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Guitonkagya
Minmatar
The Ouroboros Partnership
Posted - 2011.01.16 21:06:00 - [1]
 

A few questions about this ship.

What in particular makes it so awesome? whats the reason why people reccomend it as a good choice to fly when soloing something like c1 - c2 WH sites?

What advantages does the Drake have over the Hurricane (and vice versa) for soloing these sites? and what makes it a 'better' than 'other' BC's for this particular task? (im assuming the 5% shield resist is major factor of why this ship is seemingly rated so highly)

What would be your personal reasons for flying a drake? and what would you mainly use it for?

I've never flown a Drake (yet) but maybe I will train up my skills to do that since it seems to be a ship that everyone talks about alot. And i'd like to see for myself Wink

sincerely



Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2011.01.16 21:17:00 - [2]
 

Few reasons why the drake excels in pve:

Missiles tend to offer better damage projection than other weapon types. At the ranges missiles can hit, they do much better damage than other weapons. (And they use no cap)

The drake itself gets a shield resist bonus, and being a BC it has the ability to field a massive passive tank. This means neuting won't screw you over, you need to invest very few SP to make a solid tank and the ship itself is absurdly cheap.

You could probably get a cane to tank almost as well, but it would do horrible damage at pve ranges. Myrm suffers the problems all drone ships do in WH space, and the harb doesn't have the cap to run its guns if you want to passive tank it (which is why amarr ships never fit shield power relays, one of the big mods used for passive tanking)

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Posted - 2011.01.16 21:19:00 - [3]
 

The Drake has inherent shield resistances (5% per level of Battlecruiser), high passive regeneration for its shields, a healthy amount of mid-slots to field a nice buffer, and fires missiles (which do not have the issues of tracking and falloff that turrets do).

tl;dr... the Drake is a self-sustaining "brick" that can spew missiles from a decent range.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2011.01.16 21:33:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 16/01/2011 21:39:34

Well above average tank (including large EHP) in typical passive tanked configurations, still decent EHP in PvP buffer//gank fits (with the added bonus that the tank layer regenerates in time even without RR), moderate to high (depends on actual fit) effectiveness under enemy NOS/NEUT, TD immunity (no gun turrets), practical TP near-immunity (already BS-sized sig in typical fits so boosting it will have little extra effect in most cases anyway, especially if you're using fury ammo), resistance to ECM (high sensor strength AND ability to fire FOF missiles), decent enough DPS output against most size of targets (not affected by NOS/NEUT at all since missiles don't require capacitor to fire) with most of it nondestructible (drone DPS helps but missile DPS is the main damage source), quite a long weapons range for a battlecruiser and last but not least, the fact that it's dirt cheap and relatively manageable to fit "all T2".

That's what makes the Drake "THE Drake".

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2011.01.17 00:23:00 - [5]
 

Akita T was pretty much spot on, but I'd say the drake has above average EHP in PvP buffer fit . so I mean +1 to all his +1s

haha compared to a gank fit harbinger the drake has equal ehp with the hardeners OFF (and if you want to compare to a shield tanked harb the drake has more with the hardeners off)

Cataca
Posted - 2011.01.17 01:04:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Cataca on 17/01/2011 01:04:29
Edited by: Cataca on 17/01/2011 01:04:08
Originally by: Akita T
with most of it nondestructible (drone DPS helps but missile DPS is the main damage source)



Isnt its dps mostly destructible? Smartbombs being able to destroy missiles and the like.

Otherwise, your points pretty much cover it all imho.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2011.01.17 01:28:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 17/01/2011 01:29:58
Originally by: Cataca
Isnt its dps mostly destructible? Smartbombs being able to destroy missiles and the like.

Well, yeah, true, I guess Smile But the enemy has to keep destroying them constantly.
Still much better than droneboats, which once they lose the drones, they're not exactly easy to replace in an away-from-base operation.
I should have probably said "non-permanently-destructable" Wink
Also, well-timed smartbomb fleets (designed to counter Drakes or other missileboats) are quite uncommon in the field, uncommon enough to be an utter surprise.

Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.01.17 03:38:00 - [8]
 

What makes Drake so awesome? 3x medium shield extender rigs

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2011.01.17 04:17:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 17/01/2011 01:29:58
Originally by: Cataca
Isnt its dps mostly destructible? Smartbombs being able to destroy missiles and the like.

Well, yeah, true, I guess Smile But the enemy has to keep destroying them constantly.
Still much better than droneboats, which once they lose the drones, they're not exactly easy to replace in an away-from-base operation.
I should have probably said "non-permanently-destructable" Wink
Also, well-timed smartbomb fleets (designed to counter Drakes or other missileboats) are quite uncommon in the field, uncommon enough to be an utter surprise.


a blob of ships just randomly using medium smartbombs should take out every drake missile ever fired. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1E9uVtP7IQ4

Lili Lu
Posted - 2011.01.17 16:16:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton
Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 17/01/2011 01:29:58
Originally by: Cataca
Isnt its dps mostly destructible? Smartbombs being able to destroy missiles and the like.

Well, yeah, true, I guess Smile But the enemy has to keep destroying them constantly.
Still much better than droneboats, which once they lose the drones, they're not exactly easy to replace in an away-from-base operation.
I should have probably said "non-permanently-destructable" Wink
Also, well-timed smartbomb fleets (designed to counter Drakes or other missileboats) are quite uncommon in the field, uncommon enough to be an utter surprise.


a blob of ships just randomly using medium smartbombs should take out every drake missile ever fired. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1E9uVtP7IQ4


Mad FFS! Ok calming down. Look, this worked well the first couple times. BTW that's me in the center of that video in mah damnation Cool But, it is a hard tactic to implement. There are scaling problems, and other battlefield problems (both internal and external) with it. It stopped working so well. INIT stopped using it and went with, wait for it . . DRAKES.ughCrying or Very sad

Can't wait for the Drake/HM nerf. Prepare Uranus, Drake/HM lovers.Razz You've still got some months though.


Dray
Caldari
Euphoria Released
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.01.17 17:14:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Lili Lu

Can't wait for the Drake/HM nerf. Prepare Uranus, Drake/HM lovers.Razz You've still got some months though.




Nerfing heavy missiles isn't the answer, the ship needs to be looked at, f**king around with heavies will probably affect Tengus more than Drakes and the Cerberus and Caracal need a heavy missile nerf like a snake needs an arse kicking competition.

The Drake is the problem, fix the problem.

Lili Lu
Posted - 2011.01.17 17:27:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Dray
Originally by: Lili Lu

Can't wait for the Drake/HM nerf. Prepare Uranus, Drake/HM lovers.Razz You've still got some months though.




Nerfing heavy missiles isn't the answer, the ship needs to be looked at, f**king around with heavies will probably affect Tengus more than Drakes and the Cerberus and Caracal need a heavy missile nerf like a snake needs an arse kicking competition.

The Drake is the problem, fix the problem.


I agree. I think the resist bonus should be swapped out on the drake, and the shield regen time for all BC increased. The BS sized tank for much less the cost in isk and sp is the problem that creates monoculture Drake fleets in pvp and too easy of entry into level 4s for pve. Unfortunately the few hints dropped by devs seem to have been pointed at damage projection of HMs. Oh well.

Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2011.01.17 17:47:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Lili Lu
Originally by: Dray
Originally by: Lili Lu

Can't wait for the Drake/HM nerf. Prepare Uranus, Drake/HM lovers.Razz You've still got some months though.




Nerfing heavy missiles isn't the answer, the ship needs to be looked at, f**king around with heavies will probably affect Tengus more than Drakes and the Cerberus and Caracal need a heavy missile nerf like a snake needs an arse kicking competition.

The Drake is the problem, fix the problem.


