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Death4free
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2010.06.18 15:35:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Akita T


Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Also Death penalty dont work as a deterrent against criminals.

The death penalty in my system is not meant to be a deterrent at all Twisted Evil
It's purely a cost-savings measure YARRRR!!
The indentured servitude and heavy fines are the deterrent.



Please move to england and run as a conservative mp we need more people like you

Kuar Z'thain
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2010.06.18 16:01:00 - [32]
 

Akita T for Dictator! Twisted Evil

Ulhass
Caldari
Mindstar Technology
Posted - 2010.06.18 16:25:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: Zeredek
What did he do?


I guess he tried to escape from the courthouse he was being tried in for another crime and his girlfriend got a gun in there some how and he killed an attorney

Caldari Citizen20090217
Posted - 2010.06.18 16:54:00 - [34]
 

Ah firing squads. They aim to please. Even if they are bang out of order. OK i'll stop now.

Quote:
I would only have three types of punishment, ever :
* fines (as a combo of fixed amount plus percent of networth plus percent of recent income),
* limited-time slavery-like indentured servitude (for those that can't pay the fines even with loans, i.e. those unable to become wage-slaves),
* and death (for those that can't properly serve as slave-a-likes for some reason, be it bad behaviour as a slave or inability to do anything useful as a slave).



Long live Akita's vision of a purely economic based punishment system. A world where if I save up enough I can commit any crime without meaningful consequence (ok I lose some stuff). You could even expand it and make the punishment received based on the net worth of the victim - so killing a person of less value to society has less consequence Twisted Evil That'll motivate people to get off welfare and provide a useful means of population control and wealth redistribution in economic downturns. YARRRR!!


Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2010.06.18 19:10:00 - [35]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 18/06/2010 19:12:32
Originally by: Caldari Citizen20090217
Quote:
I would only have three types of punishment, ever :
* fines (as a combo of fixed amount plus percent of networth plus percent of recent income),
* limited-time slavery-like indentured servitude (for those that can't pay the fines even with loans, i.e. those unable to become wage-slaves),
* and death (for those that can't properly serve as slave-a-likes for some reason, be it bad behaviour as a slave or inability to do anything useful as a slave).

Long live Akita's vision of a purely economic based punishment system. A world where if I save up enough I can commit any crime without meaningful consequence (ok I lose some stuff). You could even expand it and make the punishment received based on the net worth of the victim - so killing a person of less value to society has less consequence Twisted Evil That'll motivate people to get off welfare and provide a useful means of population control and wealth redistribution in economic downturns. YARRRR!!

Hey, who says "first degree murder" couldn't have a penalty of, oh, say "fixed amount judicial and investigative fee + 100% of your current networth punitive measure + typical payout value for the victim's life insurance accidental death payout as compensation for victim's family regardless of whether the person had any insurance at all or not" ?
That would make it an almost instant sent-into-slavery thing (unless, of course, you can work like a madman to pay off the money you borrowed to "pay the fine").
I don't know, losing everything you have AND being plunged into debt quite heavily (the more "important" the person killed, the worse the extra on top of losing everything you have) sounds like a pretty nasty punishment you'd actually want to avoid.

So Sensational
Ministry of War
Posted - 2010.06.18 20:16:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Akita T

Meh. Long live the reboot of the dark ages Twisted Evil

I would only have three types of punishment, ever :
* fines (as a combo of fixed amount plus percent of networth plus percent of recent income),
* limited-time slavery-like indentured servitude (for those that can't pay the fines even with loans, i.e. those unable to become wage-slaves),
* and death (for those that can't properly serve as slave-a-likes for some reason, be it bad behaviour as a slave or inability to do anything useful as a slave).

Prison is for wishy-washies. Long live modern slavery. Death to the criminally useless.
Don't want to be fined/enslaved/killed ? DON'T COMMIT CRIMES.
Of course, the list of crimes would have to be radically revamped too... it's only a crime if there was actual prejudice to somebody else except you, and punishment will fit the damage you dealt to others. Stuff you do to yourself ? Go ahead, do anything you want, nobody cares.



QFE.

Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
Posted - 2010.06.18 22:09:00 - [37]
 

Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 18/06/2010 22:09:33
Originally by: Akita T
Hey, who says "first degree murder" couldn't have a penalty of, oh, say "fixed amount judicial and investigative fee + 100% of your current networth punitive measure + typical payout value for the victim's life insurance accidental death payout as compensation for victim's family regardless of whether the person had any insurance at all or not" ?


