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Corvus Dove
Caldari
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas.
Posted - 2010.07.02 12:14:00 - [151]
 

In regards to my corp's behavior in the form of PvP with Primary.;

We were a small corp, new to the region even when all of this went down. In the time period I was there personally, at least half of our corp was involved in roaming gangs and HD regularly, and I myself participated in regional PvP roams and fleets every night I was logged in (usually as a tackler), save one. In fact, when a Primary. ratting ship was sillily ratting in 1v, which has all of two belts and three stargates, came under attack, I undocked in an interceptor and threw myself at the attacker to buy the ratting ship time to escape. Of course, I got chewed apart against the HAC that was fitted for hunting, but it beat us losing a way-too-much-ISK-to-waste PvE-fit BS.

I only point this out because I think it's a bit unfair to lump the corps that Primary. left hanging out to dry in SP with Primary.'s behavior itself, for the same reason that Primary. is so anxious to treat us as "not really Primary." and leave us behind as they make off across space with 32 Billion ISK. Our behavior may not have matched their behavior, but I think in this particular case that might not necessarily be a bad thing.

As I sit in station in EVE, a station I will likely only be able to undock from and never dock again, unable to log in properly while I wait for my laptop, my thoughts go to this. Personally, I'd rather my reputation in combat be put in question (which can be rectified in about 20 minutes with a torrent of hot fury) than to be considered an untrustworthy ally that sells out its members and space, then makes off with the money when the deal goes sour (which will never be forgotten).

Am I bitter that my assets will likely be stuck out in 4-C and 1v-, and that I'll have to sell several month's worth of PLEX's to get back on my feet completely, rather than have what I need on hand to earn it the old fashioned way? Hell yes I am. But eventually, as EVE goes, I can rest assured that something will happen that allows me to get to them eventually.

As for the usefulness of the component corps left behind, considering us rejects that just didn't participate is bunk. The fact is, our participation in fleet ops, etc. had absolutely nothing with why we were left behind. It just makes a good excuse for why someone would leave 12-1500 pilots in a hotzone while the remaining original members have less people among whom they divide the spoils.

Guru
Caldari
Woopatang
Primary.
Posted - 2010.07.02 13:47:00 - [152]
 

Originally by: Corvus Dove
In regards to my corp's behavior in the form of PvP with Primary.;

We were a small corp, new to the region even when all of this went down. In the time period I was there personally, at least half of our corp was involved in roaming gangs and HD regularly, and I myself participated in regional PvP roams and fleets every night I was logged in (usually as a tackler), save one. In fact, when a Primary. ratting ship was sillily ratting in 1v, which has all of two belts and three stargates, came under attack, I undocked in an interceptor and threw myself at the attacker to buy the ratting ship time to escape. Of course, I got chewed apart against the HAC that was fitted for hunting, but it beat us losing a way-too-much-ISK-to-waste PvE-fit BS.

I only point this out because I think it's a bit unfair to lump the corps that Primary. left hanging out to dry in SP with Primary.'s behavior itself, for the same reason that Primary. is so anxious to treat us as "not really Primary." and leave us behind as they make off across space with 32 Billion ISK. Our behavior may not have matched their behavior, but I think in this particular case that might not necessarily be a bad thing.

As I sit in station in EVE, a station I will likely only be able to undock from and never dock again, unable to log in properly while I wait for my laptop, my thoughts go to this. Personally, I'd rather my reputation in combat be put in question (which can be rectified in about 20 minutes with a torrent of hot fury) than to be considered an untrustworthy ally that sells out its members and space, then makes off with the money when the deal goes sour (which will never be forgotten).

Am I bitter that my assets will likely be stuck out in 4-C and 1v-, and that I'll have to sell several month's worth of PLEX's to get back on my feet completely, rather than have what I need on hand to earn it the old fashioned way? Hell yes I am. But eventually, as EVE goes, I can rest assured that something will happen that allows me to get to them eventually.

