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blankseplocked Enemy Stealth Bombers in a mining system. A becomming curse.
 
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Aessoroz
Nohbdy.
Posted - 2010.09.30 16:38:00 - [151]
 

Better yet, I'll agree for for a timed cloak only if stealth bombers get their EHP increased to 20k minimum from just 1k.

Caldari Citizen20090217
Posted - 2010.09.30 16:38:00 - [152]
 

Cloak = pvp flag. Twisted Evil

/sits back and grabs popcorn

BlondieBC
Minmatar
Galactic Exploration and Missions
Posted - 2010.09.30 16:40:00 - [153]
 

Originally by: Chirzo Mundael
Originally by: Emperor Cheney
Area and supply denial is the one of the original purposes of submarine warfare.

You can find a submarine, but not a AFK cloaked SB.

I have been in tese situations myself, annoying, but i adapted and i don't complain about it.


This is technically true, but somewhat misleading. A modern attack submarine, that intentionally stays away from targets is almost impossible to find.
I War World II, the germans had a couple of re-fueling submarines, that hid from the allies. They were never found dispite great effort and partial breaking of the code. They hid near greenland, and only came up at nite, if no allied ships were around.
Generally Speaking, Submarines are only "findable" when actually hunting targets.
The thing that is overpowered compared to RL is Local. Local would be equivalent of a device that would tell you the exact number of submarine withing 20 miles, the hull number, and the name of the captain. Local is also the equivalent of a device on a sub that tells the player the number of ships, and hull numbers of all surface ship within 20 miles. If we want to make more like RL sub warfare, local is what has to go first.
The problem with null sec is not that the risk is too high, but that the nullsec/high sec reward ratio is too low. If the mineral content of null sec only ore was double or triple, a lot of these complaints would go away, IMO.



Selling Slave
Posted - 2010.09.30 16:40:00 - [154]
 

Edited by: Selling Slave on 30/09/2010 16:41:09
Originally by: Caldari Citizen20090217
Cloak = pvp flag. Twisted Evil

/sits back and grabs popcorn


Did you mean f a g? an added the L so it would post?

Kiran
Minmatar
Knights of Azrael
Anti-Social Outcast
Posted - 2010.09.30 16:44:00 - [155]
 

You could keep local but just make it like wormhole local where you only appear if you talk. I have had some very funny conversations with cloaked scouts from an enemy alliance in the past.

But why not just make sure your hulks can tank the damage of the stealth bomber ?
Use a Orca to give combat bonus instead of mining imagine a SB dropping a bomb on your little hulks only to see it do not even half damage due to the warfare link Shield Harmonization being active. You can make a very effective tank this way. (Checked it in efit when my last corp was in wormhole space, needed a way to tank the sleepers.)

Use drones to kill him. Place cans around the belt with large tech 2 warp disruption bubbles. Get him tangled up in the roids your mining. Make bookmarks so you wont get caught in them. Or even better get some of your corp to fly defense?
I guess you never did see the you tube vid of the pvp hulk ?
And to prove it can be done here is the you tube link pvp hulk
But that would mean actually playing with other people in game.

Terminal Insanity
Minmatar
Convex Enterprises
Posted - 2010.09.30 16:45:00 - [156]
 

Originally by: Venkul Mul
They have been nerfed, don't you remember?


i got 150 MILLION units of tritanium from 2 hauler spawns.
Nerfed?

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2010.09.30 16:46:00 - [157]
 

Originally by: Caldari Citizen20090217
Cloak = pvp flag. Twisted Evil

/sits back and grabs popcorn
Nah.

AFK Father
AFK Chartered System Management
Posted - 2010.09.30 16:49:00 - [158]
 

Originally by: AFK Cloaker



I know things have been bad between us, but I want to make amends. You can talk to me son.

Diomedes Calypso
Aetolian Armada
Posted - 2010.09.30 17:07:00 - [159]
 

Originally by: Sjugar
Originally by: Nuela
Solution to problem.

Get rid of local.

