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Albert O'Balsam
Posted - 2011.01.27 11:20:00 - [1]
 

It seems there is a need for more logistics pilots in incursion. Recommend me a fit that will best suit the needs of an incursion fleet please ;).

Guardian, basalisk and oneiros are all possibilities for me.

Thanks

Wardeneo
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.01.27 11:26:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Wardeneo on 27/01/2011 11:41:19
Edited by: Wardeneo on 27/01/2011 11:36:17
Edited by: Wardeneo on 27/01/2011 11:31:45
Originally by: Albert O'Balsam
It seems there is a need for more logistics pilots in incursion. Recommend me a fit that will best suit the needs of an incursion fleet please ;).

Guardian, basalisk and oneiros are all possibilities for me.

Thanks


Arrow IF ur fleet armor tanks and u have another logi pilot in gang - Guardian - Exclamation If not Oneiros

Arrow IF ur fleet shield tanks and u have another logi pilot in gang - Basalisk - Exclamation If not Scimitar

Pick 1 :)

EDIT No.1; - u wanted fits 2 brb - fetching EFT...

EDIT No.2;

[Guardian, duo 1]
Damage Control II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Adaptive Nano Plating II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I

10MN Afterburner II
ECCM - Radar II

Large 'Regard' I Power Projector
Large 'Regard' I Power Projector
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I


Light Armor Maintenance Bot II x5

Get 2 of these and use cap xfer on eachother - if u have logi 5 u "should" only need 1 cap xfer each iirc - if u have logi 4 or below - u will need both cap xfers......

also since new EFT came out (Version 2.13.2 iirc) - and my last 1 went wrong (Version 2.13.1 iirc) and i lost all my fits... i dont have any other logi setups to hand sorry....

EDIT NO.3;

[Guardian, incursion logi 5 duo]
Damage Control II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Adaptive Nano Plating II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I

10MN Afterburner II
ECCM - Radar II

Large 'Regard' I Power Projector
Medium 'Regard' I Power Projector
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I


Light Armor Maintenance Bot II x5


IF u want more tank (bearing in mind u loose 1 large cap xfer for a medium): this is a logi 5 modified version, with better tank, use large cap xfer for other logi pilot and medium for who ever....


Salpad
Caldari
Carebears with Attitude
Posted - 2011.01.27 18:42:00 - [3]
 

I'd like to see a Basilisk fit that's good for Incursions.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2011.01.27 22:18:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Salpad
I'd like to see a Basilisk fit that's good for Incursions.


Me too!

-Liang

Celgone Rahl
Rest ln Peace
Posted - 2011.01.27 22:48:00 - [5]
 

Needs good fitting skills (which any Logi pilot should already have)

[Basilisk, Logi V Incursion Fleet]

5x Large Shield Transporter II
Large Energy Transfer Array II

Conjunctive Gravimetric ECCM Scanning Array I
Invulnerability Field II
Photon Scattering Field II
Large Shield Extender II
10MN Afterburner II

Beta Reactor Control: Reaction Control I
Warded Gravimetric Backup Cluster I

2x Medium Ancillary Current Router I

5x Light Shield Maintenance Bot I

-----------------------

Pairs nicely with another logi V Basilisk.

If you have Logi 4 or are pairing with a Logi 4 pilot that needs 2 cap transfers, swap out 1 shield xfer and swap in 1 large cap xfer. Everything permaruns. Sensor strength is 61 which is very much needed against sleeper ECM.

Mara Rinn
Posted - 2011.01.28 00:14:00 - [6]
 

I have been using Solace armor, Regard cap and S95a shield transfers to save on fitting. With 4/2 between tank/cap transfers, at logi 4 we have managed to stay alive, though we have lost T1 cruisers due to lack of tanking power.

I will remember to use the current router to let my guardian use the 1600mm plate instead of trimarking it :)

Albert O'Balsam
Posted - 2011.01.28 08:36:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Albert O''Balsam on 28/01/2011 08:38:22
2 good setups thanks for the feedback.

