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blankseplocked Combat is shallow
 
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Emulated
Posted - 2010.11.27 09:05:00 - [1]
 

the combat needs a revamp this gam is no longer a high school physics project. it lacks depth and twitch reflex. not good enough im sure the eve devs know this youcan hire me to make ur game exceptional and you wont have to charge the hard core players for ingame ship decals... :)

Conrad Makbure
Gallente
Teutonic Brotherhood
Posted - 2010.11.27 09:10:00 - [2]
 

Is this some kind of a damn joke? Aw hell, troll or not, you're probably right. While you're at it, make sure you change all low level agents (lev 1 - 4) missions so they never send you to low sec. What a pain in the ass. I'm getting sick of Pucherie.

CCP Zymurgist


Gallente
C C P
Posted - 2010.11.27 18:44:00 - [3]
 

Moved from New Citizen's Q&A.

Valandril
Caldari
Ex-Mortis
Posted - 2010.11.27 18:44:00 - [4]
 

2/10

Xercodo
Amarr
Xovoni Directorate
Posted - 2010.11.27 19:03:00 - [5]
 

the whole point of the game is to NOT have twitch game play

if i want that then ill fire up X if i want twitch in space but if i want twitch in general then ill fire up a FPS

De'Veldrin
Minmatar
Norse'Storm Battle Group
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2010.11.27 19:13:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Emulated
the combat needs a revamp this gam is no longer a high school physics project. it lacks depth and twitch reflex. not good enough im sure the eve devs know this youcan hire me to make ur game exceptional and you wont have to charge the hard core players for ingame ship decals... :)


Why haven't you quit yet? You said you were quitting. Pack your **** and get out already.

Tradeahun
Posted - 2010.11.27 20:21:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: De'Veldrin
Originally by: Emulated
the combat needs a revamp this gam is no longer a high school physics project. it lacks depth and twitch reflex. not good enough im sure the eve devs know this youcan hire me to make ur game exceptional and you wont have to charge the hard core players for ingame ship decals... :)


Why haven't you quit yet? You said you were quitting. Pack your **** and get out already.


No, he didnt. He just said "hey, look at me, Im a call of duty douche expecting this game to be designed for inbred rednecks, hence why Im here"

Uronksur Suth
Posted - 2010.11.27 20:46:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Tradeahun
Originally by: De'Veldrin
Originally by: Emulated
the combat needs a revamp this gam is no longer a high school physics project. it lacks depth and twitch reflex. not good enough im sure the eve devs know this youcan hire me to make ur game exceptional and you wont have to charge the hard core players for ingame ship decals... :)


Why haven't you quit yet? You said you were quitting. Pack your **** and get out already.


No, he didnt. He just said "hey, look at me, Im a call of duty douche expecting this game to be designed for inbred rednecks, hence why Im here"



You, sir, are brilliant. Very Happy

De'Veldrin
Minmatar
Norse'Storm Battle Group
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2010.11.27 22:00:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Tradeahun
Originally by: De'Veldrin
Originally by: Emulated
the combat needs a revamp this gam is no longer a high school physics project. it lacks depth and twitch reflex. not good enough im sure the eve devs know this youcan hire me to make ur game exceptional and you wont have to charge the hard core players for ingame ship decals... :)


Why haven't you quit yet? You said you were quitting. Pack your **** and get out already.


No, he didnt. He just said "hey, look at me, Im a call of duty douche expecting this game to be designed for inbred rednecks, hence why Im here"


Oh, well in that case...

"Ya'll toss yer **** in the back of that there pickemuptruck and git the hell off mah lawn!"

Kissa Kurnauskis
Amarr
Hups Oho
Posted - 2010.11.28 16:25:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: De'Veldrin


Oh, well in that case...

"Ya'll toss yer **** in the back of that there pickemuptruck and git the hell off mah lawn!"


You pretty much owe me new keyboard. Seems like reading forums while drinking coffee is dangerous combination... Laughing

William Cooly
Sol Enterprises
Posted - 2010.11.28 17:13:00 - [11]
 

I love this thread so much I can almost forgive OP for making it.

De'Veldrin
Minmatar
Norse'Storm Battle Group
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2010.11.28 17:41:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Kissa Kurnauskis
Originally by: De'Veldrin


Oh, well in that case...

"Ya'll toss yer **** in the back of that there pickemuptruck and git the hell off mah lawn!"


