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blankseplocked SHSG Basic Bond - 5B @ 3% for 30days. (Paid & Closed)
 
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Stealing Honest
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
Posted - 2010.12.08 05:55:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Stealing Honest on 09/02/2011 00:28:18
Edited by: Stealing Honest on 07/01/2011 23:16:29
SHSG Basic Bond


Bonds available: 5
Face value per bond: 1B Isk Ea.
Total Bond Value : 5B
Bond Begins: Soon as filled
Maturity: 30 days
Interest: 3%
Date of issuance: TBA
Date of maturity: TBA

Reserved:
Breaker77 - 5 @ 5b


This bond carries 5b isk in collateral in the form of BPOs. Terms are 30 days @ 3%, with the option to roll over if both parties agree. This bond will be used for general trading in SHSG core markets & provide BPO research.

Contract has been set for collateral.

Thank you

Stealing Honest
CEO
SHSG


Bond has finished, and turned into strait loan.

Cesar Menage
MenageTech
Posted - 2010.12.08 06:15:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Cesar Menage on 08/12/2010 07:59:10
I will take 1
edit: changed the amount I wanted

Von Bonez
SecDiv
SpaceMonkey's Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.08 06:20:00 - [3]
 

You can count me in for two

Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2010.12.08 10:58:00 - [4]
 

Confirming ISK sent and collateral received. Not sure why it's opened as a bond when it's more of a private loan though.


Lederstrumpf
Posted - 2010.12.08 11:24:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Breaker77
Confirming ISK sent and collateral received. Not sure why it's opened as a bond when it's more of a private loan though.


There's no proof you're not his Alt or the other way 'round, right?

Because if you were, this'd be just a stagy rep grinding stunt which would make sense. Well, kind of.

Rykker Bow
Posted - 2010.12.08 13:07:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Lederstrumpf

There's no proof you're not his Alt or the other way 'round, right?

Because if you were, this'd be just a stagy rep grinding stunt which would make sense. Well, kind of.


wow. where did this come from? I highly doubt this is true.

Cesar Menage
MenageTech
Posted - 2010.12.08 15:33:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Breaker77
Confirming ISK sent and collateral received. Not sure why it's opened as a bond when it's more of a private loan though.




so.....
does this mean your covering the whole 5bil loan?
is he still offer bonds?

Von Bonez
SecDiv
SpaceMonkey's Alliance
Posted - 2010.12.08 16:02:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Stealing Honest

Reserved:
Breaker77 - 5 @ 5b



wow, I guess I need to train my reading comprehension skill

Cesar Menage
MenageTech
Posted - 2010.12.08 17:17:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Von Bonez
Originally by: Stealing Honest

Reserved:
Breaker77 - 5 @ 5b



wow, I guess I need to train my reading comprehension skill


same here lol well time to go look for more investments

Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2010.12.08 23:27:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Lederstrumpf

There's no proof you're not his Alt or the other way 'round, right?

Because if you were, this'd be just a stagy rep grinding stunt which would make sense. Well, kind of.


Why would I rep grind under a different name when I already have people begging me to take their full API keys and audit them, people who will loan me ISK if I ask, and have been suitable for 3rd party holding in offers?

Wouldn't I just use this character?

Idiot.

Eunson
MenageTech
Posted - 2010.12.09 00:33:00 - [11]
 

Mr Breaker77
are you the broker holding the prints as 3rd party or are
investor?
Reserved:
Breaker77 - 5 @ 5b

so far I dont know whats going on lol sorry new to investing on MD.

Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2010.12.09 02:57:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Eunson
Mr Breaker77
are you the broker holding the prints as 3rd party or are
investor?



I am the sole investor. Which as I already mentioned is more like a collateralized loan instead of a bond.


Lederstrumpf
Posted - 2010.12.09 12:47:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Lederstrumpf on 09/12/2010 13:13:11
Originally by: Breaker77
Originally by: Lederstrumpf

There's no proof you're not his Alt or the other way 'round, right?

Because if you were, this'd be just a stagy rep grinding stunt which would make sense. Well, kind of.


Why would I rep grind under a different name when I already have people begging me to take their full API keys and audit them, people who will loan me ISK if I ask, and have been suitable for 3rd party holding in offers?

Wouldn't I just use this character?

Idiot.


You would not use your main character because throwing away your main (ISK making?) character reputation would make no sense if you would like, and could succeed, to enter the scammer side of the game by building up a fake reputation on an alt without any hard proof to get linked back to your main character.

Interesting though that you're calling me names instead of coming up with the simple reason given above.

Liberty Eternal
Posted - 2010.12.09 13:23:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Lederstrumpf
You would not use your main character because throwing away your main (ISK making?) character reputation would make no sense if you would like, and could succeed, to enter the scammer side of the game by building up a fake reputation on an alt without any hard proof to get linked back to your main character.

Interesting though that you're calling me names instead of coming up with the simple reason given above.