As for the usefulness of the component corps left behind, considering us rejects that just didn't participate is bunk. The fact is, our participation in fleet ops, etc. had absolutely nothing with why we were left behind. It just makes a good excuse for why someone would leave 12-1500 pilots in a hotzone while the remaining original members have less people among whom they divide the spoils.


I think the people who feel like this seem to be offended and hurt in some way. We as an alliance, did nothing but make a deal and push mergers tbh. These sorts of deals and mergers are made all the time.. its just not publicized as much as this one. :) There is no shame in our behavior and I have nothing to regret about it. The only surprise we had in all of this was HTA not being able to do what they were told they can do. All the other emo-raging and issues were to be expected. We did our part, you corp did your part, and now we are on our way's, maybe separately, but to new ventures. I wont be repetitive, just encourage you to talk to people in the know to find out the info and truth.

One thing I think that is important for me to say, and maybe I should have said this earlier. Corps were chosen based on a specific formula. It was a mixture of length in the alliance, combined with killboard activity vs. member count, and size. As we reached the limit of corps/pilots we could bring with us there were plenty of corps who were great corps with good activity that we just couldn't invite along. A good portion of the corps who are not coming are great pvp'ers. Some of them are great industry corps. It was not an easy decision for any of us as we got towards our limit. I wish you guys luck and any alliance that has you guys in the future will be a better alliance because of it.


Noobjuice
Minmatar
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.07.02 15:00:00 - [153]
 

Originally by: Cupdeez
Hmm....

So yeah COW has been talking about removing Primay for the last 6 months on our forums.

Reasons:
1. The have no recruiting standards (everyone gets in 50 corp and only 1800 member)
2. They recruited Corps COW/GC kicked for not being an active PVP Corp
3. Our allies like Atlas didn't trust them
4. They rarely came on COW/GC CTA's that both alliances had heavy participation.
5. When Caps were involved we didn't tell Primary because well they recruited anyone and we didn't want to lose our Cap fleet because of them.
6. We killed a few of their marco rat hunters ratting in our space and they openly admitted they forgot to turn their marco (pretty funny)

Anyone who fights or pvps in the area knows who most gangs were comprised of.

Stats below for people who like to think Primary was a PVP entity.

Primary

Gents Club

COW


Primary have a higher K:D ratio than IT alliance, just sayin.

Garbad theWeak
Caldari
Blackwater USA Inc.
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2010.07.02 15:23:00 - [154]
 

I don't believe Guru intended to cheat anyone. I'm also glad to see Primary go back to a smaller, merc style alliance instead of blobsov.

GL to you all. o7

Corvus Dove
Caldari
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
Atlas.
Posted - 2010.07.02 15:59:00 - [155]
 

Edited by: Corvus Dove on 02/07/2010 16:00:06
Originally by: Guru

I think the people who feel like this seem to be offended and hurt in some way. We as an alliance, did nothing but make a deal and push mergers tbh. These sorts of deals and mergers are made all the time.. its just not publicized as much as this one. :) There is no shame in our behavior and I have nothing to regret about it. The only surprise we had in all of this was HTA not being able to do what they were told they can do. All the other emo-raging and issues were to be expected. We did our part, you corp did your part, and now we are on our way's, maybe separately, but to new ventures. I wont be repetitive, just encourage you to talk to people in the know to find out the info and truth.

One thing I think that is important for me to say, and maybe I should have said this earlier. Corps were chosen based on a specific formula. It was a mixture of length in the alliance, combined with killboard activity vs. member count, and size. As we reached the limit of corps/pilots we could bring with us there were plenty of corps who were great corps with good activity that we just couldn't invite along. A good portion of the corps who are not coming are great pvp'ers. Some of them are great industry corps. It was not an easy decision for any of us as we got towards our limit. I wish you guys luck and any alliance that has you guys in the future will be a better alliance because of it.




Alright, fair enough, and a very straightforward response. Also, it's a nice sidestep from the emotional rollercoaster end of things that came barreling out of this being a forum, and I feel a good bit less like I've had an Iteron shoved up my EVE-gate. The lack of a heads-up, though, really left some of us bent over a barrel; me possibly worst of all, since I can't log in to just up and go.

