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MuerteDio
Posted - 2010.10.28 05:30:00 - [1]
 

Ok..so don't laugh....well you can laugh if you want but some sage input from some of the more knowledgable players is what I am seeking. I can handle flames.

Anyway...I've just gotten around to being able to put on T2 rigs. Specifically t2 armor rigs in the way of the small Trimark Armor pump. I figure it would be a nice little touch for my frigates.

So I get my hauler with the intent of grabbing a shipment only to see the prices are insane. Just one of the T2 rigs costs (in the cheapest I was able to find it in Jita) 52 or so million isk. That costs more then seven times what I normally spend on a fully fitted out Frigate.

W...t...f?

So now that I have checked Dodixie (no help) and Eve Metrics (wtf?) I have to ask....


Who buys these things? And what do they fit them on? And why? I'm confused and beseech those with knowledge to enlighten this poor noob.

~M

P.S. Fly Safe.

Arthur Frayn
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.10.28 05:35:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 28/10/2010 05:36:38
T2 rigs are so expensive because T2 salvage is so rare. I think you can get T2 salvage parts from wrecks of T2 ships and also from wrecks of faction/deadspace/officer spawns in 0.0.

People who fly dreadnoughts, supercarriers and titans buy them. They're not really cost-effective on anything else.

LiNuXb0y
Amarr
Imperial Shipment
Posted - 2010.10.28 05:43:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 28/10/2010 05:36:38
T2 rigs are so expensive because T2 salvage is so rare. I think you can get T2 salvage parts from wrecks of T2 ships and also from wrecks of faction/deadspace/officer spawns in 0.0.

People who fly dreadnoughts, supercarriers and titans buy them. They're not really cost-effective on anything else.


Thats partly true, some t2 salvage is really exspensive and those obviously make for exspensive rigs, trimarks and extenders for example, however some rigs such as t2 shield resist are made form cheap salvage and so are cheap. Its worth looking into other types rather then just trimarks and extenders.

Arthur Frayn
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.10.28 05:50:00 - [4]
 

Also to the op: why on earth do you need an extra 5% performance on a frigate? It's not even worth it on a battleship. Stick with T1 rigs on your frigates.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.10.28 06:25:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Also to the op: why on earth do you need an extra 5% performance on a frigate? It's not even worth it on a battleship. Stick with T1 rigs on your frigates.


I T2 rig some of my ships....

-Liang

Dark Voynix
Gallente
Garoun Investment Bank
Posted - 2010.10.28 06:28:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Dark Voynix on 28/10/2010 06:34:52
Consider several things.

T1 salvages and very, very, very easy to collect. T2 salvages are hard to collect ( faction pirate ship salvage ). then you have also to "invent" T2 bpc's, so means you need a pos. Last but n ot least, the "demand & offer" rule. If there are very few t2 salvages for trimarks, but almost anybody want this rig, the price raise. Other T2 rigs with much lower demand ( maybe because they are not good at other, or maybe because they have a much more situational usage) usually require different T2 salvage and so they price drop.

You consider those prices unrealistic, and probably they are, but consider that people buy faction ships at huge prices, put them faction modules that cost several hundreds of millions ( if not more). In this situation the cost of t2 rigs don't change anything.

So if you are fitting t1 ships or even t2 with standard fitting, then look to t1 rigs, if you are fitting an uber pimped faction frigate, then the T2 cost is anyway irrelevant to the cost of the ship/fitting.

Edit: Laugh? why should we have laugh ? You made a perfectly legitimate question. Much more than half of the topics made everyday that ask always the same things.

Grumpy punk
Stir Crazy Research and Manufacturing
Posted - 2010.10.28 08:12:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: MuerteDio
Ok..so don't laugh....well you can laugh if you want but some sage input from some of the more knowledgable players is what I am seeking. I can handle flames.

Anyway...I've just gotten around to being able to put on T2 rigs. Specifically t2 armor rigs in the way of the small Trimark Armor pump. I figure it would be a nice little touch for my frigates.

So I get my hauler with the intent of grabbing a shipment only to see the prices are insane. Just one of the T2 rigs costs (in the cheapest I was able to find it in Jita) 52 or so million isk. That costs more then seven times what I normally spend on a fully fitted out Frigate.

W...t...f?

So now that I have checked Dodixie (no help) and Eve Metrics (wtf?) I have to ask....


Who buys these things? And what do they fit them on? And why? I'm confused and beseech those with knowledge to enlighten this poor noob.

~M

P.S. Fly Safe.


Wait till you reach T2 Large Armor Rigs, the real fun is there. A single T2 Nanobot Accelerator or Auxiliary Nano Pump cost as much as a faction battleship(~700 mil). And those don't work on capital modules. You'd have to be the uberpimp to purchase these rigs.

Dr Fighter
Posted - 2010.10.28 08:20:00 - [8]
 

Trimarks is a perfect example of why the sizing of rigs was a bad idea when they require the same parts as the larger sizes.

