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Zeba
Minmatar
Honourable East India Trading Company
Posted - 2010.08.08 06:00:00 - [151]
 

Originally by: Ranger 1
A lot of people seem to confuse GTC's with Plex.

GTC's have a monetary value, can get a refund (I believe) for that value, and are redeemable for game time or can be converted into an in game item called a plex (2 actually). These are not destructible in game.

At the point of conversion into in game items (2 PLEX) the GTC loses all monetary value.

A PLEX has no monetary value, nor can be refunded for money. It is simply a valueless in game item like all other in game items.

If the person in question bought the PLEX from someone else, he spent valueless in game money to purchase them.

If the person in question converted multiple GTC's into PLEX's, he voluntarily negated any real world value the GTC had and transformed them into a valueless item he could sell in game for equally valueless game money.

If the point of buying the original GTC's was for the person in question to extend his game time, he would never have converted/moved the PLEX's to begin with... although strictly speaking their intentions are completely irrelevant as to the discussion of whether a PLEX has any kind of real world value.



And for all you just said 74 accounts will never be extended by those plex. Ever. Wink

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2010.08.08 06:20:00 - [152]
 

Edited by: Ranger 1 on 08/08/2010 06:21:07
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Ranger 1
A lot of people seem to confuse GTC's with Plex.

GTC's have a monetary value, can get a refund (I believe) for that value, and are redeemable for game time or can be converted into an in game item called a plex (2 actually). These are not destructible in game.

At the point of conversion into in game items (2 PLEX) the GTC loses all monetary value.

A PLEX has no monetary value, nor can be refunded for money. It is simply a valueless in game item like all other in game items.

If the person in question bought the PLEX from someone else, he spent valueless in game money to purchase them.

If the person in question converted multiple GTC's into PLEX's, he voluntarily negated any real world value the GTC had and transformed them into a valueless item he could sell in game for equally valueless game money.

If the point of buying the original GTC's was for the person in question to extend his game time, he would never have converted/moved the PLEX's to begin with... although strictly speaking their intentions are completely irrelevant as to the discussion of whether a PLEX has any kind of real world value.



And for all you just said 74 accounts will never be extended by those plex. Ever. Wink


Correct, which has literally no significance because the moment they were converted into PLEX they lost all real world value.

Does CCP keep the money paid for the GTCs?

Of course, they provided the GTC's as per the transaction. Their part in this comic tragedy is over.

Does a player get 6 years of game time?

No, because someone in their lust for worthless game money got both greedy and stupid (which, of course, happens every day in EVE).



Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
Posted - 2010.08.08 06:45:00 - [153]
 

Originally by: Ranger 1
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 08/08/2010 06:21:07
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Ranger 1
A lot of people seem to confuse GTC's with Plex.

GTC's have a monetary value, can get a refund (I believe) for that value, and are redeemable for game time or can be converted into an in game item called a plex (2 actually). These are not destructible in game.

At the point of conversion into in game items (2 PLEX) the GTC loses all monetary value.

A PLEX has no monetary value, nor can be refunded for money. It is simply a valueless in game item like all other in game items.

If the person in question bought the PLEX from someone else, he spent valueless in game money to purchase them.

If the person in question converted multiple GTC's into PLEX's, he voluntarily negated any real world value the GTC had and transformed them into a valueless item he could sell in game for equally valueless game money.

If the point of buying the original GTC's was for the person in question to extend his game time, he would never have converted/moved the PLEX's to begin with... although strictly speaking their intentions are completely irrelevant as to the discussion of whether a PLEX has any kind of real world value.



And for all you just said 74 accounts will never be extended by those plex. Ever. Wink


Correct, which has literally no significance because the moment they were converted into PLEX they lost all real world value.

Does CCP keep the money paid for the GTCs?

Of course, they provided the GTC's as per the transaction. Their part in this comic tragedy is over.

Does a player get 6 years of game time?

No, because someone in their lust for worthless game money got both greedy and stupid (which, of course, happens every day in EVE).





This. A million times this.

Zeba
Minmatar
Honourable East India Trading Company
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:01:00 - [154]
 

Originally by: Ranger 1
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 08/08/2010 06:21:07
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Ranger 1
A lot of people seem to confuse GTC's with Plex.

