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Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.12.14 00:54:00 - [121]
 

I observe a couple distinct types of solo pvp

1) solo people looking for fights in cheap stuff - t1 frigs and cruisers, typically low sec empire
2) solo people looking for fights in expensive stuff - HACs, battleships, t3, typically 0.0 space

Seems like the first kind of solo PvP is doing well enough and not effected by most negative changes in the game. It's the 2nd kind that's effected most.

Personally, I find flying t1 frigs and cruisers completely pointless, since you can't engage superior forces, people flying expensive ships. I have no interest in killing people flying cheap stuff. That's just a preference.

Ruiryu
Caldari
Gray Rogue Squadron
Posted - 2010.12.14 00:55:00 - [122]
 

Solo PVP is far from dead. Yes it is difficult and you really need to pick and choose your fights.

But one person stands out in my mind. PROMETHEUS EXENTHAL; good friend of mine and the guy loves to do it solo.

http://www.promsrage.com/videos.html

Check out his frigank series. Or just about any of his videos most of them are him solo.

So before people go off saying something is dead or over try thinking outside of the box and do a little looking around.

Infinity Ziona
Minmatar
Cloakers
Posted - 2010.12.14 04:26:00 - [123]
 

Originally by: Ruiryu
Solo PVP is far from dead. Yes it is difficult and you really need to pick and choose your fights.

But one person stands out in my mind. PROMETHEUS EXENTHAL; good friend of mine and the guy loves to do it solo.

http://www.promsrage.com/videos.html

Check out his frigank series. Or just about any of his videos most of them are him solo.

So before people go off saying something is dead or over try thinking outside of the box and do a little looking around.

Yeah good solo kills. I'm gonna steal some of his setups.

Cearain
Caldari
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
Posted - 2010.12.14 05:16:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: Ephemeron
I observe a couple distinct types of solo pvp

1) solo people looking for fights in cheap stuff - t1 frigs and cruisers, typically low sec empire
2) solo people looking for fights in expensive stuff - HACs, battleships, t3, typically 0.0 space

....



Actually I haven't found anyone in this thread that has shown me many solo kills in null sec in things larger than cruiser or so. Infinity is a solo roamer but he gets his kills ganking newbs in high sec. Sassy B who was mentioned before is low sec.

Prometheus is null sec but his solo vids afaik is showing frigate work.


It seems to me that null sec is the natural place for large fleets. Low sec is the natural place for tiny gangs and solo. Null sec is for those players who have all sorts of real life time to dedicate to the game. They can spend it organizing people and trying to win eve. At least the null sec that is not npc null sec.

Low sec (and npc null sec) is more for people who like to dock their crap up and not worry the station might be blown up in the morning. They like to undock and find some people they can blow up. People who can challenge them with how they set up their ship and fly it. etc.


High sec solo – well look at infinity’s battleclinic killboard. Check out the people he is fighting, see who they have killed and imagine the challenge he must have.


Cearain
Caldari
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
Posted - 2010.12.14 05:24:00 - [125]
 

Originally by: Yvella


...Some ideas mooted so far that may merit further thought:
-Remove local from 0.0 (scare those bears)
-Get rid of KM’s???
-Lock time. Sensor strength is a legacy from a time when tracking and sig did not protect little ships from nig ships. Could mega gate -camping be reduced discouraged this way. Clearly the introduction of regional gates, means CCP recognise tard-camps as an issue.


IMO

Kill mails drive pvp and solo pvp as much as they deter it.

Removing local hurst solo and small gang pvp much more than it hurts blobbing. Reomving local is a step in the wrong direction.
Developing a mechanic that encourages small gang or solo pvp is something you forgot. FW is an obvius choice but there are others.

Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Posted - 2010.12.14 05:50:00 - [126]
 

FW is already a blobfest, terribly plagued with lag (lowsec can't handle fleets a tenth of what nullsec can), crowded with spies and in-fighting (just like 0.0). It's everything a small scale PvPer wants to avoid, by not heading to null.

So no, FW doesn't need incentitives for PvP. Perhaps it needs better options/tools for smaller scale fights, but right now it's already zero-zero in minimode.

