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blankseplocked Kronos does the future actually hold a viable missionsetup?
 
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NoNah
Posted - 2010.09.16 10:49:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Kail Storm
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Edited by: Liang Nuren on 16/09/2010 02:16:34
Originally by: Caius Severus
Edit - Also Laughing at 1-1.2kdps being considered 'rather low' I doubt there are more than a handful of ships that can get to that figure under any circumstances, let alone in a viable mission fit.


I'm seeing 1248 DPS out of my Vargur, and 1290 DPS out of my Golem. You can get 1477 DPS out of a Mach, 1134 out of a Domi, and 988 out of a Tengu. And yes, those are all viable mission fits.

-Liang

Ed: In case anyone's wondering, I'm down to having a Golem, CNR, Tengu, and Vargur currently fit for "serious" mission running.


What fit do you use on the 998 DPS Tengu?
And also please show me your 1134dps missioning Domi Fit. If its actually viable I need to make it my 2nd toons asap.


Not having any idea what Liang actually had in mind here's how I'd probably setup my Tengu. As mentioned havn't flown with the domi in a bit so I won't really spend the effort on getting the details sorted, but the fundamentals will work.

tengu(You could opt for a t2 bay loading accelerator and t1 flares, which would put you at 1005 dps but with slightly worse application.(Oh, and I would've gone with a web if it wasn't for A) Hams and B) the sadness of current missile formula)

Dominix Drawing blanks here. I'm gonna go ahead and guess his figure was a typo. I even suspect the Tengu dps was.

As for the 1-1.2k dps figures, it's average to all the other marauders but with huge drawbacks in applied damage not only because of range and tracking but because of damagetypes. Making the kronos a droneboat would mean nothing other than removing a turret and it's highslot and giving it more drone bay and it's drone bonus - probably instead of the web bonus. Most likely also removing lows for mids. Marauders doesn't get more damage than their best tech 1 bs counterpart, just more utility and fitting room allowing you to squeeze out a tad more.(You could argue it'd get a 100% drone damage bonus and a bandwidth of 62.5 but that'd make it even more useless.

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2010.09.16 10:58:00 - [32]
 

the domi looks rightish, although I like something with a bit more cap stability (or cap injector)

as for the tengu this is what I got, 1052 dps with 5% implants. the mids are kinda randomly thrown together, fit to taste/wallet.

[Tengu, Hams]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Pithi B-Type Small Shield Booster
Invulnerability Field II
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Cap Recharger II
Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner

Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile

Medium Bay Loading Accelerator II
Medium Hydraulic Bay Thrusters I

Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir
Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay
Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst


Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.09.16 17:04:00 - [33]
 

Edited by: Liang Nuren on 16/09/2010 17:06:17
Originally by: Kail Storm

What fit do you use on the 998 DPS Tengu?
And also please show me your 1134dps missioning Domi Fit. If its actually viable I need to make it my 2nd toons asap.



The Tengu was 988, and was roughly what NoNah showed, except that it had AB+Web and no ACR. There's places that you can use that fit very very well - for instance any mission where you expect all the rats to be within 45km. I personally strongly prefer the HML Tengu for general use, but I wouldn't laugh if someone told me they had both a HML and HAM Tengu. Of course, everywhere that I'd personally use a HAM Tengu, I use a Golem instead (because it's just flat better).

The Domi is a 425mm Accelerator II shield tank monster.

-Liang

Ed: It's worth noting that it wasn't really fair to use "No Reload DPS" on the Tengu. It reloads so often that it will frequently reload multiple times inside the same room, while the other ships mentioned can usually reload between rooms.

Kail Storm
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.09.16 21:55:00 - [34]
 

In most cases ive found the 600 DPS HML Tengu wipes the floor with the 900 DPS HamGu, Travel time is a huge factor and at 45km-55km where alot of BS`s like to be you have to use Javs which cut your DPS to 700ish and has worse tracking for smaller ships.

But the biggest advantage is the transition betwen 1 spawn and another which usually depending on mission is 80km+, HMLGu can apply 100% DMG all the way from te new Spawn where as the Ham needs time to approach etc and I find that it cuts my times in Half making the longer missions half of 900 DPS so 450 overall DPS, also the Hams Shoot so damned fast that you reload way more often.

The role where the Hamgu is great is Support/Secondary SHip. IE Domi primary or CNR or anything with drones to kill small stuff preferably Nightmare Pally etc while the Hamgu melts the BS`s in Orbit and its tank is so strong when you dual box you dont have to worry much/if at all. i actually will load FOF`s Orbit the spawns and then use my primary ship and its suprising how well it does.

