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blankseplocked Warning for those thinking about going to the CSM mumble to talk.
 
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Yuki Kulotsuki
Posted - 2011.04.12 05:43:00 - [31]
 

Edited by: Yuki Kulotsuki on 12/04/2011 05:47:28
I wonder if the paranoid realize that there'll probably be recordings released once the chats are done. So all you're really missing is the chance to make your voice heard.

That and mittens has a dreamy voice.

Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
Posted - 2011.04.12 05:45:00 - [32]
 

I agree that the CSM should not be allowed to officially advertise completely unaudited 3rd party stuff on behalf of CCP.

Sarmatiko
Posted - 2011.04.12 05:50:00 - [33]
 

Goons can have my whole dynamic IP address pool. I trust them even more than those strange looking adult sites asking my info each time i want.. nvm.

JitaBUGz TheGreat
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2011.04.12 08:11:00 - [34]
 

They took my JobExclamation

The op just knocked the total iq pool of these forums down 85%


Warning-GOONS will control ur mind using ur harvested IP, put ur tin foil hats on!

You have been warned...

Lt Angus
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.12 08:25:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Bane Necran
134.11.103.26

There's mine. I'd like to see you try.


I like what you did there YARRRR!!

Aldo Bridger
Posted - 2011.04.12 08:26:00 - [36]
 

Tinfoil hat stuff is cute.

That said, I'm still holding on to hope that Mittens and co. are using the laughable CSM as platform for a legendary troll.

Cmon smugdogs, make me proud!

Cyaxares II
Posted - 2011.04.12 08:30:00 - [37]
 

Edited by: Cyaxares II on 12/04/2011 08:42:36

I don't quite understand the vitriol in this thread - OP is right.

(1) Harvest IPs from your own voicecomms
(2) Link funny/interesting picture from your private server on the forums of hostile alliance
(3) ???
(4) Profit!

This is done all the time and one of the more successful methods of catching spies.

(even if your IP address is dynamic you will usually get an address from the same narrow IP range - in most cases that's enough of a red flag)


Unless you are friendly with GF I would strongly recommend not use one of your in-game character names as nick when connecting to their public Mumble server.

You might only realize later that they already had a logged IP address for a different character that you want to keep secret (from some other source) and you just gave them the opportunity to link these two characters to the same person.

Suitonia
Gallente
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.04.12 08:35:00 - [38]
 

Your IP is noise if its just harvested from the eveonline forum because all it tells the person hosting the picture is that you're an eve player. Not who you likely are in game or your suspected alliance. For the average user it won't make a bit of difference if GoonSwarm has your IP anyway, if you don't have a spy or intend on spying on them, it's not going to be information they'll find useful, or rather, they won't find a use for it.

Honestly if you're worried about them getting your IP, just clone your computers MAC address on your router WLAN settings and it'll usually reset your IP, and just join their mumble with a username like SirMollesMother or something.

Kristina Vanszar
Caldari
Posted - 2011.04.12 08:41:00 - [39]
 

1. Goon s + IP : CHECK
2. PROXY : CHECK
3. Problem : UNCHECK

Cyaxares II
Posted - 2011.04.12 08:55:00 - [40]
 

Edited by: Cyaxares II on 12/04/2011 09:15:13
Originally by: Suitonia
Your IP is noise if its just harvested from the eveonline forum because all it tells the person hosting the picture is that you're an eve player. Not who you likely are in game or your suspected alliance.

this depends...

Assume you use an image to harvest IPs (and mods are slow with linkifying images because it's Sunday).

If anybody else quotes your post (with image) the image will be requested once after he hits "Quote", whenever he uses "Preview" and when he loads the page directly after posting his reply (all of this may depend on your browser's caching settings).

So you just go through your logs and see which IPs requested the image at the time a reply quoting it was posted and filter for those IPs that had already previously requested your image in a pattern that looks like it might have resulted from writing that reply.

Unless the thread is extremely popular chances are you will at least be able to link the character names of those replies that quote your image to their respective IP addresses.


If the thread is very unpopular chances are you will be able to narrow down the pool of possible IP addresses of the characters replying to your post (without quoting), too (especially if you have some additional information such as which country/region the characters are from).
Any IP address requesting the post with your image/signature in it left a "I was here @ <timestamp>" mark and every character replying to that thread left a "I was here @ <timestamp2>" mark. There must be an IP address logged for any reply you see (usually relatively short before the reply was written), if you are lucky there will only be a handful of IP addresses that remain as possible candidates.
If you do this several times (that is make several posts/threads to which the people you target are going to reply) and take the intersection of all possible candidates (while allowing for dynamic IPs, i.e. some variation in the last few digits) you might be able to get useful data.

edit: an enemy that has a way to know your IP may be able to DDoS you at an inconvenient point of time (e.g. while you are just commanding a fleet).
This can of course be prevented (both depending on your local configuration of open ports/services and on ISP level) but imo it is something that has to be considered.
(I have seen popular livestreamers getting DDoSed by people from their audience who got the IP as it was displayed on stream - so this is not an entirely hypothetical threat).