Infinity Ziona
Minmatar
Cloakers
Posted - 2010.12.14 05:52:00 - [127]
 

Edited by: Infinity Ziona on 14/12/2010 05:59:38
Originally by: Cearain
Originally by: Ephemeron
I observe a couple distinct types of solo pvp

1) solo people looking for fights in cheap stuff - t1 frigs and cruisers, typically low sec empire
2) solo people looking for fights in expensive stuff - HACs, battleships, t3, typically 0.0 space

....



Actually I haven't found anyone in this thread that has shown me many solo kills in null sec in things larger than cruiser or so. Infinity is a solo roamer but he gets his kills ganking newbs in high sec. Sassy B who was mentioned before is low sec.

Prometheus is null sec but his solo vids afaik is showing frigate work.


It seems to me that null sec is the natural place for large fleets. Low sec is the natural place for tiny gangs and solo. Null sec is for those players who have all sorts of real life time to dedicate to the game. They can spend it organizing people and trying to win eve. At least the null sec that is not npc null sec.

Low sec (and npc null sec) is more for people who like to dock their crap up and not worry the station might be blown up in the morning. They like to undock and find some people they can blow up. People who can challenge them with how they set up their ship and fly it. etc.


High sec solo – well look at infinity’s battleclinic killboard. Check out the people he is fighting, see who they have killed and imagine the challenge he must have.



I'm not biting your obvious bait.

As for Prometheus he has some very nice kills, in 0.0, versus multiple opponents (rapier, falcon, vagabond) within 2 minutes of each other, in a valuable ship.

Its quite a bit more impressive than your or my own kills.

My challenge, which you have failed to take up, is still open, since what I do is so easy, create a corp for a week, dec an alliance and get 7 kills without dying. I give you 1 billion isk for success.

My best is 44 kills. My last war was 24 no deaths. Its easy remember, take up the offer.

Oh yeah you need to use something that costs more in losses then 200k. ie No no-risk rifters.

Garmon took up my offer, he failed. Though to be fair it was 10 kills he was required to make.

Bengal Bob
Royal Order of Security Specialists
Posted - 2010.12.14 11:46:00 - [128]
 

Solo pvp isn't dead, just don't expect it to be 1v1. You might have to work for it but you can definitely find it in low sec. I prefer rifters because if you make a mistake you are dead. People are also less likely to run from a frig. af/inties/dessies and other frigs are all possible targets, so you have a wide pool to choose from whilst being able to evade large gangs. Even the large gangs can be fun if you can pull the tackle away and then take one down.

If you are willing to make the effort, solo is alive and well.

Infinity Ziona
Minmatar
Cloakers
Posted - 2010.12.14 12:03:00 - [129]
 

Originally by: Bengal Bob
Solo pvp isn't dead, just don't expect it to be 1v1. You might have to work for it but you can definitely find it in low sec. I prefer rifters because if you make a mistake you are dead. People are also less likely to run from a frig. af/inties/dessies and other frigs are all possible targets, so you have a wide pool to choose from whilst being able to evade large gangs. Even the large gangs can be fun if you can pull the tackle away and then take one down.

If you are willing to make the effort, solo is alive and well.

That strikes me as consensual duelling in ships whose loss doesn't mean anything. To me its pointless although if you enjoy it that's cool. Its however, no substitute to killing someone that doesn't want to PvP.


Metalkiss
Minmatar
Pack Mentality
Art of War Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.14 12:40:00 - [130]
 

Originally by: Parsee789
Killboards ruin eve. People are too obsessed with their scores and rankings to risk a fight unless they are fairly or even absolutely certain that they will win.
While I admit to loving killboards (even though right now my kill to death ratio isn't exactly nice to look at...) I completely agree. This is a problem I've found in a lot of games where stats get introduced. The moment the game, or an outside source, starts tracking your awesomness, you stop going out on a limb to have fun and start focusing on how to get a better score. It's quite sickening.

Cearain
Caldari
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
Posted - 2010.12.14 15:34:00 - [131]
 

Originally by: Infinity Ziona
Edited by: Infinity Ziona on 14/12/2010 05:59:38
As for Prometheus he has some very nice kills, in 0.0, versus multiple opponents (rapier, falcon, vagabond) within 2 minutes of each other, in a valuable ship.