You pretty much owe me new keyboard. Seems like reading forums while drinking coffee is dangerous combination... Laughing

Very Happy

I grew up in the Southeastern US. All my neighbors talked like that.

Emulated
Posted - 2010.11.29 03:54:00 - [13]
 

i forgot rts dont have twitch gaming, id rather not play a combat system designed for optimal server funcionality and ur typical fat analitical star treck fan. its 2 basic it needs to be tweaked to require skill. end of topic.

Emulated
Posted - 2010.11.29 03:59:00 - [14]
 

guns should be limited to positional fire radius there for making positioning more of an aspect aswell there is very little depth outside primary ranges.

William Cooly
Sol Enterprises
Posted - 2010.11.29 04:03:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Emulated
guns should be limited to positional fire radius there for making positioning more of an aspect aswell there is very little depth outside primary ranges.


If you have a problem with something as big as how the guns shoot, then EVE is not for you.

Kabaal S'sylistha
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.11.29 04:33:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Kabaal S''sylistha on 29/11/2010 04:34:00
Originally by: William Cooly
Originally by: Emulated
guns should be limited to positional fire radius there for making positioning more of an aspect aswell there is very little depth outside primary ranges.


If you have a problem with something as big as how the guns shoot, then EVE is not for you.



I personally think that having ways to configure guns so that (for one example) you can engineer them to fire forward better, resulting in higher numbers if you're shooting at a target in front, penalties to the other directions.

I don't like defending anything obvioustroll has to say (even if I have to stretch, bend, and warp what he said to do so), but there is kind of a case for increasing positional considerations, as long as appropriate considerations are taken. I personally am not going to ragequit and start 'lolevesux' threads if something like that never happens, but for the sake of the idea itself I had to defend it, since the OP ad hominem'd himself essentially :/


Sed Man
Gallente
Havoc Violence and Chaos
Posted - 2010.11.29 04:53:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Sed Man on 29/11/2010 13:39:50
I've been trying to use overload rack and nanite paste.
I've found overloading the rack to be not as effective as I'd hoped, and I've found paste ineffective for use during battle after overloading.

I'm hoping that this is all down to my skills rather than it being how I've experienced it so far.

The depth in combat is in planning your defensive/offensive fittings before you even start combat, and during combat with regard to useage and combinations of usage of those mods... there is enougth depth...
As far as twitch reflexes go... I've still not been successful in bookmarking an in flight missile yet... and managing your guns when someones target range dampening and while another is taking out your drones, all the time managing the cap usage related to that extra repper your toggling.... I'm still not fast enougth to keep up yet.... how much more complexity do you want to add to pvp?

ed. cant bookmark missiles, changed some time ago.... apparently...

Arklan1
Dunedain Rangers
Posted - 2010.11.29 05:38:00 - [18]
 

while i think the OP is out of his mind...

i would like to see fixed, no turret guns, particularly for frigs and other small craft.

Ishimaru Hun
Posted - 2010.11.30 00:53:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Emulated
i forgot rts dont have twitch gaming, id rather not play a combat system designed for optimal server funcionality and ur typical fat analitical star treck fan. its 2 basic it needs to be tweaked to require skill. end of topic.


The post that this quote came from, and the double post immediately following it proves my point about inbreeding. Thank you very much Emulated.
First this one: RTS = real time strategy. Strategy takes skill. And you obviously haven't done anything more then l1 missions. There is nothing about the combat that is basic, as what occurs in combat is a direct result of your ship build and the builds against which you are fighting. Nothing basic about ship fitting considering the sheer amount of customization that can be done with a configuration. As for your comment on 'typical fat analtitical star treck fan', first of all, its analytical. I'm surprised you cant even be bothered right clicking on a word to correct it. Its also trek, not treck. Pleas use your brain. Its really not that hard for someone who isn't a 5th generation 1st line inbred to do.
Second of all, most star trek fans aren't overweight. That's just a stereotype portrayed by the media to lessen the desire for science fiction and heighten the desire for reality television and sitcoms. If anything, more reality tv and sitcom fans are overweight more then pure trek fans are.

However, I take it you are suggesting that CCP alter an entire game to modify the combat system so that is twitch based, and only those with the quickest reflexes, best gaming mouse, and a fps optimized keyboard (wouldn't phase me on the hardware, as I do) have a chance to win? If you want that, go play CoD. This is not CoD. This is a game for those with brains. And FYI, the SERVERS (not servers, plural, not singular) are state of the art, and require so much power that they are now in a dedicated super computer storage room with active air cooling. There is more power in the servers that hold eve then in all the servers used for WoW, as you should expect considering the servers are optimized to hold what, 100,000 people simultaneously online?