Moscow Blue
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.04.12 09:10:00 - [41]
 

It has been called to my attention that about half the posters itt would benefit from clicking on this slightly NWS link. Please click with all available haste; I have a quota of hot and sweaty IP addresses to fill.

Tyburn Stannis
Caldari
Xenon Salvage Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.12 09:22:00 - [42]
 

IP address and personal information paranoia aside - is the act of using a third-party host for a supposedly "official" line of communication a case of CCP distancing itself from the CSM, or the CSM distancing itself from CCP?

I personally won't touch anything Goon-hosted with a bargepole and a bucket of antiseptic (because of personal experience across EVE and other game platforms, not Eve-O hyperbole) so am I now permanently excluded as a player from interacting with "my" CSM?

A complete and public loss of neutrality worries me more than the potential computer-related issues.

Brodde Dim
Hyper-Nova
Posted - 2011.04.12 09:24:00 - [43]
 

You can safely join the mumble talks.

1: Its goons. They don't have the skills to do anything even if you give them your static unsecure IP straight up.

2: Even if there was a goon with a specific target, and the skills to do something, a single voice com server would not be ideal. Especially not during a event with a LOT of random people joining.

3: You can still, as many have pointed out already, fake your IP and your name.

4: There are other things you should worry about instead.

Milo Caman
Gallente
Anshar Incorporated
Posted - 2011.04.12 09:31:00 - [44]
 

Detecting Extremely Large amounts of Stupid in this thread.

BlankStare
Posted - 2011.04.12 09:37:00 - [45]
 

The Goon's mumble server is probably being used as a matter of convenience. Its already set up and running, and can handle large groups of people congregating on it, AFAIK it's used for the 'State of the Goonion' addresses.

Its nice that The Mittani has made this service available for the use of the CSM, but, as this thread proves, simply using a different domain name (but pointing at the same server) probably could have avoided this anti-goon tinfoil-hattery.

Ladie Scarlet
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.04.12 09:49:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Dalketh
Fireside chat - the new CSM - hosted on a goon channel... no offense but ya that shows no obvious slant to the new CSM. CCP events up til now have been in Eve Voice. Problem?

We want to have more than five people listening.

Karadion
Posted - 2011.04.12 13:52:00 - [47]
 

Oh god they're harvesting IP addresses! Everyone quick, get off the internet because your IP addresses are being harvested by the goons. Unplug that ethernet, no throw your computer out the window! The goons will simply call up sat cameras and pinpoint us down to the nearest meter to call in Goonstrikes on your home location. The invasion of the neckbeards is going to happen (when they leave their desk!).

Save yourselves people. Save the 0101010101010101 from being displayed to goons!

Lubomir Penev
Dark Nexxus
S I L E N T.
Posted - 2011.04.12 14:00:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: Akita T
You mean, the IP address that is actually dynamic for most users ?


Really depend on the country tbh. E.g. in France most people nowaday access the Internet via triple play boxes that either have a fixed or very stable (months) IP address.

Furb Killer
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.12 14:06:00 - [49]
 

Originally by: Lubomir Penev
Originally by: Akita T
You mean, the IP address that is actually dynamic for most users ?


Really depend on the country tbh. E.g. in France most people nowaday access the Internet via triple play boxes that either have a fixed or very stable (months) IP address.

Yeah while this (what akita said) comes up very often when people talk about IP addresses, in which country are they dynamic? Here in the Netherlands it is exactly the same, technically they dont guarantee you keep the same IP address, but since everyone has at least a router that pretty much is always on with always an active connection your IP address barely ever can change. And my own ISP (which is one of the largest here, and I am pretty sure it is similar for most others) gives an IP address based on the mac adress of your modem -> same modem, same IP address.

Of course if you want to hide your real IP it is extremely easy, but it sure as hell is not dynamic for most users here.

thatbloke
Gallente
Posted - 2011.04.12 14:12:00 - [50]
 

You mean they could take note of the very same IP address you're using to make this forum post on their voice server? ONOES!

Implying Implications
Minmatar
Broski Enterprises
Elite Space Guild
Posted - 2011.04.12 14:53:00 - [51]
 

I don't want Goons to backtrace me.

Solo Drakban
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.04.12 15:00:00 - [52]
 

Edited by: Solo Drakban on 12/04/2011 15:00:59
The level of paranoia in this thread is amazing. If you think that anonymously handing out your IP address will somehow compromise your entire financial security and collapse the free world on your head, then by all means, don't join. For those of you who actually understand how the internet works, please feel free to come as you are.

For those of you on the fence for some reason, consider the following:

  • You are under no obligation to use your character's name when connecting. Feel free to make something up. Feel free to connect with a random md5 hash if you want or the first 100 characters of La Marseillaise go for it.

  • The client is open source. Feel free to download the source code and audit it. Feel free to compile your own version and distribute it for others to use.

  • The protocol is also available, feel free to right your own client, or proxy.



For those of you wondering "why not EVE Voice?" consider the following:

  • Mumble's voice quality in infinitely superior (sorry CCP)

  • Mumble has been proven to be able to handle huge numbers of people in a single channel (1k+)

  • I can personally monitor and scale the mumble server as necessary. We aren't sure how many people will show up. Currently I have the server configured to handle 10,000 people. If necessary I can scale the CPU or RAM up on the server within seconds if we run into issues.