Its quite a bit more impressive than your or my own kills.

My challenge, which you have failed to take up, is still open, since what I do is so easy, create a corp for a week, dec an alliance and get 7 kills without dying. I give you 1 billion isk for success.

My best is 44 kills. My last war was 24 no deaths.


Prometheus is one of the best pvpers in the game. Just because he can do something doesn’t mean its viable for most players like myself. It’s sort of like telling a fifth grader stop trying to make lay ups just slam dunk the ball like Michael Jordan.

As far as your “challenge” and your views in general. I think you miss it on several levels.

1) Why do you want me to do this “without dying.” Your view of pvp - where it’s of paramount importance to never die - is indeed why solo pvp is difficult to find.
2) I’m not saying it’s easy to find people to fight in what you do. But the fights you do get are far from impressive. The ship type you have killed the most is an industrial. Do you think people are going to be impressed?
Why don’t you do a video like Prometheus? It would have you warping and scanning around for hours on end then finally tackling that badger. See how many people swoon at your prowess.
How many victims on your killboard have ever even shot at another player let alone have a kill?? You wait until momma bear leaves the den then your run in there and club all the baby bears that haven’t even opened their eyes yet. This is fine with me. Whatever floats your boat. But it is crazy that you then beat your chest and proclaim what a great warrior you are.

3) What you do is equivalent to fw missions. You have to go in kill the industrials and warp out before anyone catches you. If I wanted to spend a whole week doing that I would want more than 1 billion isk. I certainly would want more than a promise from a griefer that he will pay 1 billion isk.
4) But in the end what would this prove. You say Garmon didn’t get 10 kills. Does this mean you’re a better pvper than Garmon? Or does it mean that what you do is just a slow and tedious way to go about solo pvp? You have been playing this game for *6 years* and you only have 179 kills. Looking through your kills it seems you have not left high sec. I agree with people who say this game is a sanbox so you can do what you want. But if you really want solo pvp you may want to at least try leaving high sec.

Cearain
Caldari
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
Posted - 2010.12.14 16:00:00 - [132]
 

Originally by: Misanth
FW is already a blobfest, terribly plagued with lag (lowsec can't handle fleets a tenth of what nullsec can), crowded with spies and in-fighting (just like 0.0). It's everything a small scale PvPer wants to avoid, by not heading to null.

So no, FW doesn't need incentitives for PvP. Perhaps it needs better options/tools for smaller scale fights, but right now it's already zero-zero in minimode.


I am saying it could use some better options and tools. Specifically it would be nice if the complex fighting was tweaked so that people would fight in them more. The NPCs are very annoying and there are other things they could do.

For me, in fw, a small gang is 5 or under. For null sec alliances small gang is what they have in the alliance tournaments. That would be considered a blobby in fw. So really when I say “small gang” most people should read “tiny gang”

FW can be a miniblob fest if you do it that way. But it can also be a good way (best way?) to get allot of small gang and solo pvp. You have allot of war targets plus all the other people in low sec.

If you are solo why do you care about spies or infighting? I imagine that goes on but since I have been mainly going solo, I really have no clue and couldn’t care less.

I am likely to start doing some small gang stuff – like under five people – but I doubt we will start infighting or spying on each other. The thought is even sort of amusing.

I'm not going to say the lag is gone but from what I read it seems it was *much* worse in the past. I have had *very* few problems. If your solo or in a small gang I wouldn’t worry about it.



Merdaneth
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.14 17:56:00 - [133]
 

Edited by: Merdaneth on 14/12/2010 17:58:42
Originally by: Infinity Ziona

My challenge, which you have failed to take up, is still open, since what I do is so easy, create a corp for a week, dec an alliance and get 7 kills without dying. I give you 1 billion isk for success.


The attitude that PvP is about killing others without dying is what hurts the viability of solo PvP more than anything else. If nobody is taking risk, and everybody is somewhat smart, then of course solo PvP is difficult.

The ability to sort of guess the outcome of many 1vs1 ship match ups in advance in combination with the point above is extra killing for solo PvP. In my eyes a good solo PvP-ers is someone who can kill you in a ship that you expected to win from.