I agree. I think the resist bonus should be swapped out on the drake, and the shield regen time for all BC increased. The BS sized tank for much less the cost in isk and sp is the problem that creates monoculture Drake fleets in pvp and too easy of entry into level 4s for pve. Unfortunately the few hints dropped by devs seem to have been pointed at damage projection of HMs. Oh well.
Truth be told I'm not 100% sure the drake needs nerfing anymore. I'm TOLD that fleets of BSs are starting to make a comeback, and if this is true then the drake's main predator is once again being fielded, making the issue of drakes nonexistent. The main issue with the damn things is that their main counter wasn't being fielded due to hotdrops and whatnot, and if this is no longer the case then there really isn't much of a problem with drakes themselves.

Another reason for the change of heart on my part is that I'm not exactly sure HOW a drake nerf could be implemented without completely screwing the ship over. I mean let's look at the 3 main problems brought fourth by the drake:

Damage projection: It already has a limited damage bonus. Nerfing this further would make the ship pretty bad at just about everything, because let's face it: short of being bait, tanking is not a role, and the drake makes a poor bait ship.

Resists: Nerfing this would hit mission runners a bit too hard. Drake is one of the few low SP mission boats that can run lvl 4s reasonably easily, nerfing it would screw over a lot of low SP mission runners, and I mean come on, you can hardly call a ship that struggles to put out 500 DPS in missions OP as it is (and that's with good skills)

Recharge rate: Really this isn't an issue in pvp, and would only screw over the PVEers using the drake. That said, one way to properly nerf the drake without destroying the ship completely could be to buff the shield recharge, ditch the resist bonus, and maybe give it something like a missile velocity bonus instead. Would nerf the drake blobs without making the ship useless in pve OR pvp.

As far as it being too easy an entry into lvl 4s:
Suffice to say I can get a character to go from 0 to lvl 4 running domi pilot in about 2 weeks. And it would quickly start outDPSing a newb-carebear overtanked drake. Oh and it would be able to afk run missions. The passive tanks on BCs are fine, it's just the buffer/resists on the drakes that make them somewhat OP.

Denuo Secus
Posted - 2011.01.17 18:19:00 - [14]
 

@Drake is OP, needs a nerf: ever tried to one-volley a frig in a Drake?

Ships are different. People should stop comparing EFT numbers only. There is more than EHP + DPS.

freshspree
Caldari
Dissonance Corp
Posted - 2011.01.17 18:53:00 - [15]
 

In my opinion nerfing the drake will make it fail at almost everything. It doesn't have enough dps compared to other BCs still u still want to nerf it's range? Doesn't make sense to me. Caldari ships generally don't put out much dps but they have range and better tank compared to other ships in their class. CCP needs to stop listening to bias and not well thought out ideas on nerfing ships. The drake's range is what makes it different from other ships. If ccp wants to nerf the range on HMs. They should increase their dmg to match other what other Bcs can do with long range medium turrets. You probably don't fly a drake which is why u want it nerfed.

Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.01.17 18:59:00 - [16]
 

There's no need to nerf ship performance, it's enough to adjust the price so it balances out the performance.

Force BC to use large rigs, adjust prices of shield extender rigs so they are a little higher, problem solved.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2011.01.17 19:00:00 - [17]
 

Like I've repeatedly stated every place where a "nerf Drake" thread exists, the only "nerf" I'd agree with would be a swap of the -5% shield resists bonus for a -5% missile RoF bonus.
Twisted Evil

Darth Anonymous
Amarr
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.01.17 20:05:00 - [18]
 

How about instead of nerfing the Drake (which will just cause something else to be the new, overpowered thing of the month) CCP just boosts some other ship. Not even all other battlecruisers. Pick one ship that can do any of the roles a Drake can do and boost it to the point that people will be split between flying a Drake for versatility or flying the other ship that's better for that specific application. Balance issue is then solved.

Birdman Ravo
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2011.01.17 22:26:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Darth Anonymous
How about instead of nerfing the Drake (which will just cause something else to be the new, overpowered thing of the month) CCP just boosts some other ship. Not even all other battlecruisers. Pick one ship that can do any of the roles a Drake can do and boost it to the point that people will be split between flying a Drake for versatility or flying the other ship that's better for that specific application. Balance issue is then solved.