Sorry, this is just ****ing stupid.

Here is what would happen:

1) Rich guy gives all of his assets to a friend.

2) Rich guy kills someone.

3) Rich guy (if he is even convicted) pays the penalty of 100% of his zero net worth.

4) Rich guy's friend "loans" him the money to pay the other costs.

5) Rich guy's friend gives him all of his assets back.


End result: if you have enough money, you can kill anyone you want and just pay a fine. Perhaps we could even simplify the system and build it into the murder weapon? When you pull the trigger, the gun automatically deducts the appropriate price from your bank accounts, saving the state all the trouble of actually convicting you?

Quote:
I don't know, losing everything you have AND being plunged into debt quite heavily (the more "important" the person killed, the worse the extra on top of losing everything you have) sounds like a pretty nasty punishment you'd actually want to avoid.


Ah, this is entirely a fair justice system. It is perfectly obvious that killing a rich person should have a much higher price than killing some poor homeless guy. Maybe for the lowest of the undesirable members of society we could just sell hunting licenses? Pay $1 million to the state as an advance "fine", and you get to kill as many homeless people as you can in one weekend? You could even sell the TV rights to cover the cost of your "punishment"!




So, let me guess, you're one of those "I'm rich already, screw the rest of you" libertarians, aren't you?

Jago Kain
Amarr
Ramm's RDI
Tactical Narcotics Team
Posted - 2010.06.18 22:18:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Merin Ryskin
...Maybe for the lowest of the undesirable members of society we could just sell hunting licenses?...


Y'know; as much as I dissaprove of capital punishment and as much as I know you're being sarcastic for emphasis and not in any way proposing this seriously, I live near Birkenhead and can't quite bring myself to hate the idea. EmbarassedTwisted Evil

So Sensational
Ministry of War
Posted - 2010.06.19 00:41:00 - [39]
 

Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Maybe for the lowest of the undesirable members of society we could just sell hunting licenses? Pay $1 million to the state as an advance "fine", and you get to kill as many homeless people as you can in one weekend? You could even sell the TV rights to cover the cost of your "punishment"!





Wow... that's a great idea! I think you might be a genius, we should immediately implement this idea.

rValdez5987
Amarr
Imperial Guard.
Posted - 2010.06.19 00:52:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 18/06/2010 11:12:04

Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Any country with death penalty is a nation still with a foot in the dark ages.


Meh. Long live the reboot of the dark ages Twisted Evil

I would only have three types of punishment, ever :
* fines (as a combo of fixed amount plus percent of networth plus percent of recent income),
* limited-time slavery-like indentured servitude (for those that can't pay the fines even with loans, i.e. those unable to become wage-slaves),
* and death (for those that can't properly serve as slave-a-likes for some reason, be it bad behaviour as a slave or inability to do anything useful as a slave).

Prison is for wishy-washies. Long live modern slavery. Death to the criminally useless.
Don't want to be fined/enslaved/killed ? DON'T COMMIT CRIMES.
Of course, the list of crimes would have to be radically revamped too... it's only a crime if there was actual prejudice to somebody else except you, and punishment will fit the damage you dealt to others. Stuff you do to yourself ? Go ahead, do anything you want, nobody cares.

As for the death method, again, who cares. LET THEM PICK IT THEMSELVES (as long as it fits the budget).
Sleeping pills ? Lethal injection ? Drug overdose for their drug of choice ? Electric chair ? Robot firing squad ? Brick of C4 ? Decapitation ? Several hand grenades ? Drop a 64-ton weight on them for all I know. Or give them the option of a loaded shotgun after you put them in solitary with nothing to eat or drink, open the cell a week later.
They're dead either way, so it doesn't matter how they die, might as well let them pick their own death method, as long as it ensures their death.


Man, I would totally have a zero percent approval rating as a country leader Laughing
Actually, the scary thought would be that I might actually get a high approval rating.



HOLY **** THIS ^^^^^^^^^^ times 1 million. Seriously. I approve.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2010.06.19 03:54:00 - [41]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2010 04:41:43

Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Originally by: Akita T
Hey, who says "first degree murder" couldn't have a penalty of, oh, say "fixed amount judicial and investigative fee + 100% of your current networth punitive measure + typical payout value for the victim's life insurance accidental death payout as compensation for victim's family regardless of whether the person had any insurance at all or not" ?