This is Breaker77 you're talking to. Stop embarassing yourself.

RAW23
Posted - 2010.12.09 13:38:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Lederstrumpf
Edited by: Lederstrumpf on 09/12/2010 13:13:11
Originally by: Breaker77
Originally by: Lederstrumpf

There's no proof you're not his Alt or the other way 'round, right?

Because if you were, this'd be just a stagy rep grinding stunt which would make sense. Well, kind of.


Why would I rep grind under a different name when I already have people begging me to take their full API keys and audit them, people who will loan me ISK if I ask, and have been suitable for 3rd party holding in offers?

Wouldn't I just use this character?

Idiot.


You would not use your main character because throwing away your main (ISK making?) character reputation would make no sense if you would like, and could succeed, to enter the scammer side of the game by building up a fake reputation on an alt without any hard proof to get linked back to your main character.

Interesting though that you're calling me names instead of coming up with the simple reason given above.



Do you actually have any evidence at all to suggest that there is any substance to this or is this in the conspiracy theory bracket? What exactly is the issue here? SHSG gets a collateralised loan and you think this in some way boosts their rep preparing them for a scam down the line? Apart from the fact that you get little to no credit for running a fully collateralised loan successfully (because there is no investor risk and, thus, no real trust issues), why do you think there is a potential issue in this case and not in the case of any other collateralised loan, about which you could have passed exactly the same comments? Or do you think we should be suspicious of all collateralised loans on these grounds? If the latter, what solution do you propose?




Stealing Honest
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
Posted - 2010.12.09 21:12:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Breaker77
Confirming ISK sent and collateral received. Not sure why it's opened as a bond when it's more of a private loan though.




Its written as a bond because that's how it was proposed in the discussion phase. It is a 5 share bond, and you offered to take the whole thing.

At the end of 30 days, we will roll the bond over (to continue research) or pay out if you wish, but we will also add more BPO's for collateral to offer public at least 3 more shares.

We @ SHSG have been talking and we like this idea of full collateral, and plan to grow the bond in this way. This is a win/win for us and our investors. We may even be open to offering BPC print sharing in the future as part of our payment plan.

SH

Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2010.12.09 23:09:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Liberty Eternal
Originally by: Lederstrumpf

Interesting though that you're calling me names instead of coming up with the simple reason given above.



This is Breaker77 you're talking to. Stop embarassing yourself.



Indeed!

Just as AC has his /finger I'm the therapist.



Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2010.12.09 23:11:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Stealing Honest

At the end of 30 days, we will roll the bond over (to continue research) or pay out if you wish, but we will also add more BPO's for collateral to offer public at least 3 more shares.



As of now, I have no problem with rolling over after the first 30 days.

Also if you wish I can do the others for a reasonable fee which I'm sure would be acceptable as a 3rd party for many investors.


Lederstrumpf
Posted - 2010.12.10 03:39:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: RAW23
Do you actually have any evidence at all to suggest that there is any substance to this or is this in the conspiracy theory bracket?


It is well within conspiracy brackets. But the way how things are being played look way too dumb for the brains involved to me... and if stuff is being played similar to what I "suggested", the beauty within is it'd be quite impossible to pinpoint any hard proof of prior connection between investee and investor - as it'd be designed to withstand it from the beginning.

Liberty Eternal
Posted - 2010.12.10 05:24:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Lederstrumpf
if



Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2010.12.10 10:53:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Lederstrumpf
and if stuff is being played similar to what I "suggested", the beauty within is it'd be quite impossible to pinpoint any hard proof of prior connection between investee and investor - as it'd be designed to withstand it from the beginning.



Except that you failed to notice this

Originally by: RAW23
Apart from the fact that you get little to no credit for running a fully collateralised loan successfully (because there is no investor risk and, thus, no real trust issues)



Even if we were alts, this would do nothing.


Lederstrumpf
Posted - 2010.12.10 11:59:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: Lederstrumpf on 10/12/2010 12:12:34

Originally by: Breaker77
you failed to notice this

Originally by: RAW23
Apart from the fact that you get little to no credit for running a fully collateralised loan successfully (because there is no investor risk and, thus, no real trust issues)



Even if we were alts, this would do nothing.



In such a setup one would not need to have any collateral at all and the involved parties would not be required to give out interest to any outsider. So it'd be a "moneyless" round of "Ponzi" one could point to later on as yet another "successful 5b bond got completed"... I'm not saying there's valid reason to point at it, but I'm pretty sure it will happen. And it's true: For now the values are kinda irrelevant, too:

Anybody buying game time for months ahead for two chars can invest 150m pocket change interest.

My personal belief is that mixing up roles of third party(collateral holder) and single investor in a thread called public bond puts you on a bad position, to say at least. If I were you I'd try to agree with the investee on this thread to go private and never ever be brought up in an attempt to gain credibility in the future anymore. But that's your call.

