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Smelly Bait
Posted - 2010.09.05 22:34:00 - [1]
 

Im a player who first start playing mid 2008's. Patch after patch and following developments i dont think ccp wants us to pvp / fleet / cta anymore. What do u think? After reading an article linked in this topic im convinced that pve is accouring to ccp the way to go? What is left that is still fun for the people that like shooting real people. Im not talking about shooting artificialy red crosses on your overview. I dont see any real developments for the pvp'rs anymore in a resonable timeframe. Whats the point of undocking anymore, if u can not be botherd to bear (shoot boring red crosses that do not pose any danger), enjoy the lag fest or getting blobbed. I am talking about 0.0, not frig mania FW/ month's camping in wormholes or lowsec gankers aka selclaimed pvp'rs.

I really wonder if it is possible to get a real discussion without the trolls YARRRR!!


Ps:
Yes i do maybe quit EVE and yes u can have all my stuffs (approx 45b). The one that has the most serious answere gets all my stuffs




Jita Alt666
Posted - 2010.09.05 22:37:00 - [2]
 

This is not a troll:
The best pvp in the game is in jita and you dont have to undock. Just make a spreadsheet for a market niche - observe developments over a long period of time, understand the cycles that develop and the factors that influence those cycles and then attempt to manipulate them to your favour.

This is really what eve is about.

Nikal Vaszol
Dissonance Corp
Posted - 2010.09.05 22:37:00 - [3]
 

I think it's a good thing they added it, adds some more interesting events to 0.0 other than "Oh look a red/neut, hunt it and kill it guys", but I am looking forward to it, but i'm curious to wether the NPCs attacking will have bounties or the reward will purely be the mothership blueprint (as it's probably going to be worth alot if they are unique), but PvP will still continue in null sec, it wont purely stop because of waves of NPCs in a system, but you might need to help out if your station is camped by a NPC mothership is all :P

Stick Cult
Posted - 2010.09.05 22:44:00 - [4]
 

I do not think CCP doesn't want you to PVP. Dominion was an expansion dedicated to nullsec, it may have been terrible, but it was meant to be a nullsec revamp. Apocrypha was PVE, with wormholes, but it also provided a lot of new PVP opportunities.

The next expansion, with Invasions, is mostly PVE oriented, but it deserves it. PVE has sucked for a long time, and I bet there will be plenty of PVP opportunities in the new Invasion thing. The lag isn't intentional, obviously, CCP wants to make the game as good as possible, and they are working on lag, check out the dev blogs.

Can I have your stuffs?

Jita Alt666
Posted - 2010.09.05 22:50:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Stick Cult
I do not think CCP doesn't want you to PVP. Dominion was an expansion dedicated to nullsec, it may have been terrible, but it was meant to be a nullsec revamp. Apocrypha was PVE, with wormholes, but it also provided a lot of new PVP opportunities.

The next expansion, with Invasions, is mostly PVE oriented, but it deserves it. PVE has sucked for a long time, and I bet there will be plenty of PVP opportunities in the new Invasion thing. The lag isn't intentional, obviously, CCP wants to make the game as good as possible, and they are working on lag, check out the dev blogs.

Can I have your stuffs?


Is it only the intention that matters? CCP releases are akin to Family Guy episodes, Peter screws things up with good intentions, fails to rectify his errors fully then episode ends.

To be honest the process is about as amusing as family guy episode and CCP deserve the same amount of respect Peter Griffin does.


Bhattran
Posted - 2010.09.05 22:53:00 - [6]
 

The issue I think you are experiencing is that 00 got what it wanted, they wanted to control space and build empires, fighting eachother for fun and profit and it had to escalate to the point you have it now. You need the blobs and capitals and all the BS, IMO, to 'own' that space and to make it 'worth' it in many player's view.

I don't see CCP removing capital ships, or POS, the 'best' you could hope for is meaningful changes to make battles only work if they are happening on multiple fronts at the same time or some other mechanic that makes massing a blob to defeat the enemy not work for you, it could be that battles have to be in systems or across several systems(constellation) in order to 'win'. As is it seems to be you mass your blob to attack the enemy does the same and lag ensues, if you don't outnumber/power them you run.