Sorry, this is just ****ing stupid.
Here is what would happen:
1) Rich guy gives all of his assets to a friend.
2) Rich guy kills someone.
3) Rich guy (if he is even convicted) pays the penalty of 100% of his zero net worth.
4) Rich guy's friend "loans" him the money to pay the other costs.
5) Rich guy's friend gives him all of his assets back.
End result: if you have enough money, you can kill anyone you want and just pay a fine. Perhaps we could even simplify the system and build it into the murder weapon? When you pull the trigger, the gun automatically deducts the appropriate price from your bank accounts, saving the state all the trouble of actually convicting you?

NONONO, you see, you ALSO abolish any form of paper cash, shut down all privately-owned banks, and force everybody into a single government-issues universal payment account, pretty much like the wallet in EVE.
Afterwards, each and every transaction is purely electronic, and you have to fill in a reason for making a payment.
We also abolish the IRS or any similar agency in its current form, since all taxes and dues and whatnot are automatically processed by the system.

Obviously, the trial would not just focus on the forensics of the crime being investigated, but also on the forensics of your networth. Twisted Evil

Fiscal evasion, no matter how minimal, would probably be one of the harshest crimes you could commit. Yes, even worse than murder. Why ? Because you have no excuse of not knowing how to file your papers (the system does it automatically), and you had to go way out of your way to make it get confused. And because the only reason to do it would be to escape proper punishment for any other crimes.
Razz

Quote:
Quote:
I don't know, losing everything you have AND being plunged into debt quite heavily (the more "important" the person killed, the worse the extra on top of losing everything you have) sounds like a pretty nasty punishment you'd actually want to avoid.

Ah, this is entirely a fair justice system. It is perfectly obvious that killing a rich person should have a much higher price than killing some poor homeless guy.

Actually, it _IS_ perfectly obvious. Evil or Very Mad
Some human lives ARE worth more than others. Even orders of magnitude more, in some cases.
The current justice systems would punish the person that kills a random nobody pretty much the same as somebody who killed Stephen Hawking.
That is simply wrong.

Quote:
Maybe for the lowest of the undesirable members of society we could just sell hunting licenses? Pay $1 million to the state as an advance "fine", and you get to kill as many homeless people as you can in one weekend? You could even sell the TV rights to cover the cost of your "punishment"!

No, that's just silly. And a waste of perfectly good, cheap human resources. YARRRR!!Twisted Evil
Besides, there would be no homeless people. Everybody would get some form of employment to cover minimal room and board, if not much else. Oh, you don't like cleaning pigeon poo off of statues just so you can live in a bunk bed and eat military style rations and get paid absolutely nothing extra ? GET A JOB then.

Quote:
So, let me guess, you're one of those "I'm rich already, screw the rest of you" libertarians, aren't you?

If by "rich" you mean "I have no debts, no significant assets, a reasonable income and some modest savings", then yeah, I'm sort of, kind of rich.
ugh

Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
Posted - 2010.06.19 04:42:00 - [42]
 

Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 19/06/2010 04:44:00
Originally by: Akita T
NONONO, you see, you ALSO abolish any form of paper cash, shut down all privately-owned banks, and force everybody into a single government-issues universal payment account, pretty much like the wallet in EVE.
Afterwards, each and every transaction is purely electronic, and you have to fill in a reason for making a payment.
We also abolish the IRS or any similar agency in its current form, since all taxes and dues and whatnot are automatically processed by the system.


Can I have some of what you've been smoking? Do you have even the slightest clue how much work this system would involve? And that's ignoring the complete impossibility of ever getting the necessary laws passed. We can't even "punish" banks more than a weak "please don't do that again, now how much more money can we give you?" for ripping off countless people and nearly destroying our entire economy. How can you possibly think that any government would EVER eliminate banks entirely?


PS: if you actually think this would stop rich people from finding loopholes, you're a gullible moron. Rich people ALWAYS find loopholes, and if they don't, they bribe their representatives to fix the laws and add a few. Or, they just leave your country and laugh as your entire economy collapses.

