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Alexandra Stormwing
Cry Wolf.
Posted - 2011.03.30 14:57:00 - [181]
 

Dramiels need to be fixed.

Personally, I'm okay with the speed the way it is. If the idea behind the ship was to create something exceptionally fast and agile that is able to disengage at will, well, that's fine. It's very Minmatar in flavor.

The problem is that it can have this amazing mobility AND do a lot of damage AND have nice EHP AND have fantastic tracking AND have fantastic projection. Then drones on top of it all. It's just too much of a good thing.

I personally refuse to fly them because of this, but this does limit what I can reasonably engage because Dramiels are so popular. Go Dramiel or go home - it shouldn't be this way.

El Liptonez
V0LTA
VOLTA Corp
Posted - 2011.03.31 18:44:00 - [182]
 

+1 for nerfbat.

Jerika Bodet
Posted - 2011.03.31 20:07:00 - [183]
 

FFS people, a Dram is Elite faction. It's cost is 10x or more of T1's and 3-4x's more than AFs, I would definitely expect for it to be better. Risk vs reward! That's what Eve is! Cause if I fly one and F'up then I pay a high price for it!

There have been a number of threads on this debate already. It comes down to people whining cause they are ill prepared and don't want to have to adjust tactics. Well hell, adjust or die. They have a Dram, come out in a Daredevil or even a sentinel could work. So why not use what's commonly know as Tactics and planning and quit whinning. Heh, not to mention the ship is available to Everyone! Whether you choose to invest in the Dram elite/risk is up to you! But stop being babies because others choose to use the ship.

Btw, Drams have been killed by a well fitted Badger Mk II, so the idea of it's impossibly difficult to kill and it can GTFO whenever it decides is total crap. Use your brains for once and make that Dram pilot cry over his loss.

Reaver Glitterstim
Legio Geminatus
Posted - 2011.04.01 02:34:00 - [184]
 

Edited by: Reaver Glitterstim on 01/04/2011 02:34:32
What Alexandra Stormwing said. The dramiel is the fastest ship out there, no need for a nerf to that because it's not overpowered in its speed alone. But it's far too powerful to be that fast. I think its power should be nerfed.

The dramiel is like they took an interceptor and an assault ship and slapped em together with the best of both worlds, and you get a dramiel. But that wasn't enough so they had to let it field 3 drones. Sure it has trouble hitting stuff when it's vroming around at the speed of sound. Everyone else has trouble hitting it. I don't see what's wrong with that.


Also I think the Rifter is in need of a nerf. They're popular but I don't see them used perhaps as much as one might expect. However, I've used lots of frigates in various situations and the rifter is the one I keep coming back to. It's just got the best of so many things. It's pretty fast and with 3 low slots, you can fit it to go almost as fast as a slasher or other fast-type t1 frigate. But it still has a fair amount of powergrid, and can fit a medium shield extender with autocannons and an afterburner. I find that with this setup, and with nanofiber internal structures in the lows (and maybe a weapons upgrade or two), it's hard for other frigates or evens mall drones to hit me, even though they can't do much damage to my rifter with that gigantic shield extender on it. I can even sort of outrun heavy assault missiles while orbiting within range of my autocannons and firing at my target. This also happens to be within the range needed to warp scramble them. I've never tried fitting artillery and using a microwarpdrive (flying in a wide orbit to allow my rifter to track with them), but I know it can be cap stable doing that. I'll bet that is also an effective strategy, and would be particularly good at dodging missiles, stasis webifiers, and drones.

fr0gout
The Scope

Posted - 2011.04.01 11:43:00 - [185]
 

Edited by: fr0gout on 01/04/2011 11:43:34
Originally by: Jerika Bodet
FFS people, a Dram is Elite faction. It's cost is 10x or more of T1's and 3-4x's more than AFs, I would definitely expect for it to be better. Risk vs reward! That's what Eve is! Cause if I fly one and F'up then I pay a high price for it!

There have been a number of threads on this debate already. It comes down to people whining cause they are ill prepared and don't want to have to adjust tactics. Well hell, adjust or die. They have a Dram, come out in a Daredevil or even a sentinel could work. So why not use what's commonly know as Tactics and planning and quit whinning. Heh, not to mention the ship is available to Everyone! Whether you choose to invest in the Dram elite/risk is up to you! But stop being babies because others choose to use the ship.

Btw, Drams have been killed by a well fitted Badger Mk II, so the idea of it's impossibly difficult to kill and it can GTFO whenever it decides is total crap. Use your brains for once and make that Dram pilot cry over his loss.


The Daredevil and Cruor both cost more and have strengths and weaknesses which can be exploited. Price shouldn't be the only balancing factor.

Sephiroth CloneVII
Posted - 2011.04.01 20:17:00 - [186]
 

do people realize a dramial is a faction pirate ship that is woth 100's of millions of isk?

If other frigs cost the same it would make sense they get the same stats.


Sexy Mirkin
Posted - 2011.04.01 21:41:00 - [187]
 

why do people always want balance, what's the point of having 50 ships to fly if they're all the same. There is always a best ship. Drake being best bc for example. This game has never had balance and never should attempt to. eve is more like paper rock scissors, everything has it's counter.