A stealth bomber AFK would then do nothing to stop operations.
So, is the unprobable T3 in a safespot the wormhole equivalent to the AFK cloaker?


So.. pretty much always assume that your ship has no crew or can warp light years but can't have a scanner operate withou you clicking incessantly and even there not even know if a ship is anywhere around if its cloaked?

Great, then the miners and ratters would move more and more to high sec ... less targets.

Without Local we'd have a lot less idea of who we were playing the game with.. less chance to know our competion, even meet allies seeing them in local each night or convoing them for cooperation. All the planets, stations, and gates look the same....what makes jumping around interesting to me and makes me feel like I'm actually going places and places are different is the names in local.

I play to PVP ..even when trading its a cat and mouse game. I want interaction with other players, friend and foe .

Most of all I want more targets. I want more people in 0.0 (no concord to shoot at me because i want to pvp) . Miners and PVE'rs are good targets... don't scare them off.... give them ways to switch to pitchfork mode instead of turtling or moving to high sec. I like to cloak, but knowing that they could find me if I didn't move now and then actually make me fly my ship instead of surfing the internet on the other monitor...actualy playing the game shouldn't be much a chore...

..and to the other person who said something about my complaint meaning that all players should be logged off ater 15 minutes of inactivity? Yeah, why not.... seeing all those people in stations who aren't at their comptuer is also kida dumb ... logging back in or running over to click the keyboard a coupld times whil making dinner to preserver chat intel isn't that much of a hardship.... either your'e in the game or you're not... i'm ok with being consistent there.

Terminal Insanity
Minmatar
Convex Enterprises
Posted - 2010.09.30 17:22:00 - [160]
 

Edited by: Terminal Insanity on 30/09/2010 17:25:19
So lets see here...

1) "High security" space provides your security, so you really do not care if theres an AFK cloaker in the system.
2) In 0.0 space, you have no concord. Due to the lack of concord, you have to suddenly worry about the AFK cloaker.
3) 0.0 Space is also supposed to be player-driven.
4) There is another thread somewhere, players want to take the role of Concord in Jita.

Well, heres an idea

1) Man the **** up.
2) Create your "concord" wannabie alliance/corp/whatever.
3) Guard all these carebears in 0.0.
4) ???
5) Profit?

Edit: oh wait, sorry, i missed the part where you want to just bear in 0.0 as if it was highsec and not take any added costs OR risks. Continue moaning.

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2010.09.30 17:25:00 - [161]
 

Why are there 6 pages of HERP DERP I KNOW ABOUT U-BOATS I SAW A FILM when I posted the counter to lurking bombers 3 pages ago. It's not hard! It's easy! Stop talking *******s about ASW because internet spaceships are not RL submarines OK?

Mamba Lev
BricK sQuAD.
Posted - 2010.09.30 17:38:00 - [162]
 

Originally by: kasiloth
BAWWWWW

Princess Jodi
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.09.30 17:44:00 - [163]
 

Originally by: Malcanis
I posted the counter to lurking bombers 3 pages ago. It's not hard! It's easy!


As did I, Malcanis. But please realize that most of these threads are started by people who don't want a SOLUTION, but rather want a CHANGE that gives them perfectly safe mining grounds.

Dred Control
Posted - 2010.09.30 17:58:00 - [164]
 

If SB are now submarines, then give us the equivalent of sonar and depth charges to seek and destroy them, please.

Sealiah
Minmatar
Coffee Lovers Brewing Club
Care Factor
Posted - 2010.09.30 18:05:00 - [165]
 

Make cloaks burn fuel - isotopes, stront or something in a qunatity allowing a ship to stay constantly cloaked for maybe 60 minutes with a big hold, for stealth-ships like recons, SB make it last up to maybe 3 hours, for black ops make it up to 6 hours of cloak without refuel.

Cloaks are indetectible - still true.
Cloakers can make great ops, runs, etc based on their cloaking devices almost without limit - true
Cloakers can't afk-cloak the entire days or months just to ruin other peoples experiance - true!

