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blankseplocked Just say NO to the new forums
 
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Mrs Snowman
Posted - 2011.03.02 11:35:00 - [91]
 

Originally by: CCP Elais
Now this is what I call feedback!

The Dev team, devoted to bringing you the new EVE forums on EVE gate, will take your opinions to heart and are taking quite a few into consideration for further development. Several issues are already being worked on and others have been identified for further development, released in the more frequent fashion that you have been accustomed to.

Rest assured, these forums would be nothing without you.


So your basically gona give in to a few whiny baby social networking haters?

Y'know there was a time when I said I'd never join facebook too, I resisted the way the world was changing, social networking bolox, but I caved in the end.. and now I'm in regular contact with family and friends and love interacting with peoples status, sometimes I dont want to say 'i like this status' Its easy just to 'like it'

'liking' is a modern day expression in this fast paced world where time becomes more and more precious as everything competes for our time. Dont give in to those old fussy bastards who just hate anything thats new and modern.

CCP make an admirable effort to keep fresh, push ahead and keep up with the modern day social patterns. Dont stop now because of crusty old, live-in-past, resist change, minority who rant (in the wrong place I might add) with no good reason other than to influence a resist in change.


Fulmar Muse
Caldari
Posted - 2011.03.02 12:37:00 - [92]
 

wat forums?

TokiWartooth Joringer
Posted - 2011.03.02 13:38:00 - [93]
 

I dont have a problem with the forums, i have a problem being forced to use, some hyberbole POS spacebook, that offers me nothing in terms of gameplay enhancement. See i play bugs and features online, not bugs and features offline...

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.03.02 13:41:00 - [94]
 

Originally by: TokiWartooth Joringer
I dont have a problem with the forums, i have a problem being forced to use, some hyberbole POS spacebook, that offers me nothing in terms of gameplay enhancement. See i play bugs and features online, not bugs and features offline...
Good think they're not forcing you to do that, then…

TokiWartooth Joringer
Posted - 2011.03.02 13:47:00 - [95]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: TokiWartooth Joringer
I dont have a problem with the forums, i have a problem being forced to use, some hyberbole POS spacebook, that offers me nothing in terms of gameplay enhancement. See i play bugs and features online, not bugs and features offline...
Good think they're not forcing you to do that, then…


Originally by: CCP Elais


The Dev team, devoted to bringing you the new EVE forums on EVE gate
oh really, hmm, maybe i was mistaken. Wink

Neamus
Posted - 2011.03.02 13:56:00 - [96]
 

This game has forums? Shocked

Oh, wait...

Guilliman R
Gallente
Northstar Cabal
Important Internet Spaceship League
Posted - 2011.03.02 15:44:00 - [97]
 

Originally by: Neamus
This game has forums? Shocked

Oh, wait...



These forums are part of a game??? I thought I was paying 15$ to post!

Niccolado Starwalker
Gallente
Shadow Templars
Posted - 2011.03.02 17:16:00 - [98]
 

Originally by: CCP Elais
Now this is what I call feedback!

The Dev team, devoted to bringing you the new EVE forums on EVE gate, will take your opinions to heart and are taking quite a few into consideration for further development. Several issues are already being worked on and others have been identified for further development, released in the more frequent fashion that you have been accustomed to.

Rest assured, these forums would be nothing without you.


I like the forums. Except for all the empty space on each side of the forum windows! I would love you all though if you could make the forum fit for screens like 1900x1200!


Abon
Caldari
Pandorum Research Incorporated
Posted - 2011.03.02 18:31:00 - [99]
 

Originally by: Mrs Snowman


So your basically gona give in to a few whiny baby social networking haters?

Y'know there was a time when I said I'd never join facebook too, I resisted the way the world was changing, social networking bolox, but I caved in the end.. and now I'm in regular contact with family and friends and love interacting with peoples status, sometimes I dont want to say 'i like this status' Its easy just to 'like it'

'liking' is a modern day expression in this fast paced world where time becomes more and more precious as everything competes for our time. Dont give in to those old fussy bastards who just hate anything thats new and modern.

