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blankseplocked Captain's quarters: where is the live video feed of the undock?
 
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Mors Sanctitatis
Posted - 2011.03.31 00:55:00 - [1]
 

We need to have real time video of the undock area available to us when we're sitting in our captain's quarters so we can see who's outside. There are all sorts of other display panels in the CQ, why can't we have a camera feed composited on one of the video screens for the undock? The technology for it is dead simple.

cpu939
Gallente
Volatile Nature
White Noise.
Posted - 2011.03.31 01:44:00 - [2]
 

Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
The technology for it is dead simple.


how about you code it, also http://www.ccpgames.com/en/jobs.aspx as it is so simple you might want to work for them

Mors Sanctitatis
Posted - 2011.03.31 02:19:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: cpu939
Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
The technology for it is dead simple.


how about you code it, also http://www.ccpgames.com/en/jobs.aspx as it is so simple you might want to work for them


I have absolutely no desire to live in Iceland, China or Atlanta, GA. Any other stupid questions?

kriot Thellere
Posted - 2011.03.31 02:39:00 - [4]
 

wouldn't this require your client to render both the in station incarna graphics as well as the out of station graphics as well? sounds like that would cause most peoples systems to run way slower then normal. unless of course you are suggesting these camera feeds be rendered server side.... i really hope not, many of the nodes are at or near capacity due to limitations of both hardware and the server code, making the server render live video feeds for thousands of stations throughout the game doesn't sound like its a smart use of remaining resources.

dont get me wrong i think its a great idea.. just seem to me like there are some hurdles as far as implementation.
i believe there was something similar mentioned on a CSM panel once were CCP was thinking about making it so warp scramblers prevented docking in order to make high sec wars less of station games, it was decided that if it were done there would have to be a way to load up the overview from inside the station to check and see if it was safe outside and such a video feed would certainly be a great addition for this purpose once both hardware and software were ready for it.

Juil
Gallente
Phoenix Industries Pty. Ltd.
Posted - 2011.03.31 06:48:00 - [5]
 

What gets me is the amount of ppl who keep thinking that Incarna is a completely seperate 3D engine.. I do not see two seperate rendering profiles being used.. I very much doubt that CCP is going to bother with 2 specific graphic engines when one Graphic Engine can be used for both.

Two seperate groups of ASSETS maybe, but not two seperate engines. Two diffrent groups of Physics commands and state machines maybe.. but not two diffrent Graphic engines.

Also if you look at what was said durring the Fanfest, part of the reason Character's are so graphic intensive is there using up to 2 - 5 x's the amount of poly's used by most other systems. Drop that down with LOD and Normal mapping and you'll find a lot of resources reopen up.

Awesome Possum
Original Sin.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
Posted - 2011.03.31 07:14:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
We need to have real time video of the undock area available to us when we're sitting in our captain's quarters so we can see who's outside. There are all sorts of other display panels in the CQ, why can't we have a camera feed composited on one of the video screens for the undock? The technology for it is dead simple.


they've already answered that question, the answer is NO.

Mirabi Tiane
Posted - 2011.03.31 08:00:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Awesome Possum
Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
We need to have real time video of the undock area available to us when we're sitting in our captain's quarters so we can see who's outside. There are all sorts of other display panels in the CQ, why can't we have a camera feed composited on one of the video screens for the undock? The technology for it is dead simple.


they've already answered that question, the answer is NO.

Got link?

Rasz Lin
Caldari
Uitraan Diversified Holdings Incorporated
Posted - 2011.03.31 08:31:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Juil
What gets me is the amount of ppl who keep thinking that Incarna is a completely seperate 3D engine..


maybe its because CCP said so themselves

Pandadora
Posted - 2011.03.31 08:51:00 - [9]
 

+1 If CCP ist serious about being THE scifi simulation this has to be done.

Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
We need to have real time video of the undock area available to us when we're sitting in our captain's quarters so we can see who's outside. There are all sorts of other display panels in the CQ, why can't we have a camera feed composited on one of the video screens for the undock? The technology for it is dead simple.

Mors Sanctitatis
Posted - 2011.03.31 08:57:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: kriot Thellere
wouldn't this require your client to render both the in station incarna graphics as well as the out of station graphics as well? sounds like that would cause most peoples systems to run way slower then normal. unless of course you are suggesting these camera feeds be rendered server side.... i really hope not, many of the nodes are at or near capacity due to limitations of both hardware and the server code, making the server render live video feeds for thousands of stations throughout the game doesn't sound like its a smart use of remaining resources.

dont get me wrong i think its a great idea.. just seem to me like there are some hurdles as far as implementation.
i believe there was something similar mentioned on a CSM panel once were CCP was thinking about making it so warp scramblers prevented docking in order to make high sec wars less of station games, it was decided that if it were done there would have to be a way to load up the overview from inside the station to check and see if it was safe outside and such a video feed would certainly be a great addition for this purpose once both hardware and software were ready for it.