That said, if I can't dock or safely undock from 1v or 4-c to get my things, I'm still screwed. If HTA had been able to keep the region as per the original deal, there would be no problem, but that deal soured and left all of the Primary. component corps left behind in a lurch, between losing assets and losing members. Quite possibly me (losing assets), most of all, for the aforementioned reasons. What can be done to rectify this, since those component corps went from safe and comfortable, to safe and tradable, to in the line of fire between politically disenchanted Alliances?

I'm sure since you've reasonably argued the purpose and method behind the actions that took place, that the middlemen-turned-victims in this mess should have some leeway. 48 hours to pack up and split is great when everyone involved logs in nightly and constantly, but anyone on vacation this week, or who might be suffering my technological troubles, is hosed.

HomeGrownBudZ
Gallente
modro
R.A.G.E
Posted - 2010.07.02 16:06:00 - [156]
 

I know i'm a 'nobody' but i felt the need to add to this already emo-tastic thread.

My Corp was a member of GC not too long ago. We were brought in to be carebears when GC first moved into SP, but we like to shoot **** too. At the time, it appeared to me that Primary was much more active PvP-wise in the area. I would often fly a few jumps over, and hop in a Primary gang that was already busy fighting nuets/reds roaming into thier space. I hardly remember CTA's or HD's being called, everyone would simply dock-up or run when DARKSIDE came rolling through. I always thought Primary where good folks (personality wise) and it felt like GC where riding on CoW/Atlas's collective coattails.

CoW might be able to stand on thier own, but i think GC would have done much better staying and growing with Primary. Mya likes to talk about the great elephant pen15, when he was hardly ever seen on the field. Mukk and Faffy seem to hold 90% of GC's PvP ability (much respect to those 2, Mukk is still my fav FC evaaa) While Mya seems to fight his battles on CAOD while shipspinning, So don't sweat anything he says, he's on a power trip. Never really got to know CoW that well so i cant say too much for those guys, character wise.

GL Primary, you guys will be just fine ( I hope) look forward to watching the KB's and seeing you roll GC (primary Mukk = Win)

Ash Ock
Caldari
First Flying Wing Inc
ROMANIAN-LEGION
Posted - 2010.07.02 16:18:00 - [157]
 

Originally by: Corvus Dove
Edited by: Corvus Dove on 02/07/2010 16:00:06

Alright, fair enough, and a very straightforward response. Also, it's a nice sidestep from the emotional rollercoaster end of things that came barreling out of this being a forum, and I feel a good bit less like I've had an Iteron shoved up my EVE-gate. The lack of a heads-up, though, really left some of us bent over a barrel; me possibly worst of all, since I can't log in to just up and go.

That said, if I can't dock or safely undock from 1v or 4-c to get my things, I'm still screwed. If HTA had been able to keep the region as per the original deal, there would be no problem, but that deal soured and left all of the Primary. component corps left behind in a lurch, between losing assets and losing members. Quite possibly me (losing assets), most of all, for the aforementioned reasons. What can be done to rectify this, since those component corps went from safe and comfortable, to safe and tradable, to in the line of fire between politically disenchanted Alliances?

I'm sure since you've reasonably argued the purpose and method behind the actions that took place, that the middlemen-turned-victims in this mess should have some leeway. 48 hours to pack up and split is great when everyone involved logs in nightly and constantly, but anyone on vacation this week, or who might be suffering my technological troubles, is hosed.


Man I feel your pain and you have posted about it a couple of times now but dude stop whining. Get yourself a box of tissue and a romance novel and do what you always do and curl up on your couch with your ShamWoW and weep yourself to sleep.

Have a nice day.

Diddyo
Caldari
Death Watch Guards
AAA Citizens
Posted - 2010.07.02 21:56:00 - [158]
 

Edited by: Diddyo on 02/07/2010 21:56:47
Originally by: Ash Ock


Man I feel your pain and you have posted about it a couple of times now but dude stop whining. Get yourself a box of tissue and a romance novel and do what you always do and curl up on your couch with your ShamWoW and weep yourself to sleep.