I will be getting myself a basalisk and a guardian over the next couple of days based on this info and trying them out. On the face of it the guardian seems the best bet however with a much higher buffer and lower sig chances of staying alive long enough to really help seem better.

On the basalisk setup - I guess theres a skill defecit somewhere that means you need the reactor core, surely its better to fit something like a damage control if you can for the extra buffer, but I like the setup and it does give a nice sensor strength

Also it seems these are the 2 ligi ships of choice but is anyone using a different logi and think their setup is any good? I would be interested to see the setup.

Celgone Rahl
Rest ln Peace
Posted - 2011.01.28 15:37:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Albert O'Balsam
Edited by: Albert O''Balsam on 28/01/2011 08:38:22
On the basalisk setup - I guess theres a skill defecit somewhere that means you need the reactor core, surely its better to fit something like a damage control if you can for the extra buffer, but I like the setup and it does give a nice sensor strength



No skill deficit (assumes no fitting implants though). T2 shield reps use a lot of grid. You could switch the highs to meta 4 and save some grid to change the fit up a bit, but I like the faster cycle time of the T2 reps.

Ravenal
The Fated
E.Y
Posted - 2011.01.28 18:17:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Ravenal on 28/01/2011 18:27:37
throw away these stupid eccm mods ... they don't work against npcs.

edit: oh and to contribute

[Guardian, incursion]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Damage Control II
Energized Thermic Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II

10MN Afterburner II
Cap Recharger II

Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Regard' I Power Projector
Medium 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Medium 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Medium 'Regard' I Power Projector

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I

2 of these each put their large power and two med armor on each others for emergency stuff while throwing around the two large armor and the med energy.

2 per squad of 10 please ...

Ni'ark
Parnassius Corporation
Inception Alliance
Posted - 2011.03.07 17:41:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Ravenal
Edited by: Ravenal on 28/01/2011 18:27:37
throw away these stupid eccm mods ... they don't work against npcs.

edit: oh and to contribute

[Guardian, incursion]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Damage Control II
Energized Thermic Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II

10MN Afterburner II
Cap Recharger II

Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Large 'Regard' I Power Projector
Medium 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Medium 'Solace' I Remote Bulwark Reconstruction
Medium 'Regard' I Power Projector

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I

2 of these each put their large power and two med armor on each others for emergency stuff while throwing around the two large armor and the med energy.

2 per squad of 10 please ...


They do work against npc's, even against mission rats

Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2011.03.07 18:48:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Ravenal

throw away these stupid eccm mods ... they don't work against npcs.

This has been disproven, ECCM DOES work against NPCs.

The basi fit I use:

Lows:
Damage control
Power Diag II

Mids:
2 Invuln IIs
Photon scattering field II
10mn AB
Remote sensor booster (best named)

Highs:
2 Large energy transfer IIs
4 large shield transporter IIs

Rigs:
2 ancillary current routers

It works quite well for vanguard farming, though I'd not take it to the higher end sites. 2 energy xfers so I can feed my vindi when he wants to MWD all over the place.

Isan'na
Malicious Destruction
Posted - 2011.03.07 20:02:00 - [12]
 

Edited by: Isan''na on 07/03/2011 20:03:00
Originally by: Albert O'Balsam
Edited by: Albert O''Balsam on 28/01/2011 08:38:22
*snip*
On the face of it the guardian seems the best bet however with a much higher buffer and lower sig chances of staying alive long enough to really help seem better.
*snip*

Also it seems these are the 2 logi ships of choice *snip*


The guardian's buffer is offset by the fact that the reps take effect at the end of the cycle, therefore extra EHP is needed to soak up the 3.5 second delay. If a basi calls for reps, it gets them immediately. The sig helps a lot, but an AB fit basi doesn't take too much more damage that it's dealbreaking.

