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Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.05.29 08:39:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Nooma K''Larr on 29/05/2010 08:42:21
So what do you think?

If CCP cares about player input how about sending out questionnaires to ALL of your players via email and ask how they would feel if a certain "item" in Eve were removed like...well, all the stuff you have removed in the past year.

Explain why you would like to remove it and provide player feedback to the community.

In other words...how about a freakin dialog with your paying customers.Evil or Very Mad

Super Whopper
I can Has Cheeseburger
Posted - 2010.05.29 08:43:00 - [2]
 

Did you vote for your favourite CSM candidate?
Did you raise any issue in one of the many threads before this patch/expansion?
Did you check the test server before release of the patch?
Do you ever follow anything that happens or is discussed on the forums?

Enjoy being hit in the face by things many others knew prior to changes.

Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.05.29 08:51:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Super Whopper
Did you vote for your favourite CSM candidate?
Did you raise any issue in one of the many threads before this patch/expansion?
Did you check the test server before release of the patch?
Do you ever follow anything that happens or is discussed on the forums?

Enjoy being hit in the face by things many others knew prior to changes.


Yes I voted and NO on everything else. You see, I have this thing called a life and it really doesn't involve games like EVE. EVE is for fun and relaxation...not for work. That is why it's called A GAME. As for testing...pay me and I'll be happy to test and debug. That is why they have QA teams for, no?

Anyone catch the POS's going postal on the test server? No? If not then the whole test server thing is BS.

Abrazzar
Posted - 2010.05.29 08:55:00 - [4]
 

They do send out surveys. Although I have the suspicion that certain people aren't on the list of eligible candidates.

Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.05.29 08:57:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Abrazzar
They do send out surveys. Although I have the suspicion that certain people aren't on the list of eligible candidates.


Hopefully that is not the case, but if so, is my money any different from the next player?

Ban Doga
Posted - 2010.05.29 09:01:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Ban Doga on 29/05/2010 09:01:20
Originally by: Super Whopper
Did you vote for your favourite CSM candidate?
Did you raise any issue in one of the many threads before this patch/expansion?
Did you check the test server before release of the patch?
Do you ever follow anything that happens or is discussed on the forums?

Enjoy being hit in the face by things many others knew prior to changes.


Yes, to everything - didn't make a difference.

What was your point?

SirRalph
Minmatar
U.K.R.A.I.N.E
SOLAR FLEET
Posted - 2010.05.29 09:02:00 - [7]
 

So no you have to grind the isk by yourself, poor ex-macroer.

Super Whopper
I can Has Cheeseburger
Posted - 2010.05.29 09:25:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Ban Doga
Edited by: Ban Doga on 29/05/2010 09:01:20
Originally by: Super Whopper
Did you vote for your favourite CSM candidate?
Did you raise any issue in one of the many threads before this patch/expansion?
Did you check the test server before release of the patch?
Do you ever follow anything that happens or is discussed on the forums?

Enjoy being hit in the face by things many others knew prior to changes.


Yes, to everything - didn't make a difference.

What was your point?


My point is that OP is whining about something that should have been implemented a long time ago and was only a matter of time. Had OP been following the forums OP would have seen it coming when the forums were alive with this discussion a year ago.

zombiedeadhead
Minmatar
The Tuskers
Posted - 2010.05.29 09:29:00 - [9]
 

If they sent out a questionnaire to remove Nooma K'larr and your spamming whines, I'd sign it.

Venkul Mul
Gallente
Posted - 2010.05.29 09:37:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Super Whopper
Did you vote for your favourite CSM candidate?
Did you raise any issue in one of the many threads before this patch/expansion?
Did you check the test server before release of the patch?
Do you ever follow anything that happens or is discussed on the forums?

Enjoy being hit in the face by things many others knew prior to changes.


YES to all and I did bug reports where the problem was a bug and not a Development decision.

One of the problems is that most of the time CCP seem first to decide what is the problem and then to search "proof" that they are right, disregarding all other informations that seem to point to different reasons for the issue and every player comment.

An example: the change to courier missions.