Disclaimer: this reply is very simplified.

To accomplish what is proposed in my original post would indeed require the client to render both the station interior and the exterior system at the same time, in parallel. But that doesn't mean that it's hard. There aren't two rendering engines. What's more is that because the image is so small on the in-game screen the exterior LOD can be very light weight so as to reduce the number of polys used, as well as the texture sizes loaded in memory.

What's more- it doesn't need to be real time, or even 30 or 15FPS. A snapshot every 5-10 seconds would be sufficient. Have a little disclaimer at the corner: "Video Feed Delayed Five Seconds". Everyone who has responded negatively in this thread is either stupid, small minded or is simply being negative to be negative (which is pretty much covered by my first two affirmations).

Think about how it could be done, not why it can't be done. It's simple to build pre-rendered video into a texture that is displayed in game. Such a thing already exists with the billboards. Now all we have to do is convert live video on the fly to something that can be applied as a texture in real time. Not that complicated. Particularly if you don't have to do it at 15-30 FPS.

Jennifer Starling
Imperial Navy Forum Patrol
Posted - 2011.03.31 09:23:00 - [11]
 

Funny that it's too complicated to enable people to look out of windows .. Rolling Eyes

Darth Skorpius
m3 Corp
Fidelas Constans
Posted - 2011.03.31 10:01:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
Disclaimer: this reply is very simplified.

To accomplish what is proposed in my original post would indeed require the client to render both the station interior and the exterior system at the same time, in parallel. But that doesn't mean that it's hard. There aren't two rendering engines. What's more is that because the image is so small on the in-game screen the exterior LOD can be very light weight so as to reduce the number of polys used, as well as the texture sizes loaded in memory.

What's more- it doesn't need to be real time, or even 30 or 15FPS. A snapshot every 5-10 seconds would be sufficient. Have a little disclaimer at the corner: "Video Feed Delayed Five Seconds".


they could also tone down the level of detail, they really only need to display the basic model of a ship, without all the fancy textures. alternatively, they could also us to access our overview on a screen, which could be more informative than a video feed and would require much less system resources to render. personally id prefer ot have access to my overview rather than a video feed.

also, to the person who said ccp already said no on the matter, they never said no, just that it might not be fesible, if i remember correctly. there was a thread, last year i think it was, about changing docking and undocking machanics to get rid of station games and the idea of a feed of the exterior of the station was brought up. dont have a link but the thread is probably still there if you want to look for it

Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
Everyone who has responded negatively in this thread is either stupid, small minded or is simply being negative to be negative (which is pretty much covered by my first two affirmations).


you're asking the eve playerbase not to be negative or jerks on the forums? have you been playing this game long? because you really dont know this games playerbase that well, especially the forum whoring portion of it

CCP Dropbear

Posted - 2011.03.31 11:28:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: CCP Dropbear on 31/03/2011 11:29:08
Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
We need to have real time video of the undock area available to us when we're sitting in our captain's quarters...The technology for it is dead simple.


A d-scan/overview option while docked could work too. Not saying it is or isn't happening (it's not my area, for one), but yeah, there are simpler options than a live video feed.

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.03.31 11:37:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: CCP Dropbear
A d-scan/overview option while docked could work too. Not saying it is or isn't happening (it's not my area, for one), but yeah, there are simpler options than a live video feed.
More to the point: an overview would contain useful information a live feed would just be pretty.

Cathy Drall
Amarr
Royal Amarr Institute
Posted - 2011.03.31 11:41:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: CCP Dropbear
Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
We need to have real time video of the undock area available to us when we're sitting in our captain's quarters...The technology for it is dead simple.


A d-scan/overview option while docked could work too. Not saying it is or isn't happening (it's not my area, for one), but yeah, there are simpler options than a live video feed.

That would indeed be a lovely idea!! :)

Lord's Prophet
Totally Abstract
O X I D E
Posted - 2011.03.31 11:42:00 - [16]
 

CCP developed the fitting screen and ship preview picture-in-picture dual rendering technology just for this kind of thing. Originally they were promising we'd be able to watch alliance tournament rendered in client in proxy instead of just the video stream we have today. The code is in place, they just don't want to give you it.

