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blankseplocked 0.0 Alliances live this everyday.
 
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Raiden Kaine
Kaine Innovation
Posted - 2010.06.06 17:18:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Raiden Kaine on 06/06/2010 17:19:25
The 0.0 alliances are wiping the floor with these high-sec / pirate (low-sec) corps. They live this everyday and as you can see from today's matches they are far better at fleet comp, strats and fc shot calling.

I'm just saying there is a very distinct advantage and you can see it in the matches.

Thresh Avery
Best Path Inc.
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2010.06.06 17:20:00 - [2]
 

Yeah, but there are some good low sec teams too, because small gang PvP is really what the tournament is about. For example Star Fraction have a history of doing relatively well and thinking up some good setups. Smile

Raiden Kaine
Kaine Innovation
Posted - 2010.06.06 17:31:00 - [3]
 

No doubt that there is some strong small-gang pvp fighters out there. I wanted the Tusker Bastards to win myself. It's just what I have seen so far is not what I expected.

darius mclever
Posted - 2010.06.06 17:31:00 - [4]
 

For typical 0.0 combat we miss 10 titans and 10 motherships at the gate. 250 people blobs on each side and more black screens.

Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.06.06 17:33:00 - [5]
 

One day I hope I can join a 0.0 alliance so I can learn how to PvP like all the best players in the game!

Raiden Kaine
Kaine Innovation
Posted - 2010.06.06 17:37:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Dez Affinity
One day I hope I can join a 0.0 alliance so I can learn how to PvP like all the best players in the game!


Rolling Eyes

Dez Affinity
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.06.06 17:47:00 - [7]
 

I don't know I just think it would be great to be able to form fleets and have 'fleet commanders' and call targets and stuff, sounds like an exciting new way to play the game for us empire dwellers.

Tyrrax Thorrk
Amarr
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.06.06 17:50:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Raiden Kaine
Edited by: Raiden Kaine on 06/06/2010 17:19:25
The 0.0 alliances are wiping the floor with these high-sec / pirate (low-sec) corps. They live this everyday and as you can see from today's matches they are far better at fleet comp, strats and fc shot calling.

I'm just saying there is a very distinct advantage and you can see it in the matches.


MM didn't wipe the floor with us and i'm pretty sure the parts of our alliance that actually login are mostly in lowsec ;O

Massive Dragon
Genos Occidere
Posted - 2010.06.06 18:02:00 - [9]
 

yeh those big named 0.0 alliances are surely so much better than the rest of us.


Kobalth
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2010.06.06 18:35:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Kobalth on 06/06/2010 18:35:30
Confirming that being in a 0.0 alliance makes you able to stand the lag in Jita

ThrashPower
Gallente
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2010.06.06 18:37:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: ThrashPower on 07/06/2010 03:20:40
NRDS alliances also seem to have a hard time in the tournament, both hydra and cva lost their first match.
Let's hope The Star Fraction can turn this trend when they fight their match later tonight.

edit: whoops.

Raiden Kaine
Kaine Innovation
Posted - 2010.06.06 18:38:00 - [12]
 

@Tyrrax - Mainly talking about today's matches (i.e. Tusker Bastards / Ivy - whom both had my vote to win)

@Massive - Didn't mean to step on your e-peen, so small and all, couldn't see it.

Strider Hiryu
Kangaroos With Frickin Lazerbeams
Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns
Posted - 2010.06.06 21:11:00 - [13]
 

100% Fact
Empire people are simple minded.
Unable to fathom the superior tactics of 0.0
Also following FC orders in a 200 man gang like sheep is EXTREMLY hard,
Only a hardernd 0.0 PVPer could manage such draining mental stimulation.
0.0 Will PWN the alliance torny.

Shocked

Narciss Sevar
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.06.06 21:23:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Thresh Avery
Yeah, but there are some good low sec teams too, because small gang PvP is really what the tournament is about. For example Star Fraction have a history of doing relatively well and thinking up some good setups. Smile
lol

Omara Otawan
Posted - 2010.06.06 21:24:00 - [15]
 

Hmm, out of 4 lowsec alliances 3 won their matches? Seems to be a better overall ratio then the 0.0 alliances tbh.

Teinyhr
Minmatar
A Club for Reputable Gentlemen
Posted - 2010.06.06 21:26:00 - [16]
 

0.0 Alliances live blob warfare every day. I'm surprised they can actually kill something without bringing out 500+ ships.

Caellach Marellus
Gallente
Nephtys Ventures inc
Posted - 2010.06.06 21:48:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: ThrashPower
NBSI alliances also seem to have a hard time in the tournament, both hydra and cva lost their first match.
Let's hope The Star Fraction can turn this trend when they fight their match later tonight.


