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sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.13 12:44:00 - [1]
 

How come all of the fits ( armour tanks ) only use 1 repper and 3 hardeners I in my geddon or typhoon cannot tank a lv4 unless I use 2 and even then it dosent hold on some missions . Any advice ?

Chesty McJubblies
Gallente
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2010.12.13 13:20:00 - [2]
 

What repper are you using?

sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.13 13:43:00 - [3]
 

Tech 2 large armour repairer

Chesty McJubblies
Gallente
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2010.12.13 13:46:00 - [4]
 

The DS ones are far better, might wanna think about grabbing one of them.

sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.13 13:50:00 - [5]
 

I'll nip in to jita and pick one up providing there not priced redicusly should free up a couple of slots for sensorboster and the like

Von Kapiche
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.12.13 14:51:00 - [6]
 

How are your relevant skills? and rigs? I don't think I've ever used a dual repper fit, but my first Domi had a faction repper and two ANP rigs.

Jagga Spikes
Minmatar
Spikes Chop Shop
Posted - 2010.12.13 15:56:00 - [7]
 

dps counts as well. faster you can kill rats, less you have to tank.

Xentara Vispari
Posted - 2010.12.13 16:09:00 - [8]
 

Edited by: Xentara Vispari on 13/12/2010 16:09:57
I'm using one repper (mostly the Imperial Navy, sometimes T2) and 4 hardeners on my
Domi (+ ANP rig) and can tank almost everything.

With armor tank you have a high base resist against EM. If you go against Sansha/Bloodraiders
3 hardeners are fine.

If you go against angels, which do EXP/KIN dmg, 3 hardeners (t2) won't be enough, because
your base EXP resist is zero.

Another thing to consider: how much DPS are you dealing. If you can kill NPCs very quickly,
you will also reduce the incoming damage very quickly and you don't need that much tank.

Devil tiger
Posted - 2010.12.13 16:18:00 - [9]
 

In normal situations you must have these for doing lvl 4s :

one large repper t2/better
"general" shield/armor resist mod t2 or better(ean or inv.)
DC2
2 diff types of shield/armor hardeners for the rats/factions dmg type.
lots of guns/missiles & drones

Cap stable fitting is nice but not always feasible and sometimes it's enough to get by with
just pulsing the repper instead of using cap batteries.


I've probably never flown passive regen ships so I can't comment on those set up's

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2010.12.13 16:57:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: sevrisyn
Tech 2 large armour repairer


keep it and don't waste isk on deadspace ones.

you are fitting specific hardeners, watching your aggro, and doing good dps right?


sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.13 17:40:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: sevrisyn on 13/12/2010 17:40:54
Originally by: Von Kapiche
How are your relevant skills? and rigs? I don't think I've ever used a dual repper fit, but my first Domi had a faction repper and two ANP rigs.


compensation skills lv3
hull upgrades lv4
repair systems lv4

rigs ccc x3 as i need thgem to run both permantly

Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton
Originally by: sevrisyn
Tech 2 large armour repairer


keep it and don't waste isk on deadspace ones.

you are fitting specific hardeners, watching your aggro, and doing good dps right?




even then im needing two even with my mate in his raven(xl permaboost) he is having similar probs but he cant fit 2 reppers and yeah deadspaces onea as nice as they are i just dont have 500mil to spend on 1 module hell i done have 500mil at all. could be a dps issue it was going better when i was 3 shoting battleships in my tempest but the tank on that was naff hence why i dont have one any more.

Anachronic
Posted - 2010.12.13 19:11:00 - [12]
 

If I may ask, what kind of ship are you flying for L4s. the particular fit is going to make a huge difference when it comes to your tanking ability. I am running a single T2 armor repper and with 4 hardeners it is a 440dps tank which with aggro management is more than enough to do a L4.

sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.13 19:59:00 - [13]
 

well ive tryed ad lost the following (bloody scrams and crap drones)

passive typhoon
armoor typhoon
two rep tempest
xl boster tempest
acttive raven
dual rep geddon
single rep apoc

thats what i have tryed soo far all have failed i uppose i should go back to l3's which are soo boring but a face roll

Widemouth Deepthroat
Posted - 2010.12.13 20:43:00 - [14]
 

Fit 1 repper, 3-4 x mission specific hardeners. 2-3 damage mods.

Carefully follow the mission guides (eve-survival.org) so you can manage your aggro and survive with minimal tank.

