 - [40]
 

Well...

1. Trying to keep game as lag-, rmt-, corruption- and botfree as humanly possible.
- There has to be risk to get reward. If some entity has no risk of running out of iskies, getting the reward is only matter of time. This ruins pvp, 0.0 sov-system and feeds botting, rmt and corruption.
2. Developing:
- 50% new content
- 50% fixing bugs and updating (rewriting) old content to meet current standards
3. Communicating with playerbase about stuff before it actually goes to development.
- Even general info like "we are going to rewrite some parts of science and industry interface during next year" would bring up a thread with 10 000 replies from people willing to say something about that. There actually could be few posts with some valid points to stuff what developers had not thought out yet."

...end of my top 3.



sableye
principle of motion
Posted - 2011.04.19 00:15:00 - [41]
 

peoeple have been moaning and quiting eve here since for forums started, alot of them still play.

Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
Posted - 2011.04.19 00:42:00 - [42]
 

Spending resources on EveOnline, you know, that game we play, would be a great start.

Antihrist Pripravnik
Scorpion Road Industry
Posted - 2011.04.19 04:02:00 - [43]
 

Having more intelligent player base than developer team can be a curse. Even slightest mistake is seen by the players. Unfortunately, CCP made some major ones and that's the source of the outrage.

What can they do? If they are not allowed to be involved in player controlled space and politics, then they obviously don't know that part of the playerbase or their needs. It wouldn't hurt them to listen to us and the CSM once in a while.

Carniflex
StarHunt
Fallout Project
Posted - 2011.04.19 08:12:00 - [44]
 

I am indeed quite .. discontent. This is rather recent development.

What you see is loss of faith in CCP competence. Sure, there has been screwups in the past, bad decisions and so on and on. However, this last patch was bucketful of cold water into the face of many people (I mean some other people in addition to myself who I have talked about it). It's not only the feeling of "screw the bugs, we have deadline to meet" but also the relatively crappy way of communicating going with it. Take for example the drastic null sec change. It's all quiet during fanfest, nobody mentions anything. Like nothing at all. And then after the fanfest there is short blog where in addition to other stuff there is "btw we are nerfing null sec", 100 pages of responses explaining why the idea is not good, why the predicted outcome will not happen and what IS actually the problems, but Greyscale went "meh, it's easy to do, we will do it anyway as fixing real problems would be hard". It's hard to believe after such attitude that CCP actually really cares what they do. Mind tho I'm not blaming Greyscale alone for this crap, CCP devs dont exsist in vacuum and I highly doubt that Greyscale would be allowed just magick this idea out of thin air and implement it overnight without nod from several other guys in there.

Nypheas Azurai
Posted - 2011.04.19 11:20:00 - [45]
 

Originally by: Ana Vyr
Lately?

EvE attracts intelligent people to it's playstyle model. Such people are often imaginative, and can really see where the game could be taken. The glacial pace of development is often frustrating to these kinds of folks, so it's no wonder we see so much ranting and raving around here. As to whether there is more disgruntlement lately, perhaps there has been.

We've just witnessed the failure of the new forums, and we are sitting on the brink of the highly controversial Incarna content after many years of waiting and speculating. I don't find it surprising that the forums are quite active and quite critical lately.

I agree with this and not in a self-ego promoting way. Why is that generic FPS players always seem the happiest in the world? New achievements and hats melt their little hearts and even the smallest lamest efforts ostensibly only to bilk their customers further are met with by the consumer base with cheers and hurrah's for the devs while they gleefully rub their hands together with dollar signs in their eyes muttering "that's right, lap it up you fools".

Whereas we here, in a much more utopian place than they are bitter and not content. And ultimately that is because of what the quoted poster has pointed out. Eve's playerbase recognizes and is fueled on EVE's potential. In fact I'd go so far as to say the sole reason for my playing EVE is not based on what it offers now, but the hope that investment now unlocks its rich potential, with Incarna (as we heard it 2 years ago, not the chunks that are being dropped now) at the forefront of one of those "potential unlocked" moments.