Also the 1200 DPS Domi seems way to steep DMG wise, and I wonder why not use the Kronos if its a 425mm setup.

PS that was the Domi I said could be OP`d that you argued a Shield tank doesnt work BTW Wink had to get that in there for good measure

NoNah
Posted - 2010.09.16 22:01:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Kail Storm
In most cases ive found the 600 DPS HML Tengu wipes the floor with the 900 DPS HamGu, Travel time is a huge factor and at 45km-55km where alot of BS`s like to be you have to use Javs which cut your DPS to 700ish and has worse tracking for smaller ships.

But the biggest advantage is the transition betwen 1 spawn and another which usually depending on mission is 80km+, HMLGu can apply 100% DMG all the way from te new Spawn where as the Ham needs time to approach etc and I find that it cuts my times in Half making the longer missions half of 900 DPS so 450 overall DPS, also the Hams Shoot so damned fast that you reload way more often.

The role where the Hamgu is great is Support/Secondary SHip. IE Domi primary or CNR or anything with drones to kill small stuff preferably Nightmare Pally etc while the Hamgu melts the BS`s in Orbit and its tank is so strong when you dual box you dont have to worry much/if at all. i actually will load FOF`s Orbit the spawns and then use my primary ship and its suprising how well it does.

Also the 1200 DPS Domi seems way to steep DMG wise, and I wonder why not use the Kronos if its a 425mm setup.

PS that was the Domi I said could be OP`d that you argued a Shield tank doesnt work BTW Wink had to get that in there for good measure


Because the Kronos is crap. It does less damage than the domi, is much more fragile to any form of ewar and is all in all just a waste of isk for pve.

The ham tengu is poor not only because of it's range and thus traveltime(other ships get this aswell such as the golem and has no issue what so ever) but because it can't handle small ships very well, nor can it handle large ships very well(once again, compare it to the golem or CNR that are very similiar otherwise). Hence using it as a secondary ship doesn't make any real sense as having a golem there would be much better.

I honestly have no idea what you tried to say with that last sentence.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.09.16 22:19:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Kail Storm
PS that was the Domi I said could be OP`d that you argued a Shield tank doesnt work BTW Wink had to get that in there for good measure


IIRC that conversation was about PVP, genius. :)

-Liang

Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2010.09.16 23:33:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Kail Storm
PS that was the Domi I said could be OP`d that you argued a Shield tank doesnt work BTW Wink had to get that in there for good measure


IIRC that conversation was about PVP, genius. :)

-Liang
It was, kail's a derp :P

Kail Storm
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.09.17 01:30:00 - [38]
 

Twas a joke...Hence the wink...I wasnt hitting on you Liang, If I want Boobs Ill get a girl :)P

Once again a joke not being mean.

But I am concerned about Camb`s attraction to you, he seems to want to be your fluffer.

Cambarus
Malicious Destruction
War Against the Manifest
Posted - 2010.09.17 01:55:00 - [39]
 

Originally by: Kail Storm
Twas a joke...Hence the wink...I wasnt hitting on you Liang, If I want Boobs Ill get a girl :)P

Once again a joke not being mean.

But I am concerned about Camb`s attraction to you, he seems to want to be your fluffer.
I lolled a bit when I read this :D but just for the record, I don't even look at the person's name that I quote unless I'm arguing with them (and even then, as of right now you're the only one whose name I remember, there were those 2 matari derps and that one guy who wanted faction drones on his underskilled gila, but that's about all I remember :D )

Caius Severus
Galaxy Punks
Dead Terrorists
Posted - 2010.09.17 02:21:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Liang Nuren
I'm seeing 1248 DPS out of my Vargur, and 1290 DPS out of my Golem. You can get 1477 DPS out of a Mach, 1134 out of a Domi, and 988 out of a Tengu. And yes, those are all viable mission fits.


I am curious - do you run missions using one character? Also, I assume you are including drones in the damage figures above - which drones are you using?




NoNah
Posted - 2010.09.17 02:25:00 - [41]
 

Originally by: Caius Severus
Originally by: Liang Nuren
I'm seeing 1248 DPS out of my Vargur, and 1290 DPS out of my Golem. You can get 1477 DPS out of a Mach, 1134 out of a Domi, and 988 out of a Tengu. And yes, those are all viable mission fits.


I am curious - do you run missions using one character? Also, I assume you are including drones in the damage figures above - which drones are you using?



