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Shtirlec
Roving Guns Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:14:00 - [61]
 

Edited by: Shtirlec on 01/09/2010 22:17:40
I don't think the problem is in the region itself...it's that CCP hamsters are either dying or malnutritioned...or both...they must be treating those hamsters like prisoners were treated during WWII

and I'm trying to log into a system with 7 people in it in a different region...black screened at log in...WTF

Jita Alt666
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:17:00 - [62]
 

Originally by: Shtirlec
I don't think the problem is in the region itself...it's that CCP hamsters are either dying or malnutritioned...or both...they must be treating those hamsters like prisoners were treated during WWII

and I'm trying to log into a system with 7 people in it...black screened at log in...WTF


That is a fitting analogy considering who you're fighting.

HeliosGal
Caldari
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:18:00 - [63]
 

i guess ccp overloaded with thier jita node. SO this is flowing over to other areas. Ruining our gameplay ccp so are u intending to fix things outside of jita so regular players can have fun

Zagdul
Gallente
Clan Shadow Wolf
Fatal Ascension
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:20:00 - [64]
 

Edited by: Zagdul on 01/09/2010 22:20:44
@CCP Devs, despite the 24 hour notice you ask for...

If you see a spike on your servers happening in a system which has a reinforcement timer, there should be some code you can run to reboot the node and reinforce it. This seems like something pretty easy to automate.

From here, there can be a basic standings check and put everyone with similar standings on once side of the solar system in dead space upon login, and the other fleet on the other side of space.


Shtirlec
Roving Guns Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:20:00 - [65]
 

i haven't fought anybody in a long time in eve....cause of this game not being fixed...and not being able to log on to my main half a universe away from *epic fights* is annoying

Zagdul
Gallente
Clan Shadow Wolf
Fatal Ascension
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:24:00 - [66]
 

Originally by: Shtirlec
i haven't fought anybody in a long time in eve....cause of this game not being fixed...and not being able to log on to my main half a universe away from *epic fights* is annoying
I don't blame you guys for taking off. It was pretty bad.

The CCP guy above said there was just under 600 in system when it started, but you guys didn't hang out long and frankly, I wish I would have followed but leaving my coalition behind seemed like a bad idea.

When the engagement actually started, there was about 600, you guys were around 150 and took off so they're taking the peak load.

Jita can do 1600 and this is with all that concord stuff going... get combat at least to 250 vs. 250...

Stick Cult
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:25:00 - [67]
 

Originally by: Zagdul
If you see a spike on your servers happening in a system which has a reinforcement timer, there should be some code you can run to reboot the node and reinforce it. This seems like something pretty easy to automate.

I do remember them talking about a dynamic load balancing thing of sorts... in 18 months lololol

Jita Alt666
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:26:00 - [68]
 

Originally by: HeliosGal
i guess ccp overloaded with thier jita node. SO this is flowing over to other areas. Ruining our gameplay ccp so are u intending to fix things outside of jita so regular players can have fun


I guess you dont read blogs posted by CCP employees. Jita is now on its own dedicated node. What we are witnessing right now is improving performance in the field.

Stick Cult
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:30:00 - [69]
 

Originally by: Jita Alt666
Originally by: HeliosGal
i guess ccp overloaded with thier jita node. SO this is flowing over to other areas. Ruining our gameplay ccp so are u intending to fix things outside of jita so regular players can have fun


I guess you dont read blogs posted by CCP employees. Jita is now on its own dedicated node. What we are witnessing right now is improving performance in the field.

Jita's always been on it's own node, they just put in a new and improved one!

But don't think your 1000 man fleet fights will run on that node, either. The only reason Jita survives at 1600 is because there's very little combat (compared to the number of people), and most of the people are docked.

Darius silverbolt
Caldari
Aura of Darkness
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:36:00 - [70]
 

Edited by: Darius silverbolt on 01/09/2010 22:36:31
We now return the game that CCP made back to the rest of the EvE community. The battle in RORZ-H has been completed and after an estimated 610 kills via DOTLAN. NC forces were turn back and Evoke, Dead Terrorist, Cry Havoc took the field.

Thank you to the NC for bring the fight. Thanks for CCP for making sure the LAG monster hurt both sides and made the rest of your customers unhappy.