In fact, as soon as I meet someone seems determined to avoid the risk of dying at all cost, then I will try to avoid PvP with that person (if he's good) since if he does engage, he only does so when he's sure to win. As a rule, if you want to fight me, you gotta risk something.

Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.12.14 18:59:00 - [134]
 

Edited by: Ephemeron on 14/12/2010 19:02:17
Originally by: Infinity Ziona

My challenge, which you have failed to take up, is still open, since what I do is so easy, create a corp for a week, dec an alliance and get 7 kills without dying. I give you 1 billion isk for success.
Can I please take that challenge for a week? I can easily make a new corp since I'm out of one right now. It'll be just me an my alt - Imperishable. I'll war dec an alliance of your choice (as long as it doesn't cost more than 200 mil)

And if I get 7 kills within 1 week of starting the war, I get 1 bil. Is that a deal? ugh

Lost Greybeard
Gallente
Posted - 2010.12.14 19:14:00 - [135]
 

Originally by: Wandering Deathstriker
It's hard to solo unless your a really fast ship or find someone who isn't going to call all his buddies.


A fast ship does help (though it's not necessary, witness the large numbers of Recons around), but as for calling his buddies-- kill him before they can get there, man. Not _that_ hard if you're initiating combat (i.e. you got the jump on them).

Deserek Calani
Caldari
IMMERSION CORP
Posted - 2010.12.14 19:45:00 - [136]
 

I see a lot of people saying that killboards kill eve, and that people won't risk a fight unless they are sure they can win. Well, in response, I shall quote one of the smartest military geniuses of human history...

"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight, even though the ruler forbid it; if fighting is not sure to result in victory, then you must not fight, even at the rulers bidding." - Sun Tzu

This applies to soloers as well as gangs and fleets, and I think it's very valid to not fight unless you're sure you can win. But in fairness, I have disregarded this from time to time, that is, when I could pick the fight. Sometimes, I knew I wasn't going to win but I fought anyway because it was fun. So if you're not willing to risk a fight because you're afraid of your stats being tarnished, forget about it. That's all they are, just stats. Even if you're the best of the best, once someone better comes along, are people going to remember your name? No, they aren't. So there's really no point to worrying about your stats.

Merdaneth
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.14 21:22:00 - [137]
 

Originally by: Deserek Calani
I see a lot of people saying that killboards kill eve, and that people won't risk a fight unless they are sure they can win. Well, in response, I shall quote one of the smartest military geniuses of human history...

"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight, even though the ruler forbid it; if fighting is not sure to result in victory, then you must not fight, even at the rulers bidding." - Sun Tzu.


However, military wisdom has nothing to do with what we are doing, which is playing a game.

Sun Tzu never fought unless necessary. We fight for fun. Might as well apply Sun Tzu's rules to your next game of tennis or chess. I doubt even Sun Tzu would challenge a 4 year old kid to some game just because he knew for sure he would win.

Michwich
Posted - 2010.12.15 00:11:00 - [138]
 

I dont like the fact the battles are pre-determined before they start, hence the battle being the hunt. Im really competative person, I love testing myself against others and using my skill against theres. When skill in this game is numbers, or higher stats/more expensive ships and the actual battle is an afterthought, I dont get my competative fix from what you guys call PVP in this game. Even in 1 on 1 situations its the same thing, only the numbers factor is taken out,but lack of skill in battle is still there. Theres no turning on this mod at the right time to counter what the enemy is doing, thers no putting a well placed strategic shot against a ships defenses. Its all min maxed and predetermined and the game seems a hunt rather than a battle. Even with high stakes there are games that exist because they allow for player skill over rpg game mechanics where you can stand to lose a lot but at the same time everyone think they got a shot. See poker. But i cant imagine CCP adding skill to a game where people have payed for advantages in time and money, just look at the crying over learning skills. Some people take their artificial skill seriously.

Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.12.15 00:24:00 - [139]
 

Originally by: Michwich
I dont like the fact the battles are pre-determined before they start, hence the battle being the hunt. Im really competative person, I love testing myself against others and using my skill against theres. When skill in this game is numbers, or higher stats/more expensive ships and the actual battle is an afterthought, I dont get my competative fix from what you guys call PVP in this game. Even in 1 on 1 situations its the same thing, only the numbers factor is taken out,but lack of skill in battle is still there. Theres no turning on this mod at the right time to counter what the enemy is doing, thers no putting a well placed strategic shot against a ships defenses. Its all min maxed and predetermined and the game seems a hunt rather than a battle. Even with high stakes there are games that exist because they allow for player skill over rpg game mechanics where you can stand to lose a lot but at the same time everyone think they got a shot. See poker. But i cant imagine CCP adding skill to a game where people have payed for advantages in time and money, just look at the crying over learning skills. Some people take their artificial skill seriously.
EVE used to have more player skill based competitiveness - before the Great Nano Nerf.

Back then ships could be faster and personal piloting skills often meant life or death. And in those days a single guy could successfully harass superior numbers.

Now things are a lot slower, dumber, and your count in numbers holds more sway.

1600 RT
Posted - 2010.12.15 00:32:00 - [140]
 

removing the local would be the total end of solo roamers.
if you are solo sometime you do even 20-30 jumps with most of system empty, you see the local and just jump to the next system, if you had to probe/scan every single system you jump in it would just be impossible.
removal of local would just boost cloakers wich is a boring tactic at best

Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.12.15 00:42:00 - [141]
 

Originally by: 1600 RT
removing the local would be the total end of solo roamers.
if you are solo sometime you do even 20-30 jumps with most of system empty, you see the local and just jump to the next system, if you had to probe/scan every single system you jump in it would just be impossible.
removal of local would just boost cloakers wich is a boring tactic at best
I'm a solo roamer and I want removal of local more than anything.

Any time I enter 0.0 the local alliance scout reports me in all intel channels. So everybody knows I'm coming within 20 jump radius and a blob will be on its way within 5 minutes.

Infinity Ziona
Minmatar
Cloakers
Posted - 2010.12.15 02:59:00 - [142]
 

Edited by: Infinity Ziona on 15/12/2010 03:21:40
Originally by: Cearain

Prometheus is one of the best pvpers in the game. Just because he can do something doesn’t mean its viable for most players like myself. It’s sort of like telling a fifth grader stop trying to make lay ups just slam dunk the ball like Michael Jordan.

As far as your “challenge” and your views in general. I think you miss it on several levels.

1) Why do you want me to do this “without dying.” Your view of pvp - where it’s of paramount importance to never die - is indeed why solo pvp is difficult to find.
2) I’m not saying it’s easy to find people to fight in what you do. But the fights you do get are far from impressive. The ship type you have killed the most is an industrial. Do you think people are going to be impressed?
Why don’t you do a video like Prometheus? It would have you warping and scanning around for hours on end then finally tackling that badger. See how many people swoon at your prowess.
How many victims on your killboard have ever even shot at another player let alone have a kill?? You wait until momma bear leaves the den then your run in there and club all the baby bears that haven’t even opened their eyes yet. This is fine with me. Whatever floats your boat. But it is crazy that you then beat your chest and proclaim what a great warrior you are.

3) What you do is equivalent to fw missions. You have to go in kill the industrials and warp out before anyone catches you. If I wanted to spend a whole week doing that I would want more than 1 billion isk. I certainly would want more than a promise from a griefer that he will pay 1 billion isk.
4) But in the end what would this prove. You say Garmon didn’t get 10 kills. Does this mean you’re a better pvper than Garmon? Or does it mean that what you do is just a slow and tedious way to go about solo pvp? You have been playing this game for *6 years* and you only have 179 kills. Looking through your kills it seems you have not left high sec. I agree with people who say this game is a sanbox so you can do what you want. But if you really want solo pvp you may want to at least try leaving high sec.


1. Because 'dying' in my eyes is ultimate failure. If I wanted a game where I died and respawned over and over I'd play an FPS. EvE is not an FPS.

2. Industrials are have very high priority on my kill list, as they would for anyone looking to make isk from PvP. BS & BC > my industrial kills. My pod kills twice industrial kills. Pod kills are primary target because they cause the most potential damage to a player. Most importantly I'm not interested in impressing you or anyone else. I play EvE for me.