CCP make an admirable effort to keep fresh, push ahead and keep up with the modern day social patterns. Dont stop now because of crusty old, live-in-past, resist change, minority who rant (in the wrong place I might add) with no good reason other than to influence a resist in change.




WOW way to miss the point! First of all nobody here is against improvements and new technology. With the high amount of IT people playing EVE it is quite the contrary i would say but we already have facebook so nobody here is interested in another clone of it. If you want to "like" **** go there and "like" it. What this forum needs is a slashdot style rating system to control the rampant trolling. A stupid like button is not going to help in that case.

From a technical and sociological point of view facebook COMPLETELY lacks the necessary tools to be a "social network". This was proven many many times already even by university professors and other highly educated internet analysts across the globe. (Not gonna google it for you.)

You talk about fast paced times? Do you even realize that it is useless stuff like facebook that eats up your time? Facebook is THE biggest productivity killer world wide and is highly intrusive, people get sucked into it no matter the cost with massive email spam and whatnot. I take care of multiple small to mid sized companies in terms of IT and Server Services and they ALWAYS ask me to completely block facebook out of their networks. Ever wondered why? I know multiple facebook "dropouts" and all of them are feeling much much better without it and oh wonder they even have the feeling that they have more time for important stuff!

Oh and did you ever had the joy of taking a close look at the facebook APIs? I guess not because those provide access to private data for third parties in amounts you cannot even begin to imagine. You would never pack all your private data in a folder and hand it over to some stranger on the street, yet you do it daily on facebook! Have the facebook app on your smartphone? Cool all(!!!) of your phone contacts just got transfered to facebook WITHOUT ASKING YOU! Fact is that it is a money printing machine above everything else. We are talking about hundreds of millions of dollars and those guys don`t give a damn about user concerns, privacy issues or delivering a "social" user experience. A single user datasheet is worth about hundred dollars at the moment on the market so they suck up as much as they can, i leave the math to you! Sorry to burst your bubble!

Next time please do some diving into the matter before rambling about old crusty people who in fact want an adult environment where some sort of debate is possible without the lolipop crap you call "modern day expression". Laughing Also if you want to be "social", go out and meet people or if that is not possible call them, it is much much more social than updating your status with the consistency of your latest poop.

Anyways i applaud CCP on their approach, it just needs better and more effective tools than currently implemented. And by the way your avatar reeks of anime fanboyism, please stop spamming your facebook status with ascii bunnies thx! YARRRR!!


Ai Shun
Caldari
Posted - 2011.03.02 20:07:00 - [100]
 

Originally by: Mrs Snowman
So your basically gona give in to a few whiny baby social networking haters?


Nothing to do with Social Networking. (Although that is crap :P) It is poorly designed and performs badly.

Pingdom full page load test (Sample)

The "Copy this link" code doesn't do proper URL escaping so .... Copy/paste the URLs into the site once it loads and do your own test.

My results?

The total loading time for the front page of the current General Discussion on the live forums is 1.3 seconds with 44 objects on it. I suspect for people with less Latency this will be faster.

The total loading time of the front page of the new General Discussion on the test forums is 14.9 seconds with 93 objects on it.

Is this REALLY an improvement?

I'd like a RSS link and a working Search function. If you really need to waggle your little ePeen with a Like function, sure. Go ahead. Let's all hold hands and sing Kumbaya.


But beyond that?

I can't imagine what it will be like once there is actually a decent volume of data and the same volume of concurrent users on the new test forums. Imagine what that 14.9 seconds will look like then when it is already SEVEN times slower than the current forum.