Sexy Mirkin
Posted - 2011.04.01 21:50:00 - [188]
 

Here's an idea, nerf skilled pilots too. If you get too many kills ccp should start lagging you out to balance you with others, then everything would be balanced and everyone would be just as **** as every one else.

Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.04.02 09:52:00 - [189]
 

Originally by: Sexy Mirkin
why do people always want balance, what's the point of having 50 ships to fly if they're all the same. There is always a best ship. Drake being best bc for example. This game has never had balance and never should attempt to. eve is more like paper rock scissors, everything has it's counter.


You don't know what the word 'balance' means.

Xydros
Veto.
Posted - 2011.04.02 10:20:00 - [190]
 

I too have access to all of the frigs in the game with near max skills.

Dramiels are killing frig PVP, please give them an exploitable weakness like the other faction frigs have.

GheyNeil
Posted - 2011.04.02 19:43:00 - [191]
 

overdue, dramiel nerf is overdue

PreZiDenT1
Omega Wing
Snatch Victory
Posted - 2011.04.04 09:21:00 - [192]
 

Edited by: PreZiDenT1 on 04/04/2011 09:23:14
I agree that dramiel should get a small nerf. In that case the anti-dramiel, daredevil, should probably get one too.

I see some people play the risk vs reward card here, but i dont think they realise the market mechanics behind nerfs/buffs. If the dramiel gets the nerf the risk will be smaller = lower price.

In other words: risk vs reward is fixed + frigate class is balanced.

Edit: I havent read all posts in case someone has already pointed this out.

Miso Hawnee
Posted - 2011.04.04 17:09:00 - [193]
 

Confirming Dramiel pilots are the biggest ***gots in eve.

Eve has not known such ***gotry since before the falcon nerf.

I love how fast they are, its cool to be able to break 10 km/s but the ship has too many other strengths. imo, dps nerf in the form of less drones.

Firey Jack
Caldari
Wolfsbrigade
ShadowWolves.net
Posted - 2011.04.06 11:21:00 - [194]
 

Supported completely.

Kingwood
Amarr
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.04.06 20:21:00 - [195]
 

Supported.

Davader
Posted - 2011.04.07 12:35:00 - [196]
 

Support

CaldeteisX
Caldari
Aurora Polaris
The Babylon Consortium
Posted - 2011.04.07 15:20:00 - [197]
 

supported.

Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2011.04.07 15:32:00 - [198]
 

Quote:
do people realize a dramial is a faction pirate ship that is woth 100's of millions of isk?

If other frigs cost the same it would make sense they get the same stats.



You don't understand how pricing works. Hint: It is no more difficult to produce a Dramiel than it is to produce a Worm.


Supported. What's funny is the opponents of nerfing dramiels are using the same non-arguments that precede every obvious, needed nerf...generic stuff that could be applied to literally everything.

Sephiroth CloneVII
Posted - 2011.04.07 15:58:00 - [199]
 

Edited by: Sephiroth CloneVII on 07/04/2011 16:00:18
While dramiels should defiantly be better then tech 1 ships (and faction), it should probably brought in line closer to other faction frigs.

As it is dramiels stand as overpowered compared to the others, or the only one that doesn't suck major dongs, considered how much it is used.

Looking at the stats the big difference between drams and other faction frigs is the base speed (470 to 300), make them all closer to interceptor speeds of the respective race then that would do allot (mabey 50 km slower, so that the frigs that are specialized just for speed have some edge in that category), being the preferred role of a elite frig (is something small not going to speed tank and be fast? Add to that gurista need a equal boast to the damage of missiles to that of other frigs, instead of being gimped with half the slots and no base boasts to firepower.

Maksim Cammeren
Posted - 2011.04.29 01:16:00 - [200]
 

Edited by: Maksim Cammeren on 29/04/2011 01:21:26
Edited by: Maksim Cammeren on 29/04/2011 01:16:18
Bump.

I approve of this idea.
While not nearly as experienced as other pilots in this thread, I have been engaging Dramiels recently with fits specifically designed to beat them. Even then, the only hope is that the other pilot doesn't know how to properly fly the ship. A good pilot just disengages if he starts to lose.

Falloff bonus + a tracking bonus + superior speed is the main issue in my opinion (echoing some of the other comments in this thread).
Nerf at least some of these and Dramiels would have a weakness that can be exploited.

Tyrehl
Amarr
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2011.05.25 15:43:00 - [201]
 

Bump, because i just spent 30 minutes arguing with people in FW.

Svyatagor
Posted - 2011.05.25 15:47:00 - [202]
 

Originally by: Tyrehl
Bump, because i just spent 30 minutes arguing with people in FW.

We both just did.

Was this pic posted b4?

sten mattson
Amarr
1st Praetorian Guard

Posted - 2011.05.25 16:11:00 - [203]
 

supported , cuz i just listened to your argueing :p

Kadesh Priestess
Scalding Chill
Posted - 2011.05.25 18:28:00 - [204]
 

.


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