I've been in support of this for a while. The Drake isn't OP, it's just that it's strengths are obvious, easy to work with, and don't take a lot of SP to utilize.

Buffing the other battlecruisers (And adding a serious buff to all the command ships) would add some incentive to train and fly something other than the Drake.

Nakaota
Posted - 2011.01.17 22:45:00 - [20]
 

The drake doesn't need a nerf. This is not the drake you're looking for. Move along now...

Salpad
Caldari
Carebears with Attitude
Posted - 2011.01.17 22:58:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Guitonkagya
What advantages does the Drake have over the Hurricane (and vice versa) for soloing these sites? and what makes it a 'better' than 'other' BC's for this particular task? (im assuming the 5% shield resist is major factor of why this ship is seemingly rated so highly)


The flat (not multiplied-in) +25% bonus to all shield resists at BC skill level 5 certainly contributes to my carebear chubby, but another thing to look at is the base shield HP of the Drake, and compare that to how many HP extra you get for each Large Shield Extender (or LSE II).

That, too, makes the Drake such a passive tanking monster. Find that ratio, for various ships. Analyze it. Passive tanking can be done on other ships. The NightHawk works well for it, although not as well as the Drake. The Caracal, Navy Caracal and Cerberus can do it too.

Smaller ships can also do the same by fitting MSE II, perhaps. Again, do the "math".

Ranka Mei
Caldari
Posted - 2011.01.18 00:51:00 - [22]
 

People need to really stop whining about wanting to see the Drake nerfed. Especially since a lot of you probably never even flew a Drake. A few things for you folks to consider:

- Just because a ship is particularly useful in one area (PvP fleet encounters: huge EHP and good range), doesn't make it overpowered: it just means it's good in one specific circumstance.

- Drake has lousy DPS. Everyone who's ever missioned in a Drake will know it can do Lv 4's, but slowly. You simply don't have enough DPS to do 'em quickly. That's because it's Alpha-strike is close to deplorable. Unlike my corp mates with their laser boats, outputting near 7,000 dmg per shot. Yes, you can fit BCU's and such to compensate, but then you'll start losing your legendary tank rapidly (in missions you need fast regen; EHP means almost nothing).

- Drake is frakkin' slow. At 175 m/s, it's a crime getting to the next acc gate. Again, you can fit an AB, but you'll need an extra mid-slot for that (at the expensive of tank).

I can only hope CCP will stay level-headed enough, and won't cater to the whinoes here, and will leave the Drake alone.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2011.01.18 02:08:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Like I've repeatedly stated every place where a "nerf Drake" thread exists, the only "nerf" I'd agree with would be a swap of the -5% shield resists bonus for a -5% missile RoF bonus.
Twisted Evil


I like that one Twisted Evil

Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2011.01.18 02:33:00 - [24]
 

See I was ready to stop complaining about drakes. Really I was, but people like this need to be called out for being oblivious:
Originally by: Ranka Mei
People need to really stop whining about wanting to see the Drake nerfed. Especially since a lot of you probably never even flew a Drake. A few things for you folks to consider:
The 'you don't fly ship x so you can't comment on it' argument tends not to work that well when 're literally discussing the most flown combat ship in the game. And with such low SP requirements to boot.
Originally by: Ranka Mei

- Just because a ship is particularly useful in one area (PvP fleet encounters: huge EHP and good range), doesn't make it overpowered: it just means it's good in one specific circumstance.

Drake is useful in large fleet pvp, in small gang pvp, and in pve. The only way CCP could give it more niches is to let it equip strip miners.

Originally by: Ranka Mei

- Drake has lousy DPS. Everyone who's ever missioned in a Drake will know it can do Lv 4's, but slowly. You simply don't have enough DPS to do 'em quickly. That's because it's Alpha-strike is close to deplorable. Unlike my corp mates with their laser boats, outputting near 7,000 dmg per shot. Yes, you can fit BCU's and such to compensate, but then you'll start losing your legendary tank rapidly (in missions you need fast regen; EHP means almost nothing).
Drake has fantastic damage projection, and it most certainly does NOT have poor base DPS. Don't compare heavy missile fits to blasters/ACs/pulses, compare them to rails/arties/beams. Drake outdamages all other BCs IIRC past ~5km if we're dealing with closerange weapons.