  • We can produce high-quality recordings of the session for later distribution.

  • You don't have to be running EVE to connect. You can connect from Windows, OS X, Linux from your desktop or laptop. Mumble also has a functioning Android client and I believe the iPhone client has been released so you can connect and listen from your phone and listen while sitting in a pub tossing back a beer, letting everybody know about your nerdiness.

  • Mumble is open source, if there isn't a client for your platform and you really felt like it, you can compile one and connect.



So connect if you want. Connect via a proxy if you really feel the need to obscure your IP address. Use your real character name, or don't. Connect from your phone via a proxy if you really want to obscure your IP information. Don't connect at all. The choice is with you and if you are convinced that we'll be able to steal your children somehow by knowing what your IP address is, little I can say will chance your mind. A recording should be available afterwards (that is if you trust an mp3 or ogg produced by a Goon, we might be trying to hack your speakers and cause your monitor to explode with a high-pitch sympathetic vibration).



Edit: Wow, [/*] to close a list item? Really?

War Kitten
Panda McLegion
Posted - 2011.04.12 15:01:00 - [53]
 

Don't post in the forums either, Goons will know your character name!



Barakkus
Posted - 2011.04.12 15:10:00 - [54]
 

Edited by: Barakkus on 12/04/2011 15:12:16
Confirming, you will get a virus and you accounts will be hijacked.

Originally by: BlankStare
The Goon's mumble server is probably being used as a matter of convenience. Its already set up and running, and can handle large groups of people congregating on it, AFAIK it's used for the 'State of the Goonion' addresses.


It would take CCP all of 10 minutes to setup mumble properly to host it themselves, holding their chat on Goon mumble servers is ******ed.

Lubomir Penev
Dark Nexxus
S I L E N T.
Posted - 2011.04.12 15:58:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: Barakkus
Edited by: Barakkus on 12/04/2011 15:12:16
Confirming, you will get a virus and you accounts will be hijacked.

Originally by: BlankStare
The Goon's mumble server is probably being used as a matter of convenience. Its already set up and running, and can handle large groups of people congregating on it, AFAIK it's used for the 'State of the Goonion' addresses.


It would take CCP all of 10 minutes to setup mumble properly to host it themselves, holding their chat on Goon mumble servers is ******ed.



We found the one guy who still think CCP can deliver anything properly working and within delays...

Barakkus
Posted - 2011.04.12 16:02:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Lubomir Penev
Originally by: Barakkus
Edited by: Barakkus on 12/04/2011 15:12:16
Confirming, you will get a virus and you accounts will be hijacked.

Originally by: BlankStare
The Goon's mumble server is probably being used as a matter of convenience. Its already set up and running, and can handle large groups of people congregating on it, AFAIK it's used for the 'State of the Goonion' addresses.


It would take CCP all of 10 minutes to setup mumble properly to host it themselves, holding their chat on Goon mumble servers is ******ed.



We found the one guy who still think CCP can deliver anything properly working and within delays...


If you can't setup mumble or teamspeak you're ******ed Laughing

knobber Jobbler
Holding Inc.
Posted - 2011.04.12 16:06:00 - [57]
 

oh noes! World will crash.

Jebus people, chill out. If you are that paranoid then just renew your IP after leaving. You should be grateful that a 3rd party is taking enough interest in EVE to pay for the hosting bills to do this.

AztecD
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.04.12 19:30:00 - [58]
 

You can have my IP ...

When you pry it from my cold dead lifeless virgin nerd fingers

Yuki Kulotsuki
Posted - 2011.04.12 19:36:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: Barakkus
If you can't setup YAF you're ******ed Laughing
fyp

Comrade Commizzar
Posted - 2011.04.12 19:49:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: Solo Drakban
Edited by: Solo Drakban on 12/04/2011 00:11:50


YOUR COMPUTER IS BROADCASTING AN IP!!!!


Aaaaaaaaaaaaaa!


Seriously though, we aren't enforcing any requirements that log in into the Mumble server with any sort of identifying information other than your publicly available IP address. You can put whatever you want for a username, eg, "FuzzyPinkBear".

If you think that simply connecting to a service with your IP address opens you up to anything (beyond knowing what your IP is right that second) I'd suggest unplugging your computer and going outside forever.



Edit: Seriously, as was already pointed out, most IP addresses are dynamic. Even if the IP addresses weren't dynamic the most we'd know about your connection is you have an IP address. You don't have to give API information or a valid character name. There is no survey asking you for your home address and telephone number. The most we'd be able to gain is that somebody connected with that IP address. Information you can obtain from an IP include the ISP it's assigned to, a rough geographical location, and pretty much that's it. This information is available to any internet service you connect to, including these forums... It's not exactly an extreme security threat.

Edit Again: I can't spell.

*************

One phrase... "DENIAL OF SERVICE".

Nope, no reason to worry about this... Now "move along!"..Twisted Evil


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