EDIT: so my engrish sucksRolling Eyes

Jita Alt666
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:36:00 - [71]
 

Originally by: Stick Cult
Originally by: Jita Alt666
Originally by: HeliosGal
i guess ccp overloaded with thier jita node. SO this is flowing over to other areas. Ruining our gameplay ccp so are u intending to fix things outside of jita so regular players can have fun


I guess you dont read blogs posted by CCP employees. Jita is now on its own dedicated node. What we are witnessing right now is improving performance in the field.

Jita's always been on it's own node, they just put in a new and improved one!

But don't think your 1000 man fleet fights will run on that node, either. The only reason Jita survives at 1600 is because there's very little combat (compared to the number of people), and most of the people are docked.


That is the direction the rest of eve is heading to now.

Zagdul
Gallente
Clan Shadow Wolf
Fatal Ascension
Posted - 2010.09.01 22:37:00 - [72]
 

Originally by: Darius silverbolt
Edited by: Darius silverbolt on 01/09/2010 22:36:31
We now return the game that CCP made back to the rest of the EvE community. The battle in RORZ-H has been completed and after an estimated 610 kills via DOTLAN. NC forces were turn back and Evoke, Dead Terrorist, Cry Havoc took the field.

Thank you to the NC for bring the fight. Thanks for CCP for making sure the LAG monster hurt both sides and made the rest of your customers unhappy.



EDIT: so my engrish sucksRolling Eyes


You out lagged us.

Well done good sir!

r3voo
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2010.09.01 23:00:00 - [73]
 

Originally by: Darius silverbolt
Edited by: Darius silverbolt on 01/09/2010 22:36:31
We now return the game that CCP made back to the rest of the EvE community. The battle in RORZ-H has been completed and after an estimated 610 kills via DOTLAN. NC forces were turn back and Evoke, Dead Terrorist, Cry Havoc took the field.

Thank you to the NC for bring the fight. Thanks for CCP for making sure the LAG monster hurt both sides and made the rest of your customers unhappy.



EDIT: so my engrish sucksRolling Eyes


Yup,

Whas a very good fight Laughing. Rly i dont mind losing ships.
I rly just hope in the future that we all can enjoy a lagfree battle.


alittlebirdy
Posted - 2010.09.01 23:33:00 - [74]
 

Originally by: CCP Mindstar
There is a rather large fight disrupting space-time in a few pockets around new eden. We are working on getting everyone back to normal ASAP ;)


Learned alot form everyone getting p¡ssed off at the news report I can tell...

You aint fired yet Sad

Camios
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.09.01 23:51:00 - [75]
 

Originally by: CCP Mindstar

Some good questions and hopefully I can clear up a few things about what goes on behind the scenes in these cases.


  1. The fight started with just under 600 pilots in local.

  2. Yes, however the first notification mentioning this system was at around 1400 EVE time, which is well after downtime. (We perform analysis and dedication of fleet fight nodes at downtime each day, which is why we ask for a 24 hour notice if at all possible). Because of this, the system was not on a dedicated node, but sharing with a number of other constellations.

  3. It is related – the constellations affected were also in these regions (note – this is constellation based not region based).

  4. If a system is sharing, and a fight in that system overloads the node (ie. 100% CPU), then it will affect the other systems on the same node. This is the reason we have the fleet fight notification in place, so we can move hot systems to separate nodes. It gives better performance for the fight, and reduces impact on neighbors.


Cheers and Fly safe,
Mindstar.



Thanks A LOT to CCP Mindstar for clarifying these things.
The problem is people not using Fleet Fight Notification Form, so instead of blaming CCP you should blame the ones that did not fill the fleet fight notification form in time.

Either the attacker or the defender knew well in advance about the possibility of a big battle (such operations are planned wel in advance) but they sent the notification AFTER DOWNTIME, and everybody should know that it's completely useless.

If you don't know that the FFNF must be filled at least before downtime please go mining in empire.

I think that some criticism to CCP is right, but in this case it's just evident player's fault.

Ruby Khann
Posted - 2010.09.02 00:30:00 - [76]
 

Originally by: Camios
The problem is people not using Fleet Fight Notification Form, so instead of blaming CCP you should blame the ones that did not fill the fleet fight notification form in time.


And when a timer is less than 24 hours, is that the player's fault?

How dare these brazen people attempt to play the game! The nerve of them!

Camios
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.09.02 00:38:00 - [77]
 

Originally by: Ruby Khann
Originally by: Camios
The problem is people not using Fleet Fight Notification Form, so instead of blaming CCP you should blame the ones that did not fill the fleet fight notification form in time.