Have a nice day.


a couple of times? I've counted at least 5 or 6 posts of him whining about the terrible terrible tragedy of being stuck unable to login with assets trapped.

Please Corvus don't stop whining posting. some of us find you amusing Laughing

Wusti
Caldari
The New Era
C0NVICTED
Posted - 2010.07.03 10:15:00 - [159]
 

Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
I know i'm a 'nobody'


Truth

Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
Mukk and Faffy seem to hold 90% of GC's PvP ability


Scary **** (hi Faffy & Mukk :D)

Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
While Mya seems to fight his battles on CAOD while shipspinning, So don't sweat anything he says, he's on a power trip.


You have absolutely no idea how much of a time sink being CEO of an alliance of your size can be - so juts STFU and make everyone's day a brighter one.

Mr Disturbed
Caldari
The Army
Cult of War
Posted - 2010.07.03 12:28:00 - [160]
 

Edited by: Mr Disturbed on 03/07/2010 12:34:38
Hmm **** happens, just join to whatever alliance you like, form the fronts and start ****ing shooting each-other please Razz Who care about politics anyways.

btw: there is solution if you dislike what Guru did, just make him KOS Cool Killing always makes things more simple. Fly unsafe o7

GavinGoodrich
Caldari
State Protectorate
Posted - 2010.07.03 21:37:00 - [161]
 

Originally by: Mr Disturbed
Edited by: Mr Disturbed on 03/07/2010 12:34:38
Hmm **** happens, just join to whatever alliance you like, form the fronts and start ****ing shooting each-other please Razz


Preach on, brothaa man! \o/

fathitman
Gallente
SniggWaffe
Posted - 2010.07.03 22:39:00 - [162]
 

We love EMO Politics

orphenshadow
Gallente
Easy Co.
Fatal Ascension
Posted - 2010.07.04 09:23:00 - [163]
 

Originally by: Mr Disturbed
Edited by: Mr Disturbed on 03/07/2010 12:34:38
Hmm **** happens, just join to whatever alliance you like, form the fronts and start ****ing shooting each-other please Razz Who care about politics anyways.

btw: there is solution if you dislike what Guru did, just make him KOS Cool Killing always makes things more simple. Fly unsafe o7


Agreed.

Find a group of misfits and ****ups, drink beer, and blow things up. It's a game you should enjoy it.

Xornicon Altair
Caldari
Woopatang
Primary.
Posted - 2010.07.04 22:58:00 - [164]
 

Rumor has it that CoW is evacing from Scalding Pass and may be dissolving. I love the divine irony of this in their statements of Primary's uselessness.

Barnaby Jones
Gallente
First Flying Wing Inc
ROMANIAN-LEGION
Posted - 2010.07.04 23:03:00 - [165]
 

Originally by: Xornicon Altair
Rumor has it that CoW is evacing from Scalding Pass and may be dissolving. I love the divine irony of this in their statements of Primary's uselessness.


Just goes to show, once Primary left the GC/COW failscade was a lock. How fitting for Rube Goldberg's birthday. Have a nice trip guys, I hear high sec is lovely this time of year.

fpshacker
Gallente
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2010.07.04 23:19:00 - [166]
 

Edited by: fpshacker on 04/07/2010 23:19:46
haha wow, cow are calling someone bad

edit: also cow too has no recruiting standards

Mr Disturbed
Caldari
The Army
Cult of War
Posted - 2010.07.05 07:14:00 - [167]
 

Edited by: Mr Disturbed on 05/07/2010 07:19:43
this whole situation is quite amusing tbh Razz

yeah, and don't look at me like that as I have no idea what our politics did/are doing. I'm simple minded folk, if I like their decisions I will say nothing, if I do not like them, well I will say nothing and KOS YARRRR!! Razz

CrazyDeathz
Gallente
Paragon Fury
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2010.07.05 11:14:00 - [168]
 

The story dosnt end here ladies. Lots of tasty tears are incomming. :)

NL1GHT3D
Gallente
Feudum Chalybis
The Spire Collective
Posted - 2010.07.05 13:26:00 - [169]
 

Originally by: CrazyDeathz
The story dosnt end here ladies. Lots of tasty tears are incomming. :)

oh, i thought you guys would be mature enough to not cry?