RAW23
Posted - 2010.12.10 12:00:00 - [23]
 

Edited by: RAW23 on 10/12/2010 12:00:44
Originally by: Lederstrumpf
Originally by: RAW23
Do you actually have any evidence at all to suggest that there is any substance to this or is this in the conspiracy theory bracket?


It is well within conspiracy brackets. But the way how things are being played look way too dumb for the brains involved to me... and if stuff is being played similar to what I "suggested", the beauty within is it'd be quite impossible to pinpoint any hard proof of prior connection between investee and investor - as it'd be designed to withstand it from the beginning.



Whilst conspiracy theories may well sometimes be true they derive their particular characteristics from being indemonstrable and/or unfalsifiable. As such, they are fun to roll around the mind and to play with but they cannot form the basis for rational discussion and criticism, they can only provide a conceptual starting point for the gathering of actual evidence which can then be critically examined. It is possible to put together a thousand a one possible conspiracy theories for any offering on MD, none of which can be proved or disproved. I could, for example, claim that you are the alt of someone who wants to drive investors away from this offering so that there will be more investor money available for your own offerings. This is a claim that you will not be able to disprove and which is certainly conceivable (that is, there is no logical reason to reject it as impossible). However, in the absence of any positive evidence it is not a very useful claim to add to the discussion since it will not convince anyone who makes their investment decisions based on the evidence that they do have available. As such, I think it is best to steer away from unsupported claims that it is impossible to falsify as they constitute noise rather than information.

Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2010.12.10 22:48:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Breaker77 on 10/12/2010 22:49:15
Originally by: RAW23

It is possible to put together a thousand a one possible conspiracy theories for any offering on MD, none of which can be proved or disproved.


Adding to the theories, I am pretty sure that Lederstrumpf is butthurt he couldn't invest in this.

In all seriousness though, 3% is a very low ROI, especially including the research that is being done of the collateral. However I had spare ISK and spare slots which was making 0 ISK. I suppose 150 mil a month is better than nothing.


edit:

Summary:
SH gets a great interest rate and research done but no credibility.
I get a little extra income for about 2 minutes of work installing the jobs.



Stealing Honest
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
Posted - 2010.12.11 03:07:00 - [25]
 

Some people just don't like the way i do business. They are so caught up in "what if's", "tinfoil hattery", and "tea leaf readings", that they foam at the mouth with the simple mention of my name.

Some have gone to the extremes of flinging as much random sh*t as possible to see if anything will stick.

When our bonds were very small, they yelled scam.
When we ran the IPO they yelled scam.
When we ran multi bond offers they yelled scam.
When we paid back in full they yelled scam.
When we offered 50% collateral they yelled scam.
When we offered 100% collateral - they yelled scam.
When we got an audit, they yelled scam .

When we paid every single offering we've ever had, in full, with full interest/bonus/principal every single time..they still yelled Scam.

They have claimed our auditor was an alt, claimed our 3rd party holders as alts, and claimed all our investors as alts. Going back you will see claims of alt against nearly every person we have done business with in our offerings

For the last 7 months, we at SHSG have done our best in trading. We forge ahead with our personal goals of improving our corp, our selves, and hopefully soon growing a small manufacturing wing.

We feel our investors, and our corp bottom line have done well in all of our investment offerings. Some people cant live with this, and become enraged that SHSG is still profitable, successful, and slowly growing.

We honor our deals, and have fun in the process. To the sh*t flingers we say..... /meh.


Stealing Honest
CEO
SHSG


Lederstrumpf
Posted - 2010.12.11 11:47:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Lederstrumpf on 11/12/2010 11:49:18
Originally by: Stealing Honest
Some people just don't like the way i do business. [..] When we paid


Is it "I" or "we" ?

I in fact do not buy your story of success.

Is there _anybody_ you supposedly did trade with who might vouch for you in here?

Liberty Eternal
Posted - 2010.12.11 12:43:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Liberty Eternal on 11/12/2010 12:47:22
@Lederstrumpf - it's good that you want to challenge potential scammers - and I wholeheartedly encourage you to continue - but keep in mind that there is a right way to do it. Patiently analysing data, finding inconsistencies, forensic questioning and reviewing the facts, as well as audits, are the best way to catch most scammers out.

And remember that you can't catch them all, some will get through no matter what we do. I think for this offering, we have already established that there are no factual grounds to continue along this line of questioning. Pull your guns in for now and take a more analytical approach, otherwise you risk being a little unfair to the people involved in this offering. Wink

Edit: Just for clarification, I don't personally think there are any grounds for considering this to be a scam [except the fact that it's posted in MD, and this is EVE online, of course].

Stealing Honest
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
Posted - 2011.02.08 20:07:00 - [28]
 

This Bond/Loan is ready for Payoff. Once the contract is complete, ill ask the lender to verify completion.

SH

Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2011.02.08 23:53:00 - [29]
 

Contract up.

Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2011.02.09 00:12:00 - [30]
 

and received. Thanks


 

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