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blankseplocked is EVE a nvidia game?
 
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Embrace My Hate
Amarr
Keyboard Cowboys
The Jagged Alliance
Posted - 2011.04.16 18:50:00 - [31]
 

I have almost always been an Nvidia fan. That being said my new Nvidia GTX 460 is giving me problems. Its more than likely not the cards fault since the rest of my system is bottlenecking my performance big time. Currently EVE is the only game I am getting graphics glitches on though =(

Larry Foulke
Posted - 2011.04.16 19:01:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Mary Chocolat
Hi all

I'm about to purchase a new gaming laptop and actually the main game im playing is EVE.

I am wondering if the new graphics system and further expansions aka WiS will be very PhysX dependent or I will be able to play decently on an AMD/ATI card, because these are often better in terms of quality/price

any lights on this?


You will have no trouble playing WiS on an ATI card with cloth simulation enabled.


WiS uses Nvidia's APEX cloth simulation shenanigans, its a subset of PhysX. The first game to use it was Mafia II. I've played Mafia II on an ATI card with apex on maximum, the simulation of clothing was buttery smooth, with no noticeable performance hit walking around near other characters.

Mafia II will quickly fall apart on an ATI card with PhysX enabled if physically simulated smoke and debris and all that other crap gets in the scene, but a scene with just cloth simulation is completely smooth.

This is exactly the kind of physics workload you can expect from Incarna: cloth simulation - and nothing more. Even if this somehow overwhelms the processor, the cloth simulation can be disabled from the settings menu.

It's very unlikely CCP will implement any other Nvidia specific "features" anytime soon, much less ones that would punish anyone without an nvidia card.

So you probably shouldn't make it a factor in deciding what gpu to get.

Lykouleon
Wildly Inappropriate
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.04.16 19:05:00 - [33]
 

I used to run ATI cards, but switched to Nvidia a couple years ago for a multitude of reasons.

The biggest thing you'll run into with AMD/ATI is worse driver support than even Creative. Nvidia and the companies that sell their chipsets tend to have much better tech support.

Rosalina Sarinna
Intergalactic Syndicate
Nulli Tertius
Posted - 2011.04.16 20:25:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Lykouleon
I used to run ATI cards, but switched to Nvidia a couple years ago for a multitude of reasons.

The biggest thing you'll run into with AMD/ATI is worse driver support than even Creative. Nvidia and the companies that sell their chipsets tend to have much better tech support.


Sorry, I can't let you get away with that scaremongering. Creative drivers have on more than one occation killed my windows installations, and many more people besides me have had similar problems (the dark Audigy days ofc, but also pre-audigy). ATi drivers, although sometimes a little "fruity" (at worst) just give some artifacting in shadows etc until the next driver release when they fix/optimize for said problem.

Ten Bulls
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.04.16 21:32:00 - [35]
 

TLDR; NVIDIA now, AMD later.

The thing you get with AMD cards, that you will _never_ get with NVIDIA, is the promise of good open source drivers _one_day_.

That is, AMD release the details of how their cards work so third party drivers can be written (eg. for Linux), NVIDIA will never ever do that.

When i say _one_day_, there has been efforts going on for a few years to translate AMD's open specs into good open source drivers, i believe they are still a long way away. Last i heard that internally AMD where working on open source drivers for new cards, but i could be wrong.

AMD seem to understand that they sell hardware, their business follows a manufacturing model. NVIDIA still arent mature enough to know themselves, they are still trying to be a software company which necessitates a service model of operation (rather than a manufacturing model).

AMD's long term plan of tighter integration between GPU and CPU is something NVIDIA and intel wont give you.

I concede to the NVIDIA fanbois this round, but its not over !

Freyya
Advanced Planetary Exports
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.04.16 23:14:00 - [36]
 

Edited by: Freyya on 16/04/2011 23:22:03
Originally by: Mashie Saldana
Originally by: Zofran
Originally by: Mashie Saldana

I moved from ATI to nVidia a month ago for that simple reason (and they had cards with more framebuffer).

Hahaha wat

The 2GB of effective videomemory which is the most you can get from an ATI card isn't enough if you play at a high resolution with everything maxed.


Lol...Your screenshot shows used memory as 2982 MB. This means you're running in SLI since a single GTX580 has 1536 MB of gddr. At a price range of about mehhhh 400 euro's a piece you've got for 800+ euro's of gfx cards in your system. That'll give you your precious 3 GB of gddr..

On the other hand we have the AMD HD6950 with 2 GB on one card, at a price range of around 225 euro's a piece. I'll leave you to add those 2 numbers and draw the conclusion of which provides more bang for buck.....

ALso to the OP and some random dude somewhere in the thread: Just because nVidia spends a megaton of cash on "promotional co-development" doesn't mean AMD cards will run horrible. nVidia just makes sure that by paying off developers to only optimise for nVidia cards that some performances are less optimal with an AMD card. Don't let that scare you though. It'll work just fine either way. Goes for EvE or any other game. With an AMD card you just have to bite through the bad taste of nVidia influences in the optimalization processes. Those eventually get fixed though, and sooner than CCP soon.