Salpun
Gallente
Paramount Commerce
Posted - 2011.03.31 11:50:00 - [17]
 

Now that the carbon cliant is being deployed on the 5th. I expect us to start to see the good stuff.Twisted Evil

Jenny Cameron
Caldari
Ordo Eventus
Inception Alliance
Posted - 2011.03.31 12:08:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: CCP Dropbear
A d-scan/overview option while docked could work too, there are simpler options than a live video feed.

Would be a nice addition to the CQ~!

Pandadora
Posted - 2011.03.31 13:03:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Pandadora on 31/03/2011 13:04:56
Originally by: CCP Dropbear
A d-scan/overview option while docked could work too. Not saying it is or isn't happening (it's not my area, for one), but yeah, there are simpler options than a live video feed.


Maybe so, but it would not add to the 'one world' feeling. CQ would just a different (seperated) area of the game rather than part of a big universe.

Awesome Possum
Original Sin.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
Posted - 2011.03.31 13:16:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Pandadora
Edited by: Pandadora on 31/03/2011 13:04:56
Originally by: CCP Dropbear
A d-scan/overview option while docked could work too. Not saying it is or isn't happening (it's not my area, for one), but yeah, there are simpler options than a live video feed.


Maybe so, but it would not add to the 'one world' feeling. CQ would just a different (seperated) area of the game rather than part of a big universe.


it is a separate part of the game, it'll be client side. stop adding lag to the game.

Pandadora
Posted - 2011.03.31 13:27:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: Pandadora on 31/03/2011 13:27:49

Either CCP want to make their 'vision' come true (watch that video again. Big windows in the station watching the planet raid) or they keep adding seperate pieces to the game that further cluster up the players. I vote for the first. Obviously its CCP part to make sure that the overall performance dont suffer.

Patient 2428190
DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School
Posted - 2011.03.31 13:30:00 - [22]
 

One of the CSM minutes suggested if players had a way to see what's going on in the grid of the undock, that docking games could be fixed due to the fact that being warp scrambled would stop you from docking.

I was p. excited about that when I read it, shame it was in the CSM minutes and can be safely filed under /ignore and "Never going to happen"

Mors Sanctitatis
Posted - 2011.03.31 18:35:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: CCP Dropbear
Edited by: CCP Dropbear on 31/03/2011 11:29:08
Originally by: Mors Sanctitatis
We need to have real time video of the undock area available to us when we're sitting in our captain's quarters...The technology for it is dead simple.


A d-scan/overview option while docked could work too. Not saying it is or isn't happening (it's not my area, for one), but yeah, there are simpler options than a live video feed.


Quite frankly, I'm open to a myriad of options. Live video feed would simply be the most immersive for the players but would also be the most costly in terms of development time and CPU/video processing overhead. I figure if I ask for the ultimate and get half of that, the half way measure might still be pretty good. :)

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2011.03.31 19:16:00 - [24]
 

Have an alt run the equivalent of Jita Cam while outside and pipe the feed over the IGB eh?

Yeah, windows would be nice. I'm all about the eye candy.

Barakkus
Posted - 2011.03.31 20:38:00 - [25]
 

I want to fit a warp scrambler and web to my avatar and target ships outside that are close to the window to keep them from warping off.

Jon Taggart
State War Academy
Posted - 2011.03.31 20:39:00 - [26]
 

If we fall into one of the station toilets, will we be sucked out into space?

Rubix Khamsi
Posted - 2011.03.31 21:07:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Patient 2428190
One of the CSM minutes suggested if players had a way to see what's going on in the grid of the undock, that docking games could be fixed due to the fact that being warp scrambled would stop you from docking.

I was p. excited about that when I read it, shame it was in the CSM minutes and can be safely filed under /ignore and "Never going to happen"


This would suck tbh. I'm training straight for arazu and rapier. Cloak up and they see I'm not outside and they undock and I uncloak and scramble them and they can't dock = stupid

Barakkus
Posted - 2011.03.31 21:28:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Rubix Khamsi
Originally by: Patient 2428190
One of the CSM minutes suggested if players had a way to see what's going on in the grid of the undock, that docking games could be fixed due to the fact that being warp scrambled would stop you from docking.

I was p. excited about that when I read it, shame it was in the CSM minutes and can be safely filed under /ignore and "Never going to happen"


This would suck tbh. I'm training straight for arazu and rapier. Cloak up and they see I'm not outside and they undock and I uncloak and scramble them and they can't dock = stupid


I like that idea very much.
It gets boring shooting someone then they dock...undock, you shoot them more while trying to bump them off station then they dock...rinse, repeat...


 

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