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2011.03.02 23:04:00 - [101]
 

Originally by: TokiWartooth Joringer
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: TokiWartooth Joringer
I dont have a problem with the forums, i have a problem being forced to use, some hyberbole POS spacebook, that offers me nothing in terms of gameplay enhancement. See i play bugs and features online, not bugs and features offline...
Good think they're not forcing you to do that, then…


Originally by: CCP Elais


The Dev team, devoted to bringing you the new EVE forums on EVE gate
oh really, hmm, maybe i was mistaken. Wink


I wasn't aware that you would be unable to simply bookmark the forum main page if you prefer. Smile

CCP Explorer

Posted - 2011.03.02 23:44:00 - [102]
 

Originally by: Palovana
Originally by: Josefius
I'm sure it works fine in Linux, however he was talking about running a browser in an emulation of Windows (WINE). Also, some people play EVE via WINE.
Correct. I might not have been specific enough previously.

Only the IGB when running it under Wine gives the error with HTTPS pages not rendering (unable to process the site's SSL certificate error). Firefox and Chrome under Linux work just fine.

I'm assuming it's an issue in how Wine handles Awesomium.dll. I don't believe the issue is related to the new EVE forum code as HTTPS in general does not work in the IGB under wine.
Do you know if there is a bug report in the Wine project for this issue?

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.03.02 23:50:00 - [103]
 

Originally by: TokiWartooth Joringer
oh really, hmm, maybe i was mistaken. Wink
Yes, they're forcing you to log in to the forums if you want to post. How horrid. Rolling Eyes

What is it they're forcing you to use, again?

Internet White Knight
Posted - 2011.03.03 00:05:00 - [104]
 

Needs an "ignore" function ffs.

mkmin
Posted - 2011.03.03 00:07:00 - [105]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: TokiWartooth Joringer
oh really, hmm, maybe i was mistaken. Wink
Yes, they're forcing you to log in to the forums if you want to post. How horrid. Rolling Eyes

What is it they're forcing you to use, again?


Since there is no way to 100% opt out of spacebook short of biomassing your character and quitting EVE, yes you are forced to take part in it no matter how badly you want not to. If you choose to use the new forums, they force you to use spacebook even more, as it logs you in. Stop being obtuse, I know you're smarter than that.

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.03.03 00:28:00 - [106]
 

Originally by: mkmin
Since there is no way to 100% opt out of spacebook short of biomassing your character and quitting EVE, yes you are forced to take part in it no matter how badly you want not to.
By that logic, these forums also force you to use EVE Gate…

…so what's the difference?
Quote:
they force you to use spacebook even more, as it logs you in
Yes. You must log in to use the forums. How is that any different from what we have now?

How does logging in force you to use EVE mail?
How does logging in force you to use the calender?
How does logging in force you to use contacts?
How does logging in force you to use status updates?
How does logging in force you to use EVE voice?
How does logging in force you to use the char sheet?

But ok, let's use that logic and follow it to its conclusion…

Why do I have to use the forums to look at the calendar?
Why do I have to use EVE voice to check my contacts?
Why do I have to use status updates to check my mail?
[etc for every combination]

…oh wait, I'm not forced to use any of those to do any of those things, am I? Aw shucks.

mkmin
Posted - 2011.03.03 00:42:00 - [107]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: mkmin
Since there is no way to 100% opt out of spacebook short of biomassing your character and quitting EVE, yes you are forced to take part in it no matter how badly you want not to.
By that logic, these forums also force you to use EVE Gate…

…so what's the difference?
Quote:

The current forums can't be used for easy intel. The current forums might be archaic, but they don't try to provide some fantastic service and then use it to grip your balls and twist.


Quote:
they force you to use spacebook even more, as it logs you in
Yes. You must log in to use the forums. How is that any different from what we have now?

How does logging in force you to use EVE mail?
How does logging in force you to use the calender?
How does logging in force you to use contacts?
How does logging in force you to use status updates?
How does logging in force you to use EVE voice?
How does logging in force you to use the char sheet?