I never claimed to be a great pvp'r. I stated I'm actually not that great of a PvP'r. What I do in this game is however, the most difficult and challenging thing I have done in EvE and I have done all of EvE, 0.0 alliance, 0.0 pirating, low sec pirating, low sec carebearing, high sec carebearing and high sec piracy.

3. So you don't wish to take up my offer. I didn't think you would.

4. It means I'm better at what I do then most people and I don't have ADHD needing a pointless riskless kill every 2 minutes to make me happy. Edit: I have a analogy for you: A big game hunter is good at hunting not because he shoots the game, but because of all the things he does prior to shooting. He could get a lot more kills if he had someone tie up the game to a post, but that removes 100% of the fun of hunting. I'm a hunter.

Infinity Ziona
Minmatar
Cloakers
Posted - 2010.12.15 03:08:00 - [143]
 

Originally by: Ephemeron
Edited by: Ephemeron on 14/12/2010 19:02:17
Originally by: Infinity Ziona

My challenge, which you have failed to take up, is still open, since what I do is so easy, create a corp for a week, dec an alliance and get 7 kills without dying. I give you 1 billion isk for success.
Can I please take that challenge for a week? I can easily make a new corp since I'm out of one right now. It'll be just me an my alt - Imperishable. I'll war dec an alliance of your choice (as long as it doesn't cost more than 200 mil)

And if I get 7 kills within 1 week of starting the war, I get 1 bil. Is that a deal? ugh

Sure m8, I pick alliance and you fraps each kill. No RR or ganglinks, scouts are fine. I'll pay the war dec. Cruisers or above.

Karn Mithralia
Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2010.12.15 03:42:00 - [144]
 

Edited by: Karn Mithralia on 15/12/2010 03:51:54

Solo pvp is why I play(ed) EVE. I like(d) nothing better that listening to music, drinking spirits and roaming solo. Sure, I have run the alliance, lead region-taking coalitions, flown multi-boxed cap ships in 1500+ system count lag fests, and in many other ways taken part in all other 'end game' aspects of eve, but lone roaming has always been what kept me sane.

It went really down hill a few years ago when they buffed all ship hit points. This effectively nerfed solo pvp to hell as suddenly people had way more time to yell for help. Ever increasing gangs sizes hasn't helped, nor has all the speed nerfs.

Now, these things may all be good for the game as a whole, but for solo pvp they are all bad news.

I find myself reduced to flying very few ships, in all honestly there's only 1 ship that can do solo pvp with any degree of all round success - a vagabond. It has enough dps, it can run gate camps, and more importantly it can gtfo when it inevitably gets blobbed. It's not too expensive. I have bling that works too, but as I don't enjoy grinding for isk, or industry of any kind, I need a pvp ship that is self-sustaining.

But it gets dull flying the same ship. Have a look at my kill records, you will see I'm perhaps the all-time solo kill pilot in U'K. You'll see my stats are pretty reasonable, I don't say this to brag, but just to show that unlike 90% of people in this thread I know what I'm talking about.

You'll see I use vagas a lot. You will also see I am hardly active these days.

I have grown tired of flying around for hours to get 1 or 2 "good fights" and then having to leave most of them mid-way through due to getting blobbed.

I have grown tired of drakes, never ending ****ing drakes and the nubs who fly them. I don't mean to dis the few experts who use them well, just the herd mentality that makes them so prevalent.

In short, I have grown tired of having so few ships to choose from that work with my play style.

I don't like flying duel accounts (although I have done so), I don't really like flying in gangs that often (did I mention I love to fly alone?), and I hate the logistics involved in getting myself new ships. Yep thats all personal choices, but they used to be choices that fitted in the sandbox of eve, but now have trouble doing so.

Well, maybe not logistics, thats always sucked. Razz

Tell me that solo pvp is not dead all you want - I agree it isn't - but it is definately in danger of going extinct. For me at least.

/bitter vet signing off so he can go back to WoT where he knows he will get a good fight at the click of a button Very Happy

Infinity Ziona
Minmatar
Cloakers
Posted - 2010.12.15 03:53:00 - [145]
 

I disagree they're good for the game as a whole.

Take gang links for example

If you have 10 average pvp'rs and 5 expert pvp'rs you would expect the expert pvp'rs have a chance.