CrazyDeathz
Gallente
Paragon Fury
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2010.07.05 15:34:00 - [170]
 

Originally by: NL1GHT3D
Originally by: CrazyDeathz
The story dosnt end here ladies. Lots of tasty tears are incomming. :)

oh, i thought you guys would be mature enough to not cry?


Who said anything about our tears. Jucy as they are, im sure the bucket will be filled by how shall I put this. Lets just say the bucket shall be filled and the trolls will be happy Very Happy

Mr Disturbed
Caldari
The Army
Cult of War
Posted - 2010.07.05 16:10:00 - [171]
 

Edited by: Mr Disturbed on 05/07/2010 16:20:15
Originally by: CrazyDeathz
...trolls will be happy Very Happy


YARRRR!!

Garbie
Caldari
Woopatang
The Spire Collective
Posted - 2010.07.05 20:59:00 - [172]
 

Originally by: Mr Disturbed
Edited by: Mr Disturbed on 05/07/2010 16:20:15
Originally by: CrazyDeathz
...trolls will be happy Very Happy


YARRRR!!


heyheyheyhey!!! OMG STOP! Stop ruining our disbanding thread and derailing it with cow disbanding. START YOUR OWN DISBANDING THREAD DAMMIT!!

btw hi guys!!!! Wusti, mind if we logon trap you again?

Achem
Minmatar
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers
The 0rphanage
Posted - 2010.07.05 21:19:00 - [173]
 

HIJACK -> o/ hey Garbie !

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Amarr
Divine Power.
Atlas.
Posted - 2010.07.05 23:42:00 - [174]
 

I'll never forget our old scalding pass comrades CoW and GC and will be sure to give them a o/ whenever I go past their HQ system in Empire


Ronnald mcdonnald
Gallente
Xicron Syndicate
Posted - 2010.07.06 07:06:00 - [175]
 

I want my 30mins back

ThaDollaGenerale
Caldari
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.07.06 07:49:00 - [176]
 

Mr Blue > 07:47:16 Notify The station ROMANIA Renegades HQ has been captured by ElitistOps corporation!

Wusti
Caldari
The New Era
C0NVICTED
Posted - 2010.07.06 08:28:00 - [177]
 

o/ Garbie :D

Elendar
Amarr
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.07.06 10:10:00 - [178]
 

Originally by: ThaDollaGenerale
Mr Blue > 07:47:16 Notify The station ROMANIA Renegades HQ has been captured by ElitistOps corporation!


What have you done! :facepalm:

Also why are our forums down?

Mr Blue
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.07.06 11:20:00 - [179]
 

Edited by: Mr Blue on 06/07/2010 11:34:15

Originally by: Elendar
Originally by: ThaDollaGenerale
Mr Blue > 07:47:16 Notify The station ROMANIA Renegades HQ has been captured by ElitistOps corporation!


What have you done! :facepalm:

Also why are our forums down?

sorryEmbarassed We didnt mean to....

Crossposted from SHC
Originally by: "Mr blue"
Battleupdate.
Short version: Captain Grath lead us onward to victory jet again. 4-c station falled into PL hands

background:
We suspected that Atlas combined with HTA and possible AAA was gonna try kill our pos in TPP that came out of RF during US tz. Possible massive supercapital fleet since Atlas had used quit a nice cap fleet the day before.

With a small but stiff and battlescared praetorian guard of 12 guardians and prob what was 20-30 diff t2 armor hacs with their rear guard covered by goons, Captain Grath formed a less glourius than usually Fist of **** to defend the pos without much hope of keeping it. Order was to defend it as long as possible, make it as expesive as possible for the attacker, but dont go stupid/sucide about it. The POS was deemed expendable.

Then Shamis in a Deadspace fitted Damnation decided that he was gonna go afk giving armor bonuses for the rest of the evening. "dont let me die" was his last order before running to drive bike or whatnot, orbiting the tower. The Dice was trown, it was either die trying or save the POS. We could not let Shamis die.

