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blankseplocked [Proposal] Redesign fleet concept to add more strategy and lower lags
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Jean Leborgne
Posted - 2011.01.17 23:50:00 - [1]

Just some thought regarding current large scale battle in 0.0:
  • Not so interesting for base pilots, you follow FC order, you play until you become primary target then you rush for another ship.

  • Battles are often won by the side aligning the larger fleet.

  • Large fleets tend to limit ship types to ease leadership, which lower tactical effect of different ships (only drakes and scimitar for instance)

  • Large fleets create huge lag

After discussing with many players, everyone just love looking at alliance tournament because of small engagement (1 pilot using his ship perfectly can change the outcome of the fight) and because of diversity (what types of ship will they align and how they interact together to form a well-balanced group).

I propose to completely redesign the fleet concept in order to:
  • Give more responsibility for each pilot.

  • Give more importance to the fleet composition (preparation of the battle)

  • Try to stop very large fleet size, which is the main cause of lag when fighting

This is mainly done by reducing the number of ships in a fleet.
Here are my propositions to achieve this:

  • Replace the pilot fleet limit by a Fleet Command Limit

  • Fleet command limit is influenced by FC leadership skills

  • Each ship type receive a fleet command weight

  • Sum of all ship fleet command weight within a fleet cannot exceed the Flee command limit

  • Fleet command weight is bigger for bigger ship (idea is to have fleet with no more than 15 BS sized ships for instance). Taking the volume or mass of a ship to get its fleet command weight might be a first settings to investigate

  • When create a fleet the fleet commander has the option prepare his fleet composition by asking for specific ships (3 drakes, a vulture, 2 scimitar) or asking for specific ship role (3 interceptors, 1 titan)

  • When a pilot join a fleet, either the fleet has no composition, either the pilot fly one of the ships part of the composition which reserves the dedicated slot for him

Of course this will not stop alliance to form-up 10 fleets and play together but this will make the coordination of these fleets more difficult (you cannot warp or anchor the same guy) which will naturally force alliance leader to adapt and create new way of fighting.
This will certainly force alliance to spread their forces and try to build balanced fleet groups (with complementary ships).
This will also force fleet leader to think differently (do I prefer 1 drake or 2 cerberus + a frigate sized ship ?).
Of course you can create a full DPS fleet with no support but its role and engagement will then need to be carefully planned.

I know it's a little strange proposition in the never-ending "I want to have larger fleet" request but I think this might really add more strategy on fleet leader hands, give more responsibilities to pilots within the fleet and more over limit the number of ships fighting on the same place, thus reducing lag issue.

I don't know if this kind of proposition has ever been made, let me know what you think about this.


Jean Leborgne

Orb Lati
Sebiestor Tribe

Posted - 2011.01.18 00:49:00 - [2]

I could see such a concept working and I would in fact be temped to support it if there was also a new mechanic to allow more control of warping on grid.

One of the primary functions of the fleet structure is it provides the fleet commanders movement and positioning control. There is always within the fleet structure a few pilots dedicated to providing the positioning points for the combat ships. This is by far the greatest tactical work of the fleet commander is just positioning.
The issue in game at the moment is that the only methods to move a fleet coherently is to use another fleet member to warp to.

Your proposition while interesting would simply multiply pilots needed for this basic task.
What would be required before adopting a point system to enforce multiple fleets (which could be coupled with gang bonuses grid specific) is a basic navigation mechanism to allow "free warp" in space.

IMHO the 3 basic navigation functions needed would be:
1.) Coordinate input and display.
2.) Homeworld navigation control for warp and creation of BM (both in macro and solar system view)
3.) Broadcast and viewable in space bookmarks. (FC only broadcast to fleet)

I might look at elaborating this idea in a separate post.

Word Bearers of Chaos
Word of Chaos Undivided
Posted - 2011.01.18 04:07:00 - [3]

Simply not allowing a fleet to exceed the leadership skills of the boss would do wonders as well.

Antihrist Pripravnik
Scorpion Road Industry
Posted - 2011.01.18 04:54:00 - [4]

If something is more difficult, it's more challenging.
If it's more challenging, it's more interesting to make it work.

So, basically, you achieved nothing, because established large alliances will eventually successfully deploy huge fleets and due to increased difficulty of making a huge fleet, smaller entities will be even more defenceless against blobs.

All kinds of other misc stuff pops up by drastically limiting the fleet size:
- Sov warfare
- Capital warfare
- Supercapital warfare
- CCP losing a marketing strategy ("epic" fleet battles not seen in any other MMO)

Besides, an option is already given - Wormhole space limited by the amount of ships that can come through before the entry wormhole collapses. Not to mention that living in a wormhole space is much more profitable and challenging than living in nullsec.

However, I'm not for keeping the blobs in the current form, so I'll be neutral on this suggestion.

Guldi Ranmos
Posted - 2011.02.03 21:58:00 - [5]

I completely agree with the idea. I'm not sure what you propose can work but we definitively need to reduce fleet size.
Fleet should be limited to 40 pilots to maximum.

With the current concept of fleet and 200 drakes flying together, we don't need any pilot anymore, fleet commander just need a big remote control to control all ships it will be better (for the result, for the players who can watch a movie instead of looking at the lag).

Do something regarding this please.


Posted - 2011.02.04 07:05:00 - [6]

Originally by: Guldi Ranmos
Fleet should be limited to 40 pilots to maximum.

Please do this right away.

I'd allso like to see something like, fleet bonuses only beeing applied from an active command ship on grid.

good way to reduce size of sov capping fleets, is to make it a capital ship's job (buff capitals through the roof in dps and hp - but, virtually unable to harm subcapitals) witch means, subcap fleet can gtfo the TCU and roam/camp gates like they should do. while the fewer, more powerful capitals can eat structures and other capitals without the 1000 drakes crashing the server every time they shoot a missile

Posted - 2011.02.04 15:04:00 - [7]

Artifficial limits like that will accomplish absolutly nothing , it will only anyjoy poeple .

While your idea is noble , your implementation sucks.


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