The 'best' thing for CCP to do would be to find a way to fix 00, if that is even possible, or just tweak it as players 'want' to make them happy then move on to 'new space' where 00 BS can't get a foothold. The best way for that, I think, is no capital ships(maybe dread, rorqual), limited POS/sovereignty structures etc, and probably no cyno's bringing in fleets.

Betty Boom
Caldari
SPECTRE Syndicate
Posted - 2010.09.05 22:54:00 - [7]
 

Quote:
CCP: Dont want people to pvp?


This question can only come from someone newbie. PvP or better the destruction of ships is an important part of EvE and their economy. And only PvP can take enough minerials etc. out of the game. PvE is not effective in this way, coz KI is easy to understand. Players not.

Your Question is like 'Porsche doesnt want us to buy their cars?'

totally stuid and not worst of a discusion.

Jita Alt666
Posted - 2010.09.05 22:58:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Betty Boom
Quote:
CCP: Dont want people to pvp?


This question can only come from someone newbie. PvP or better the destruction of ships is an important part of EvE and their economy. And only PvP can take enough minerials etc. out of the game. PvE is not effective in this way, coz KI is easy to understand. Players not.

Your Question is like 'Porsche doesnt want us to buy their cars?'

totally stuid and not worst of a discusion.


With a name like smelly bait the op has lived up to his/her name. The bait was laid, and the trap was sprung and betty went boom.

Hari Markkus
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2010.09.06 00:27:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Betty Boom
PvP or better the destruction of ships is an important part of EvE and their economy. And only PvP can take enough minerials etc. out of the game. PvE is not effective in this way

This is incorrect. Go and read the the quarterly economic newsletters and you will see that the PvE losses greatly outnumber the PvP losses.

To find out why, re-read the original post.


Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2010.09.06 00:51:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Hari Markkus
Originally by: Betty Boom
PvP or better the destruction of ships is an important part of EvE and their economy. And only PvP can take enough minerials etc. out of the game. PvE is not effective in this way

This is incorrect. Go and read the the quarterly economic newsletters and you will see that the PvE losses greatly outnumber the PvP losses.

To find out why, re-read the original post.




Maybe reading comprehension isn't your thing either. That's not what the QEN said at all. Here:

"The most dangerous place for strategic cruisers during
the first quarter of 2010 was null security space,
with 1,514 destroyed there. Overall, 2,252 were lost
in PVP and 1,771 in PVE."


Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
Posted - 2010.09.06 01:24:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Vaal Erit

"The most dangerous place for strategic cruisers during
the first quarter of 2010 was null security space,
with 1,514 destroyed there. Overall, 2,252 were lost
in PVP and 1,771 in PVE."




Wait. People are stupid enough to lose ships in PvE? Now thats funny.


Atticus Fynch
Gallente
Posted - 2010.09.06 01:37:00 - [12]
 

I understand CCP wont allow dancing either come incarna.

Jenny Cameron
Caldari
Ordo Eventus
Inception Alliance
Posted - 2010.09.06 01:38:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Jenny Cameron on 06/09/2010 01:41:39
Originally by: Smelly Bait
i dont think ccp wants us to pvp / fleet / cta anymore. What do u think? After reading an article linked in this topic im convinced that pve is accouring to ccp the way to go?

You're serious?

EVE is by far the most PvP friendly game around. Things like wardecs, option to regain sec loss, special FW rewards, insurance, sov mechanisms, increased ease of probing down missioners, best ore/moon/PI resources placed in PvP friendly space .. what more do you want?

EVE is also one of the most boring PvE games around. Mining is bacially a *yawn* afk activity, all the missions are designed without any insipration with hardly any other challenge than "can I tank it or can't I".

So what would you think?

I'd say that the problem isn't the PvP friendly mechanics but giving people more incentives to engage in PvP. For many if not most players PvP gives no gain except some fun at quite a high cost (ships, implants).

Ryhss
Caldari
The Excecutorans
Posted - 2010.09.06 01:44:00 - [14]
 

PvP is just hard to afford on one account. I pretty much make 0 ISK in null pvp, sure I could go do anomolies or whatever, but I really don't want to. Whenever I need ISK, I have to wait for whatever asshat has war decced us, to retract it or for it to end. Then I can get my mission ship out of dry dock and mission away(which is actually fun for me, just wish there was more variety).