Every supercap in the game (practicly) has T2 extender rigs or T2 Trimarks. This demand for these types of rigs makes the components raise in price the rarest being the most expensive. Problem is that if a large rig gets to the piont wheres its 300 mil but only reqiures 15 of the rarest parts, a small rig that only needs a few must still pay that same premium price.

Due to the rig trade being completly down to the playare and the salvaging drop rates of the rarest compentents of these popular rigs low, the knock on effect from large to small rig sizes doesnt scale with their average cost.

If ccp wanted frigates to have affordable rigs of all types the drop rates, or the re****ents would need to change on the rigs themselfs.

Since this system is already in place and the markets flowing Capital ships requiring an new XL size while a good idea from the start, wouldnt be now, only the dorp rates/re****ents can really make T2 frig rigs cheaper. I doubt that will happen.

So find some other T2 rigs which do a similar job, t2 resistance rigs might be a half decent alternative in some cases.

Siigari Kitawa
Gallente
Perditus Peregrinus
Posted - 2010.10.28 08:21:00 - [9]
 

The proper balance of tech 2 rigs on a ship are the perfect finishing touch on any fit. They generally use a lot of calibration though, so unless you're using something like Trimarks, expect to be squeezing them in.

fivetide humidyear
Gallente
Fool Mental Junket
Posted - 2010.10.28 08:55:00 - [10]
 

some tech 2 rigs are worth it, the ones that spring to mind are the t2 missile rigs such as rigors and catalysts.

Lutz Major
Posted - 2010.10.28 08:59:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Dr Fighter
Trimarks is a perfect example of why the sizing of rigs was a bad idea when they require the same parts as the larger sizes.
Huh? So you want different components for different sizes? Your big-tower desktop has a CPU and RAMs installed and your tiny laptop a banana and cookies?

Apart from that, most others have already answered the question: A successful invention chance is about 50% (no need for a POS though - invention could be done at any station!), the components are very expansive, the movement is not so great, and and and...

TaluxA
Posted - 2010.10.28 09:45:00 - [12]
 

T2 small shield and damage rigs are about 11 mil so they're worth considering for a faction frigate.

Armor rigs always have been stupidly expensive.

Kendon Riddick
Posted - 2010.10.28 09:48:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Kendon riddick on 28/10/2010 09:52:05
Originally by: Lutz Major
Originally by: Dr Fighter
Trimarks is a perfect example ofHuh? So you want different components for different sizes? Your big-tower desktop has a CPU and RAMs installed and your tiny laptop a banana and cookies?




bad analogy, laptops do have cheaper/slower parts behind cutting edge desktops and servers.

Lutz Major
Posted - 2010.10.28 09:55:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Kendon riddick
Edited by: Kendon riddick on 28/10/2010 09:52:05
Originally by: Lutz Major
Originally by: Dr Fighter
Trimarks is a perfect example ofHuh? So you want different components for different sizes? Your big-tower desktop has a CPU and RAMs installed and your tiny laptop a banana and cookies?




bad analogy, laptops do have cheaper/slower parts behind cutting edge desktops and servers.


Nope, from my point of view Mr. Fighter wanted the smaller rigs to have other - cheaper - components! Hence the remark on the 'cutting edge' desktop with a CPU (the large rig) and the tiny laptop (small rig).

Buzz Killingdon
Posted - 2010.10.28 15:35:00 - [15]
 

I use T2 resist rigs on my Tengu.

They were 18 mil for the Kinetic and Exp, and 30 mil for the EM (Perfect example of supply and demand)

omgfreemoniez
Posted - 2010.10.28 16:06:00 - [16]
 

T2 Ambits are nice on your Cynabal and/or Vagabond.

Wacktopia
Sicarius.
Legion of The Damned.
Posted - 2010.10.28 18:35:00 - [17]
 

Some T2 rigs are quite affordable. Take a look at medium T2 anti EM shield ughrigs for example; about 11-12 mil. Pretty good price to help plug those em holes.

Arthur Frayn
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.10.29 03:34:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Also to the op: why on earth do you need an extra 5% performance on a frigate? It's not even worth it on a battleship. Stick with T1 rigs on your frigates.


I T2 rig some of my ships....

-Liang


That's because you're ridiculous. But you didn't say "I T2 rig some of my frigates...", now did you?

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.10.29 04:35:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Arthur Frayn
That's because you're ridiculous. But you didn't say "I T2 rig some of my frigates...", now did you?


I have multiple T2 rigged frigates. T2 frigate rigs are cheap.

-Liang

Arthur Frayn
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.10.29 04:47:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
That's because you're ridiculous. But you didn't say "I T2 rig some of my frigates...", now did you?


I have multiple T2 rigged frigates. T2 frigate rigs are cheap.

-Liang


You sir, have just comfirmed my previous accusation. Shocked

MuerteDio
Posted - 2010.10.29 05:07:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Also to the op: why on earth do you need an extra 5% performance on a frigate? It's not even worth it on a battleship. Stick with T1 rigs on your frigates.


