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James Giovanni
Posted - 2011.01.23 06:24:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: iP0D
Absolutely hilarious.

CCP put all communication with the CSM under NDA.

Keep in mind CSM are torn between disbelief and disappointment on the severe and continuing lack of gameplay, content and features of Incarna after those communications as visible in the Minutes and on blogs, publications and posts by CSM members.

But CCP turn to EON and tell them everything there is. Which mirrors exactly the sentiment of CSM reports, with the addition of a little glossy wrapping Very Happy


Well well, that really says a bit about the challenges of Incarna and the CSM. Brilliant brand management. At least it shows the upcoming candidates for CSM 6 the best pressure spot and instrument to engage in the next time constructive criticism is unwanted, and mere media attention is desired.

This is even better than the lead game designer recently in an interview stating he only wants to do new things, but hey when customers shout so much, you give them rockets Very Happy




excuse me but they are just keeping CSM on the same level as their employees.


they release new info at fanfest and at EON, and just like thier empolyees, the CSM have to hold thier tongue.

besides we WANT the CSM to taking seriously don't we? or else they would lie about stuff, and just show them nothing under NDA.

Weltact
INVICTUS.
Posted - 2011.01.23 11:31:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Kyra Felann
I can't stand games where everyone runs everywhere. It kills immersion for me.


Until they decide we have to go to some dungeon in the station to talk to our agents, or our captain's quarters for the market or get our ship repaired, etc. Now there's a killer for my immersion. Which is a very common pitfall for CCP, something new and awesome is figured out, got to make sure people use it otherwise it looks a bit meh and besides, nothing can be compelling anyway if it isn't enforced so let's make things required this and that way over a few expansions.
They better let us run, if we're going to have to walk around to agents.

Jennifer Starling
Amarr
Posted - 2011.01.23 11:50:00 - [33]
 

Edited by: Jennifer Starling on 23/01/2011 11:51:12
Originally by: Kyra Felann
I can't stand games where everyone runs everywhere. It kills immersion for me.

At least give Amarr the ability to be carried around by slaves then! Cool

If slowly walking from hangar to bar is a just as time-consumingly sluggish activity as jumping 15 systems I'll get annoyed as hell!

I'm a bit disappointed that no-one seems to be interested in things like gestures, poses, facial expressions, animations, lip sync, mini-games, proximity sound, voicecom in rooms, autorisations and whiteboards in corp offices, sitting and lying, NPCs, food + drinks, clothes, tattoo shops, implant traders, accessoires, windows, pets, music in bars ..

Lijhal
Posted - 2011.01.23 11:51:00 - [34]
 

on the day where something similar like mass effect meets eve online, on this day, eve will become "the" ultimate game!

Disteeler
Perkone
Posted - 2011.01.23 12:00:00 - [35]
 

I'll leave a bit of the article:

"The theme of what we're looking into for Incarna is called 'risky business'," says Arnar [Zulu]. "Smuggling, contraband, trading, black market, handling stolen goods... stuff like that. The things that you need to do 'off the grid', things you need to do without anyone else seeing."



hired goon
Posted - 2011.01.23 12:11:00 - [36]
 

If I bought this magazine, I wouldn't scan it and put it here. It would be like throwing my sunday roast to the dogs. If you are excited about Incarna, you will buy the mag and support a great indy publisher. If you are the kind of person who is complaining about not having the info for free, you are likely the kind of cynic who is just going to **** all over the information anyway, the same way most of you are already doing in this thread.

The thing that gets me is how you think you are all such experts on something you don't even have access to the information for.

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2011.01.23 12:21:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: Iamien
Edited by: Iamien on 18/01/2011 06:07:39
Looking at the newest in-game ad it seems CCP may have buried some highly-sought information in an extremely overpriced publication that few people can afford to subscribe to.

You know what to do.




Yup I have the information right here. I know exactly what to do.




Not give it to you. Cool

C.

TeaDaze
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
Posted - 2011.01.23 12:27:00 - [38]
 

CCP fed fluff information about Incarna to Eon and PC gamer along with their hopes and dreams for where it might be in a couple of years. The actual state of Incarna is under tight NDA because it doesn't match most people's expectations (don't make assumptions based on a fanfest demo 2+ years ago). It is convenient for publicity to allow the players to speculate about what Incarna will provide.