Also you're comparing a BC to BSs. BSs are SUPPOSED to have more tank and more DPS, it's what they get for being slower, easier to hit, and more skill intensive.
Originally by: Ranka Mei

- Drake is frakkin' slow. At 175 m/s, it's a crime getting to the next acc gate. Again, you can fit an AB, but you'll need an extra mid-slot for that (at the expensive of tank).
Drake is the second fastest BC under the cane. Do your homework.

Originally by: Ranka Mei

I can only hope CCP will stay level-headed enough, and won't cater to the whinoes here, and will leave the Drake alone.
TBH I imagine CCP will end up nerfing the drake, because personal feelings aside, the ship is literally used more than any other combat ship in the game (and if memory serves it's used more than any of the other races ships combined). As I've mentioned before, I'd like to see it lose the resist bonus in favor of a missile velocity bonus, and get its shield recharged buffed a bit to compensate (or maybe more raw shield HP) It would nerf the massive drake blobs without breaking the ship in other areas.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2011.01.18 02:35:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Ranka Mei
- Just because a ship is particularly useful in one area (PvP fleet encounters: huge EHP and good range), doesn't make it overpowered: it just means it's good in one specific circumstance.
- Drake has lousy DPS. Everyone who's ever missioned in a Drake will know it can do Lv 4's, but slowly. You simply don't have enough DPS to do 'em quickly. That's because it's Alpha-strike is close to deplorable. Unlike my corp mates with their laser boats, outputting near 7,000 dmg per shot. Yes, you can fit BCU's and such to compensate, but then you'll start losing your legendary tank rapidly (in missions you need fast regen; EHP means almost nothing).
- Drake is frakkin' slow. At 175 m/s, it's a crime getting to the next acc gate. Again, you can fit an AB, but you'll need an extra mid-slot for that (at the expensive of tank).


the drake is useful in more than one area. fleet pvp, small gang pvp I'd say the drake is still the best bc. pve... oh **** wait its a bad mining ship boohoo Crying or Very sad

drake might have lousy dps, if you compare it to max skilled battleships (really useful Rolling Eyes), vs the other bc sure it doesn't have max dps, but if you look at other factors like tank and range it is the best pve bc.

the drake has room for an afterburner and more than adequate tank, plus an afterburner is a tank mod


DeftCrow Redriver
Gallente
Best Path Inc.
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2011.01.18 02:41:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Ranka Mei
People need to really stop whining about wanting to see the Drake nerfed. Especially since a lot of you probably never even flew a Drake.


I actually fly Drakes, so it seems I'm qualified to reply.


Originally by:
A few things for you folks to consider:
- Just because a ship is particularly useful in one area (PvP fleet encounters: huge EHP and good range), doesn't make it overpowered: it just means it's good in one specific circumstance.


You know, there are other battlecruisers that don't even have that one particular good use.
**Cough**Prophecy**Cough** (Yes, I hate tiers)


Originally by:
- Drake has lousy DPS... Unlike my corp mates with their laser boats, outputting near 7,000 dmg per shot...


Post a battlecruiser fit that has 7,000 volly damage. Or, were you comparing a Drake to a Nightmare? You need near perfect gunnery skills, four bonused T2 tachs, four faction heatsinks, faction crystals and two 5% implants to do that.

Besides, the amount of DPS you get while maintaining battleship level tank is out of proportion. 120 hp/s peak recharge with 2 BCUs, which is more than enough for L4s assuming 80% specific resists. 300 DPS with 2 BCUs, T2 heavies and vanilla scourge only. You don't even have to look at the target's angular velocitiy to apply that amount of damage.


Originally by:
Drake is frakkin' slow. At 175 m/s, it's a crime getting to the next acc gate. Again, you can fit an AB, but you'll need an extra mid-slot for that (at the expensive of tank).