The reason that they're the logi ships of choice is because they rep more and can counter the heavy neuting that the Sansha rats bring to bear, or keep cap-intensive fleetmates working at full power. Their downside is that you need multiple to operate at all; however, this is negated by the fact that the incursions require you to have multiple logis to be alive anyways.

And one last thing, our fleet basi fit:

[Basilisk, Incursions]
Damage Control II
Reactor Control Unit II

Photon Scattering Field II
Photon Scattering Field II
Large Shield Extender II
Y-S8 Hydrocarbon I Afterburners
Invulnerability Field II

Large Shield Transporter II
Large Shield Transporter II
Large 'Regard' I Power Projector
Large 'Regard' I Power Projector
Large Shield Transporter II
Large Shield Transporter II

Medium Anti-Explosive Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Ancillary Current Router I




Arazel Chainfire
The Awakened Armada
Apex United
Posted - 2011.03.07 23:15:00 - [13]
 

Having lead lots of shield fleets, there's a couple things that you should do if running in a pickup fleet. One, always fit for logi 4 if you're in a basi or a guardian. I don't care if you have logi 5, or if your current buddy has logi 5, once he drops fleet, he is going to be replaced by someone else, and they probably have logi 4. No need to waste more time refitting than you have to. Second, you always want to keep moving, and afterburners are great for minimizing damage. Third, always do a test with your cap buddy before you go in, because there is nothing worse than you dying, and the whole fleet dying, because the other logi in the fleet didn't know what he was doing. Fourth, always use best named remote reps - the difference in performance is small, and the difference in fitting is large, don't compromise the rest of your fit just for t2 reps. Lastly, and this is for everyone, even non-logi's, fit a damage control! Do not undock in an incursion fleet without it.

Standard Incursion Fits:

Basilisk
Highs
4 S95a Partial Shield transporters
2 Large Regard power projector
Mids
1 AB 2
1 Photon 2
2 Invuln 2's
1 Large Shield Extender 2
Lows
1 DCU 2
1 RCU 2
Rigs
2 CCC or shield extender
Drones
shield rep drones, armor rep drones, or mining drones, depending upon fleet and FC.

Scimitar - Logi 4
Highs
3 Large S95a shield transporters
Mids
1 AB 2
2 Invuln 2's
1 Large Shield Extender 2
1 Cap recharger 2
Lows
1 DCU 2
3 cap power relay 2
Rigs
2 CCC
Drones
shield, armor, or mining drones as needed

Fit will permarun everything, even if you don't have shield emission systems 5. And you can't really fit a 4th rep and still be cap stable. Always keep moving with your afterburner on

Scimitar - Logi 5
Highs
4 S95a Shield transporters
Mids
1 AB 2
2 invuln 2's
1 large shield extender 2
1 cap recharger 2
Lows
1 DCU 2
3 cap power relay 2
Rigs
2 ACR
Drones
again, to taste

Once again, fit permaruns everything.

As for why I'm giving Scimitar fits when you didn't ask for them? I'm sure someone else will look at the thread and be able to fly one. Personally, I prefer having scimitars in my fleet, because then npc jamming (or more importantly, DCing) doesn't give them a 2for1 when knocking out my rep power. I don't have any guardian/onerios fits because I don't fly armor in incursions, but I'm sure someone else will come along with a few eventually.

-Arazel

insulubria
Posted - 2011.03.08 01:28:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: insulubria on 08/03/2011 01:31:00
1 Pacifier large remote rep (lets you fit 3 tech2) (makes you the most armor/sec gaurdian in your fleet, unless someone else has nerfed their 1600mm)
3 large remote rep II

2 regaurd energy transfer

1x 10mn ab (used for a 5000m orbit of a stationary ship)

1x 1600mm plate
1x energized adapt
1x non energized adapt (no cpu needed)
1x dcuII
1x navy thermal active

2x t2 gridrigs

used to have navy energy transfers, could send cap further than lock distance. and they ate too much fitting so tossed em

Qanael Radlari
Caldari
Morior Invictus.
Velocitas Eradico
Posted - 2011.03.08 06:42:00 - [15]
 

Another consideration, if you have Logistics up to 5 and other pilots in your fleet do as well, is to use 5-repper Basilisk fits and do a one-way cap chain or cap pairs. That adds quite a bit of repping power. You can also keep the second cap transfer on to help people who get neuted.