…oh wait, I'm not forced to use any of those to do any of those things, am I? Aw shucks.

oh wait, the address is testforums.EVEGATE.com. and it shares all the same faulty assumptions about how the target market might use it as spacebook. But you are still arguing for the sake of arguing. The forums do not improve nor make worse the pile of crap that evegate is. I don't trust evegate even a little bit, to the extent that I now am running under a policy to NEVER set anyone to +10 standings. CCP's track record with evegate is godawful, has not improved, and is surprisingly unremarked by the general playerbase, and associating the forums with it is spreading that stink around. I'm just waiting for someone to find those exploits and account hacks that I'm 100% confident someone will find sooner rather than later.

TipsyMcStagger
Caldari
Spruillo WarDec Corp
Posted - 2011.03.03 02:37:00 - [108]
 


How bout CCP use all their time and energy doing something REALLY cool.

I want to be able to mod, tweak, and soup up my spaceship Gran-Turismo style.
Thats a natural progression that shoulda came along years ago, if anything is dinosaur it's not the forums its the spaceships were forced to predictably cookiecut fit

They have all the depth and complexity of a 90's nintendo game.

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.03.03 02:39:00 - [109]
 

Edited by: Tippia on 03/03/2011 02:40:35
Originally by: mkmin
[oh wait, the address is testforums.EVEGATE.com.
So?

The question is still the same, and no-one can apparently answer it: are you required to use "spacebook" to use the forums or can you just… you know… use the forums?
Quote:
But you are still arguing for the sake of arguing.
No, I'm questioning this nonsense about how they're "forcing us to use spacebook" to use the forums, when we can, in fact, just use the forums.

…oops. I guess that answered it. Rolling Eyes

I'm also implicitly questioning this notion that there is such a thing as "spacebook" to begin with. What is it, and what on earth does it have to do with the forums? Why and how are we forced to use it when we can just go to the forums? In short: what's all the noise about?

Kyra Felann
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2011.03.03 05:00:00 - [110]
 

Edited by: Kyra Felann on 03/03/2011 05:13:24
So you don't like the vastly improved new forums because of a little tiny "like" button and a little tiny number on each post? Really?

This goes to show that people will complain about absolutely anything. CCP could give every player $100 and people would still find some way to complain.

Originally by: Internet White Knight
Needs an "ignore" function ffs.


This. There are tons of people who contribute absolutely nothing of value to the forums. I'd like the options to ignore posts by them and to ignore threads started by them (as two separate options).

Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
Posted - 2011.03.03 05:10:00 - [111]
 

Edited by: Dr BattleSmith on 03/03/2011 05:14:52
Originally by: mkmin
it shares all the same faulty assumptions about how the target market might use it as spacebook.


Just funny isn't it? Basically it comes down to some team-leader being a very good talker, and being completely full-of-****.

Originally by: mkmin
I don't trust evegate even a little bit, to the extent that I now am running under a policy to NEVER set anyone to +10 standings.


Good policy, no character except for an alt should ever be set to 10+ with the current evegate-as-an-intel-tool setup.

Funny how CCP don't think local should be an intel tool but consider evegate to be just fine as such.

Originally by: mkmin
CCP's track record with evegate is godawful, has not improved, and is surprisingly unremarked by the general playerbase, and associating the forums with it is spreading that stink around.


They really need to clear house, get rid of the sociopath bull**** that is guiding them down this load of garbage path.

Originally by: mkmin
I'm just waiting for someone to find those exploits and account hacks that I'm 100% confident someone will find sooner rather than later.


Too late.

Each time CCP release real player data into alpha versions of these sites with no privacy protection or obfuscation, they are instantly spidered and stored.

As for hacking, from what I've seen the sites haven't been properly tested for XSS holes and the like. Some forms are missing security tokens etc.

Jojo Jackson
Caldari
Posted - 2011.03.03 10:21:00 - [112]
 

As long as you don't have up/down votes where to many downvotes lead to lock or hide a thread it's ok.