EDIT: yes there is a 2GB GTX580 aswell....for aprox 450 a piece.....And yes the GTX580 performs better in most games vs a HD6950, but since you can't even see the difference over 30-40 FPS compared to 300FPS i'll gladly keep 400+ euro's in my wallet or spend it on a higher end HD/CPU/MB/MEM whatever.

Mrs Snowman
Posted - 2011.04.16 23:30:00 - [37]
 

your a bit ****in stupid if you think your ATI is better than NVIDIA

Ever see ATI at fansfest? no. why? because ATI only produce their items to make a bit of cash, nvidia develop, push the boundries, communicate, update their drivers.

More expensive? Slower? NO! A Slower Nvidia card is faster in real-time actualy experience.

10 years ago maybe, but this is 2011, just grow up will you. You spend more on beer and subsprition than you do on the price difference.

Terminal Insanity
Minmatar
Convex Enterprises
Posted - 2011.04.16 23:38:00 - [38]
 

both nVidia and ATI make powerful cards, however ATI's drivers are absolute **** terrible.

If you want game compatibility problems with every other driver release, go with ATI. Otherwise, nvidia is a solid choice.

Thats not to say that nvidia has been immune to driver bugs. its just that nvidia's driver problems have been far, FAR fewer then ATI's.

Every time ATI releases a new driver there are hordes of people flooding into the Steam Support channels asking why their games dont work anymore.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2011.04.16 23:48:00 - [39]
 

On a scale of 0 to 100, 100 being most the NVIDIA-oriented game to date, 0 being the most ATI/AND-oriented game to date, and 50 being perfectly neutral...
...I would say EVE scores about a 55 or thereabouts.

So, yes, you get an ever so slight advantage with NVIDIA cards, but not radical enough to justify NOT buying an ATI/AMD card of similar overall capabilities.

Kyoko Sakoda
Caldari
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2011.04.16 23:56:00 - [40]
 

Edited by: Kyoko Sakoda on 17/04/2011 00:10:47

So many fanboys in this thread. Basically it all comes down to this:

Originally by: Larry Foulke
You will have no trouble playing WiS on an ATI card with cloth simulation enabled.


EVE currently only uses PhysX for cloth sims. The reason being is that there is currently no good OpenCL solution for cloth sims with all the necessary development tools to back it up. If CCP decided they wanted to use it for more than that, we would have a problem. Considering the user metrics CCP likely has on hand though, with the playerbase split between nVidia and AMD, I don't think they'd ever do that.

Should PhysX 3.0 ever be released, it will run approx. 2x faster in AMD systems than now since it should finally use the SSE instruction set and allow multi-threaded processing on the CPU. The x87 instructions are suboptimal relics, but nVidia's bosses have promised these changes soon™.

nVidia has a much larger software development division than AMD has allocated to their graphics division, and as such they are able to offer assistance to various game developers. This is why no one has seen AMD "in bed" with any AAA developers since Valve and their Source engine back in the early 2000's.

Hardware-wise, nVidia dropped the ball with Fermi (to my amusement), but the top-of-the-line AMD and nVidia cards are now within 1-2% of each other in a multitude of benchmarks.

nVidia has also recently decided to license SLI to AMD and their motherboard manufacturers, which means it will be available on high-end versions of the next chipset, the 900-series, which is an AM3+ Bulldozer platform. Both companies are positioning against the Intel giant and there will likely be more agreements like this in the future.

I'm a proud owner of an AMD-nVidia system and will probably continue to use components from both companies in my setups.

Freyya
Advanced Planetary Exports
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.04.17 00:28:00 - [41]
 

Originally by: Mrs Snowman
your a bit ****in stupid if you think your ATI is better than NVIDIA

Ever see ATI at fansfest? no. why? because ATI only produce their items to make a bit of cash, nvidia develop, push the boundries, communicate, update their drivers.

More expensive? Slower? NO! A Slower Nvidia card is faster in real-time actualy experience.

10 years ago maybe, but this is 2011, just grow up will you. You spend more on beer and subsprition than you do on the price difference.


Preacher, follow your own advice. Just grow up will you?
You don't see ATI (AMD now btw) at fanfest because CCP works with nVidia...duhh

nVidia develop, yes.

nVidia push the boundries? Not really since AMD was first with full DX11 support and you had to wait 0.75 year on an nVidia that did. Next to that they've been late with everything and made new graphics cards with the same chip several times over. So much for pushing the boundries of "old" architecture. There's one thing they push aswell, your power bill Wink

nVidia communicates? What exactly? I don't really keep up with communiques of either side...I do know only AMD communicates to 3rd parties regarding driver source code so people can develop better ones.

nVidia updates their drivers? Sure...AMD does it alot more though, just so you know...

More expensive, overall yes. Slower, no not really.

Facts here, not fanboyism. It's all google searchable.

Cindy Marco
Minmatar
The Warp Rats
Apotheosis of Virtue
Posted - 2011.04.17 00:36:00 - [42]
 

I've always had far less problems with ATI then Nvidia. But honestly with both companies you will occasionally have some type of issue eventually.

If you want to have the longest life out of a video card I would look more at the shader versions more than other things. A high end card will still be running new games until it simply doesn't support new shaders.