King Pleasure
Posted - 2010.09.06 04:12:00 - [15]
 

Edited by: King Pleasure on 06/09/2010 04:15:40
Edited by: King Pleasure on 06/09/2010 04:14:26
Edited by: King Pleasure on 06/09/2010 04:14:02
I think, more or less that you are right in saying that the focus at the moment has moved away from PVP. I think that they've invested so much over the past 3 years (It is 3, isn't it?) in walking in stations that they've reached a point where until they release it and polish it, we're not going to see a whole lot of extra PVP content. You look at the last expansion and the upcoming and they're both more or less filler expansions for what I suspect will be a very large care-bear circle-jerk. And I'm not even against the idea of walking in stations. For them it could very well mean a large increase, at least in the short term, of new players and a return of vets who are looking for an excuse to take up the pew pew again.

I suspect another off-set of the resources invested in care-bear circle-jerk 1.0 is the current rash of PVE content we're seeing. It is (I would imagine) far, far easier for them to create and push out balanced (or at least not completely backward) PVE content than it is for them to add a whole selection of new PVP activities. So I'm fairly doubtful that you'll see any major changes to the PVP scene until late next year at the earliest.

I think until they release a new kind of space (something beyond the current nullsec), or create a reason for the battlefield to become a line instead of a blob (Like effective WMD's) there won't be a major shift away from the current renter-pet, lag infested blobbing that we see today.

Of course, I could be very wrong. Maybe they'll do something interesting to incourage smaller fleet pvp over a wider area of regions. Or create a system in which alliances have to consolidate their systems instead of having a couple of hubs and a whole bunch of empty space. But I doubt it.

Until Incarna hits, we're not going to see a change to the way pvp works. Maybe we can player newb ganking in stations?

*edit, who'd have thunk the filter wouldn't pick that up. And anyway, I should also mention that I think PVP in EVE is still the most interesting. Compared to most of the other games, it doesn't try and level the playing field so your inbred second cousins sister-mother can do it.

** second edit, feel free to send me your stuff, I'll hold onto it for you. Laughing

Ma'kal
The Imperial Commonwealth
E.Y
Posted - 2010.09.06 04:38:00 - [16]
 

The one PvP thing I really want to see is them changing the bounty hunting system. That would make my Eve year, but over all I think there is a lot of PvP in Eve already. The PvE blows because it is very repetitive (mostly) so it seems fair that it gets some loving.

BTW you should keep your stuff everyone seems to come back to Eve sooner or later. But if you really want to get rid of it...

Lance Fighter
Amarr
Posted - 2010.09.06 05:03:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Ma'kal
The one PvP thing I really want to see is them changing the bounty hunting system. That would make my Eve year, but over all I think there is a lot of PvP in Eve already. The PvE blows because it is very repetitive (mostly) so it seems fair that it gets some loving.

BTW you should keep your stuff everyone seems to come back to Eve sooner or later. But if you really want to get rid of it...

I agree. WIth a 10 million bounty on my head, what i REALLY WANT is for more pepole to be trying to claim it.

Omara Otawan
Posted - 2010.09.06 05:09:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Lance Fighter

I agree. WIth a 10 million bounty on my head, what i REALLY WANT is for more pepole to be trying to claim it.


That would basically mean removing the ablility to instawarp from pods.

Or allowing bubbles in lowsec and highsec.

I'm all for it, but most players would disagree I guess.

Travarica
Posted - 2010.09.06 08:04:00 - [19]
 

Well, I also like to PVP, but to do that, you must have steady ISK income. The problem is that pretty much all such activities become boring after a while, so expanding and improving on them is a right way to go.

PVP after all is pretty much brought to perferction (by players, not CCP). Sure, there are problems, but problems exist everywhere. You don't like lag? Go to lowsec, become a pirate! You are irritated by sec status hits? War dec some corp and PVP in empire!

The point is, there is much to do in EVE Online, and just when you think you've done it all, a new expansion comes out, and players have a new toy. Sure, not everyone will like it, but the choice is always up to you!

Kestrix
Posted - 2010.09.06 09:12:00 - [20]
 

"pve is accouring to ccp the way to go?"