The reaction from the people on the CSM looking forward to Incarna was one of disbelief and disappointment. I would love to explain why, but I can't due to :NDA:

Jennifer Starling
Amarr
Posted - 2011.01.23 12:31:00 - [39]
 

Edited by: Jennifer Starling on 23/01/2011 12:31:39
Originally by: TeaDaze
(..) don't make assumptions based on a fanfest demo 2+ years ago (..) The reaction from the people on the CSM looking forward to Incarna was one of disbelief and disappointment. I would love to explain why, but I can't due to :NDA:

/me cries in utter disappointment * Crying or Very sad

So I guess the half-life engine will be best to make Clear Skies like fan vids for the coming 5 years .. great (not)!

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2011.01.23 12:55:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: TeaDaze
CCP fed fluff information about Incarna to Eon and PC gamer along with their hopes and dreams for where it might be in a couple of years. The actual state of Incarna is under tight NDA because it doesn't match most people's expectations (don't make assumptions based on a fanfest demo 2+ years ago). It is convenient for publicity to allow the players to speculate about what Incarna will provide.


The reaction from the people on the CSM looking forward to Incarna was one of disbelief and disappointment. I would love to explain why, but I can't due to :NDA:


Let me guess. Its restricted to the captains quaters in terms of environment. Avatars look approximate to the char generator and can walk about.

And thats it.

C.


Jennifer Starling
Amarr
Posted - 2011.01.23 13:04:00 - [41]
 

I still wonder if it wouldn't be better to pay for expansions so we at least get something more decent!!!

CCP WTF is this!! Evil or Very Mad

Yauna
Caldari
Parnassius Corporation
Revival Of The Talocan Empire
Posted - 2011.01.23 14:09:00 - [42]
 

TBH, i don't see what all the fuss is about. I's been a long time since we last got any proper footage of Incarna, so it's only natural that people start to dream up "What will be". Of cource Incarna today is not going to match up with peoples expectations because it's likely so diferent.

Now correct me if i'm wrong, but i haven't seen any posts by CCP stating that the initial release of Incarna would be anything other than a very basic template. I beleive the integration of two game engines inside the same game is a very dificult task, so honestly i don't expect it to be that overwhealming when it is first released. What i am curious about is wether or not CCP intends to expand farther on Incarna after the initial release, as they said they would back in... when ever it was they said they would.

I can understand the need for NDAs, but some more info would be nice to help ease the hearts and minds of your paying customers... Wink

Boma Airaken
Seekers of a Silent Paradise
Posted - 2011.01.23 14:42:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Sosus Red
THe EON magazines are really really nice. Possibly the most high quality looking mag I've ever seen. That said, if more people subscribed, I think the price would come down. It's made by a small publishing house, they've got to make profit somehow. I actually think its pretty cool that a niche game like EVE has such a great fan magazine.




The problem is that the magazine is more expensive than the ****ing game you ****ing jackwagon. Not going to happen.

Viqer Fell
Minmatar
RETRIBUTIONS.
Legion of The Damned.
Posted - 2011.01.23 15:05:00 - [44]
 

To hear from someone that is in the know that they are that disappointed over what Incarna will be is saddenning.

I hate the whole concept of Incarna and have been against it from the start but still I know many people are eager for it. I think the reason I am so against Incarna is that I just don't think that CCP will be able to provide the scope of environment and variety of features that I think it needs to be good.

And to be clear I don't think any company could currently provide it not just CCP. Incarna needs to be too grande too large too immersive for anyone to get close to it.

Zora
Gallente
Vector Industries
DONT PANIC.
Posted - 2011.01.23 15:15:00 - [45]
 

Edited by: Zora on 23/01/2011 15:22:55
Edited by: Zora on 23/01/2011 15:16:35
One of the things they mention in the latest EON is that they've been thinking hard about which roles (read: mini-professions) they could make for Incarna.
And, what I find interesting, they want to introduce professions like smuggler/black market traders with certain items which can only be traded in station, in certain back-alleys or something (think advanced illegal drugs aka boosters).
No further detail is given, but they seem to want to shift some market mechanics to Incarna, which I find interesting.
Apart from that, the known stuff like being able to build your own environments (bars, offices, etc.) in reserved areas of each station is still on the plan.

Also, v1.0 will be having limited content but they will be expanding it over time. Probably they will set up the basic framework with v1.0, and then deliver additional assets in the coming months.