HeIIfire11
Posted - 2011.04.17 05:41:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Embrace My Hate
I have almost always been an Nvidia fan. That being said my new Nvidia GTX 460 is giving me problems. Its more than likely not the cards fault since the rest of my system is bottlenecking my performance big time. Currently EVE is the only game I am getting graphics glitches on though =(


I too have the 460 gtx and I always put on my seat belt before playing.Everything boosted to high an runs like a charm.Have tried a few other new games and same there.

+1 from me anyday. cheap and fast

Zarutha
The Night Crew
Posted - 2011.04.17 08:00:00 - [44]
 

I run two computers simultaneously, each multiple monitors. One with ati and the other with nvidia. The Nvidia on looks great, and is best with 1 account per monitor. The ati one allows me to easily stretch out 1 account over several monitors if I wanted to. This is a beautiful thing. The only problem with ATI is occasionally the suns in eve blink like strobe lights. It can be distracting at times. The eye affinity though is total win. My ati card tends to be run hotter than Nvidia.

Hope this helps.Very Happy

Cyzlak
Karkand Kampa
Posted - 2011.04.17 08:49:00 - [45]
 

Originally by: Adrie Atticus
If graphics is what you're looking in EVE, then I suggest you look elsewhere.

Oh okay that can't be you talking out yo @ss at all, no sir not at all. I mean, EVE has the best graphics of any MMO- hell, of ANY game on the market right now and you gonna come in here saying hey yo the graphics aint flash. Are you kiddin me nucka? Best you take a seat before you give yourself a headache over there

Iden Secundus
Posted - 2011.04.17 09:03:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Akita T
On a scale of 0 to 100, 100 being most the NVIDIA-oriented game to date, 0 being the most ATI/AND-oriented game to date, and 50 being perfectly neutral...
...I would say EVE scores about a 55 or thereabouts.


Unfortunatly not true since we have the (useless) character generation:
- Laptop NVIDIA: Win7; Q720; GT330M; mostly running smooth (1920x1080)
- Desktop ATI: Vista; E8400+ATI5830; no smoth anymore since incursion 1.4 (1600x1200)

In the normal gameplay I got some more texture errors at ATI in the past years; but non of the problems was blocking

Karbowiak
Sniggerdly
Posted - 2011.04.17 11:38:00 - [47]
 

Edited by: Karbowiak on 17/04/2011 11:39:17
You are all ******ed..

Only difference with the WiS **** is that the physics stuff will run smoother on nVidia, cause CCP is a bunch of ****ing ******ed ****s, that can't figure out how to use HAVOK's physics engine.

Why will it run smoother on nVidia cards? simple, physx is limited by nVidia to only work on nVidia cards. Not that it wont work on ATi, oh it will - but nVidia just decided that physx should be nvidia proprietary.
Ofc CCP went with that - instead of utilizing true open platforms that work for all gamers.

But thats what you can expect from the bunch of ****** developers at CCP. Failure failure and more failure Sad

TL;DR:
If you want WiS to be smoother with the physics rendering, go nVidia
If you don't care but want a card that runs cooler, uses less power, costs less and performs the same as a comparable nVidia card - go AMD/ATi

Undeniable Existence
Questionable Practices
Posted - 2011.04.17 12:16:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: Adrie Atticus
Edited by: Adrie Atticus on 16/04/2011 10:28:16
Instead of staying here and watching the flamewar about which is better, just go with the one you want to. Both give the same performance in their pricegroups with EVE and just because nVidia paid a few bucks to advertise on EVE videos doesn't mean that nVidia would be any better than AMD for EVE.

About being PhysX "dependent", that's not the case. PhysX is supported and utilized but youdon't need it to run any part of the game differently. If graphics is what you're looking in EVE, then I suggest you look elsewhere.

>If graphics is what you're looking in EVE, then I suggest you look elsewhere.
>If graphics is what you're looking in EVE, then I suggest you look elsewhere.
>If graphics is what you're looking in EVE, then I suggest you look elsewhere.

This is stupid on so many levels.
I suggest you go die in a fire!

Amberlamps
Posted - 2011.04.17 12:30:00 - [49]
 

Originally by: Mrs Snowman
your a bit ****in stupid if you think your ATI is better than NVIDIA

Ever see ATI at fansfest? no. why? because ATI only produce their items to make a bit of cash, nvidia develop, push the boundries, communicate, update their drivers.

More expensive? Slower? NO! A Slower Nvidia card is faster in real-time actualy experience.

10 years ago maybe, but this is 2011, just grow up will you. You spend more on beer and subsprition than you do on the price difference.


Lolwut?

Perhaps nVidia have contributed to CCP's wallet, no?

Some may say ATI of pushing the price boundary by bringing you a great product for a great price, where as nVidia seem to enjoy selling a great product for the deposit of a house.

Illwill Bill
Svea Crusaders
Posted - 2011.04.17 12:42:00 - [50]
 

Well, nVidia still make desktop chipsets, don't they? Why not get one of those boards, stick an ATI card in the PCE-e slot, and then use the onboard chip for PhysX?


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