Harbinger goes at 188 m/s. Mrym? 172 m/s. Brutix? 181 m/s. It's a crime getting to the next accel gate. So I fitted an AB (at the expense of cap and tank). Besides, 5 mid slots for tank is enough. If you want speed, go for a hurricane.

I don't want to see the Drake get nerfed; I want CCP to scrap the tier system and get the tier 1 BCs in line with the current tier 2 BCs, so that some day there will be another BC that can smack the Drake in the bottom. The hurricane is close to that, but I can use more.

Theodoric Darkwind
Gallente
PonyWaffe
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.01.18 06:07:00 - [27]
 

Originally by: Ephemeron
There's no need to nerf ship performance, it's enough to adjust the price so it balances out the performance.

Force BC to use large rigs, adjust prices of shield extender rigs so they are a little higher, problem solved.


Which makes it frighteningly expensive to fit out a BC then, the rigs would cost several times the rest of the fit.

Especially given that the only BC with an OP tank is the Drake. You dont see people complaining about BS grade tanks on Myrms, Harbis and Canes.

Delta Bacat
Posted - 2011.01.18 10:06:00 - [28]
 

I love my drake for the following reasons:

- Great passive tank (due to high resists and great tweakable recharge time)
- OK dps, using 7 heavy missiles
- Good for dualbox with FoF missiles
- High slot for salvage

Now everyone is whining about Drakes being OP and stuff, which I'm not really agreeing with. (seeing as I fly one). But IF it ever happens, I wouldn't mind the following change that much:

one high missile launcher slot removed, but the high slot remains for other functions.
(for example a cloak or a probe launcher). Perhaps a 1% increase of RoF per level.

Then give us the navy drake which will be rediculous expensive but with the same bonusses and 8 missiles slots Twisted Evil

Carniflex
StarHunt
Fallout Project
Posted - 2011.01.18 10:27:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Like I've repeatedly stated every place where a "nerf Drake" thread exists, the only "nerf" I'd agree with would be a swap of the -5% shield resists bonus for a -5% missile RoF bonus.
Twisted Evil


That change I would quite love tbh :p - It would not really overpower the ship even. Yeah it has 7 launchers over nighthawks 6 and would have same bonuses, but would lack the t2 resists and the additional resist bonus of NH. Marginally better than NH in damage dealing, but thinner tanking wise and still outclassed by Tengu.

Ranka Mei
Caldari
Posted - 2011.01.18 10:38:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: DeftCrow Redriver

Post a battlecruiser fit that has 7,000 volly damage. Or, were you comparing a Drake to a Nightmare? You need near perfect gunnery skills, four bonused T2 tachs, four faction heatsinks, faction crystals and two 5% implants to do that.


The point was not so much to compare Battlecruisers to Battleships, as rather missiles vs. lasers. Even a Harbi can do 966 DPS with a 64k EHP. Ever seen a Caldari Battlecruiser that can do that? Not even a heavy missiled Tengu can be made to output 966 DPS. And that's a T3, even!

Should we now nerf the Harbi too?

Quote:

Besides, the amount of DPS you get while maintaining battleship level tank is out of proportion. 120 hp/s peak recharge with 2 BCUs, which is more than enough for L4s assuming 80% specific resists. 300 DPS with 2 BCUs, T2 heavies and vanilla scourge only. You don't even have to look at the target's angular velocitiy to apply that amount of damage.


You decidedly get a good tank on the Drake. Was just doing lv 4 'Going Beserk' in it yesterday. You can pretty much hang still, and still tank the 12 waves of Battleships, even with 3x BCU fitted. Then again, I deserve that tank. I didn't train Battlecruiser V all for nothing, thank you. :)

Quote:

I don't want to see the Drake get nerfed; I want CCP to scrap the tier system and get the tier 1 BCs in line with the current tier 2 BCs, so that some day there will be another BC that can smack the Drake in the bottom. The hurricane is close to that, but I can use more.



I can agree with that. Instead of constantly nerfing things people took a long time to train for, I'd much rather CCP equalized comparable other ships. That's win-win all over the place.


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