CCP thought process:

People do more Gallente and Minmatar courier missions than Caldari and Amarr -> Gallente/Minmatar missions should be better -> search and find some thing in wick Gal/Min mission are better -> change missions so it is no more true

Alternate possible explanation that apparently has not been checked:

People do more Gallente and Minmatar courier missions than Caldari and Amarr -> several of the best high sec Gallente/Minmatar agents are in division that give a lot of non combat missions -> a player can refuse 1 mission every 4 hours only -> the Gal/Min hi sec agent cluster have less agents than the Caldari -> Gal/Min players accept a short and easy courier mission instead of refusing it to keep open the option to refuse a unwanted mission while a Caldari player will simply refuse it and if neede use another neraby agent -> Gal/min do more courier missions

Another possible explanation -> Gallente have 89 low sec level 4 q 20 agents -> 8 are in combat division, 81 in non-combat or semi-combat divisions -> there are several systems with multiple non combat division agents in the same station -> it is easy to do courier missions for isk sellers (they can be macroed or done by a sweatshop worker running several accounts) -> a lot of "players" do them

Jut to compare, Caldari have 5 level 4 q 20 agents in low sec, 1 of them is in a combat division, 2 system with 2 non combat agents against clusters with 4 Gallente non combat agents.

So there is a "problem": Gallente players do the lion share of the non combat mission, but why?

Because the Gallente missions are easier, because the Gallente high sec missioner is pushed to do them or because the low sec missions are set to be farmed by isk farmers working for RMT?

And the "solution" what as cured?

I suspect we will still see isk farmers running them even after the changes.

Heck, after doing this analysis I am temped to run them with a alt with less Sp than the alpha clone. For the cost of a few iteron III I will gather plenty of LP semi AFK. Probably it will make more isk than mining.

Pressure Point
Posted - 2010.05.30 04:19:00 - [11]
 

What am i missing?
What did they remove?

Fi Vantage
Minmatar
Bristol Freedom Cooperative
True Reign
Posted - 2010.05.30 04:34:00 - [12]
 

Edited by: Fi Vantage on 30/05/2010 04:36:11
Probably something to do with the UI, in which case it was probably removed because of bugs.

Edit: Or OP could be talking about the old cyno effect. Or the old warp sound. Or the desync?

Stick Cult
Posted - 2010.05.30 04:41:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Pressure Point
What am i missing?
What did they remove?

Probably the change to courier missions, making them involve a little bit more work.


Or the removal of widescreen.

De'Veldrin
Minmatar
Norse'Storm Battle Group
Intrepid Crossing
Posted - 2010.05.30 04:56:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Pressure Point
What am i missing?
What did they remove?


Nooma has been whinging on about the medium shader for months now. Her newest axe to grind is the removal of the wide screen option.

Hecatonis
Amarr
Posted - 2010.05.30 05:06:00 - [15]
 

Edited by: Hecatonis on 30/05/2010 05:15:38
Originally by: De'Veldrin
Originally by: Pressure Point
What am i missing?
What did they remove?


Nooma has been whinging on about the medium shader for months now. Her newest axe to grind is the removal of the wide screen option.


i eve searched medium shader and almost all the results nooma. i think it was like 2% of players used med. shader and she was one of them, and i can see about the same usage for wide screen as well. this made poor nooma .04% of users, dam i would be pi*sed too,

or she is a complainer....my bet its the latter more then the former

Grath Telkin
Amarr
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2010.05.30 07:13:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
is my money any different from the next player?


Yes, its your money, and quite frankly, the player base has asked me, to ask you, if you'd consider spending it on a different game so we don't have to hear your constant *****ing and moaning about everything.

Fikreta
Posted - 2010.05.30 07:42:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr

You see, I have this thing called a life and it really doesn't involve games like EVE.


So you know what you have to do, isn't it? There are a lot of easy themeparks out there which will offer you instant gratification you seem to be looking for.

Zartrader
Posted - 2010.05.30 08:18:00 - [18]
 

Edited by: Zartrader on 30/05/2010 08:20:16



Surveys do not work well. Those that do not care won't reply, those that do will, so you get a completely biased response.