Now on to your second post (someone needs to learn how to use the edit button): Do you honestly think that in a galaxy where technology is so advanced as to have jump bridges, warp drives, shields, subspace communications relays, subspace consciousness transference and perfect cloning devices that they would not be able to mount weapons on 360 degree turrets? I mean sure the modeling and animation is poor to reflect the reality behind the weapons, but still? Honestly? Are you so dense as to actually think that a 360 degree weapon mount is too hard to make?

Kabaal S'sylistha
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.11.30 01:35:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Kabaal S''sylistha on 30/11/2010 01:39:17
We've established that troll is troll, but had a comment on the 360 turret bit.

By sacrificing the 360 firing circle, you can do things like reinforce the weapon housing, allow more kick, etc. I certainly don't think anything is wrong with 360 turrets myself and they have a major place in combat that operates on an xyz grid, but the idea of position playing a role has its place. Unless you have a spherical ship with turrets mounted at equal intervals, the amount of guns you can bring in to play is going to change based on position.

Take a harpy for example. The guns are located mostly along the front vertical section, four on either side. This fits with the fitting, as at most any place (except behind and 'above' so the wings block the lower turrets) four turrets can fire on a target. Once the target is in front, technically the harpy could fire all 8 turrets on that target. If anything, not having position in play is a simplification of ship design and simplifies combat both in the fitting room and on the field.

Claiming a person would need some specialized keyboard and going off on these twitch rants seems like slippery slope arguing to me, especially when as ship size goes up any 'twitch' gameplay slows. I support the idea that position should matter for the same reason I think AT-ATs should never have gotten a single kill on Hoth - high power guns with a tiny firing radius.

If you want to argue for it not being a good idea then implementation is the way to go. Fearing change, reality, and "I won't have a sphere of death!" is a poor argument even against a troll.

TL;DR mode - Making "How am I flying?" matter more would hardly make things a twitch game. Unless you think Eve is even approaching the twitch required for 100+ APM Starcraft I tournament play.

Edit - And for those who are arguing against the troll's idea and assuming his end result is pewr tweetch, he might very well mean that and I don't want to dissuade anyone from shaking your head at him. My focus is purely the positional firing bit. I can see the OP wanting clicking the spot to fire for each gun, joystick support, and what have you, which isn't Eve's gamestyle. Variations in tactics based on the difference between fitting a 360 turret and a more fixed gun with better stats in other places does fit, in my opinion.

Uronksur Suth
Posted - 2010.11.30 04:15:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Emulated
i forgot rts dont have twitch gaming, id rather not play a combat system designed for optimal server funcionality and ur typical,fat analitical star treck fan. its 2 basic, it needs to be tweaked to require skill. end of topic.


Attempting to be condescending fails when you can't spell at the seventh grade level. Rolling Eyes

I've placed all of your mistakes in bold, and added commas in bold where appropriate.

Cpt Winky
Posted - 2010.11.30 06:31:00 - [22]
 

In my little dream world, I've always wanted to see ships capable of fitting a LOT more mods than they can now, with the drawback that everything takes a more significant amount of capacitor to use. This would give you a lot more options in combat, and allow the ability to switch tactics on the fly(and would allow the opponents to counter those tactics), with the downside being your ship is a lot more expensive with all that equipment fit.

Kabaal S'sylistha
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.11.30 06:58:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Cpt Winky
In my little dream world, I've always wanted to see ships capable of fitting a LOT more mods than they can now, with the drawback that everything takes a more significant amount of capacitor to use. This would give you a lot more options in combat, and allow the ability to switch tactics on the fly(and would allow the opponents to counter those tactics), with the downside being your ship is a lot more expensive with all that equipment fit.


I like this too. "Alpha" confused me on Eve because, coming from Mechwarrior, alpha was the activation of every weapon you had equipped and usually resulted in immediate overheating and shutdown if you had a normal setup equipped.

In Eve that concept doesn't quite work since missiles and projectiles don't have any firing drawbacks to play off of. The ability to switch gears is something I think some people in Eve would also have issues with, due to the "Battle is won in the fitting room" idea being played down to it.

I'm also sure you've decided not to hold your breath on a change like that going in, just wanted to share an ego boost today! I'm not always mean :(


 

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