We want so hard for CCP to succeed, and like a parent who scorns their child for satisfactory work, only because they know they could be doing exemplary work, we are never content with CCP's half-deliveries and uncooked product. When will we be there? Hopefully never. But are we at least going down the right path? That's the expression of the forums lately; we see the vehicle wavering as if its driver were intoxicated and we worry; we plead, we beg, we hope that the path remains straight.

I Love Boobies
Amarr
All Hail Boobies
Posted - 2011.04.19 13:49:00 - [46]
 

Lol... think this is bad... should have seen it after the t20 fiasco. They actually shut down the forums because it was so bad. They were locking threads left and right. Also, I dunno if it was true or not, but I heard they were threatening people with bans if they kept up with it. That is probably not true, but anyway, it was pretty bad back then when it happened.

With that being said... the state of discontent always ebbs and flows. Sometimes it is worse than others. It's just the cycle of how things work in Eve. I wouldn't worry about it too much. As others have stated, it's happened in the past.

REiiGN15
Caldari
Posted - 2011.04.19 13:54:00 - [47]
 

They should just fix hybrids. All should be well then

Lost Greybeard
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.19 14:19:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: suZy pLaIn

What can CCP do make "us" (the EVE community) happy and excited to play again?



While they do actually watch the forums from time to time, this is not actually a line of communication for them so much as an online resource for us to discuss things with _other players_.

Our primary line of communication with CCP is subscriber count (people actually deciding to play) and subscription duration statistics (how long the average player stays active). By those measures, it seems that people are actually pretty happy with the game as-is. It keeps growing even when CCP starts doing things like banning accounts for botting.

Though, personally, I'd like CCP to further de-distribute the resources in Null (so that you can't have a full t2 production line in a single region), tune up NPC AI so that missions aren't as mind-numbing, and alter the local channel to only add people to the list when they use it (as in WHs) and add in a way to set your d-scan to pulse automatically at some slow rate (every 2 minutes or something). I'd also like sovereignty to require less in the way of isk and more in the way of active players, and a mechanic that makes you not safe from being podded/stolen from even in station. Oh, and I'd like a PvP aspect to hacking (allow us to sneak through shields, fiddle with anchored containers, etc).

They're already kinda working on the first two of those, and the lot of it amounts to minor quibbles, so... meh.

gfldex
Posted - 2011.04.19 14:36:00 - [49]
 

Originally by: suZy pLaIn
What can CCP do make "us" (the EVE community) happy and excited to play again?



Kill the CSM and start to communicate with the community again.

Opertone
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.19 15:02:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: Calathea Sata
Originally by: Opertone

There is discontent. And a lot of posters are biased, while some use alts to make extra forum noise about anything.

CCP must remain consistent in their game development course, resist the urge to listen to nerds rage and trolls and actually provide a level playing field for all players.

Most complaints come from exploits and unfair gaming conditions, not game balance or game development pace. One problem is macro cheating, another is massive lag, which affects players in unequal manner. More often than not people prefer equality over imbalance, fair play over cheating. And CCP must enforce that.


I've underlined the things your are utterly wrong about.


good one!

Alissa Solette
Posted - 2011.04.19 15:37:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: suZy pLaIn
For a new player, as I am, I read the forums to get a better picture of the community. But when I read the general community i see a game that is crashing into the abyss.

I even watched the FanFest videos on youtube and i felt like CCP was trolling the community with the video the "A Future Vision" video they showed. They show it but won't talk about how soon or the major pieces of the puzzle... Dust. A carrot on a stick is still a great scam.


I don't agree that EVE is dying or heading towards the abyss - there has always been much trolling and unhappyness on the forum so don't get to scared by it.

I do agree on the point about CCP trolling us though. They constantly make these stupid marketing videos ("bait") with heaps of features, great grPhics and reactive game play. What you get in the end is trash like PI (Civilization 1 was better in every way incl. graphics) or Faction Warfare (unfinished trash and empty promises to fix it later/soon). It's the classic bait n' switch scam. Make people horny and then **** them over.