Quote:
Actually, it _IS_ perfectly obvious.
Some human lives ARE worth more than others. Even orders of magnitude more, in some cases.
The current justice systems would punish the person that kills a random nobody pretty much the same as somebody who killed Stephen Hawking.
That is simply wrong.


And of course it is blindingly obvious that you are one of the "more valuable" people. It's easy to say that the lives of all those "lesser" people aren't worth as much when you aren't one of them.


Quote:
No, that's just silly. And a waste of perfectly good, cheap human resources.


It is the inevitable conclusion of your insane system: if some lives are worth more than others, why shouldn't someone with enough wealth be able to buy the life of someone "less valuable"? Having a scaled system of "value"-based punishments for murder doesn't work if murdering even the most "worthless" person gives you so much of a punishment that your life is effectively over.


Quote:
Besides, there would be no homeless people. Everybody would get some form of employment to cover minimal room and board, if not much else. Oh, you don't like cleaning pigeon poo off of statues just so you can live in a bunk bed and eat military style rations and get paid absolutely nothing extra ? GET A JOB then.


Let me guess, refusing to work = execution?

Hint for the ****ing clueless: we TRY to give homeless people jobs. Some people are just lazy and/or suffering from addictions or mental problems that prevent them from getting a job.

Quote:
no debts, no significant assets, a reasonable income and some modest savings", then yeah, I'm sort of, kind of rich.


IOW, yes, you're rich. It's very easy to talk about systems like you proposed when you're one of the comfortable elite. I suspect if you were one of those "less valuable" people, you wouldn't be so eager to insist that some lives are worth more than others.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2010.06.19 04:44:00 - [43]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2010 04:55:26
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Can I have some of what you've been smoking?

Sarcasm root. Does your sense of humour good Wink
Have some, it's on the house.
Pick up a cup of Devil's Advocate tea while you're at it, I had a fresh pot brewing.
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
IOW, yes, you're rich.

Wouldn't I technically be better described as middle class ?

M'ktakh
Posted - 2010.06.19 05:10:00 - [44]
 

Akita, I expected you, a resident of a former communist country (you are from Romania, IIRC, no?) to have better ideas then "give everyone a job so they have room and board". Look how well that worked out for you. Or us, for that matter (I live on the other side of the Carpathian Wasteland).

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2010.06.19 05:25:00 - [45]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2010 05:29:38
Originally by: M'ktakh
Akita, I expected you, a resident of a former communist country (you are from Romania, IIRC, no?) to have better ideas then "give everyone a job so they have room and board". Look how well that worked out for you. Or us, for that matter (I live on the other side of the Carpathian Wasteland).

Actually, it worked exquisitely until the dictator decided to pay back all the country's debts and imposed harsh austerity measures, and even then, people were overall just mildly displeased... it was only AFTER all debts had already been repaid for a while but the austerity measures REMAINED in place exactly the same way as before that people started to get upset. Yes, for people not from around here, we had ZERO external debt (not sure any country in the world now can say that), we had some healthy exports going, and other countries had debts to us.
Immediately after the "revolution" all industry was cast into chaos, petty political rivalries and rampant corruption combined with downright criminal incompetence (that went unpunished) ensured economic disasters, when things got really bad we started borrowing again, and we've been borrowing more and more ever since.
We're now basically almost as bad off as Greece, we're just not really admitting it.

Intense Thinker
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.06.19 09:41:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Zeredek
What did he do?


Can baiting in a noob system

Lord Matrix
Flying Banana Squad
Posted - 2010.06.19 10:51:00 - [47]
 

Instead of having to deal with criminals, the society would be better of preventing the circumstances for a crime from appearing in the first place. Replace the monetary based economy with a resource based economy so there is no monetary incentive to commit a crime. It also fixes poverty, hunger and other problems we have atm. We are technologically advanced enough to abolish 90% of all the current jobs, so people don't need to work to survive. This will be the real freedom. What we have now is just payed slavery.

Casen Vherok
Posted - 2010.06.19 11:28:00 - [48]
 

anyone who is in jail for over 5 years should be executed tbh
would save alot taxpayers money

and probly make ppl think twice b4 comiting crime


Dred 'Morte
New European Regiment
Blade.
Posted - 2010.06.19 16:57:00 - [49]
 

There's only one reason I disagree with death penalty: the judicial system (in all countries, some more than others) is imperfect.

There's always a chance that an innocent person might be sentenced to death.