You mean NRDS, and EM won so the trend was already turned.

Palolko Dwimer
CHON
THE R0NIN
Posted - 2010.06.06 21:57:00 - [18]
 

We had 7 previous AT.
How many High/low sec alliances were successful? (let's say 1st - 4th place)

AppleBanana
Posted - 2010.06.06 23:19:00 - [19]
 

If anything 0.0 alliances are at a disadvantage in AT, they simply arn't used to fighting in lag-free situations.

Ikoras
Minmatar
Final Agony
B A N E
Posted - 2010.06.07 00:27:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Palolko Dwimer
We had 7 previous AT.
How many High/low sec alliances were successful? (let's say 1st - 4th place)


We Finished 3rd in BYVI

Gwendion
Gallente
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2010.06.07 09:49:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Kobalth
Edited by: Kobalth on 06/06/2010 18:35:30
Confirming that being in a 0.0 alliance makes you able to stand the lag in Jita


Wait wait, theres lag in Jita? :P

Spatiopathe
Posted - 2010.06.07 12:10:00 - [22]
 

Edited by: Spatiopathe on 07/06/2010 12:17:26
bull****, tournament fights doesnt look like to eve fight...

In eve we have:
- more logistic
- more scramble ship and bububle ship..
- cloaking use
- more gank and less balanced fights
- intel
- less expensive ship.

and everybody who play in team have teamplay, and can do great job.

The real difference between match isnt the pilot but their fit and team setup.
many of looser and winner team could have different result with a different fitting.
there's ofc many error of fit, or risked FC decision.

Most of the match were won before beginning, because its a rochambeau game, very few team can beat all opposant, because you can always have an opponent who have the perfect setup for beat you.

by example, we saw saturday the last match:
-red overlord pwned erebus with 3 machariel/6frig angel. 2min fight perfect dps.
and we saw sunday the last match:
-tormentum pwned star fraction with 3 rookh ladar jam against also 3machariel, and angel/matar ship...coz they know theuir opponent had angel/matar ship.

Now if you put ROL team against tormentum team, tormentum would pwned ROL despite best players.., but it wont happen coz each match have different setup..

each match is different that independant from alliance or skill.

steave435
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.06.07 15:50:00 - [23]
 

Edited by: steave435 on 07/06/2010 15:52:04
Huge 0.0 alliances have 3 main advantages compared to the usually much smaller low and high sec alliances yes.
1. Due to being much larger, they have a much larger base to find skilled pilots for the ships they'd like to field, both in terms of charachter and actual player skills.

2. Again due to larger numbers, they have an easier time testing. Smaller alliance can have trouble with getting enough people together to be able to field 2 full teams with properly skilled pilots for the ships that they want to use for testing on sisi.

3. Those higher numbers allow them to defend high value assets like profitable moons, meaning they generally have much more isk and therefore only have to consider the point costs when making a setup. Less wealthy alliances though need to also consider if they can actually afford to field, for example, a team consisting completely of pirate faction ships and an officer fitted flagship.

To make up for that though, the small alliances are used to fighting in small groups, they know eachother better and while the big 0.0 fights usually involve either RR BS or some kind of sniper fleet where you just warp in, align and start shooting and click warp if you get shot yourself, those smaller alliance will be more used to manually piloting their ships.

Grunanca
Final Agony
B A N E
Posted - 2010.06.07 18:42:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Palolko Dwimer
We had 7 previous AT.
How many High/low sec alliances were successful? (let's say 1st - 4th place)



Funny you say it. PL has this statue in Amamake from back when they won a turnament as a pirate alliance.
Last year first place was again PL, yes they were bigger, but still have their roots in low sec.

Third place last year was taken by the team I was on, BYVI. Thats another pirate alliance right there.

Look at the matches from this weekend. Most of the low sec alliances all have 125 points, which means once again they are winning.

Considering our way smaller wallets and 1/10 the size of some of the big alliances, its fairly obvious who got the biggest percentage of skilled pvpers. Just watching some of the "oh so great" 0.0 alliances misuse such expensive ships, made me want to cry...

steave435
Caldari
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.06.07 19:48:00 - [25]
 

Quote:
Funny you say it. PL has this statue in Amamake from back when they won a turnament as a pirate alliance. Last year first place was again PL, yes they were bigger, but still have their roots in low sec.

Yeah, PL is a combination of the advantages that large alliances have while still not being large enough to turn into grunts with just the FC knowing what he's doing. Best of both worlds.