I do, using all of the above ships in similiar setups. If using multiple characters they're in multiple missions. Missileships in the same pocket never works out well, turretships doesn't lose as much but the double traveltime still hurts it.
sentries for machariel, cnr and domi(duh)
none for tengu
medium/light for golem

Elsa Nietzsche
Posted - 2010.09.17 02:55:00 - [42]
 

i come to these threads in hopes of finding a good setup for my kronos. well, one that doesn't involve salvagers and cargo expanders.

i am disapoint

Kail Storm
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.09.17 03:02:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Cambarus
Originally by: Kail Storm
Twas a joke...Hence the wink...I wasnt hitting on you Liang, If I want Boobs Ill get a girl :)P

Once again a joke not being mean.

But I am concerned about Camb`s attraction to you, he seems to want to be your fluffer.
I lolled a bit when I read this :D but just for the record, I don't even look at the person's name that I quote unless I'm arguing with them (and even then, as of right now you're the only one whose name I remember, there were those 2 matari derps and that one guy who wanted faction drones on his underskilled gila, but that's about all I remember :D )


I was trying to lighten things up, these arguments get heated and can get nasty but in the end the Forum posters who actually respond to thoughts are usually the cream of eve and all have there own reasons for there arguments...Also I learned long ago you cant get mad at Typing sincethere is no Tone or inflection to hear what the person is saying.

Im glad you Lol`d it was meant to be a joke.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2010.09.17 03:12:00 - [44]
 

Originally by: Kail Storm
...


Sometimes you're less of a derp than other times. Believe it or not, I like you these days. ;-)

-Liang

Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
Posted - 2010.09.17 03:47:00 - [45]
 

Originally by: Elsa Nietzsche
i come to these threads in hopes of finding a good setup for my kronos. well, one that doesn't involve salvagers and cargo expanders.

i am disapoint


me too

/emo

Kail Storm
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.09.18 02:20:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Kail Storm
...


Sometimes you're less of a derp than other times. Believe it or not, I like you these days. ;-)

-Liang


Never disliked you, ever or Camb, Its Healthy for eve to have people who are involved enough and care about **** in game, even when they disagree.

Actually esp when they disagree, Threadnoughts brought about alot of massive and needed changes in EVE, so without Flames or Drunken Rambling Wink
Or Anal Retentive Responses like Camb gives Wink, or my Emo responses, Hybrids will never get fixed but just by them seeing all the writing and responses they see the player base recognizing they need fixing.

Without conflict Eve is $h!t, in game or on forums.

Neurotica Zeshi
Gallente
Worst Case Scenario.
Posted - 2010.09.18 05:37:00 - [47]
 

[Kronos, neutrons null]
Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Republic Fleet Tracking Enhancer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer

Federation Navy Tracking Computer, Optimal Range
Core X-Type 100MN MicroWarpdrive
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Null L
Small Tractor Beam I
Small Tractor Beam I
Salvager II

Large Hybrid Burst Aerator II
Large Hybrid Locus Coordinator I


Hammerhead II x5

I still dont see blasters being that viable with their range and the travel time needed. But this was the best i could come up with that i was happy with.

1236 dps with 2 5 % damage implants nad 5 Hammerhead II's. With a 16 km optimal and 26 km Falloff

el Sabor
Posted - 2010.09.18 11:32:00 - [48]
 

Edited by: el Sabor on 18/09/2010 11:43:10
When I'm done picking up a few faction bits and getting the last couple of skills my rail kronos will just sc**** 1000 DPS with a pair of +3% implants. That's EFT DPS so of course drone travel time and railgun tracking will screw that up...

It's clearly the worst marauder, however, it's not the pile of crap everyone is making it out to be.

Edit: that was scr-ape.

Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
Posted - 2010.09.18 13:35:00 - [49]
 

I hear the Kronos is p. awesome in C6 Magnetar wormholes.

xenodia
Gallente
DYNAMIC INTERVENTION
ORPHANS OF EVE
Posted - 2010.09.24 19:24:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: NoNah
The Kronos has always had tons of issues, mainly with their gunrange being far to low and damage way to low. However with an MWD most of the range issues should have diminished, to some point. Sadly, the damage issue remains, it won't be any machariel, but maybe it's decent enough? What do you guys think?

[Kronos, Missions 2010]
Shadow Serpentis Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Shadow Serpentis Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Shadow Serpentis Magnetic Field Stabilizer

Gist X-Type 100MN MicroWarpdrive
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier

Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Antimatter Charge L
[empty high slot]
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Antimatter Charge L
True Sansha Large EMP Smartbomb
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Antimatter Charge L
[empty high slot]
Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Antimatter Charge L

Large Polycarbon Engine Housing II
Large Polycarbon Engine Housing II




Please let me know when youre doing missions in your kronos and using a smart bomb. Id really like to come see this first hand. And if im lucky... after your SB grazes the shields of my cloaked ship concord will leave me some nice faction mods from your ship :)


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