A small AAA(Outbreak gang) passed through, and we killed some odd ratters inc a Chimera that seemed it suitable to run around with PL in local/area.
To our suprice neither Atlas nor HTA seemed to form a fleet , and we repped our guns up without meeting any resistance. Incapped cynojammer and JB with our armor hac gang without meeting any resistance besides 1-2 singel bomb attempts and a drake jumping through JB while we was killing it, only to get wake up in a new clone not long after,

We called in capitals and got our pos repped up, then Shadoo suddenly popped his head in and went "mysterical" on coms, and not soon later his leviant jumped in and we got a quick message to jump our armor hac gang through.
Korinn (Cry havoc) was scouting in local and with a slightly sad tone went "If only I had had a active alliance by now" drooling by the look of the titan.
Til our grunts Suprice a what I think was a aprox 20 man mixed gang of merry HTA ppl with a handfull caps was trying to Station swap in 4-C(old owner was primary.), we killed a few before the rest docked, inc a chimera that must have been in struckture. Station was in aprox 60% struck. We found ourself in a odd situation, as we rly didnt want any sov nor station, but as real gentlemen we cant leave someones work halffinished, so we decided to do em a favor and finish it for em. So we not-so-swiftly took the station in the honour of missing Admiral Ray Butts without meeting any resistance. Some arguing about if Goons should get it or not occured, but with only 1 goon zealot as primary dmg dealer it was deemed to be too painfull to wait for him to get the final blow.
07:47:16 Notify The station ROMANIA Renegades HQ has been captured by ElitistOps corporation!

Apprently HTA had gotten a local talk ban, so any local talk communication was deemed impossible despite our persistent attempts. We therefor found ourself stuck with a station, and not too sure what to do with it.
We therefor sended a small but honourable group of the best problem solvers PL could offer on short notice, to try to find a peacefull solution with HTA through their TS3, which failed misserable as the whole PL diplomatic envoy got perma-banned before we could even present our chase properly. So much for their open diplomatic channels.

Ste Weiss
Gallente
modro
Strategic Operations Brigade
Posted - 2010.07.06 12:13:00 - [180]
 

Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
I know i'm a 'nobody' but i felt the need to add to this already emo-tastic thread.

My Corp was a member of GC not too long ago. We were brought in to be carebears when GC first moved into SP, but we like to shoot **** too. At the time, it appeared to me that Primary was much more active PvP-wise in the area. I would often fly a few jumps over, and hop in a Primary gang that was already busy fighting nuets/reds roaming into thier space. I hardly remember CTA's or HD's being called, everyone would simply dock-up or run when DARKSIDE came rolling through. I always thought Primary where good folks (personality wise) and it felt like GC where riding on CoW/Atlas's collective coattails.

CoW might be able to stand on thier own, but i think GC would have done much better staying and growing with Primary. Mya likes to talk about the great elephant pen15, when he was hardly ever seen on the field. Mukk and Faffy seem to hold 90% of GC's PvP ability (much respect to those 2, Mukk is still my fav FC evaaa) While Mya seems to fight his battles on CAOD while shipspinning, So don't sweat anything he says, he's on a power trip. Never really got to know CoW that well so i cant say too much for those guys, character wise.

GL Primary, you guys will be just fine ( I hope) look forward to watching the KB's and seeing you roll GC (primary Mukk = Win)


I think you mean we were told to DOCK when Darkside were in and around GC space, until a FC had some balls to FC against them and face MYA's "wrath" if we lost.

I remember the huge fight in KZF when primary where asking to get on coms with us so they could work with us but where told that GC where too busy to sort dual coms, so Primary did what they could and acted on their own ending up loosing their fleet as we were told to get off field and get safe, we were always told that Primary were the renters and they had to learn for themselves.

Now GC is ran by Mukk who is very respectable at PVP and GC so hopefully he can turn GC into something better than it was a few months back.

Good Luck Primary in whatever you guys do.

Ste


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