GTC's have a monetary value, can get a refund (I believe) for that value, and are redeemable for game time or can be converted into an in game item called a plex (2 actually). These are not destructible in game.

At the point of conversion into in game items (2 PLEX) the GTC loses all monetary value.

A PLEX has no monetary value, nor can be refunded for money. It is simply a valueless in game item like all other in game items.

If the person in question bought the PLEX from someone else, he spent valueless in game money to purchase them.

If the person in question converted multiple GTC's into PLEX's, he voluntarily negated any real world value the GTC had and transformed them into a valueless item he could sell in game for equally valueless game money.

If the point of buying the original GTC's was for the person in question to extend his game time, he would never have converted/moved the PLEX's to begin with... although strictly speaking their intentions are completely irrelevant as to the discussion of whether a PLEX has any kind of real world value.



And for all you just said 74 accounts will never be extended by those plex. Ever. Wink


Correct, which has literally no significance because the moment they were converted into PLEX they lost all real world value.

Does CCP keep the money paid for the GTCs?

Of course, they provided the GTC's as per the transaction. Their part in this comic tragedy is over.

Does a player get 6 years of game time?

No, because someone in their lust for worthless game money got both greedy and stupid (which, of course, happens every day in EVE).



Again, after all that a player is down 74 plex some gankers are out of luck on the 74 plex due to the crap drop and ccp is up $1295 usd they didn't have to provide any services for. Yarr indeed. YARRRR!!

suzi tzuke
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:02:00 - [155]
 

Quite simply ....ccp are stealing

Atticus Fynch
Gallente
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:07:00 - [156]
 

Originally by: suzi tzuke
Quite simply ....ccp are stealing


CCP...the ultimate pirate.

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:08:00 - [157]
 

Edited by: Ranger 1 on 08/08/2010 07:12:47
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 08/08/2010 07:10:26
Quote:
Again, after all that a player is down 74 plex some gankers are out of luck on the 74 plex due to the crap drop and ccp is up $1295 usd they didn't have to provide any services for. Yarr indeed. YARRRR!!


So? If someone wants to convert $1295 worth of GTC's into worthless in game items and subsequently get them blown up, who cares?

A GTC's value is in money. A PLEX's value is only in isk.

And can you really call it a gank when the "victim" was at war? Razz

Quote:
Quite simply ....ccp are stealing


CCP upheld it's end of the transaction, someone else pulled the trigger and hoped to reap a (in real world terms) valueless in game reward. I don't think stealing enters into the equation.


Zeba
Minmatar
Honourable East India Trading Company
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:13:00 - [158]
 

Originally by: Ranger 1
Quote:
Again, after all that a player is down 74 plex some gankers are out of luck on the 74 plex due to the crap drop and ccp is up $1295 usd they didn't have to provide any services for. Yarr indeed. YARRRR!!


So? If some to convert $1295 worth of GTC's into worthless in game items and subsequently get them blown up, who cares?
Well I personally don't care as its eve after all and I certainly didn't lose my arse over it. Besides it was only 22 bil and that ain't much more than a speck of shiat in a thimble nowadays. But I'm sure the guy at ccp who convinced the management to impliment this feature and is going to get a nice fat bonus out of it surely cares. Twisted Evil

Zaerlorth Maelkor
The Maverick Navy
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:14:00 - [159]
 

Originally by: Steve Celeste
Would have been a nice drop, too bad that CCP set the drop chance for that item to ABSOLUTELY ZERO


0% drop chance? You base this statistics on one kill? two kills?
The reason why all 74 got destroyed is because they were stacked. Stacked items count as one item when drops are measured out.

Serpents smile
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:19:00 - [160]
 

Originally by: suzi tzuke
Quite simply ....ccp are stealing


No they are not. The, and I like to nominate aystra for "biggest EVE fool of the year 2010" flying around with 74 plex's in a tin can while being wardecced stole from himself.

As said before, greed makes people stupid. /o\


Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:20:00 - [161]
 

Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Ranger 1
Quote:
Again, after all that a player is down 74 plex some gankers are out of luck on the 74 plex due to the crap drop and ccp is up $1295 usd they didn't have to provide any services for. Yarr indeed. YARRRR!!