Ray Gunne
Posted - 2010.09.30 18:05:00 - [166]
 

Originally by: Razor Vision

The ones running the markets are usually involved in some way with industrialists.



If no one looses ships and modules then noone would buy them, PVPers create the demand that the industrials supply.

Quote:

Your counter method involving the miner to purchase a second account to counter the guy who already has two accounts is exactly what CCP would want, more money. so you're suggestion is spend RL money to counter an ingame mechanic? Not very strategic. "solve all your problems by spending money on it." brilliant, brilliant. really.


Use a friend then, mine in a group with tanks and combat drones, lay a trap, but two accounts to counter two accounts doesn't seem unbalanced to me.

Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
Posted - 2010.09.30 18:08:00 - [167]
 

Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro
Originally by: Razor Vision
Without miners there would be no materials. Without materials there would be no way to build ships or modules.


You appear to be forgetting the existence of loot drops, hauler spawns and drone alloys (throughout the drone regions and in missions in highsec).

I would wager that these sources combined account for a greater share of mineral production than mining, and far more people contribute towards them (especially in the drone regions, where people effectively mine with their guns).



They have been nerfed, don't you remember?


I know the composition of some of the drone alloys has changed, and I think meta 0 loot might have been removed from some locations, but that still leaves an awful lot of stuff that just gets melted down, not to mention the hauler spawns. Would you care to elaborate if I've missed anything significant?

Ray Gunne
Posted - 2010.09.30 18:12:00 - [168]
 

Actually thinking about it then maybe local should change in 0.0 to behave like wormhole space in that unless someone broadcasts they do not show up. This would make 0.0 so much more a team dynamic and prices would go up due to lower supply benefiting those that make the effort to harvest and exploit 0.0 resources.

baltec1
Posted - 2010.09.30 18:14:00 - [169]
 

I am a bomber Pilot. I shall be visiting the OP's system soon.

Feilamya
Pain Elemental
Posted - 2010.09.30 18:59:00 - [170]
 

If stealth bombers could be a becomming curse, they would be useful for something...

Lord Xantoh
Posted - 2010.09.30 19:29:00 - [171]
 

Edited by: Lord Xantoh on 30/09/2010 19:32:33
Originally by: kasiloth
If anyone of u has the same problem and has something better to propose please do it here.



Sorry mate but if you can't use just a little imagination to play this game to your own advantage and outsmart your enemies then yes, you are a lazy carebear...

To give you the benefit of a doubt, here are some directions for you:
- Jump clones
- Use other activities until the threat has retired (if you choose to spin your ship on station, your problem)
- Form a small gang escorting your mining op with cruisers using drones and sweep the area until the threat uncloaks. The nice part is - if he is really AFK - he won't see what hit him... ;)

There are so many ways to counter this type of invisible threats, you just need to think out of your box.

LX

Mr Kidd
Posted - 2010.09.30 20:19:00 - [172]
 

Edited by: Mr Kidd on 30/09/2010 20:24:00
From what I've seen in this thread the argument is cloaked ships should not be able to cloak forever and go afk. Why?

Lets see, the reasons so far are:

1) It's unfair.
2).........there is no #2 see #1.

Why is it unfair?

The answer? Because apparently single afk cloakers have the magical ability to bring alliances to their knees.

Why?

The answer? Because it's a danger to those in that system and noone wants to undock.

Seriously, is that a legitimate reason? Of course not. I have a solution, however. There is a place for those of you too afraid of cloakers in your nullsec system. It's called Empire. Go there. Be safe. Then you can mine, rat, mission to your heart's content without fear of being shot at.

I'm not really a pvper but, dayam, this makes me want to come into nullsec and take over.

Grohalmatar
The Tuskers
Posted - 2010.09.30 20:36:00 - [173]
 

If he is just sitting cloaked then what is the big deal? He can't hurt you cloaked. If he de-cloaks, pop and pod. Then your system is safe.