If there is no death penalty, that decision might still be reversed at some point and the person will still be able to, hopefully, live a few good years. IMHO, that's a good enough reason to abolish death penalty.

For the record, I'm a Libertarian. I believe there is only one minority, the individual, and only one right, right to Life - from which the Right to Freedom and Propriety derive. I don't see how this right interferes with death penalty however. It's matter of stretching the idea of self-defence. If you deny an innocent person of their right to life, you surrender yours too. It's also kinda like that saying: your freedom ends when another's begins.

Dred 'Morte
New European Regiment
Blade.
Posted - 2010.06.19 17:27:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: Lord Matrix
Instead of having to deal with criminals, the society would be better of preventing the circumstances for a crime from appearing in the first place. Replace the monetary based economy with a resource based economy so there is no monetary incentive to commit a crime. It also fixes poverty, hunger and other problems we have atm. We are technologically advanced enough to abolish 90% of all the current jobs, so people don't need to work to survive. This will be the real freedom. What we have now is just payed slavery.


No, that's stupid. It's some kind of communism that only works with authoritarianism and it would fail very quickly. Also, there wouldn't be a EVE Online in this stupid utopia of yours.

Vogue
Short Bus Pole Dancers
Posted - 2010.06.19 17:29:00 - [51]
 

They should bring back the old colonial prisons and give prisoners a choice. Go to a regular prison facility or be bold and get sent to an island that is given basic living materials, is sealed off and the prisoners are left to their own devices.

Dred 'Morte
New European Regiment
Blade.
Posted - 2010.06.19 17:33:00 - [52]
 

And lots of traps around the island in case anyone tries to run away. Where I have I seen that Laughing

Amitious Turkey
Gallente
TarNec
Posted - 2010.06.19 18:07:00 - [53]
 

Originally by: Tallaran Kouros
Originally by: Ak'athra J'ador

its the same with laws about guns. people say having them makes them safer. and I agree that is correct for the time being. but you must understand what the fact that anyone can have a gun does to the mentality of people.

if people weren't allowed to have guns the mentality would change. not for us, and probably not even for our children, but in the long-run it would be a beneficial change for humanity in general.


I don't want to reignite this old argument again, but I can't let this pass unchallenged.

Gun ownership and gun crime in the US is far, far different to how it is in Europe - the culture is completely different in Europe and we do not have the same problems.


I'll reignite itTwisted Evil
There is one simple thing you're forgetting, Ak'athra. That is, criminals don't care about the law.
If you take guns away from law-abiding citizens, they don't have any protection against the criminals who still have guns and the means to get them. By the time the police got to the scene of a crime, all of the action is already over, because the law abiding citizen got shot in the two minutes it took the police to arrive. If you took away guns, to replace the security they provide, you would have to post a policeman (with a gun) on the stoops of every citizen.
Guns are a tool of the one who wields them, nothing more. Guns don't make people bloodthirsty maniacs.
It's much like arguing to take away knives. Knives can be used as weapons. Heck, almost anything can be used as a weapon. Guns are just currently the most effective one. Even if you took away everything in the world, people would kill each other with their bare hands. You might as well give the whole population access to guns, because guns are equalizers. A 90-year old granny can fend off a 200-pound, musclebound man with the small pistol she keeps in her purse.

It may be different in Europe, but I doubt it, since human nature is what it is. But it might be different in Europe simply because their old people outnumber their young people, and the young people are coming from Muslim countries because they have huge families.

Vogue
Short Bus Pole Dancers
Posted - 2010.06.19 18:10:00 - [54]
 

Edited by: Vogue on 19/06/2010 18:11:54
TLDR version: Criminal that gets away with stuff and does business with the weak police, spies, politicians is a gangster that has leverage and an empire of dirt. And they don't all look like criminals. A lot of them have regular jobs and think themselves respectable *oink*

Dred 'Morte
New European Regiment
Blade.
Posted - 2010.06.19 18:44:00 - [55]
 

Edited by: Dred ''Morte on 19/06/2010 18:45:35
Europe is a big place with many different countries and laws.

Here in Portugal there is crapload of bad laws, regulations and one of the lousiest judicial systems.

Yet, a few weeks ago, someone close to where I live was assaulted in his house by gipsies. He had guns in his house. He shot the bastards, sadly, in the legs. He is not in jail. In fact, he is far more scared of those ****ing gipsies families than the police.