So? If some to convert $1295 worth of GTC's into worthless in game items and subsequently get them blown up, who cares?
Well I personally don't care as its eve after all and I certainly didn't lose my arse over it. Besides it was only 22 bil and that ain't much more than a speck of shiat in a thimble nowadays. But I'm sure the guy at ccp who convinced the management to impliment this feature and is going to get a nice fat bonus out of it surely cares. Twisted Evil


Perhaps they are switching over to a commission basis. Shocked

Trygonus
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:40:00 - [162]
 

The loss mail comments is starting to get pretty awsome as more monkeys find out about it. Laughing

Mecinia Lua
Galactic Express
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2010.08.08 07:49:00 - [163]
 

Just because we can do a thing, doesn't mean we should do that thing.

I can't understand why anyone would carry a PLEX. Just wait til you get there then make it. After all they can be made in NPC stations and outposts now too.

GrandMaster JAX
Posted - 2010.08.08 08:07:00 - [164]
 

It warms my nonexistent heart when i hear about crushing someones hopes and dreams in such an epic manner.

Queen Athena
Posted - 2010.08.08 08:37:00 - [165]
 

Originally by: Ranger 1
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 08/08/2010 07:12:47
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 08/08/2010 07:10:26
Quote:
Again, after all that a player is down 74 plex some gankers are out of luck on the 74 plex due to the crap drop and ccp is up $1295 usd they didn't have to provide any services for. Yarr indeed. YARRRR!!


So? If someone wants to convert $1295 worth of GTC's into worthless in game items and subsequently get them blown up, who cares?

A GTC's value is in money. A PLEX's value is only in isk.

And can you really call it a gank when the "victim" was at war? Razz

Quote:
Quite simply ....ccp are stealing


CCP upheld it's end of the transaction, someone else pulled the trigger and hoped to reap a (in real world terms) valueless in game reward. I don't think stealing enters into the equation.




You do not get how this game works do you... If I sell you 74 plex, sure I can buy in game goods that can get blown up, but you still have 74 plex with which CCP needs to honor. This is completely different, this is a systematic built in way of CCP issuing bearer bonds in the form of game time, bearer bonds which is a pre-paid contract and then cutting out liabilities using a drop rate system they engineer.

This is the same as the numbers game in uptown New York in the 30's, the same as Enron when they wrote liabilities between divisions and then disbanded them, the same as if today you lost your cell phone and AT&T or Verizon said you had no account since you lost the phone. It is bad business practice at its worst.

I never once thought having plex in game was a good idea, it blurs the lines and violates their very own EULA. What we have here is theft, its a liability write off plan that plan stinks.

Guilty Man
Minmatar
Guilty People
Posted - 2010.08.08 08:50:00 - [166]
 

So, this topic is about someone, who decided to donate 1100 bucks to CCP? C'mon, people, someone is giving money to CCP, why you care?

Serpents smile
Posted - 2010.08.08 08:55:00 - [167]
 

Originally by: Queen Athena
but you still have 74 plex with which CCP needs to honor.


The owner of the plex has every right to with it as he/ she pleases, within the boundaries of the EULA.

Whether being selling it, using it to extend game time, trashing it or flying around in a tin can and getting blown up.

The plex was payed for, from there on it's out of CCP's hands.

Koyama Ise
Caldari
Posted - 2010.08.08 08:56:00 - [168]
 

Originally by: Queen Athena
I never once thought having plex in game was a good idea, it blurs the lines and violates their very own EULA.

Uhh where? I can't find the clause that makes that true. In fact all parts of it I read seem to say that it does not violate their EULA.

Your Client
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:04:00 - [169]
 

Have we forgotten that CCP also spawns us random faction spawns, PLEX's (game "dungeons"), and officers spawns? Every week billions, if not trillions, of isk is given out by ccp for us to do as we please.

Stop whining and play the game the game the way it was meant to be played. Buy your time anyway you please, just dont remove it from a station in a frig!

/Argument over.

Ji Sama
Caldari
Tash-Murkon Prime Industries
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:07:00 - [170]
 

OMG THIS IS A SCANDAL SOMETHING MUST BE DONE; THIS CANNOT BE; I SAY LETS SPEAK WITH OUR WALLETS LETS ALL CANCEL OUR SUBSCRIPTIONS; BUT FIRST SEND ME ALL YOUR STUFF SO I CAN KEEP IT SAFE!