And when a timer is less than 24 hours, is that the player's fault?

How dare these brazen people attempt to play the game! The nerve of them!


lol, so you say that people don't plan such things with at least 24 hours in advance?

"Hey, what do we do tonight? Choose a system! Let's roll the dice!"

The attacker always know when he is going to attack, and well in advance.

Minchurra
Caldari
Posted - 2010.09.02 00:39:00 - [78]
 

Originally by: Camios
Either the attacker or the defender knew well in advance about the possibility of a big battle (such operations are planned wel in advance) but they sent the notification AFTER DOWNTIME, and everybody should know that it's completely useless.


Because there is absolutely no chance that a fight could spill over into an adjacent system, right?

Because there is absolutely no chance that in the next 17 minutes that a titan could be close to die?

Dont be stupid.

Camios
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2010.09.02 01:03:00 - [79]
 

Edited by: Camios on 02/09/2010 01:06:11
Originally by: Minchurra

Because there is absolutely no chance that a fight could spill over into an adjacent system, right?



So you say that this 600 man fight was spilt from an adjacent system?

Originally by: Minchurra

Because there is absolutely no chance that in the next 17 minutes that a titan could be close to die?

Dont be stupid.


If this is actually the case, this is actually a better motivation for huge blobs to create instantly. Because some titan pilots use their ships with poor support... and then the fight escalates.


I don't see why it's CCPs fault. While the fact that people don't fill FFNFs is reality.




alittlebirdy
Posted - 2010.09.02 01:11:00 - [80]
 

What about the p¡ss poor fact people need to file anything?

Um... ya... rofl... Need I say more?

Everyone should just file for every 0.0 system everyday rofl.

now BRB I need to file with my crapper that I want to use it in 24H...

Shtirlec
Roving Guns Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.09.02 02:04:00 - [81]
 

Originally by: CCP Mindstar

Some good questions and hopefully I can clear up a few things about what goes on behind the scenes in these cases.


  1. The fight started with just under 600 pilots in local.

  2. Yes, however the first notification mentioning this system was at around 1400 EVE time, which is well after downtime. (We perform analysis and dedication of fleet fight nodes at downtime each day, which is why we ask for a 24 hour notice if at all possible). Because of this, the system was not on a dedicated node, but sharing with a number of other constellations.

  3. It is related – the constellations affected were also in these regions (note – this is constellation based not region based).

  4. If a system is sharing, and a fight in that system overloads the node (ie. 100% CPU), then it will affect the other systems on the same node. This is the reason we have the fleet fight notification in place, so we can move hot systems to separate nodes. It gives better performance for the fight, and reduces impact on neighbors.


Cheers and Fly safe,
Mindstar.



*snip* Some rather unkind words removed. Shadow , do I need to give a 24hr notice prior to logging in my character too?

Aessoroz
Nohbdy.
Posted - 2010.09.02 02:07:00 - [82]
 

Edited by: Aessoroz on 02/09/2010 02:09:40
tl;dr CCP needs to use the mother****ing reinforcement timers to allocate systems on hubs more properly then the current bull****(which they caused because of the massive blob fest required to take down the ihubs, tcus, sbus, and everything else). The system pretty much in final reinforcement which should have triggered a massive "O **** LETS REINFORCE" warning, especially considering a large blob reinforced it in the first place.

Mara Rinn
Posted - 2010.09.02 02:09:00 - [83]
 

There should be an automated process of moving systems to dedicated nodes the moment an SBU is anchored, and perhaps timers should be adjusted to suit.

Aessoroz
Nohbdy.
Posted - 2010.09.02 02:10:00 - [84]
 

Edited by: Aessoroz on 02/09/2010 02:14:34
Edited by: Aessoroz on 02/09/2010 02:10:40
Originally by: Mara Rinn
There should be an automated process of moving systems to dedicated nodes the moment an SBU is anchored, and perhaps timers should be adjusted to suit.


BAD BAD BAD BAD BAD BAD BAD BAD IDEA.

Let's just say there are some of us who like to troll via dropping sbus and tcus when a wormhole opens up. :D Is it a valid tactic? Why yes it is as our enemies have to waste time and money to take them down.