I just imagin such a function :D.
AAA downvote every NC post, NC downvote every PL post, PL downvote every AAA post and so on ...
Hell, this forums would be sooooo perma closed *g*.

mkmin
Posted - 2011.03.03 10:29:00 - [113]
 

Originally by: Jojo Jackson
As long as you don't have up/down votes where to many downvotes lead to lock or hide a thread it's ok.

I just imagin such a function :D.
AAA downvote every NC post, NC downvote every PL post, PL downvote every AAA post and so on ...
Hell, this forums would be sooooo perma closed *g*.


Actually, I'm not sure I see a problem with that... either they learn to put aside annoying politics on the forums, or they all go away. Sounds like a better world to me.

Mag's
the united
Negative Ten.
Posted - 2011.03.03 16:41:00 - [114]
 

Originally by: Kyra Felann

So you don't like the vastly improved new forums because of a little tiny "like" button and a little tiny number on each post? Really?

No. I don't like it, because it's not a vastly improved new forum.

Ban Doga
Posted - 2011.03.03 18:27:00 - [115]
 

Originally by: Josefius
Edited by: Josefius on 01/03/2011 17:40:01
Originally by: Ban Doga
Originally by: Palovana
It's a wine issue, HTTPS pages (any that I have tried) give errors when using wine. I have some posts in the Linux forum about it also.


Slow down here, buddy! CCP Explorer is the software director.
How would he know about the issues some users experience when using a completely exotic operating system?

That's clearly something no one could anticipate, not to mention test before making a public announcement. Rolling Eyes


I'm sure it works fine in Linux, however he was talking about running a browser in an emulation of Windows (WINE). Also, some people play EVE via WINE.


Hmmm, strange.

I thought he said the IGB in Wine does not work properly with https.
Last time I checked the IGB runs inside the EVE client and Wine runs on Linux.
Which means... O-M-G... it means he's playing EVE on Linux using Wine and his IGB is not working fine with https.
Must be why he posted about it in the Linux forum (of EVE)!!

Well, I'm glad you are sure it's working fine on Linux, tho.
That's so reassuring...

Harbingour
Gallente
Posted - 2011.03.03 19:44:00 - [116]
 

I noticed alot of lag time with the new forum when I checked it out. I like the looks & feel of this one too better but then again maybe I'm old fashed in saying don't fix something if it aint broke else you'll well a too fat Windows (M$) product that is buggyier then an Amish Pennsylvainian farm town with lotts of horse crud collecting on the side of the road.... just my 0.02 ISH Very Happy

Ai Shun
Caldari
Posted - 2011.03.03 20:07:00 - [117]
 

Originally by: Harbingour
I noticed alot of lag time with the new forum when I checked it out.


Run an actual speed test on it. My tests showed an average of 6 to 7 times slower for the new forum to load GD with fewer users and fewer topics.

Certainly not an improvement.

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.03.03 20:13:00 - [118]
 

Originally by: Harbingour
I noticed alot of lag time with the new forum when I checked it out.
Part of that is due to it running on test hardware, part of it is due to vast increase in javascripts running on the page, feeding all the bling. As always, adding large parts of the google js code repository to your browser blacklist speeds things up quite nicely (and generally improves the forums by getting rid of pointless graphical annoyances).

Ai Shun
Caldari
Posted - 2011.03.03 20:30:00 - [119]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Part of that is due to it running on test hardware ... <snip>


Do you know what the difference is in hardware between test and live? (Devblog?)

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.03.03 20:34:00 - [120]
 

Originally by: Ai Shun
Originally by: Tippia
Part of that is due to it running on test hardware ... <snip>
Do you know what the difference is in hardware between test and live? (Devblog?)
Not really, but considering that they're pulling the character data from the sisi database, and considering how much slower sisi is than the live environment…

…it probably explains some part of the speed loss. I suspect that all the scripts is a bigger culprit for the felt slowness though, as opposed to the actual page processing.


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