If CCP had to have long, drawn out and tedious discussions on every change nothing would get done either. Players are not known for having balanced views anyway, I'd prefer their opinions were not asked for at all. Most moans and opinions are based on self interest so they are useless.

C4LYP50
Solarwind Interstellar Mining and Production Ltd
Posted - 2010.05.30 08:43:00 - [19]
 

Nooma...........you're other thread on this topic was so much more thought out. You did well there, raising an issue and engendering a mostly civil and constructive thread. Why on EARTH did you start over here, and in the worst possible way? Why shoot yourself in the foot that way, (and worse yet, hand the gun and a box of bullets to your detractors) ?
Originally by: Hecatonis
Edited by: Hecatonis on 30/05/2010 05:15:38


i eve searched medium shader and almost all the results nooma. i think it was like 2% of players used med. shader and she was one of them, and i can see about the same usage for wide screen as well. this made poor nooma .04% of users, dam i would be pi*sed too,

or she is a complainer....my bet its the latter more then the former


Sir.....with all due respect, you know this argument to be false. You can't take statistics given by CCP in one circumstance (medium shader) and arbitrarily apply them to another (widescreen), when CCP Eris herself stated they had NO IDEA how many people used widescreen. You usually post more reasonably; I can't help but be just a tad disappointed in your effort this time.
And while Nooma may be .04% of the player population, in that, you two are equals, amirite? Does this not give her the same rights as you in regards to posting topics of interest to her? I'm not defending her point of view here (as you can see, I hope), but rather her right to be heard.

Just my 2 isk. Hope it helps.


Hecatonis
Amarr
Posted - 2010.05.30 15:36:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: C4LYP50
Originally by: Hecatonis
Edited by: Hecatonis on 30/05/2010 05:15:38


i eve searched medium shader and almost all the results nooma. i think it was like 2% of players used med. shader and she was one of them, and i can see about the same usage for wide screen as well. this made poor nooma .04% of users, dam i would be pi*sed too,

or she is a complainer....my bet its the latter more then the former


Sir.....with all due respect, you know this argument to be false. You can't take statistics given by CCP in one circumstance (medium shader) and arbitrarily apply them to another (widescreen), when CCP Eris herself stated they had NO IDEA how many people used widescreen. You usually post more reasonably; I can't help but be just a tad disappointed in your effort this time.
And while Nooma may be .04% of the player population, in that, you two are equals, amirite? Does this not give her the same rights as you in regards to posting topics of interest to her? I'm not defending her point of view here (as you can see, I hope), but rather her right to be heard.

Just my 2 isk. Hope it helps.




your right i was cranky. post expansion threads just get to me at times, but i still stand by my comments of way too much whine. as you pointed out earlier these comments are turning into spam. one is generally enough when you are getting the attention of the forum. but it should end there.

what people should do is make their voice heard, not take every possible opportunity to beat a dead horse. have multiple threads about the same topic made by multiple people are bothersome, but making multiple threads by the same person is inexcusable.

Simeon Tor
Picon Fleet
New Eden Research.
Posted - 2010.05.30 15:39:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr


Yes I voted and NO on everything else. You see, I have this thing called a life and it really doesn't involve games like EVE. EVE is for fun and relaxation...not for work. That is why it's called A GAME.



Seems to me like you're making EVE your life.

Ryhss
Caldari
The Excecutorans
Posted - 2010.05.30 15:42:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Super Whopper
Did you vote for your favourite CSM candidate?
Did you raise any issue in one of the many threads before this patch/expansion?
Did you check the test server before release of the patch?
Do you ever follow anything that happens or is discussed on the forums?

Enjoy being hit in the face by things many others knew prior to changes.
I'm sorry, IMO CCP doesn't care about any of that. It's thier game and they can do with it whatever they want.
The CSM is just something to make it look like they listen. While on some levels this is bad, it also has its good qualities. Shut up and play. Laughing

Musical Fist
Gallente
NAP Coalition
Posted - 2010.05.30 16:00:00 - [23]
 

YAWN!!!