This discrepancy between marketing/PR and the actual product is the main reason why the forums are so full of (rightly) angry customers.

The solution? Fire Zulu and everyone else in marketing, stop lying and pretending to be Blizzard and go back to being a honest - if geeky - company. That's what your average EVE-geek wants. Not empty promises and downright lies told by some marketing quack who thinks he can cause euphoria by his cheap calls of "**** yeah" at fanfest. People like that make me sick and certainly don't decrease the amount of trolling either.

Tarasina
Posted - 2011.04.19 15:56:00 - [52]
 

Edited by: Tarasina on 19/04/2011 16:16:52
They could start DESIGNING. Right now they just drop off the dung in-game, Eve is a bunch of modules just dropped out there, with little connection or reason to each other.

Eve is a sandbox simply because CCP can't design anything. Saves them the time to actually work on design.

CCP could use a grand scheme or grand vision, encompassing all fields in the game.
"We want a SCI-FI simulation" just isn't enough, nowhere near. It has to be more detailed. How are things connected? Why are they connected?

Coming up with reasons as you go ....it shows. Stuff just isn't coherent.




Reading post above me made me think of another thing.
Number of Youtube-video views of Eve...CCP seems to act like some 12-year olds. Oh look, mom, 500k views! I'm so great.

Quality over quantity. Always.

Carli Zandrya
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.04.19 16:11:00 - [53]
 

Originally by: suZy pLaIn
I am seeing a lot of discontent in the EVE community lately. I do understand that the forums are filled with 50% cry babies, 40% trolls, and 10% community activists but, it still seems CCP is driving the car off the cliff with all the anger I see.

What can CCP do make "us" (the EVE community) happy and excited to play again?



2 words.
Silent. Majority.
-or-
Loud. Minority.

Take your pick.

Col Callahan
Caldari
Boogie Monsters
Posted - 2011.04.19 17:10:00 - [54]
 

RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!!!!!

Zerp Metesur
Posted - 2011.04.19 17:17:00 - [55]
 

Edited by: Zerp Metesur on 19/04/2011 17:20:10
Incarna is going to bring in a crazy amount of players if handled correctly. It'll be like a relaunch and there's a reason they're neglecting the game in order to shove it out the door.

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2011.04.19 17:22:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: suZy pLaIn
For a new player, as I am, I read the forums to get a better picture of the community. But when I read the general community i see a game that is crashing into the abyss.

I even watched the FanFest videos on youtube and i felt like CCP was trolling the community with the video the "A Future Vision" video they showed. They show it but won't talk about how soon or the major pieces of the puzzle... Dust. A carrot on a stick is still a great scam.


You give them books,
and give them books,
and all they do,
is eat the pages.

Doctor'X
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.04.19 19:21:00 - [57]
 

Someone QUICK! call the waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa-mbulance..

Skylitsa
Posted - 2011.04.19 21:39:00 - [58]
 

Dying is a natural part of life.

There's nothing to worry about.

Derdin Riggor
Posted - 2011.04.19 22:48:00 - [59]
 

I definitely agree that there is a fundamental disconnect between the marketing team's videos and the developer's gameplay. I think this is because these videos represent the dream of eve and not the reality. In some core way I think these videos drive development as much as they entice people to play. Admittedly, it was an overly hyped video that got me playing in the first place, but it didn't keep me playing. What keeps me playing is the sandbox and it's ability to offer up creative opportunities to express what _I_ define as the endgame.

I'm not convinced that the recent missteps CCP has made with the Forums or Sovereignty will derail me. Or that Incarna will change my ability to enforce this creative approach to gameplay. Even if Incarna is less than promised it will still be a new tool for me to maneuver with. Although, this perspective is from an industrialist.

FutureTroll5000
Posted - 2011.04.19 22:57:00 - [60]
 

8/10. you used barely any text with virtually zero substance. you got all these "mains" to post within an already 2-page thread.

if it goes to page 3, 10/10.


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