Have a look how many lvl 4 missions their are and how often they re-accure during an evening running missions. Coupled with the fact they are always the same! If ccp were really gunning for the PVE side of eve they'd make mining fun, PI would not be the boring low profit click fest and the missions handed out by agents would be non repetative and challenging and alot more of them than we have now. The PVE side is the second job we have to do to enjoy the PvP side of eve.

Sealiah
Minmatar
Coffee Lovers Brewing Club
Care Factor
Posted - 2010.09.06 09:14:00 - [21]
 

I expect there to not only be moms owned by pirates... But also carriers, dreads, other cool stuff. Fielding capitals to pve will be a must (finally). I see guys bringing titans and dding those rats :P

On the other hands, if the drops will be worth a lot and it will be easy to find 'infected' systems, I see tons and tons of pvp coming our way. Imagine, if there is a faction mom bpc dropped once in... Maybe weeks, first need to find an NPC mom, later you need to take it down and steal the treasure. I see the huge amounts of pvp to be able to fight the mom at all. A blueprint like that could be worth a fortune, plus maybe billion-big bounties on the pirates? I see loads of possibilities for pvp in the context of the pve.

COOP in eve - gather, kill everyone else, kill the NPC... In that order :P

RaTTuS
BIG
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2010.09.06 10:46:00 - [22]
 

if you don't think that
This followed by
This
is not PvP then
pffth
Wink

anyhoo - large fleet stuff is always being looked at ... just when it will become playable again is .....

Jarne
Caldari
Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations
Posted - 2010.09.06 11:25:00 - [23]
 

If you have started in 2008 and have 46b in your wallet it seems to me that you do not have the right notion of PVP. Just go out and destroy ships (and let yours be destroyed). You could have lots of fun with those 45b.
Is CCP favouring PVE? Don't know, but also don't care. There is still enough possibilities for PVP.

Mark Foley
Funny Men In Funny Hats
Posted - 2010.09.06 13:16:00 - [24]
 

I think that PvP is as diverse as the PvE is in Eve, and that you can work at becoming a good PvPer just as much through experience as a PvE'er would through development of a specific skillset that allows him/her to reach a golem such as a particular ship or ability.

As the OP said, lag is the greatest problem with 0.0 combat, blobs or otherwise. All I can suggest is that gang warfare either as a 0.0 roaming ideal or a lowsec piracy passtime should be developed into the seminal form of PvP within Eve Online, rather than idealing a system which simply does not work.

Also : I'd appreciate OP's stuff.

Coldman Strangelove
Caldari
Woopatang
Primary.
Posted - 2010.09.06 14:26:00 - [25]
 

Well, if you still don't agree with all our points about pvp. Then, can I at least have your stuff??? Laughing

Smelly Bait
Posted - 2010.09.06 15:13:00 - [26]
 

good input here but im looking for more

Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see
Chained Reactions
Posted - 2010.09.06 15:18:00 - [27]
 

CCP: "We introduce new awesome PvE stuff in the next expansion."
You: "Wait, you don't want us PvP?"
CCP: "No, we just add new content for the people that like to play PvE stuff from time to time"
You: "BUT I DON'T WANT TO SHOOT RED CROSSES! I HATE YOU! I WILL NEVER AGAIN UNDOCK!"

And wtf is camping in wormholes? But you may be able to explain this cause you are a "real" 0.0 PvPer aka "we wait 5h and then we screw the server with a massive blob".

Phosphorus Palladium
Posted - 2010.09.06 15:24:00 - [28]
 

Edited by: Phosphorus Palladium on 06/09/2010 15:25:45
Originally by: Smelly Bait
good input here but im looking for more


Your name! Shocked

Anyways you get an answer:

Syndicate

Go there. Alone, with you and an alt if you have two accounts or join a local corp there.
Then proceed having fun. And always remember: Big Fleets = Bad PvP. Dont do it.

Smelly Bait
Posted - 2010.09.06 21:33:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Karak Terrel

And wtf is camping in wormholes?


Setting up a pos and start camping inside the system, also shooting red crossses and loads of probing. I must admit fighting sleepers insnt the same as any other type of npc's.

Napro
Caldari
Simplistic Syndicate
Cha0s Theory
Posted - 2010.09.07 01:26:00 - [30]
 

Brilliant tactic to keep the trolls in check. Dangle 45b of probably nonexistent assets in front of em

Well I for one see thru your ruse Razz

gb2wow


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