Altarica
Posted - 2011.03.08 09:04:00 - [16]
 

I see a lot of ab's fitted. Our testing seemed to show that we were better off with more buffer.

[Basilisk, Incursion]
Damage Control II
Capacitor Power Relay II

Photon Scattering Field II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II

Large S95a Partial Shield Transporter
Large S95a Partial Shield Transporter
Large S95a Partial Shield Transporter
Large S95a Partial Shield Transporter
Large 'Regard' I Power Projector
Medium 'Regard' I Power Projector

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II

Then again we have just been doing Vanguard sites, is the ab worth more than the LSE in the harder sites ?

Salpad
Caldari
Carebears with Attitude
Posted - 2011.03.08 14:18:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Altarica
I see a lot of ab's fitted. Our testing seemed to show that we were better off with more buffer.
[Basilisk, Incursion]
Photon Scattering Field II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II


The sig bloat from 2 x LSE isn't much of a problem? Or even just 1 x LSE?

And the speed tank from an AB2 doesn't help much?

Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2011.03.08 15:24:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Cambarus on 08/03/2011 15:26:42
Originally by: Altarica
I see a lot of ab's fitted. Our testing seemed to show that we were better off with more buffer.

[Basilisk, Incursion]
[...]

Then again we have just been doing Vanguard sites, is the ab worth more than the LSE in the harder sites ?
The basi fit I use in vanguards has no LSEs and no shield rigs. 2 invulns, an EM hardener and a DC is more than enough.

EDIT: and for reference, with an AB and a leadership alt my basi fit tanks the entire room in nation commander sites with 1 shield xfer on him, and the nation mining sites with 2.

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.03.08 15:42:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Altarica
I see a lot of ab's fitted. Our testing seemed to show that we were better off with more buffer.

<snip>



In this thread: People posting terrible basilisk fits.

Fit properly, a basilisk has about 120m sig radius. That does you absolutely no good if you're standing still. Propulsion is necessary to mitigate incoming damage. It's essentially another hardener.

And for god's sake, drop the local cap recharge. You look ridiculous.

Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2011.03.08 17:53:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Aamrr

In this thread: People posting terrible basilisk fits.

Fit properly, a basilisk has about 120m sig radius. That does you absolutely no good if you're standing still. Propulsion is necessary to mitigate incoming damage. It's essentially another hardener.

For vanguard farming, fit PROPERLY, my basi has a ~65m sig radius. Shield rigs and shield extenders are a waste for vanguards, maybe even assaults, as long as you can survive one volley you'll be fine if the other basi pilot is competent.

Isan'na
Malicious Destruction
Posted - 2011.03.08 18:27:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Cambarus
Shield rigs and shield extenders are a waste for vanguards, maybe even assaults


I'd say it definitely helps for assaults. Most of the damage changes from being torp-based bombers to laser-based cruisers, snipers, and battleships, and they hang back far enough that they don't have tracking issues. It's closer to the initial spawn of four Romi Thalamus in the mining site.

And we should probably not factor mind-linked lokis in unless it's applied to both sides. :P The 121m sig would go down to 87 if we did.

Oh, and our good alt friend is right: that dual-LSE, no-prop, local-cap fit is pretty damn bad. Although I resent the generalization that implies my fit could be included in the terrible category :(

Solomar Espersei
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
Posted - 2011.03.08 21:33:00 - [22]
 

Yes, needz moar Guardians and Basks to spread the lovez.