Shtirlec
Roving Guns Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2010.09.02 02:26:00 - [85]
 

The ****ty part about this whole lag situation, is that CCP is trying to make guinea pigs outta us and have US participate in battles on the test server...I pay them to play a game...and if CCP wants to use me as a test subject they should give me an incentive to do so. I participated in 3 tests, and lag is still there...I understand it takes maybe more then 3 tests to figure this stuff out, but why should I waste my time on these tests that have not resulted in anything if I personally dont get anything out of them. As the old saying goes, "Time is money".

Agrona Aerten
Posted - 2010.09.02 02:34:00 - [86]
 

Put 500 plex tags on the market out there, maybe then you will get a Jita node? Embarassed

UGWidowmaker
Caldari
freelancers inc
Imperial 0rder
Posted - 2010.09.02 05:11:00 - [87]
 

well ccp. u now know that we fight out there... where is never to know... we fly around u know!so we wouldlike the entie region on own nodes. thx! also all other 00 space btw.. fights all ower the place.

:)

Venkul Mul
Gallente
Posted - 2010.09.02 05:55:00 - [88]
 

Edited by: Venkul Mul on 02/09/2010 06:08:21

Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Jita Alt666
Edited by: Jita Alt666 on 01/09/2010 21:44:20

Because you really need 24 hours notice of major fleet fights - why does your sov system have game mechanics that utilise timers under a 24 hour period - thus ensuring there will be fleet fights where the node can not be reinforced in time?


Because people already cry a river for the length of the different timers.



Beside replying to your question, CCP don't need a warning 24 hours in advance, they need a warning at least a couple of hours before DT, so that they can see what systems need reinforcement and be capable of doing it, so most of the time they will get the message in time to reinforce the node.

Pushing all the timers at above 24 hours will give people the time to send a message and get the reinforced node (if they don't tarry too long before sending it), but will push the time to do sovereignty related battles to several days, something that don't sit well with the costumers from the post they make in the forum.

So they have chosen between two evils:
- reinforcing the nodes when the request is sent in time and missing some of them
- having people waiting 24+ hours for each step when sieging a system.

Chose your poison, I will bet that if you chose version 2 after some week you will be here with another alt protesting the length of the timers.

Originally by: Zagdul

There has got to be something you, CCP, can do to alleviate some of the load on these servers during fleet engagements.



CCP has done something, read the linked blogs:

Module lag

Character nodes

They are not "the solution" (if it exist) but are steps trying to reduce lag.

Originally by: Zagdul
Edited by: Zagdul on 01/09/2010 22:20:44
@CCP Devs, despite the 24 hour notice you ask for...

If you see a spike on your servers happening in a system which has a reinforcement timer, there should be some code you can run to reboot the node and reinforce it. This seems like something pretty easy to automate.

From here, there can be a basic standings check and put everyone with similar standings on once side of the solar system in dead space upon login, and the other fleet on the other side of space.




You want CCP to purposefully crash the node and reboot it on a "clear" node?

And in what that will be better than the current situation?

Originally by: Stick Cult
Originally by: Jita Alt666

I guess you dont read blogs posted by CCP employees. Jita is now on its own dedicated node. What we are witnessing right now is improving performance in the field.

Jita's always been on it's own node, they just put in a new and improved one!

But don't think your 1000 man fleet fights will run on that node, either. The only reason Jita survives at 1600 is because there's very little combat (compared to the number of people), and most of the people are docked.


It is not even a new node, it is a way send some of the load to another node and it used in all EVE, see Character nodes" above.

Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
Posted - 2010.09.02 06:06:00 - [89]
 

The thing is that some people are pretty okay with the lag.


Lag just became another tool in the big sandbox. It is tricky though. When it works in your favour all is fine. When it works against you, then all the blame is on CCP and how **** they are.

How often did the winning side cry about lag when they won big times because of it? Then it was always the other side who were either stupid, idiots or just plain dumb. But as soon as they taste their own medicine it is all crap, unfair and sh!t.

That happens for years now. Can someone take them really serious?

Kat Bandeis
Caldari
Space Pods Inc
Posted - 2010.09.02 06:28:00 - [90]
 

Originally by: CCP Shadow
As CCP Mindstar mentioned above, we're aware of the issue and the server gods are working to resolve it as soon as possible.

We'll keep you updated on our progress.


No, you won't, but thanks for the thought.

Noticing lag in the last couple weeks where it never existed in last couple years with virtually empty systems. Awesome.


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