Apoc, abadong, tempest and maelstrom can all easily do any lvl4 mission.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2010.12.13 20:52:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: sevrisyn

compensation skills lv3
hull upgrades lv4
repair systems lv4

rigs ccc x3 as i need thgem to run both permantly

even then im needing two even with my mate in his raven(xl permaboost) he is having similar probs but he cant fit 2 reppers and yeah deadspaces onea as nice as they are i just dont have 500mil to spend on 1 module hell i done have 500mil at all. could be a dps issue it was going better when i was 3 shoting battleships in my tempest but the tank on that was naff hence why i dont have one any more.


compensation skills don't do a damn thing for active hardeners.

and an x-l permaboost raven is a classic example of over tanking.

Originally by: sevrisyn
well ive tryed ad lost the following (bloody scrams and crap drones)

well for starters work on them drone skills.

and with your skills I question why you can fly caldari, amarr, and minmatar ships with them skills I'd bet you have nothing in gunnery, and can't do any dps and have to sit around tanking everything forever and then eventually not being able to tank and dying.

Anachronic
Posted - 2010.12.13 20:58:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton
Originally by: sevrisyn

compensation skills lv3
hull upgrades lv4
repair systems lv4

rigs ccc x3 as i need thgem to run both permantly

even then im needing two even with my mate in his raven(xl permaboost) he is having similar probs but he cant fit 2 reppers and yeah deadspaces onea as nice as they are i just dont have 500mil to spend on 1 module hell i done have 500mil at all. could be a dps issue it was going better when i was 3 shoting battleships in my tempest but the tank on that was naff hence why i dont have one any more.


compensation skills don't do a damn thing for active hardeners.

and an x-l permaboost raven is a classic example of over tanking.

Originally by: sevrisyn
well ive tryed ad lost the following (bloody scrams and crap drones)

well for starters work on them drone skills.

and with your skills I question why you can fly caldari, amarr, and minmatar ships with them skills I'd bet you have nothing in gunnery, and can't do any dps and have to sit around tanking everything forever and then eventually not being able to tank and dying.



This ^

Can you load yourself up onto Eveboard so we can actually see your skills. that would give everyone a better idea of what you want to train and fit.

Herping yourDerp
Posted - 2010.12.13 21:02:00 - [17]
 

dual rep apoc works fine
3 hardeners, 2 heatsinks, you have pulses so tracking isn't horrible either. upgrade to navy apoc and you can add another heatsink or tracking enhancer, all your mids are CR2's and you are cap stable.

sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.13 21:17:00 - [18]
 

well i got 1.7mil in gunnery

and here is a copy paste from evemon as eveboard


SKILLS
=======================================================================
Corporation Management, 0 Skill, 0 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Drones, 3 Skills, 46,005 Points
: Drones (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
: Mining Drone Operation (2) L1 500/512,000 Points
: Scout Drone Operation (1) L1 250/256,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Electronics, 10 Skills, 185,848 Points
: Electronic Warfare (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Electronics (1) L4 51,786/256,000 Points
: Electronics Upgrades (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Frequency Modulation (3) L1 750/768,000 Points
: Long Range Targeting (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Propulsion Jamming (3) L2 4,243/768,000 Points
: Signature Analysis (1) L3 27,064/256,000 Points
: Survey (1) L3 8,000/256,000 Points
: Target Painting (3) L1 750/768,000 Points
: Targeting (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Engineering, 15 Skills, 768,507 Points
: EM Shield Compensation (2) L3 16,002/512,000 Points
: Energy Emission Systems (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Energy Grid Upgrades (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Energy Management (3) L3 24,000/768,000 Points
: Energy Pulse Weapons (2) L2 2,917/512,000 Points
: Energy Systems Operation (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
: Engineering (1) L5 256,000/256,000 Points
: Explosive Shield Compensation (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Kinetic Shield Compensation (2) L2 2,829/512,000 Points
: Shield Compensation (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Shield Management (3) L3 24,000/768,000 Points
: Shield Operation (1) L4 59,145/256,000 Points
: Shield Upgrades (2) L4 90,510/512,000 Points
: Tactical Shield Manipulation (4) L4 181,020/1,024,000 Points
: Thermic Shield Compensation (2) L2 2,829/512,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Gunnery, 18 Skills, 1,777,921 Points
: Controlled Bursts (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Gunnery (1) L5 256,000/256,000 Points
: Large Energy Turret (5) L3 40,000/1,280,000 Points
: Large Projectile Turret (5) L3 40,000/1,280,000 Points
: Medium Energy Turret (3) L3 24,000/768,000 Points
: Medium Hybrid Turret (3) L2 6,177/768,000 Points
: Medium Projectile Turret (3) L5 768,000/768,000 Points

sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.13 21:20:00 - [19]
 