On the other hand, someone who lives right next to me got robbed in a street, in broad daylight and got slashed in the neck, almost died. The bandit was caught and released immidiatly.

I really believe the only justice that one can have in this country is the one you make for yourself. Which is why I support gun ownership and liberalization.

ps: better not get started on gipsies... Mad

Derovius Vaden
Posted - 2010.06.19 18:55:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 18/06/2010 11:12:04

Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Any country with death penalty is a nation still with a foot in the dark ages.


Meh. Long live the reboot of the dark ages Twisted Evil

I would only have three types of punishment, ever :
* fines (as a combo of fixed amount plus percent of networth plus percent of recent income),
* limited-time slavery-like indentured servitude (for those that can't pay the fines even with loans, i.e. those unable to become wage-slaves),
* and death (for those that can't properly serve as slave-a-likes for some reason, be it bad behaviour as a slave or inability to do anything useful as a slave).

Prison is for wishy-washies. Long live modern slavery. Death to the criminally useless.
Don't want to be fined/enslaved/killed ? DON'T COMMIT CRIMES.
Of course, the list of crimes would have to be radically revamped too... it's only a crime if there was actual prejudice to somebody else except you, and punishment will fit the damage you dealt to others. Stuff you do to yourself ? Go ahead, do anything you want, nobody cares.

As for the death method, again, who cares. LET THEM PICK IT THEMSELVES (as long as it fits the budget).
Sleeping pills ? Lethal injection ? Drug overdose for their drug of choice ? Electric chair ? Robot firing squad ? Brick of C4 ? Decapitation ? Several hand grenades ? Drop a 64-ton weight on them for all I know. Or give them the option of a loaded shotgun after you put them in solitary with nothing to eat or drink, open the cell a week later.
They're dead either way, so it doesn't matter how they die, might as well let them pick their own death method, as long as it ensures their death.


Man, I would totally have a zero percent approval rating as a country leader Laughing
Actually, the scary thought would be that I might actually get a high approval rating.



Akita has my vote, there are too many liberal pansies in the world today putting the rights of the criminal first and everyone else second. Do mistakes happen in a legal system? Absolutely. Do they happen to already unsavoury people? You bet your ass. I've never broken the law, I've never been of interest to the police, and I am in no position to be put to death should it be legally possible in Canada.

As such, I am completely for capital punishment, and I dare say the punishment should be broadened to crimes other then murder and treason. Hell, bring in the Islamic literary interpretation of the Quran for stealing too; even if cutting of their hand doesnt stop them from stealing at least you can thieves out in a crowd. Rolling Eyes

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2010.06.19 19:48:00 - [57]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 18/06/2010 11:12:04

Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Any country with death penalty is a nation still with a foot in the dark ages.


Meh. Long live the reboot of the dark ages Twisted Evil

I would only have three types of punishment, ever :
* fines (as a combo of fixed amount plus percent of networth plus percent of recent income),
* limited-time slavery-like indentured servitude (for those that can't pay the fines even with loans, i.e. those unable to become wage-slaves),
* and death (for those that can't properly serve as slave-a-likes for some reason, be it bad behaviour as a slave or inability to do anything useful as a slave).

Prison is for wishy-washies. Long live modern slavery. Death to the criminally useless.
Don't want to be fined/enslaved/killed ? DON'T COMMIT CRIMES.
Of course, the list of crimes would have to be radically revamped too... it's only a crime if there was actual prejudice to somebody else except you, and punishment will fit the damage you dealt to others. Stuff you do to yourself ? Go ahead, do anything you want, nobody cares.

As for the death method, again, who cares. LET THEM PICK IT THEMSELVES (as long as it fits the budget).
Sleeping pills ? Lethal injection ? Drug overdose for their drug of choice ? Electric chair ? Robot firing squad ? Brick of C4 ? Decapitation ? Several hand grenades ? Drop a 64-ton weight on them for all I know. Or give them the option of a loaded shotgun after you put them in solitary with nothing to eat or drink, open the cell a week later.
They're dead either way, so it doesn't matter how they die, might as well let them pick their own death method, as long as it ensures their death.


Man, I would totally have a zero percent approval rating as a country leader Laughing
Actually, the scary thought would be that I might actually get a high approval rating.