Posting in yet another coy flame baiting thread

Trader20
Posted - 2010.05.30 16:25:00 - [24]
 

this aint a democracy biatch

Shinji Seto
Minmatar
Xolti Research
Posted - 2010.05.30 16:41:00 - [25]
 

LoL OP is all worked up about changes as if it's something to get ****ed about. Then replies it's just a game, he has a life and plays it to relax. Lol what a tard. In other words to OP is just a douche who wants to whine on the forums for attention. What a life indeed! LMAO

Pesky LaRue
Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels
Etherium Cartel
Posted - 2010.05.30 17:08:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Pesky LaRue on 30/05/2010 17:12:50
Edited by: Pesky LaRue on 30/05/2010 17:12:10
Originally by: Nooma K'Larr

Yes I voted and NO on everything else. You see, I have this thing called a life and it really doesn't involve games like EVE. EVE is for fun and relaxation...not for work. That is why it's called A GAME.


given what a whining maggot you are about EVERYTHING and NOTHING, this statement seems hard to swallow.

Originally by: Nooma K'Larr
As for testing...pay me and I'll be happy to test and debug. That is why they have QA teams for, no?


Yup, why should you do ANYTHING to help, when you can just b!tch and moan like a 12-year old?

Nooma K'Larr
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.05.30 17:37:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Nooma K''Larr on 30/05/2010 17:48:55

Originally by: Shinji Seto
LoL OP is all worked up about changes as if it's something to get ****ed about. Then replies it's just a game, he has a life and plays it to relax. Lol what a tard. In other words to OP is just a douche who wants to whine on the forums for attention. What a life indeed! LMAO


Yet you take the time to give me the attention by replying...so who's the tard?

How about discussing the topic instead of the poster for a change. Sadly, no dev has replied but rather allow the topic be thrown to the trolls.

Kohana Chayton
Minmatar
Posted - 2010.05.30 17:43:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Super Whopper
Did you vote for your favourite CSM candidate?
Did you raise any issue in one of the many threads before this patch/expansion?
Did you check the test server before release of the patch?
Do you ever follow anything that happens or is discussed on the forums?

Enjoy being hit in the face by things many others knew prior to changes.


CSM is a joke, and has been a joke from the beginning, any idiot that thinks differently needs to stop dipping into the recreational drugs so much.

To answer your questions.

1. Worthless
2. yes
3. yes
4. yes

My conclusion. CCP 'has a vision for the game' and exactly as sony did with everquest, they don't give a damn what their player-base (the majority of paying subscribers who *gasps* resides in high sec) thinks or wants and fully intends to ignore, alienate and **** off the people paying their wages and then when subs start crashing ask "whats wrong? why are you leaving" all bewildered like, because they were to stupid to LISTEN to what their customers were saying in the first place.

Chaos Incarnate
Faceless Logistics
Posted - 2010.05.30 17:57:00 - [29]
 

questionnaires are dumb and useless, the responses are entirely dependent on how the questions are worded and how angry the respondent is

anyhow, we already have our powerless democratic internet spaceships council, how much more useless democracy do we really need

Terrax Norik
Posted - 2010.05.30 18:07:00 - [30]
 

Only a small percentage of those who play this game read these forums on a continuous basis and make their opinion known.
Those who post on these forums are not directly represenative of the entire Eve community and are highly presumptuous to think they are.

Making business decisions heavily based upon what is on these forums would be a mistake and only encourage social engineering on an insane level.

Those who feel that since they take the time to post an idea, that they deserve some kind of "special" attention that requires a Devs response are delusional to an amazing degree.

This game is not "owned" by the players. It is "owned" by the stock holders.
While it is nice that CCP takes our opinion from time to time, they are in no way obligated to. They are only "obligated" to the stockholders.

Saying that the Devs should be obligated to come to us before they change anything is so outrageous that it is hard to fanthom.
But I have come to expect nothing less from this OP.

Just because you make yourself the loudest mouth piece on these forums, individual or group, does not give you the right to try and speak for the majority.

This is not a democracy. It is a game that is owned by someone other than the players. We do not "own" this game.

Pull your head out of your asses, deflate your egoes, and realize you are no more important than any of the other 300k paying subscribers.



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