What a great expansion this has been, but I gotta ask, what's wrong with these PVE FCs that try these sites without Logi ships? Some of the fail fleets we've encountered have just been LOLtastic and ended in great gobs of epic explosions.

From what I've seen, these fleets really need the cap transfer so, I'd roll with a chain of those for your fleet, perhaps a few cap transfer mods from your DPS ships.

Altarica
Posted - 2011.03.09 10:04:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Aamrr
In this thread: People posting terrible basilisk fits.


I sense some hostility in this thread. Very Happy

I conceed that dropping a LSE for a AB would probably be a good idea, in fact that was why I posted initially to get feedback from others about that change.

As for the local cap charge, well really what else can you put there (low slot) thats useful? swap the cpr for a backup array? I'm still not one hundred percent convinced that npc jamming works that way, CCP say its a flat random chance and well it is their game after all (yes I know lolCCP).

And the cap charge rig, well again what do you put there thats any use? cdfe? wait you just told me that extenders were bad ...

Cap charge mods were put there because of 1) what else to put there? and 2) to have some recharge if the transfer from the other logi went down for some reason.

Generally I believe in "if you did it and lived you did it right". So far we have not lost any ships in any of the Vanguards we have done. You may not like my fit or think its ridiculous but it has worked for us so /me shrugs.

Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
Posted - 2011.03.09 10:55:00 - [24]
 

An alternative to logistics ships is the Dominix, which can provide logistics and drone DPS:

[Dominix, Incursion, Spider-Tank]
[high-slots]
Large Remote Armor Repair System II
Large Remote Armor Repair System II
Large Remote Armor Repair System II
Large Energy Transfer Array II
Large Energy Transfer Array II
Large Energy Transfer Array II

[mid-slots]
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
Target Painter II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

[low-slots]
Damage Control II
Energized Reactive Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II
1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II

[rigs]
Large Remote Repair Augmentor I
Large Egress Port Maximizer I
Large Egress Port Maximizer I

[drones]
Garde II x5
Ogre II x5
Hammerhead II x5
Hobgoblin II x5
Berserker SW-900 x2


This needs to be used together with similar setups (remote repair + cap transfer) to build a spider tank.

Isan'na
Malicious Destruction
Posted - 2011.03.09 20:18:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Altarica
I conceed that dropping a LSE for a AB would probably be a good idea

Cool :D

Originally by: Altarica
1) what else to put there?

The other fits should give you a good idea of that, but, basically, if your cap goes down, you've got about 15 seconds to reestablish it under perfect conditions. Local cap might make a difference of a second. With or without the local cap, good fleet organization is necessary to survive the disruption, so other possible improvements are more valuable overall.

Originally by: Alatrica
Generally I believe in "if you did it and lived you did it right".

Corollary: It might not be wrong, but it could probably be done better. Might've come across harsh, but we're trying to help; otherwise, we would have posted in C&P ;)

Proof of the NPC ECM chance, btw.

Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2011.04.15 23:39:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Isan'na
Originally by: Cambarus
Shield rigs and shield extenders are a waste for vanguards, maybe even assaults


I'd say it definitely helps for assaults. Most of the damage changes from being torp-based bombers to laser-based cruisers, snipers, and battleships, and they hang back far enough that they don't have tracking issues. It's closer to the initial spawn of four Romi Thalamus in the mining site.

And we should probably not factor mind-linked lokis in unless it's applied to both sides. :P The 121m sig would go down to 87 if we did.

Because I like to nitpick: My skirmish links are on a non-mindlinked tengu, the sig would be much smaller on a mindlinked loki.

And that initial spawn with the 5(or is it 6? can't remember >_> ) cruisers can easily be tanked with 2 shield RR. An AB and a small sig radius can do absurd things. TBH I'm not sure how well it would fare in assaults as I've never tried it, but don't knock something for going against conventional wisdom until you've tried it :P


 

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