Because its 5%. I saw it as an improvement, and thought that if the price increase was appropriate I would grab it. Then Eve smacked me with that curve ball. In the head.

You would think I would be used to them by now.

However with the understanding now that the parts used to make Small Trimarks are the same as large, as well as the rarity of the parts, it now makes perfect sense why they are so expensive.

Thank you all for your thoughts and input. Fly Safe.

~M

Kokura Nin
Posted - 2010.10.29 06:40:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
That's because you're ridiculous. But you didn't say "I T2 rig some of my frigates...", now did you?


I have multiple T2 rigged frigates. T2 frigate rigs are cheap.

-Liang


You sir, have just comfirmed my previous accusation. Shocked

Anything but tanking mods and certain speedmods are pretty much inexpensive to make in size S. Its just that crap demand makes em rare on the market. Invention costs are pretty much all on those select T2 size S rigs. Check T1 rig comps, if it doesnt use armor plates, cap consoles, trit bars its cheap.


Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2010.10.29 10:55:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Edited by: Arthur Frayn on 28/10/2010 05:36:38
T2 rigs are so expensive because T2 salvage is so rare. I think you can get T2 salvage parts from wrecks of T2 ships and also from wrecks of faction/deadspace/officer spawns in 0.0.

People who fly dreadnoughts, supercarriers and titans buy them. They're not really cost-effective on anything else.


And missioning BS of course.

Vladimir Norkoff
Income Redistribution Service
Posted - 2010.10.29 11:10:00 - [24]
 

Yeah, T2 rig prices suck. Easy solution though. Make Magnetometric sites worthwhile by dropping small amounts of T2 salvage instead of T1 crap. Suddenly you solve two problems, Mag sites stop being a complete waste of time, and T2 rigs will become more reasonably priced.


AstarothPrime
Posted - 2010.10.29 11:26:00 - [25]
 

I slapped T2 em hardener shield rig on my dramiel... and that only because its kinda cheap (compared to ship costs)... I wouldnt even think about T2 rigging any T2 frigate, let alone T1...

I.

sliver 0xD
exiles.
Posted - 2010.10.29 11:36:00 - [26]
 

the problem is in the intact armor plates. they are verry rare and wanted.

the intact armor plates go into the large trimark t2. this mod needs about 18 of em.
the large t2 trimark goes on the mothership and the titan.



Lady Spank
Amarr
In Praise Of Shadows
Posted - 2010.10.29 12:15:00 - [27]
 

I have a bunch of small TII burst, ambit and collision rigs which I got for 4-6m each or something like that. Some rigs have a high cost, others don't. Same as any other modules on the market.

Solomar Espersei
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
Posted - 2010.10.29 13:32:00 - [28]
 

Yeah, as many posters have pointed out, some of them are certainly worth it. You simply have to check the prices at a major hub. Last time I checked, a T2 Burst rig for ACs or Arty was about 1/3rd the price of a faction gyro. A high sec PVE pilot might really enjoy the extra DPS.

Mavnas
Posted - 2010.10.29 15:32:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Vladimir Norkoff
Yeah, T2 rig prices suck. Easy solution though. Make Magnetometric sites worthwhile by dropping small amounts of T2 salvage instead of T1 crap. Suddenly you solve two problems, Mag sites stop being a complete waste of time, and T2 rigs will become more reasonably priced.


They do already. It's just kind of rare. I pulled over 25m in T2 salvage from a high sec mag site last night.

Xanaan Zenithdul
Posted - 2010.10.30 21:55:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: Xanaan Zenithdul on 30/10/2010 21:57:28
Originally by: MuerteDio
Ok..so don't laugh....well you can laugh if you want but some sage input from some of the more knowledgable players is what I am seeking. I can handle flames.

Anyway...I've just gotten around to being able to put on T2 rigs. Specifically t2 armor rigs in the way of the small Trimark Armor pump. I figure it would be a nice little touch for my frigates.

So I get my hauler with the intent of grabbing a shipment only to see the prices are insane. Just one of the T2 rigs costs (in the cheapest I was able to find it in Jita) 52 or so million isk. That costs more then seven times what I normally spend on a fully fitted out Frigate.

W...t...f?

So now that I have checked Dodixie (no help) and Eve Metrics (wtf?) I have to ask....


Who buys these things? And what do they fit them on? And why? I'm confused and beseech those with knowledge to enlighten this poor noob.

~M

P.S. Fly Safe.
So you haven't played EVE before nanonerf?

Back in days typical inty fit had t1 polycarbs, deadspace mwd and other hotness, usually they were like 100-150 M ISK. Someones did even put t2 polycarbs on them, ship costing over 500 M ISK but going like over 10k so it pretty much never died.

In those days you had to use large rigs on frigs, and they did cost from 10 M ISK up to nearly 100 M depending on salvage prices.

EDIT: And yes, many 0.0 inty pilots had HG Snakes in their head...


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