Maybe i'm ignorant, but when people complain about afk cloakers, I always get suspicious that what they are really complaining about is the strain said cloakers place on their macro bots.

flummox
Posted - 2010.09.30 21:04:00 - [174]
 

Originally by: Lillith Starfire
Cloak = safe.


you are only half correct there. Cloak = Safe; Cloak = No Threat.

the ONLY way a cloaker is not a threat is if they are working with a fleet. if you only see one person, then there is no fleet.

also, cloaks are supposed [designed] to make the ship safe. that's what they do. an AFK Cloaker is no more a threat than a pitbull in China, when i reside in the US.

once again: playing the game wrong, or playing the wrong game...

Kalain ap'Sulen
Dirt Nap Squad
Dirt Nap Squad.
Posted - 2010.09.30 21:14:00 - [175]
 

Originally by: kasiloth
I got a ten accounts mining fleet


Krohnan?

MatrixSkye Mk2
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.09.30 21:53:00 - [176]
 

Originally by: Caldari Citizen20090217
Cloak = pvp flag. Twisted Evil

/sits back and grabs popcorn
This. So-called "PVPers" defend this ship because:

a) It allows them to PVP to virtually ZERO risk to themselves.

b) Forces everyone (but themselves) to remain active and full alert, evetually wearing them down.

Players that go AFK hours and days at a time to keep systems on lockdown are akin to macro players.


Kezzle
Posted - 2010.09.30 22:50:00 - [177]
 

Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2
Originally by: Caldari Citizen20090217
Cloak = pvp flag. Twisted Evil

/sits back and grabs popcorn
This. So-called "PVPers" defend this ship because:

a) It allows them to PVP to virtually ZERO risk to themselves.

b) Forces everyone (but themselves) to remain active and full alert, evetually wearing them down.

Players that go AFK hours and days at a time to keep systems on lockdown are akin to macro players.



What, just like Original Posters with 10 multiboxed accounts all mining semi-AFK (oo look! being generous) who can't even be bothered to bring some fight to the equation? Where's the difference between AFK cloaking and AFK mining? Just deal with it. If you can't deal with it, don't try and mine in nulsec.

Some minor changes to fit and operational doctrine would make the threat trivial-to-manageable.

JJ Starr
Minmatar
Ore Mongers
Posted - 2010.09.30 23:00:00 - [178]
 

Originally by: Mr Kidd

I'm not really a pvper but, dayam, this makes me want to come into nullsec and take over.


Don't take over. Grab a couple-3-4-5 pals (6-8 is a great number), make some chips n dip, a couple cool ones, and set up shop on busy jump bridges...in Stealth Bombers of course.

After you blow up some **** generating tears like this thread OP...the offended parties might even respond sluggishly. Bomb a couple of them then slip out of system to another bridge or go take a well deserved break making sure you stay logged on but cloaked for fine fine sippable lickable whine Cool

MatrixSkye Mk2
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.09.30 23:07:00 - [179]
 

Originally by: Kezzle
Originally by: MatrixSkye Mk2
Originally by: Caldari Citizen20090217
Cloak = pvp flag. Twisted Evil

/sits back and grabs popcorn
This. So-called "PVPers" defend this ship because:

a) It allows them to PVP to virtually ZERO risk to themselves.

b) Forces everyone (but themselves) to remain active and full alert, evetually wearing them down.

Players that go AFK hours and days at a time to keep systems on lockdown are akin to macro players.



What, just like Original Posters with 10 multiboxed accounts all mining semi-AFK (oo look! being generous) who can't even be bothered to bring some fight to the equation? Where's the difference between AFK cloaking and AFK mining? Just deal with it. If you can't deal with it, don't try and mine in nulsec.

Some minor changes to fit and operational doctrine would make the threat trivial-to-manageable.
Multimboxing =! AFK-playing

Nice try, though.


Lianari Estrosa
Posted - 2010.09.30 23:12:00 - [180]
 

Epic Fail, Please more tears, the carebare tears fuel my cloak.


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