However those 10 pvp'rs get 250% (25% x 10) buffs from ganglink while the 5 pvp'rs get 125% (25% x 5) buffs. Effectively the more people you have the greater the buff.

The 10 also get twice as many RR as the 5.

The effect of this is encouragement of not engaging at a numbers disadvantage because the buffs and RR cancel out skill.

The end result is the only way to engage without suiciding your ships is to bring as many or more than the other party and in the case of the soloer, to not engage at all unless its another solo target.

Ephemeron
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.12.15 04:52:00 - [146]
 

I usually don't use gang links or RR. I don't use Fraps either, don't really want to mess around with video editing.

How about I war dec IT, they post all their losses, you can get confirmations from their own killboard

Alt FTW
Posted - 2010.12.15 05:08:00 - [147]
 


I myself haven't PvP'd an awful lot yet, but I know that for me the only end-game that could keep me interested in EVE in the long-run is solo or small-gang warfare. Nothing else comes close, and without good solo PvP experiences, I just know I'll get bored sooner rather than later.

Reading how solo roaming is becoming increasingly difficult is really depressing (well, as far as a computer game can be "depress" me, which isn't very far), and such a waste of enormous potential.

If ever there was a game that is made for this kind of thing (solo PvP) it is EVE, where the vastness of space + sci fi fiction should make it an obvious priority to game developers. Instead, CCP seem only interested in creating more and more faceless grunts in dodgy alliances. Even their PvE content (incursion) is starting to force players to become part of "the blob".

Such a shame.

Chock Nurris
Posted - 2010.12.15 07:17:00 - [148]
 

Edited by: Chock Nurris on 15/12/2010 07:26:00
Doh wrong char.

Kindof wierd, this is the way of most MMO's. Developers somehow feel you need to be pressured into grouping to have fun.

They're yet to realise a lot of players actually enjoy being able to do their own thing, when and how they like. This is why in almost every mmo, the classes that can solo well, are usually the most popular.

Actually maybe not wierd, when I was studying programming, it was all about communication, teamwork, delegating tasks and big group hugs and kisses. Its not wonder that gets carried over into their games.

Murauke
EvE Cookie Collective
Posted - 2010.12.15 08:58:00 - [149]
 

I have had a stab at this at aggree that solo PVP is very diffcult. I have had most luck in an Arazu catching ratters and miners but yea YAWM* - i've gone all the way around Drone Russia and found every macro-er, i went to providence wanting small fights and got owned by 20 I went to the North into Cloud Ring and got ****d by again 20... Its difficult to kill **** alone - let me re-phrase that - its difficult to kill **** before their buddies show up in force. This could be simply a bait ship which i find incredibly gay...but the game is all about the "sandbox" -pfffft what ever happened to that its a sandpit not a box.

Drakarin
Gallente
Absentia Libertas Solus
Posted - 2010.12.15 09:29:00 - [150]
 

Originally by: Merdaneth
The largest problem of solo-ing is fight mismatches. Earlier today I shot at 9 different targets and was shot at by 6 different targets. Only once was there exchange of fire, all other cases was me firing at something that didn't want to engage, because they would most likely die, or others firing at me while I didn't want to engage, because I had no chance of winning.

As skill points, ship choices, fits and roles diversify and strategies get perfected the odds of finding a 'matching 'fight gets smaller and smaller. Many ships have very small 'engagement windows', that is to say, situations where the outcome of the fight is unsure.


Ding ding ding. Player skill matters very little in solo to small gang pvp. There is very little luck involved either. In 1vs 1, it's 99% about what ship you have, and how it is fit. It's a rock paper scissor game. The moment you undock you're picking one and you just have to hope that whoever you find isn't the one that counters it.

Basically, no one wants to solo because there's no point. You can know everything you need to know about your enemy via local, even long long they've been playing or if they are in a corp, and you can find out what ship they are in via the directional scanner or a combat probe.

There's no guess work. It's literally spreadsheet online, everything is calculated and quantifiable down to the last micro action. This works fine for large scale conflict, because the dynamics of this are somewhat random.. when you have hundreds of other players and ships of all kinds to contend with. It just doesn't work in small encounters and there's really nothing that can be done about it short of overhauling the entire combat system.


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