Clearly you're not applying the lessons you (should) have learned in EVE to RL.

When someone proposes a mechanics change, the first test you apply is "how could I exploit this".

Giving the state a huge economic incentive to criminalise people (in addition to all the other incentives they already have) is mouth-breathingly, droolingly, window-licking, dog-dirt eating, massive brain trauma-level ******ED.

Derovius Vaden
Posted - 2010.06.19 20:01:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 18/06/2010 11:12:04

Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Any country with death penalty is a nation still with a foot in the dark ages.


Meh. Long live the reboot of the dark ages Twisted Evil

I would only have three types of punishment, ever :
* fines (as a combo of fixed amount plus percent of networth plus percent of recent income),
* limited-time slavery-like indentured servitude (for those that can't pay the fines even with loans, i.e. those unable to become wage-slaves),
* and death (for those that can't properly serve as slave-a-likes for some reason, be it bad behaviour as a slave or inability to do anything useful as a slave).

Prison is for wishy-washies. Long live modern slavery. Death to the criminally useless.
Don't want to be fined/enslaved/killed ? DON'T COMMIT CRIMES.
Of course, the list of crimes would have to be radically revamped too... it's only a crime if there was actual prejudice to somebody else except you, and punishment will fit the damage you dealt to others. Stuff you do to yourself ? Go ahead, do anything you want, nobody cares.

As for the death method, again, who cares. LET THEM PICK IT THEMSELVES (as long as it fits the budget).
Sleeping pills ? Lethal injection ? Drug overdose for their drug of choice ? Electric chair ? Robot firing squad ? Brick of C4 ? Decapitation ? Several hand grenades ? Drop a 64-ton weight on them for all I know. Or give them the option of a loaded shotgun after you put them in solitary with nothing to eat or drink, open the cell a week later.
They're dead either way, so it doesn't matter how they die, might as well let them pick their own death method, as long as it ensures their death.


Man, I would totally have a zero percent approval rating as a country leader Laughing
Actually, the scary thought would be that I might actually get a high approval rating.



Clearly you're not applying the lessons you (should) have learned in EVE to RL.

When someone proposes a mechanics change, the first test you apply is "how could I exploit this".

Giving the state a huge economic incentive to criminalise people (in addition to all the other incentives they already have) is mouth-breathingly, droolingly, window-licking, dog-dirt eating, massive brain trauma-level ******ED.


So... it was acceptable to enslave people until they built your economy up to that of a world power... but not acceptable to enslave them after the fact. Interesting indeed.

Ak'athra J'ador
Amarr
Imperial Shipment
Posted - 2010.06.19 20:56:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: Amitious Turkey

I'll reignite itTwisted Evil
There is one simple thing you're forgetting, Ak'athra. That is, criminals don't care about the law.
If you take guns away from law-abiding citizens, they don't have any protection against the criminals who still have guns and the means to get them. By the time the police got to the scene of a crime, all of the action is already over, because the law abiding citizen got shot in the two minutes it took the police to arrive.


you are thinking in a very limited fashion (as in what lies in my backyard).I didn't say it would be better for you or for me, or even for our children and grandchildren. it would take a while, but eventually the mentality would change, but you cant possibly expect it to change in a stagnant system, where everyone believes everyone else has a gun. no wonder you keep shooting each-other. and we will continue to shoot each-other as long as guns are present.

take a tank for example. nobody has one at home, it is something only the military posses. and they aren't that uncommon or expensive, every army has one. yet a person does not even consider buying one. its in the mentality, and it is the same with guns.

look I understand. your a good guy. you would only use your gun and kill a person to protect your children/wife. but you are encouraging a society where killing a person is acceptable, and you are teaching that to those children.

one day you child dies at the end of a gun, its partially your fault, you encouraged it.

Originally by: Amitious Turkey

But it might be different in Europe simply because their old people outnumber their young people, and the young people are coming from Muslim countries because they have huge families.


ammm what?




Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2010.06.19 21:54:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: Derovius Vaden


So... it was acceptable to enslave people until they built your economy up to that of a world power... but not acceptable to enslave them after the fact. Interesting indeed.


Where on earth did I say that slavery was acceptable? Or even remotely imply that it was?

On a side note, what country are you from? The odds are very very good indeed that your country was fine with slavery until a century or two ago, and that it did a lot less to put an end to slavery than mine did.


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