To be clear, I consider the second part of my previous post to completely make up for the large alliances advantage since pilot skill and smart setups (which does not have to mean expensive), but if you can hold on to that while getting the mentioned advantages too then that's hard to beat (which is why PL is so sucessfull).

Commoner
Caldari
The Tuskers
Posted - 2010.06.07 23:41:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Commoner on 07/06/2010 23:42:01
Speaking on behalf of my Alliance i think there are a few things that might tell us why some of the larger entities "generally <--" (note that word) fares better.

1) My personal expirience in the matter is that we have had, at times difficult to field the team with the pilots of the required skills.

2) Funding, living as a pirate doesn't get you rich (unless you're smartbombing rancer and killing a 2b noobship carrying 2b in implants) so actually by the looks for us this has been quite a large splash of money for those that are participating, and is paid mostly out of own pockets and donations from each contestants and corp members.

Also, the general consensus has been that this was more about showing the flag, and making history. (Losing the first flagship in the history of the tournament)... Very Happy

Also, the tournament is Paper,Rock,Scissors....especially the match between Hydra and Agony empire comes to mind....2 competent corps...never imagined it to end that loopsided.

Archon Voranil
Posted - 2010.06.07 23:57:00 - [27]
 

As far as things go, there is no real way to draw a distinct line between alliances because even in 0.0 or lowsec or even highsec, the alliances themselves are different and geared towards different things. Even individual corporations within alliances will perform better or worse at pvp for their own reasons. The size of an alliance doesn't mean terribly too much, because you could be 95% carebear.

It really comes down to something else, knowing the people you fly with, knowing how to take on dificult situations, knowing your ship and it's capabilities, and also knowing your fleetmates and their capabilities. Even the FC doesn't win or lose a match, it's the combined efforts of the pilots on the team.

Some of these 0.0 alliances spend a lot of time in small roaming gangs that traipse all over New Eden. Thus if you are trying to make an analog between the size of an alliance and the penchant for small gang warfare, you're going to have a hard time. Lagfest Superblob warfare is just the "rent" we pay to stay in the happy hunting grounds :)

I will say this however, 0.0 alliances at times have to deal with more difficult combat situations, such as roaming into hostile territory, being caught by a much larger gatecamp or HD fleet, and having to work to get out of the situation, or just drive on in and take them on. No safe stations to dock in there, no safe systems, and even if you have to call a tactical logoff (yes it happens, yes even the best pvp groups do it) you're still sometimes 25-30 jumps into hostile territory and need to get out.

So I guess what I'm saying here is this, large or small, every team is just 10 or so pilots working to achieve a goal. As long as you have an alliance with at least that many people, you're potentially on an even footing with the alliances with 1500 people.

As always R.A.G.E is here for the good fights, and to see how well we can do, I'm sure that's the intent of the tournament, and the intentions of the alliances taking part.

(by the way, thank you to everyone for getting our alliance name right :P too often have I seen it with an extra . makes my heart sink every time :P)

So, to end this rant, and give everyone the TL;DR they have been looking for:

Doesn't really matter how big or small you are, or where you live, if you put in the effort, and know your teammates, any alliance can win this thing. So a distinction between 0.0, 0.4- and 1.0-0.5 alliances is nearly impossible to reasonably extend to the alliance tournament.

CursedEagle79
Wrecking Shots
Wildly Inappropriate.
Posted - 2010.06.08 02:25:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Archon Voranil

I will say this however, 0.0 alliances at times have to deal with more difficult combat situations, such as roaming into hostile territory, being caught by a much larger gatecamp or HD fleet, and having to work to get out of the situation, or just drive on in and take them on.


Many lowsec alliances deal with "hostile territory" every day... It's called being flashy. And jumping into a larger gatecamp? Try jumping into an eve-uni or fw blob sometime when you're flashy.

Ikoras
Minmatar
Final Agony
B A N E
Posted - 2010.06.08 03:11:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: CursedEagle79
Originally by: Archon Voranil

I will say this however, 0.0 alliances at times have to deal with more difficult combat situations, such as roaming into hostile territory, being caught by a much larger gatecamp or HD fleet, and having to work to get out of the situation, or just drive on in and take them on.


Many lowsec alliances deal with "hostile territory" every day... It's called being flashy. And jumping into a larger gatecamp? Try jumping into an eve-uni or fw blob sometime when you're flashy.

You forgot to add while being shot at by sentries.

NereSky
Gallente
RETRIBUTIONS.
Legion of The Damned.
Posted - 2010.06.08 06:15:00 - [30]
 

Its been said already the main reason 0.0 alliances do better is 1) Isk 2) playerbase and 3) always a bit of luck involved

It has nothing whatsoever to do with experience or FC skills gained from being in 0.0


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