WhiteSavage
Gallente
Ever Flow
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:19:00 - [171]
 

every plex lost equals money in ccp's wallet.

While thousands of small bugs and even large balancing issues exist... at least now plexes are "fair" right?

This is exactly what CCP wanted and shame on them for being so blunt about it.

This game is getting dull anyway

Ji Sama
Caldari
Tash-Murkon Prime Industries
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:22:00 - [172]
 

Originally by: WhiteSavage
every plex lost equals money in ccp's wallet.

While thousands of small bugs and even large balancing issues exist... at least now plexes are "fair" right?

This is exactly what CCP wanted and shame on them for being so blunt about it.

This game is getting dull anyway


stuff haz can i?

Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:22:00 - [173]
 

Edited by: Halcyon Ingenium on 08/08/2010 09:23:20
So if I bought 74 plex, put it in my cargo, undocked and self destructed, then who would CCP be stealing from?

WhiteSavage
Gallente
Ever Flow
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:32:00 - [174]
 

Originally by: Your Client
Have we forgotten that CCP also spawns us random faction spawns, PLEX's (game "dungeons"), and officers spawns? Every week billions, if not trillions, of isk is given out by ccp for us to do as we please.

Stop whining and play the game the game the way it was meant to be played. Buy your time anyway you please, just dont remove it from a station in a frig!

/Argument over.


plexes may equal isk for one but for others and more specifically ccp it equals gametime. Plexes are used up by... gametime. Thus for every plex lost, another must be bought/another character subscription payed for. And that is the only reason CCP implemented this change.

Sucking the idiots dry is one thing. But when major issues are going untouched and the developer is going way out of the way to grab as much dough from us as possible...

bad sign.

WhiteSavage
Gallente
Ever Flow
Systematic-Chaos
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:36:00 - [175]
 

Originally by: Halcyon Ingenium
Edited by: Halcyon Ingenium on 08/08/2010 09:23:20
So if I bought 74 plex, put it in my cargo, undocked and self destructed, then who would CCP be stealing from?


Well then CCP would have designed quite a process where you would end up just giving them money.

...wait

Bomberlocks
Minmatar
CTRL-Q
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:37:00 - [176]
 

To the guy who undocked with 74 PLEX in his hold, in a frigate, in Jita, without an insta-undock: What exactly did you think would happen?

To the guys who ganked him: You might have the gotten the biggest monetary gank of all time in Eve, but you still got nothing. Jokes on you as much as on him.

To CCP: While it's fun to see a game play to people's darker sides, I wouldn't be surprised if you just lost a customer there (although you probably got more out of him than he would have given you for the lifetime of eve anyway).

thoth rothschild
Method of Destruction
Snatch Victory
Posted - 2010.08.08 09:44:00 - [177]
 

Edited by: thoth rothschild on 08/08/2010 09:45:33
It was a docking attemp :p

StarRanger
Gallente
Royal Star Ranger Family
Posted - 2010.08.08 10:04:00 - [178]
 

sweet lord, lol. mission accomplish: DO EPIC STUFF! Very HappyVery Happy

Aerilis
Gallente
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Posted - 2010.08.08 10:04:00 - [179]
 

Wow this really makes me uneasy... For CCP to have just made more than a grand from a frigate gank...


Oh and to all those who say PLEX has no real life value, only ISK value.

You're sorely mistaken. The value of an item is not deemed by some fine print in the EULA, the value of any item, virtual or real, is determined by what PEOPLE THINK IT IS WORTH. Nothing else. If everyone in the world thinks pennies are more valuable then nickels, guess what? They will become more valuable then nickels, regardless of what the U.S. Mint says about the value of pennies.

Frozean
Posted - 2010.08.08 10:13:00 - [180]
 

As i always say
Its futile to deal with dumb people.

They drag you down to their level, and beat you with experience.

Blaming CCP for PLEX being destroyed in a ship, is like blaming the bank for cheating on you, Because if you burn your money it will get burned.

Undocking PLEX in a ship is as bad as burning money with your stove. Hence, the bank is wrong for releasing money


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