Oh and just by the way: EON is a great magazine, it's a great collectors item with some of the highest-quality print I've ever seen in a magazine. Yes is it's expensive, but IMO worth it.

hired goon
Posted - 2011.01.23 15:19:00 - [46]
 

I think you should all give CCP the chance of releasing it before forming your stupid ignorant opinions, and not just rely on one CSM guy saying "I was disappoint". Maybe the NDA is there because CCP know they can work their butts off and present something amazing in the summer. If that's the case, what would the point be in releasing videos and info in its current state except to turn people completely off it? If Incarna is released in the summer and is better than anyone expected, and as good as CCP say, won't you all be eating your words? I know damn well for sure I'm going to bookmark this thread so I can link back to it and make you all look like idiots.

However, if it's released and you're all right, and it's a steaming load, I will be right there next to you with my pitchfork. But probably just chanting something like "you should have taken longer on this"

ivar R'dhak
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.01.23 15:38:00 - [47]
 

Edited by: ivar R''dhak on 23/01/2011 15:39:30
Actually by now Im resigned to Incarna sucking. I just hope it will not inconvenience us too much.
Things like walking to your agents or over to the dock for refitting, etc. Rolling Eyes

I really hope they will talk about this on Fanfest and that the crowd will tear their heads off for crappy ideas like that.
Could be the very first fest without a constant CCP rulz atmosphere. Neutral

Vorqoth
Posted - 2011.01.23 15:50:00 - [48]
 

I was at least expecting to be able to go to bars and play that "boardgame" with a friend.

They show early builds at fanfests with huge stations, bars, games, and then say "remember this isnt finished".
We wait a few years, expect them to work on it and create even more content, but when its released none of that is even available, all we have is captains quarters where we can change clothes.


I so hope it wont be like that. Its like taking a kid to a toystore and show him all the fun stuff and then just leave, not cool. Sad

Iraherag
Posted - 2011.01.23 15:52:00 - [49]
 

Originally by: Zora
Edited by: Zora on 23/01/2011 15:22:55
Edited by: Zora on 23/01/2011 15:16:35
One of the things they mention in the latest EON is that they've been thinking hard about which roles (read: mini-professions) they could make for Incarna.
And, what I find interesting, they want to introduce professions like smuggler/black market traders with certain items which can only be traded in station, in certain back-alleys or something (think advanced illegal drugs aka boosters).
No further detail is given, but they seem to want to shift some market mechanics to Incarna, which I find interesting.
Apart from that, the known stuff like being able to build your own environments (bars, offices, etc.) in reserved areas of each station is still on the plan.

Also, v1.0 will be having limited content but they will be expanding it over time. Probably they will set up the basic framework with v1.0, and then deliver additional assets in the coming months.


I think no one objects to continuing work on something after the initial release.

It's just that past experience tell us that the initial release tends to be quite severely limited, not even close to what has been marketed (eg Tyrannis: "Rule mercilessly on planets everywhere in New Eden" VS "place structures, create routes, click submit; don't settle on planets in Jita, Sankkasen, Amarr, ...") and that continued development takes rather years than months.

Zora
Gallente
Vector Industries
DONT PANIC.
Posted - 2011.01.23 15:53:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: Vorqoth
I was at least expecting to be able to go to bars and play that "boardgame" with a friend.

They show early builds at fanfests with huge stations, bars, games, and then say "remember this isnt finished".
We wait a few years, expect them to work on it and create even more content, but when its released none of that is even available, all we have is captains quarters where we can change clothes.


I so hope it wont be like that. Its like taking a kid to a toystore and show him all the fun stuff and then just leave, not cool. Sad


Where did you get the information that it won't have that? As far as I can tell (and judging from the EON interview) all of that will be there.
Just maybe with fewer chair models to place, and less variety than most people would "wish" for. Best to just wait and be suprised what we'll get Rolling Eyes

Vorqoth
Posted - 2011.01.23 15:59:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: Zora

Where did you get the information that it won't have that? As far as I can tell (and judging from the EON interview) all of that will be there...

...
Originally by: TeaDaze
... The actual state of Incarna is under tight NDA because it doesn't match most people's expectations (don't make assumptions based on a fanfest demo 2+ years ago). It is convenient for publicity to allow the players to speculate about what Incarna will provide...


Just like the "new" NeoCom we never got.