: Motion Prediction (2) L3 19,900/512,000 Points
: Rapid Firing (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Sharpshooter (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Small Artillery Specialization (3) L3 38,458/768,000 Points
: Small Autocannon Specialization (3) L4 135,765/768,000 Points
: Small Energy Turret (1) L3 8,000/256,000 Points
: Small Hybrid Turret (1) L3 8,000/256,000 Points
: Small Projectile Turret (1) L5 256,000/256,000 Points
: Surgical Strike (4) L3 32,000/1,024,000 Points
: Trajectory Analysis (5) L2 7,111/1,280,000 Points
: Weapon Upgrades (2) L4 90,510/512,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Industry, 3 Skills, 283,023 Points
: Ice Harvesting (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
: Industry (1) L4 192,513/256,000 Points
: Mining (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Leadership, 1 Skill, 22,705 Points
: Leadership (1) L3 22,705/256,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Learning, 8 Skills, 282,275 Points
: Analytical Mind (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
: Eidetic Memory (3) L3 24,000/768,000 Points
: Empathy (1) L3 8,000/256,000 Points
: Instant Recall (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
: Iron Will (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
: Learning (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
: Logic (3) L3 24,000/768,000 Points
: Spatial Awareness (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mechanic, 14 Skills, 446,831 Points
: Armor Rigging (3) L1 750/768,000 Points
: Drones Rigging (3) L1 750/768,000 Points
: EM Armor Compensation (2) L2 2,829/512,000 Points
: Explosive Armor Compensation (2) L2 2,829/512,000 Points
: Hull Upgrades (2) L4 90,510/512,000 Points
: Hybrid Weapon Rigging (3) L1 750/768,000 Points
: Jury Rigging (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Kinetic Armor Compensation (2) L2 2,829/512,000 Points
: Mechanic (1) L5 256,000/256,000 Points
: Projectile Weapon Rigging (3) L1 750/768,000 Points
: Repair Systems (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
: Salvaging (3) L3 24,000/768,000 Points
: Shield Rigging (3) L1 750/768,000 Points
: Thermic Armor Compensation (2) L2 2,829/512,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Missile Launcher Operation, 13 Skills, 275,325 Points
: Cruise Missiles (5) L2 7,072/1,280,000 Points
: Defender Missiles (2) L1 500/512,000 Points
: Guided Missile Precision (5) L2 7,072/1,280,000 Points
: Heavy Assault Missiles (3) L1 750/768,000 Points
: Heavy Missiles (3) L3 24,000/768,000 Points
: Missile Bombardment (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Missile Launcher Operation (1) L4 163,609/256,000 Points
: Rapid Launch (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Point

sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.13 21:23:00 - [20]
 

: Missile Bombardment (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Missile Launcher Operation (1) L4 163,609/256,000 Points
: Rapid Launch (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Rockets (1) L1 250/256,000 Points
: Standard Missiles (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Target Navigation Prediction (2) L3 16,000/512,000 Points
: Torpedoes (4) L1 1,000/1,024,000 Points
: Warhead Upgrades (5) L2 7,072/1,280,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Navigation, 5 Skills, 102,564 Points
: Afterburner (1) L3 8,000/256,000 Points
: Evasive Maneuvering (2) L2 2,829/512,000 Points
: High Speed Maneuvering (5) L1 1,250/1,280,000 Points
: Navigation (1) L4 89,070/256,000 Points
: (Currently training to level V, completes 18/12/2010 08:35:54)
: Warp Drive Operation (1) L2 1,415/256,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Planet Management, 0 Skill, 0 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Science, 4 Skills, 182,171 Points
: Astrogeology (3) L4 135,765/768,000 Points
: Cybernetics (3) L1 901/768,000 Points
: Infomorph Psychology (1) L1 250/256,000 Points
: Science (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Social, 4 Skills, 77,755 Points
: Connections (3) L3 24,000/768,000 Points
: Diplomacy (1) L3 8,000/256,000 Points
: Negotiation (2) L1 500/512,000 Points
: Social (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Spaceship Command, 17 Skills, 2,825,611 Points
: Amarr Battleship (8) L2 11,314/2,048,000 Points
: Amarr Cruiser (5) L3 117,012/1,280,000 Points
: Amarr Frigate (2) L4 90,510/512,000 Points
: Assault Ships (4) L3 34,382/1,024,000 Points
: Battlecruisers (6) L3 102,257/1,536,000 Points
: Caldari Battleship (8) L2 42,298/2,048,000 Points
: Caldari Cruiser (5) L4 226,277/1,280,000 Points
: Caldari Frigate (2) L4 90,554/512,000 Points
: Caldari Industrial (4) L3 32,000/1,024,000 Points
: Destroyers (2) L2 2,829/512,000 Points
: Gallente Cruiser (5) L3 40,000/1,280,000 Points
: Gallente Frigate (2) L4 90,510/512,000 Points
: Mining Barge (4) L3 96,686/1,024,000 Points
: Minmatar Battleship (8) L2 11,727/2,048,000 Points
: Minmatar Cruiser (5) L5 1,280,000/1,280,000 Points
: Minmatar Frigate (2) L5 512,000/512,000 Points
: Spaceship Command (1) L4 45,255/256,000 Points