Freyya
Advanced Planetary Exports
Intergalactic Exports Group
Posted - 2011.01.23 16:12:00 - [52]
 

TL:DR;

Incarna as seen on video demo's was nothing short of a very fancy tech demo with heavy placeholders of high quality. It was a tech demo of a single player game with none of the heavy back-end for multiplayer. The Incarna (with all the sexy latex women and dancers)
demo was simply heavily scripted and a view of "what could be" instead of "what we've done so far". What they've done sofar is probably 1/30th of what you saw in the tech demo. Either that or they have everything ready and are increasing the amount of crap so they can do so called staggered releases as things "finish" so they can all be slackers for a couple months. I'm going for the 1st one though and yes, i too was someone looking forward to Incarna RELEASE...not anymore though as it's all wax statue made to look like marble and diamonds. Just don't hold your breath whatever you hope for.

TeaDaze
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
Posted - 2011.01.23 16:17:00 - [53]
 

Originally by: Vorqoth
Just like the "new" NeoCom we never got.

No, we (CSM) actually saw a working live demo of the New NeoCom.

dkbjitawhore
Posted - 2011.01.23 16:22:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: TeaDaze
Originally by: Vorqoth
Just like the "new" NeoCom we never got.

No, we (CSM) actually saw a working live demo of the New NeoCom.


As did everyone that played on the test server the day before patchday.

Apparently it was removed due to a potential exploit.

Ranka Mei
Caldari
Posted - 2011.01.23 17:06:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: Sahara

Quote:
"The theme of what we're looking into for Incarna is called 'risky business'," says Arnar [Zulu]. "Smuggling, contraband, trading, black market, handling stolen goods... stuff like that. The things that you need to do 'off the grid', things you need to do without anyone else seeing."

Blech. To stay with the RPG aspect of things for a moment, I want to go to the mall, and do in-station shopping! :) I want to accessorize! I want to find and buy me cute outfits! And I want to dress up my personal (non-gankable) station quarters.

I also want to have corp meetings, where we can interact with other corp members.

"Smuggling, contraband, trading, black market, handling stolen goods," yada, yada, yada, that could honestly be fun too (I get a sort of good Babylon 5 feel here).

Iraherag
Posted - 2011.01.23 17:10:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Ranka Mei
"Smuggling, contraband, trading, black market, handling stolen goods," yada, yada, yada, that could honestly be fun too (I get a sort of good Babylon 5 feel here).


Just think about how "tyranny on planets" was implemented and now try to imagine how dealing with contraband could look like:
Your character walks over to a dark corner...
sits down in the shadow...
...
and then you see some lists, icons and a bit of text... Shocked

Xailia
Unsteady Corporation
Posted - 2011.01.23 17:44:00 - [57]
 

Too much pessimism here about Incarna.

Be it 3D captains quarters, test-bed for WoD, or fully featured part of EVE, it will be something - I'll probably like it.

As long as they don't take Sec Wars out (which I doubt, they bought a license from O'Connor).

Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron
Legion of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2011.01.23 18:00:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: Zora

Also, v1.0 will be having limited content but they will be expanding it over time. Probably they will set up the basic framework with v1.0, and then deliver additional assets in the coming months.
You mean sorta like they did with all the content missing from Tyrannis?

Jennifer Starling
Amarr
Posted - 2011.01.23 19:12:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: hired goon
I think you should all give CCP the chance of releasing it before forming your stupid ignorant opinions, and not just rely on one CSM guy saying "I was disappoint". Maybe the NDA is there because CCP know they can work their butts off and present something amazing in the summer.

Well it's just disturbing that:
1) the fanfest was showing customizable bars, offices, long coats and other stuff;
2) the interview seems to show that they want to make part 1 of Incarna just a "smuggling mini-game";
3) a CSM representative is massively dispappointed with the current state of Incarna;
4) WiS was initially to be released dec 2010.

If summer 2011 just gets us a contraband mini-game (like PI is just a mini-game, nothing revolutionary imo) when will we get something that caters the RPers among us? Will there anything else in stations except illegal boosters at all before winter 2011/2012?

Jas Dor
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.01.23 19:34:00 - [60]
 

From the general lack of resource devoted to EvE and the end of White Wolfs print games I. Get the feeling all available resources are being thrown at the WoD MMO. From what e t hearing about Incarna I get the feeling that it will be an earkyvalph test for the WoD MMO and that WoD is eating so many resources because it is in deep technical trouble. Basically every mmo but EvE and WoW has ended up flopping. CCP may be finding out that it is quite hard to get lighning o strike twice.


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