SORRY FOR HUGE WALL OF SKILLS

Frater Sen
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.12.13 21:39:00 - [21]
 

Flying a Typhoon with such skills is a tough call. Tanking is not only an armor repper and some res mods, but speed and damage as well. Get your drone skills up as fast as possible, Repair Systems and cap skills to lv5... and so on. Typhoon is the most sp hungry battleship in EvE Very Happy

Sonya Kranz
Posted - 2010.12.13 22:37:00 - [22]
 

Well, if you want to do lvl 4 missions, getting some decent drone skills for tech 2 small and light drones is a must first

secondly id lvl those armor skills (mechanic, repair systems operation) up more, and last but not least get that BS skill up to lvl 4!

Who Wozit
Posted - 2010.12.13 22:41:00 - [23]
 

Those skills pretty much answer your question.

Everything is there in part, but very few of them have been trained up to a high enough level to be effective in a bs.

To be comfortable in a bs you really need the relevent skills at level 4 moving up to level 5, and this includes the skill for the ship itself.

So pick the bs you want to be able to performwell in, along with the weapon system you prefer and start hitting those skills.

The quicker you can kill your targets the less you will actually have to tank. Your armor tanking skills themselves are quite reasonable, although hull upgrades 5 would help since that gives you access to the t2 hardeners

sevrisyn
Posted - 2010.12.14 07:15:00 - [24]
 

Ah so the classic eve problem it takes forever to do anything oh well I think I may just play my alt who is nearly at this guys lvl in one area but has the drone skills to back it up being gelentee and al thanks for the help anyway guys but I don't have the paitents to go back to facerolling lv3 in my overtankded drake .

Deerin
Minmatar
Murientor Tribe
Posted - 2010.12.14 07:46:00 - [25]
 

It is also dependant on range of your guns. When you try to go up close and personal vs mercenary or angel battleships they will do crazy dps on you. You need to manage your range, stay away from them and kill them before they get on you.

In my opinion THE most important skill for armor tanking is Hull Upgrades V. It allows you to use t2 hardeners and t2 EANM's. Aside from that make sure you get your energy management and energy systems operation to at least 4.

Also always check the mission from http://eve-survival.org/. Knowing what to shoot and what not to avoid full room aggro matters a lot when tanking.

Master Dodge
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.14 10:20:00 - [26]
 

Some good advice here from the other posters.

As a side note I also notice you have your cybernetics at lvl 1 still, if you get it up to 4 and stick on a rack of +4's you will be much more eficient and seeing as your running lvl 3 easily these should be vastly within your price range.

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2010.12.14 10:56:00 - [27]
 

Quote:

Ah so the classic eve problem it takes forever to do anything



This is not true, you actually wasted tons of time by not picking proper implants and by training a bunch of skills "horizontally" instead of focusing in few areas of excellence first.

If you want to tank a ship and not lose it:

1) Train light drones tech 2. You can't die if you are not warp scrambled and the scramble frigs are made to be killed with tech 2 drones.

2) Open the "show info" of the missioning ship of choice, then "Recommended". It will show the certificates you shoud have in order not to suck. Go on each of them, right click, open planner and make sure you have the "Improved" certificate. Make SURE you have Core Competency at Improved as well.

YERMO
Posted - 2010.12.14 12:02:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Sonya Kranz
Well, if you want to do lvl 4 missions, getting some decent drone skills for tech 2 small and light drones is a must first

secondly id lvl those armor skills (mechanic, repair systems operation) up more, and last but not least get that BS skill up to lvl 4!




good advice there .

Gourdo
Amarr
Posted - 2010.12.14 13:33:00 - [29]
 

Get your skills up more like your armor compensation skills get them to at least 4 first. Than get you supporting gun skills up to 4 that will help you tremendously. You will tank better and do a lot more damage. Also I fly amar and what i do is I will have 2 eanm and use 2 hardeners faction if you can afford them.

Devil tiger
Posted - 2010.12.14 14:32:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: Devil tiger on 14/12/2010 14:33:04
Seeing that your skills aren't the best I'd suggest you to focus on the core competency & and favoured (racial)weapon type Certificates.
Once you have them past basic you're pretty much set to go for BS and above.

And btw A drake can do lvl 4's when you have the skills...


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